rugbyunion
Latest News:

Goto Page: Previous123456
Current Page: 6 of 6
 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
OutsideBath (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 13:59
I guess with the mess the current coaches have made, we are now back to year 1 of the development plan?

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
Bri (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 14:01
We are a mid table team at the moment any improvement on that and we are heading in the right direction.I hope to support Bath for another 20 years or so what's the rush.

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
OutsideBath (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 14:22
Don't recall my comment saying I wanted success now, all I asked was if we are now back to square 1!

However as you have brought it up, success can be attained quickly, look at Saracens.

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
Bri (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 14:27
Quote:
OutsideBath
Don't recall my comment saying I wanted success now, all I asked was if we are now back to square 1!
However as you have brought it up, success can be attained quickly, look at Saracens.

You're right,I just only hope we don't buy a south African squad to do it,I would prefer to stay mid table with local lads

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
OutsideBath (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 14:31
Each to their own, personally if we could buy a PL winning team I'd take it regardless.

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
Bri (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 14:34
Quote:
OutsideBath
Each to their own, personally if we could buy a PL winning team I'd take it regardless.

I can understand some fans wanting that,I want us to go back to West country men,each to their own.

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
Bod (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 14:40
Quote:
Bri
Quote:
OutsideBath
Each to their own, personally if we could buy a PL winning team I'd take it regardless.

I can understand some fans wanting that,I want us to go back to West country men,each to their own.

Doesn't work that way any more - the PL teams receive their feed stock through the RFU Academy "closed shop" process it seeems!



http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_dOg4Ljp3kh8/Sf89bRrqecI/AAAAAAAAAJY/eJCF1kt4b0E/s200/DON%27T-SHOOT-THE-MESSENGER1.jpg

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
TCM2007 (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 14:42
Three (four?) of those Academies are in th West Contry.



Stuart

Former ed.

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
Bri (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 14:47
Most of our Academy are West country boys.

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
Bod (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 15:28
You're not going to get the "new" Chilcott turn up to training with the first team from Old Reds just to "give it a go", or Mike Catt Mk2 ringing up to attend a session.
That where we are missing the "hungry mongrel" - I get the impression across the board that the academies produce fit young men with a feeling of entitlement - perhaps that is just the way it is?



http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_dOg4Ljp3kh8/Sf89bRrqecI/AAAAAAAAAJY/eJCF1kt4b0E/s200/DON%27T-SHOOT-THE-MESSENGER1.jpg

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
Bri (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 15:32
Not quite right Bod,what you get is very talented and hungry youngsters getting top quality training and Developement striving for their dream.

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
Bod (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 15:37
But the point is, academy is strictly the entry mode. Anyone outside has little chance.



http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_dOg4Ljp3kh8/Sf89bRrqecI/AAAAAAAAAJY/eJCF1kt4b0E/s200/DON%27T-SHOOT-THE-MESSENGER1.jpg

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
Bri (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 15:42
We've been down this road before not quite true,Last Monday night we played Somerset with lots of local lads playing,don't you think if any stood out they wouldn't be picked out?.
Someone said about local talent,I watched the four local teams,Avon,Oldfield,Norton and Chippenham,the same goes for these matches.
I think people under estimated our Academy coaches.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 29/04/2012 15:43 by Bri.

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
DanWiley (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 15:46
Actually, it sarries many seasons of us laughing at them for claiming to be something special before they achieved anything. They were doing it at least as far back as bothers leaving us, I think before.

So far I'm far convinced that their success will be particularly long lived. If you don't want long term sucess, then you should remember us under jc2.

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
Bri (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 15:52
Bod do you realise that every season we have over 100 kids being trained at EPDG level by the club and our Link with the Uni some on bursary's up there plus our senior Academy.
I'm sure the club doesn't want to miss any but if Melksham have one they've missed I'm sure if you send him along they would look at him or her.

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
TCM2007 (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 16:08
Quote:
Ex-Bod
But the point is, academy is strictly the entry mode. Anyone outside has little chance.

Catch 22 there - if the Academy system works, it will identify all the talent as it comes up through the schools and junior clubs. So there won't be anyone "outside". So what you see as a problem is actually evidence it works.

Someone like Catty could still come in - why do you think otherwise? It's unlikelyto happen, because these days he would be picked up by the SA pro set up, not because English sides wouldn't take the call.

You are basically bemoaning professionalism over amateurism. Bit late for that.

As for the "lack of hunger" thing, I see no evidence of that in our lads. They know that fewer than half of each year group will get picked up on a pro contract. If that competition doesn't make them "hungry" I don't know what will. However I think the whole absence of hunger is just in your head.



Stuart

Former ed.

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
Bod (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 16:32
OK - you must be right Stu! The talent capture and development structure of the RFU is the ideal process! We consistently bring youngsters like Pocock, North, O'Connor,Dagg ,Steyn,Lambie etc to the AP and International Stage.



http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_dOg4Ljp3kh8/Sf89bRrqecI/AAAAAAAAAJY/eJCF1kt4b0E/s200/DON%27T-SHOOT-THE-MESSENGER1.jpg

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
DanWiley (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 16:57
We consistently produce the talent required to be a top four international team and we do that with the country's top sportsmen chasing footballing dreams. Where would NZ be if only their top twenty players decided to play a different sport?

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
TCM2007 (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 17:04
Your criquing the best athletes not being attracted into rugby union Bod, not the system for bringing on the handful who do. Wrong target.



Stuart

Former ed.

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
Bod (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 17:14
But the system is a bit ar$e about face in that aspect.



http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_dOg4Ljp3kh8/Sf89bRrqecI/AAAAAAAAAJY/eJCF1kt4b0E/s200/DON%27T-SHOOT-THE-MESSENGER1.jpg

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
TCM2007 (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 17:17
How would you change it?



Stuart

Former ed.

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
marshie10 (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 17:36
One thing that's holding the development of young players to an extent is that you can't go to a school near Bath and then go to the Leicester academy. In the last two years the RFU have introduced this catchment area rule, which in my opinion is madness as it takes away any competition for young players. When I was at school there would be four or five academy coaches for different clubs watching (not me obviously), but now these children have no choice but to play for there local club.

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
Bod (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 17:38
By shipping all the English talent to the Aussie Sports Academies for a few years at age 18!



http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_dOg4Ljp3kh8/Sf89bRrqecI/AAAAAAAAAJY/eJCF1kt4b0E/s200/DON%27T-SHOOT-THE-MESSENGER1.jpg

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
Bri (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 17:42
You can if you are not pick by your region,Nick Scott is from Hereford.
Leicester Tigers Young hooker is from Cornwall,not picked up by Swera,offered to Bath I believe but we had Hayes and Stagg,ended up at Leicester?and many many more.

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
marshie10 (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 17:45
Bri, there will always be the odd player that falls into that category but the vast majority of decent players do play regional rugby.

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
Bri (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 17:51
I know it's hard to convince the general rugby supporter but selection and talent spotting is of a very high standard,giving youngsters a very good chance of progressing to professional rugby.if the odd one is missed if he has the desire by the age of 22/23 or younger for backs he would be playing in the Championship and spotted from there

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
Bath Fan (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 19:50
I agree Bri - its very exceptional to be outsde the Championship after that age - although it happened to Shaun Perry didn't it? Wasn't he a plumber or similar?

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
TCM2007 (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 20:03
Yes, he was at Dudley until he was 24, but that predates the Academy system I think.

Lee Robinson also sidestepped the system, starting playing for Plymouth (I think) while a student.



Stuart

Former ed.

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
annie blackthorn (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 21:28
Like any academy, you can get in the door, but its what you do once there that counts. Many just don't have what it takes to step up to the next level, and others have the talent but not, in that 'orrible cliche, "the right attitude" i.e. think they are the bees knees from the outset.

I don't think many with potential and talent get missed by Frank Butler.



Adoptee for 2017/18 James Phillips - newly arrived and bringing a wealth of experience in the Prem!

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
hasta (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 21:41
Didn't Nick Easter start very late as well?

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
m0rris (IP Logged)
29 April, 2012 23:18
...and didn't Ben Morgan sidestep the system and go to Wales to get into pro-rugby?

Aren't the academies supposed to be a limited size for each club that runs one? If so that's ample excuse for local players not being picked up as the academy unfortunately can't give everyone with potential a go.

Anyway, was there any news in TRP about Bath/our HC predicament this time around.

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
Substitute (IP Logged)
30 April, 2012 00:05
In my mind you ae all missing the point.

A few years back a spent some time in the then academy system (not Bath mind (Sm17)).

It basically proceeds like:
-Player arrives
-Player is given nutrition and strength booklet and regime
-Player is told not to continue playing for thier rugby club.
-Player is told to make the long journey midweek to the academy centre to run into tackle bags and admire the truly great players in the team (none of which made it).

There was no real skills training, there was certainly no encouragement of 'heads-up' rugby and worst of all, I played less rugby in that time than I did in the rest of my youth. Not to mention the alarmingly high injury rate.

What would I do? Look at the US system (for most sports but excluding Rugby). The players there have to prove themselves on the field rather than in the training room to earn their spot on a team. (They have a similar system in Ireland). These children need to playing rugby outside the regimented mindset of the English academy.

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
Bri (IP Logged)
30 April, 2012 02:44
Sounds like you were in a very poor Academy,did you make it?
John Palmer insists on a good skill set.At Bath you continue to play for your local club( there's a big difference their.)You can continue with your county and Rep rugby,
Once you leave school Bath like you to go to Uni and study,play for the Uni team,So you are given plenty of rugby and with player going out on loan now and Monday night rugby,Bath have it about right.

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
fat lock (IP Logged)
30 April, 2012 06:29
I suspect John's background as a teacher helps him handle young players and keep their non rugby options open.

It does seem that coaching badges are one thing but a few years actually teaching, inspiring and dare I say it controlling youngsters counts for quite a bit in being a decent rugby coach.

Now we're getting pro players becoming pro coaches having done nothing else. A few years in the real world working with non rugby people might be a great help to future coaches

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
Optimist (IP Logged)
30 April, 2012 07:22
Quote:
fat lock
I suspect John's background as a teacher helps him handle young players and keep their non rugby options open.
It does seem that coaching badges are one thing but a few years actually teaching, inspiring and dare I say it controlling youngsters counts for quite a bit in being a decent rugby coach.

Now we're getting pro players becoming pro coaches having done nothing else. A few years in the real world working with non rugby people might be a great help to future coaches

Totally agree with that FL. When I did my Level 1, the best coach on the course by a country mile was a young teacher who'd never played rugby before. The worst ones were the grizzled old players.

Level 1 is a very low-level comparison, but I suspect there's a degree to which it's analogous to academies/pro level.

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
Blocks2u (IP Logged)
30 April, 2012 07:25
Quote:
OutsideBath
Don't recall my comment saying I wanted success now, all I asked was if we are now back to square 1!
However as you have brought it up, success can be attained quickly, look at Saracens.

There's been something special happening at Sarries for donkey's, it has certainly taken longer than three, with a false dawn or two on the way.



Ian

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
OutsideBath (IP Logged)
30 April, 2012 07:50
Quote:
Blocks2u
Quote:
OutsideBath
Don't recall my comment saying I wanted success now, all I asked was if we are now back to square 1!
However as you have brought it up, success can be attained quickly, look at Saracens.

There's been something special happening at Sarries for donkey's, it has certainly taken longer than three, with a false dawn or two on the way.

If you take it from when their SA owners took over it was a couple of years I think. Anyway my original point was I assume we are now back to year 1 of our elongated success plan after our current coaches made a total hash of things.?

 
Re: Head Coach Approaching
TCM2007 (IP Logged)
30 April, 2012 12:02
I would think so OB, maybe with a six month head start!



Stuart

Former ed.

Goto Page: Previous123456
Current Page: 6 of 6

Sorry, you do not have permission to post/reply in this forum.
We record all IP addresses on the Sportnetwork message boards which may be required by the authorities in case of defamatory or abusive comment. We seek to monitor the Message Boards at regular intervals. We do not associate Sportnetwork with any of the comments and do not take responsibility for any statements or opinions expressed on the Message Boards. If you have any cause for concern over any material posted here please let us know as soon as possible by e-mailing abuse@sportnetwork.net
 
 

Who is online?

Total users online:  

Most users online:  

Users on this site:  

Where are they?