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No2
dhanley (IP Logged)
18 May, 2017 14:29
Hello Sharkers,

With Webber I hear suffering another broken arm at Bath (do we know if it was the same arm?), and Briggsy moving to the academy job have we heard anything about replacements at 2 next year?
Do we think Webber will do the whole season - looking unlikely. Cameron shifting back perhaps? Although I think he has done a sterling job in the back row, and it would be shame to keep shifting him around.

 
Re: No2
Tigger (IP Logged)
18 May, 2017 14:39
Same arm...and in exactly the same place....but will be back next season all the better for a long rest.



http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a83/DEmmerich/gws21.jpg

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Re: No2
18 May, 2017 15:22
Jones

 
Re: No2
MartWhit (IP Logged)
18 May, 2017 15:23
Marc Jones is the official number 2 Number 2. But I'd expect Webbber to be back in the mix come end of pre season.

The issue of what to do with Cam Nield is a great question. My personal opinion is that his skills and workrate both significantly oil the wheels of Sale's game in both attack and defence. Yet a back row of Nield with a curry doesn't create great balance, and I'd expect both Strauss and Ross to play whenever available. So his back row opportunities are likely to be limited.

IMO, now is the time for him to make the full time transition to hooker. I think he can be our new Tommy Taylor, bringing essentially back row skill levels and mobility to the front row. I think we'd find that he'd oust at least one of the 2 older players from the regular matchday 23 quite quickly.

 
Re: No2
Glossopshark (IP Logged)
18 May, 2017 15:24
So is Cameron Neild the full time back up to Jonesy? Will this stunt his development? Is their someone in the academy who is ready for some gametime?

 
Re: No2
BasilBullneck (IP Logged)
18 May, 2017 16:05
From the limited highlights I saw of Bristol when Jonesy was playing he looked to be less mobile than when he was with us, and often seemed to be carrying a leg injury. His final season with us was monumental, but appears not to have reached those heights again. I wonder if he is in fact earmarked for the third slot at hooker. Certainly, I have been sceptical about the balance of the back row with Neild playing there, although he has a tremendous engine.

There was talk about him possibly being in the minds of the selectors for England as a blind side. Without wishing to be cruel, I suspect he would be a long way down the pecking order at national level. It would be a different matter as a hooker, if he has the hookers basic skills. Currently there is Hartley, George, Cowan-Dickie, TT and Tom Youngs who I would rate as the best English Qualified hookers, and Youngs finds no favour with EJ and Hartley won't have long left at the top level. Neild's future I suspect is therefore brighter as a 2 than a 6, and of course he has two wily mentors as Dimes and Webber on hand to give him some tips.

If that does happen, I bet the training sessions are tasty because I can't see Jonesy or Webber rolling over too easily and giving up their position.

 
Re: No2
Crutch (IP Logged)
18 May, 2017 16:49
Would definitely like him to transition to hooker next year, which I believe was the original timescale. Webber had to play far too many mins this year so I expect a lot more rotation and use of the bench involving both Cam and Jonesy.

 
Re: No2
DaveAitch (IP Logged)
18 May, 2017 16:58
Quote:
Tigger
Same arm...and in exactly the same place....but will be back next season all the better for a long rest.

If the radiograph which was uploaded a couple of weeks ago was the Webber arm the fracture wasn't in exactly the same place. It was at the upper end of the plate that had been inserted. The old fracture was somewhere around the middle of the plate. i.e. The fractures were a few inches apart.

 
Re: No2
Tigger (IP Logged)
18 May, 2017 17:03
Quote:
DaveAitch
Quote:
Tigger
Same arm...and in exactly the same place....but will be back next season all the better for a long rest.

If the radiograph which was uploaded a couple of weeks ago was the Webber arm the fracture wasn't in exactly the same place. It was at the upper end of the plate that had been inserted. The old fracture was somewhere around the middle of the plate. i.e. The fractures were a few inches apart.

OK...as near as damn it (or dammit) to the original break.......



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Re: No2
H's Dad... (IP Logged)
18 May, 2017 17:34
The bone is under greater stress where an attached plate ends. Bones bend a little, healed bones with metal plates firmly attached are more rigid and therefore transfer all the forces to the end of the plate. Mechanical failure at that point quite likely due to simple leverage. ask an engineer! Bones need to take stresses in order to remodel and strengthen, so if you can do it without risking more damage you remove metal plates and screws once adequate healing has taken place.
O/T
All bones are continually being replaced and remodelled: "healing" is not switched on and off: it doesn't really exist in it's own right: it is just that normal turnover of tissue process becoming more obvious.
Many of the calcium molecules in your bones will have done a slow grand tour of all of your various calcium holding tissues and deposits in your body, whether you have broken a bone or not, ever since you drank them in your school milk!

 
Re: No2
madders (IP Logged)
18 May, 2017 17:40
Curtis Langdon?

 
Re: No2
HaleShark (IP Logged)
18 May, 2017 18:48
Hard to guess how the position of Hooker will be played out next season. With Webber's unfortunate arm-break will he be back for the start of the season? possibly so and if that is the case I'd see Webber and Jones alternating (but Webber starting more often) Cam Neild I think may stay as a flanker.

 
Re: No2
PoyntonShark (IP Logged)
19 May, 2017 07:10
Has Jones ever officially been named as No2 No2? Do we do that kind of thing anyway? I would reckon Basil nearer the mark. So long as Webber is fit he will start the season as first choice. If Cam is transitioning to Hooker (back to hooker?), then as he was likely one of the first names on the team sheet this year I would reckon he will be backup, though will of course depend on him not having forgotten how to be a hooker. Of course the best thing about having 3 quality hookers (injuries and necessity of back row duty notwithstanding) is the luxury of affording them proper rotation and rest. They could well all enjoy significant gametime. If Cam continues a similar progression to this season, then come next season end he may well be first choice at Sale and asking serious questions of EJ.



There is far too much talk about good ball and bad ball. In my opinion, good ball is when you have possession and bad ball is when the opposition have it." - R.I.P. Dickie Jeeps 25/11/1931 - 08/10/2016

 
Re: No2
dhanley (IP Logged)
19 May, 2017 07:52
Your point of rotation is a good one. Challenge cup is recently announced as winners will go into the ERC. I expect the AP to be very tight again next year so with an improved squad we could have a good run at that to try and get back into the ERC. This as you say will mean some rotation.

 
Re: No2
DaveAitch (IP Logged)
19 May, 2017 09:40
Quote:
Poynton
...not having forgotten how to be a hooker.
Name a modern player who ever knew how to be a hooker. The name at one time indicated what that player did, now it's just a name.

 
Re: No2
Crutch (IP Logged)
19 May, 2017 16:43
Tommy Taylor, the guy who plays for Japan...

I think there are plenty who can hook to be fair, just depends upon the attitude of the team if they're trying to get ball away quickly from a weak scrum, or to dominate the opposition and try and win a penalty.

 
Re: No2
BasilBullneck (IP Logged)
19 May, 2017 22:56
It's not just striking for the ball, but line out duties as well. The level of accuracy required is that much greater now.

 
Re: No2
PoyntonShark (IP Logged)
20 May, 2017 04:33
Webber appears to know how to be a hooker. Dimes appears to insist on the ability, as well as looking to exploit those who don't know.

Your point still has validity Dave, and a season or so ago would have been right on the mark, but I do think things are changing in that regard. Now if we can only get the authorities to realise that a straight put in is actually important and beneficial then we might actually return to more regular proper scrummaging contests.



There is far too much talk about good ball and bad ball. In my opinion, good ball is when you have possession and bad ball is when the opposition have it." - R.I.P. Dickie Jeeps 25/11/1931 - 08/10/2016

 
Re: No2
DaveAitch (IP Logged)
20 May, 2017 04:36
Crutch, of course, everyone in rugby knows how to hook a ball. There is a big difference, though in knowing how to do it and knowing how to do it. You're spot on saying it depends on the attitude of the team. The attitude now is that hookers aren't there to strike for the ball and that applies through the age groups. As a result the modern player never learns the art of hooking in the way that, say, Brian Moore did.

Basil, I think the hooker is probably the most changed role in rugby, certainly in my playing/watching time. It wasn't until around 1970 that the hooker was used to throw the ball into the line as the common practice. As the line has become more organised the throw has become more important, as you say.

 
Re: No2
DaveAitch (IP Logged)
20 May, 2017 04:45
Poynters, just caught you post after I posted mine. I hope you are right. As I imply in my previous post, any skill is learnt and passed on. People then get better because they are practising it all the time. If the skill is not being practised it dies out and the next generation have to relearn from, as it were, scratch. Many of the old skills are totally lost e.g. how did they build the pyramids?

 
Re: No2
H's Dad... (IP Logged)
20 May, 2017 09:21
...from the bottom up!
Which is why the academy news is particularly significant.(Sm85)


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