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The Welsh at ruck time
Posted by: DanWiley (IP Logged)
Date: 18 February, 2012 10:52

I'm getting this out before the game, so that if I complain about it afterwards it won't just look like sour grapes.

In the last two games, and I think the WC, I've noticed the Welsh going off their feet on the opposition side of the ruck all the time.

I know all teams do this, I've just noticed it in particular when watching the Welsh. It's illegal, being on the floor in ruck area, but goes unpunished as one of those things that happens. However, it is hindering opposition players joining the ruck and therefore giving the Welsh the lovely quick ball they thrive off.

I should say I'd no particular interest in the result of the Wales/Ireland/Scotland games, so I don't think this is just a prejudice on my part.

I'm interested: is it just me? Has anyone else noticed this? Can anyone else have a look at this today and give me their opinion? As someone analysing this play, can an opposition player joining the ruck emphasise the fact that there's a guy in his way to milk the penalty?

I should add, whilst they are getting away with it, I've nothing against it as play.

 
Re: The Welsh at ruck time
Posted by: Bod (IP Logged)
Date: 18 February, 2012 11:08

Where can we watch "the Welsh" today to check this theory?



http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_dOg4Ljp3kh8/Sf89bRrqecI/AAAAAAAAAJY/eJCF1kt4b0E/s200/DON%27T-SHOOT-THE-MESSENGER1.jpg

 
Re: The Welsh at ruck time
Posted by: DanWiley (IP Logged)
Date: 18 February, 2012 11:18

opps, I guess I've more free time today than I thought. Still point remains, anyone noticed this?

 
Re: The Welsh at ruck time
Posted by: m0rris (IP Logged)
Date: 18 February, 2012 11:27

I can't say I have noticed it myself but last night Cardiff Blues were able to turn Ulster over at ease and regularly throughout the game and Ulster aren't usually a team that can be turned over that easily... :/

 
Re: The Welsh at ruck time
Posted by: Substitute (IP Logged)
Date: 18 February, 2012 12:11

JUst a quick examination on iPlayer - and certainly not very rigorous.

62:21 - welsh ruck - two Welsh players come over ruck and fall down. third comes round from (ref's blind) side - welsh win ball.

62:28 - welsh ruck - two players try to secure ball - one goes off feet. Gethin Jenkins comes round from side, goes off feet and pulls scottish players whilst appealing to referee. Scottish penalty for holding on.

50:17 - welsh ruck - two players fall over the top (admittedly make it look something like a trip) - welsh win ball.

50:33 - welsh ruck - one player drives through and falls to feet. Second player falls from feet.Third player basically lies on top of ball carrier and second player. Welsh win ball.

47:23 - Scottish ruck - one welsh player enters and stays on feet - Scottish win ball

47:30 - Scottish ruck - one welsh player stays on feet - scottish win ball.


So, from the very small sample size, certain trends do appear to be developing.

On defensive ball (as is common in the Gatland era) they commit as few as players as possible. There are hands in the ruck but it is generally 'legal'.


On Offense there is a definite trend for two players to drive and fall (essentially on top of their own player). Third man comes from side.

I don't know what the law book has to say about this but it certainly appears t prevent Scotland to prevent anyreliable form of counter-ruck when it is succesful. The penalty above was because Scotland were there and lower first (essentially the Weslh fell on the Scottish.

Make what you will of that - but I hope England are gameplanning for something like this.

 
Re: The Welsh at ruck time
Posted by: OLoingseach (IP Logged)
Date: 18 February, 2012 13:06

I thought the same thing. The props seem to do it at every ruck.

 
Re: The Welsh at ruck time
Posted by: Barend (IP Logged)
Date: 18 February, 2012 13:22

Sorry to jump on this thread, but I've noticed it too.

Watch the tackler, who technically I guess, rolls away, but remains in the way of a scrum half (or their pass). Just because you've put your arms innocently in the air, doesn't mean it is ok....

 
Re: The Welsh at ruck time
Posted by: P G Tips (IP Logged)
Date: 18 February, 2012 23:16

Yes, they do it a lot - & have been doing so for some seasons: even before Gatland.Why do refs allow it?

PG

 
Re: The Welsh at ruck time
Posted by: Gareth Redux (IP Logged)
Date: 19 February, 2012 00:34

Many teams do stuff for a while til they get caught. Wales are coached by a kiwi and a cheat so I'm not surprised. NZ, a couple of seasons ago, would charge the defensive guards at the ruck to create a channel; utterly illegal but when did the kiwis ever think the laws of rugby applied to them?

 
Re: The Welsh at ruck time
Posted by: Bod (IP Logged)
Date: 19 February, 2012 00:43

"Wales are coached by a kiwi and a cheat"
Cheat GR? Repeat that please!
When sober.
You can be a real numb-knut at times G.



http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_dOg4Ljp3kh8/Sf89bRrqecI/AAAAAAAAAJY/eJCF1kt4b0E/s200/DON%27T-SHOOT-THE-MESSENGER1.jpg

 
Re: The Welsh at ruck time
Posted by: Gareth Redux (IP Logged)
Date: 19 February, 2012 00:52

Sean Edwards!!

 
Re: The Welsh at ruck time
Posted by: Gareth Redux (IP Logged)
Date: 19 February, 2012 00:53

And I'm very sober and also sticking up for you elsewhere. Thanks!!

 
Re: The Welsh at ruck time
Posted by: Bod (IP Logged)
Date: 19 February, 2012 09:32

"And I'm very sober and also sticking up for you elsewhere. Thanks!!"

That's the give-away!
(Sm7)



http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_dOg4Ljp3kh8/Sf89bRrqecI/AAAAAAAAAJY/eJCF1kt4b0E/s200/DON%27T-SHOOT-THE-MESSENGER1.jpg

 
Re: The Welsh at ruck time
Posted by: WelshBathfan (IP Logged)
Date: 19 February, 2012 13:05

If you are not bothered about the results - why bring the subject up????? You are obviously getting the excuses in early just incase Wales do thrash you!!!! Gatland a 'cheat' - very strong words there....



___________________________________________________________

C'mon Wales, c'mon on Bath.... ooooeeeerrr now i'm confused... :-(

 
Re: The Welsh at ruck time
Posted by: Gareth Redux (IP Logged)
Date: 19 February, 2012 13:10

Not Gatland!!!!! Edwards. See previous threads ad nauseam about his time with Wasps and pizzas!

 
Re: The Welsh at ruck time
Posted by: Stuart Anderton (IP Logged)
Date: 19 February, 2012 13:31

As it seems I'm doomed to only go to rubbish games this season, I should probably apologise in advance as I'm going on Satirday...



Stuart

Editor of Come On My Lovers

Follow COML on Twitter

 
Re: The Welsh at ruck time
Posted by: Isaac Dix (IP Logged)
Date: 19 February, 2012 17:41

The Irish teams have been doing this for years in various forms and got away with murder. (Sm13)

 
Re: The Welsh at ruck time
Posted by: DanWiley (IP Logged)
Date: 19 February, 2012 18:26

"You are obviously getting the excuses in early just incase Wales do thrash you!!!!"

You flatter me, but I'm nothing to do with the England team, why would I need excuses?

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