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Re: Sarries controversial again
Yorkie (IP Logged)
14 April, 2013 19:46
You miss my point ra. No one is forced nowadays to join the military. I'm glad some people do but it is a personal choice. If you choose to join the military then you've got to accept imvho that you'll be sent into a conflict situation and your life will be put at risk. If you're not happy to accept this then don't join in the first place. If you do join the military then you're far braver than me but you can't complain if you're sent to war, even by idiot politicians, as this is what your "job" is.



http://www.jakehowlett.com/tuckshop/wrappers/chocolate/plain/yorkie-nutter.jpg

 
Re: Sarries controversial again
Tom Paine (IP Logged)
14 April, 2013 19:52
Totally agree, Axeman. At least Thatcher, whose policies I hated, believed in the justice of her cause in the Falklands. A former Labour minister told me that the only reason we engaged in the Iraq war was to maintain the alliance with the USA.Totally cynical, totally wrong.

 
Re: Sarries controversial again
ra (IP Logged)
14 April, 2013 21:43
I didn't miss your point I disagreed with it. I believe that an ex member of the armed services has a perfect right to question the judgement and motivation of those responsible for sending them into conflict.



http://home.zonnet.nl/fred.kitty/calvin/A_hob.gif

 
Re: Sarries controversial again
Yorkie (IP Logged)
14 April, 2013 22:11
OK. Fair enough. But they maybe should do that before they sign on?



http://www.jakehowlett.com/tuckshop/wrappers/chocolate/plain/yorkie-nutter.jpg

 
Re: Sarries controversial again
15 April, 2013 05:38
Quote:
Yorkie
OK. Fair enough. But they maybe should do that before they sign on?

Eh?

Should they be psychic, cynical and / or not believe in the need to defend their family and country?

Should they not expect to be led wisely and used with genuine consideration of the real consequences?



'Lions led by donkeys' .. Lest we forget

 
Re: Sarries controversial again
Convex Hull (IP Logged)
15 April, 2013 07:11
The vast majority (90%+) stood in respectful silence in memory of the MP for Finchley, just down the road from AzP.

There were a few people who chose to stay in the bar and joined the match immediately after the start. There were an even smaller number who chose to sit rather than stand.



Regardez mon visage. Suis-je bovvered?

 
Re: Sarries controversial again
dailywaffle (IP Logged)
15 April, 2013 07:31
Quote:
Convex Hull
The vast majority (90%+) stood in respectful silence in memory of the MP for Finchley, just down the road from AzP.
There were a few people who chose to stay in the bar and joined the match immediately after the start. There were an even smaller number who chose to sit rather than stand.

Probably similar to what you would have had at Welford Road, had the club chosen to go down that road.

 
Re: Sarries controversial again
tjs10 (IP Logged)
17 April, 2013 11:42
Quote:
Tom Paine
Your original post said "not in my lifetime (and beyond)". I assume you meant the past rather than the future as that would be ridiculous, even for you. Suggest you go and watch The Spirit of 45. You might learn something.

"...(and beyond)" was intended to mean "just beyond", not 27 years beyond but I opted for brevity rather than 100% clarity for the sake of simplicity.

The point still remains though that you can't think of another PM since 1951 who has acted in such a manner so why single out one such individual from the 13 to chose from?

 
Re: Sarries controversial again
irishaxeman (IP Logged)
17 April, 2013 11:56
Winston Churchill, despite or because of all his manifest faults, was a colossus. To equate him in any way (e.g. pseudo-state funeral) with any of the following bunch (save perhaps Attlee) is utterly ridiculous.

I honestly don't know why people just don't look at the stats and outcomes of policies instead of spouting Little Englander stances.

 
Re: Sarries controversial again
Rich W (IP Logged)
17 April, 2013 12:32
Quote:
tjs10
Quote:
Tom Paine
Your original post said "not in my lifetime (and beyond)". I assume you meant the past rather than the future as that would be ridiculous, even for you. Suggest you go and watch The Spirit of 45. You might learn something.

"...(and beyond)" was intended to mean "just beyond", not 27 years beyond but I opted for brevity rather than 100% clarity for the sake of simplicity.

The point still remains though that you can't think of another PM since 1951 who has acted in such a manner so why single out one such individual from the 13 to chose from?

So I don't quite get this - we are now to exercise a degree of interpretive judgement abut Tim's posts where he has consistently failed to do the same over the years?

Quote:
If I may mis-quote the Bard
For 'tis the sport to have the literalist
Hoist with his own petar'



...

 
Re: Sarries controversial again
Roger (IP Logged)
17 April, 2013 13:08
I thought we'd agreed we weren't going to get bogged down in 'I'll see your Atlee and raise you one Iron Lady' shenanigans?

 
Re: Sarries controversial again
tjs10 (IP Logged)
17 April, 2013 14:15
Quote:
Rich W
So I don't quite get this - we are now to exercise a degree of interpretive judgement abut Tim's posts where he has consistently failed to do the same over the years?

I could say similar towards you Rich. Why interpret something entirely literally when you have always argued that things should not be interpreted in that manner in the past.

Had it been intended to be literal there would surely have been no need for the "in my lifetime" precursor?

Either way, the follow-up question still remains (and remains unanswered).

Thatcher divided opinion in life and will continue to divide opinion in death. She wasn't the universal saviour that some on the political Right make her out to be but equally she wasn't the outright sinner that some on the Left claim.

At least her funeral passed off without any significant public disorder in the immediate viscinity.

 
Re: Sarries controversial again
Rich W (IP Logged)
17 April, 2013 14:26
I didn't interpret it at at all.



...

 
Re: Sarries controversial again
17 April, 2013 18:23
TJS: Thatcher divided opinion in life and will continue to divide opinion in death. She wasn't the universal saviour that some on the political Right make her out to be but equally she wasn't the outright sinner that some on the Left claim.

She wasn't indeed. She was a spokesperson, a figurehead, no more, for a pernicious [to some] political ideal. The cult of 'personality' is perpetuated by those who wish to continue the divide-and-rule doctrine. It is fun though, as long as you're aware (Sm60)



'Lions led by donkeys' .. Lest we forget

 
Re: Sarries controversial again
IDLETIMES (IP Logged)
19 April, 2013 12:29
Correct on all points oddshaped and some seem to forget that The Blair Creature also won 3 times with even larger majorities than she had and Major-Ball and his 1st lady, Mrs Curry, won more votes than either of them.

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