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Blessing
WilliamBlessing (IP Logged)

OT UK Politics
19 November, 2016 17:43
The Telegraph

[www.telegraph.co.uk]

 
Blessing
WilliamBlessing (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
20 November, 2016 03:48
Nigel Farage makes new comeback bid

[www.dailymail.co.uk]

 
Bath Hammer
Bath Hammer (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
20 November, 2016 06:20
Can't be bothered to read your links William. If you want to make a point make it - don't just re-hash someone else's view.

 
Blessing
WilliamBlessing (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
20 November, 2016 09:20
I don't have a view, as such but I do think one can learn by the reading of others. Isn't that a valid position for me to adopt Bath Hammer?

By the way, I'm fully aware of hidden agenda and manipulation of the voter and it's better that I leave opinion for others to discuss, such as Malco and Dan hopefully in a positive way.

The BBC is running this current story. Yes, indeed something to discuss indeed.

One perhaps lives and learn.

Breitbart: The web that connects Trump and Farage

[www.bbc.co.uk]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 21/11/2016 14:17 by WilliamBlessing.

 
Blessing
WilliamBlessing (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
21 November, 2016 14:20
Anyone else with something to say?

People don't trust you any more! PM orders business chiefs to clean up their act and embrace Brexit - but hints at 'transitional' deal with Brussels to ease the impact on City firms

[www.dailymail.co.uk]

 
MESSAGES->author
woodpecker (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
21 November, 2016 16:37
Theresa May clearly isn't a lunatic, pound rises to 1.17430 against the euro

 
rainbow
rainbow (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
21 November, 2016 16:42
Yes i have something to write but good manners restrict me. Anyway just leave this garbage to mumsnet or whatever.

 
Blessing
WilliamBlessing (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
21 November, 2016 22:10

 
Blessing
WilliamBlessing (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
22 November, 2016 21:45
Stop putting your dislike of me above the national interest, Nigel Farage tells Downing Street in row over Trump's call to make him ambassador to US

[www.telegraph.co.uk]

I happened to watch some stuck up Tory with a horrible attitude explain why this wasn't going to happen.

Dinosaur.

Christopher Meyer,



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 22/11/2016 22:11 by WilliamBlessing.

 
MESSAGES->author
woodpecker (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
24 November, 2016 13:27
From the Telegraph 30/09/16:

The report from the Centre for Social Justice and Legatum Institute found that people in the “AB” class – the middle and upper classes - were the only group which had a majority voting to Remain at the June 23 referendum.

The majority of people in all the other income groups - described as C1, C2, D and E - all voted to leave, the report said. While 57 per cent of voters in the more affluent AB group voted to remain, the proportion in the other four groups was 36 per cent.

It said: "At every level of earning there is a direct correlation between household income and your likelihood to vote for leaving the EU — 62 per cent of those with income of less than £20,000 voted to leave, but that percentage falls in steady increments until, by an income of £60,000, that percentage was just 35 per cent."

From the BBC News website today:


Family finances face a "grim" few years with a "dreadful" outlook for wages and little respite from the Autumn Statement, two think tanks have said.
The biggest losers between now and 2020 were lower income families, with the poorest third likely to see incomes drop, the Resolution Foundation said.
The Institute for Fiscal Studies (IFS) said real wages would be below their 2008 levels in 2021.


No comment

 
Substitute
Substitute (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
24 November, 2016 13:43
Quote:
woodpecker

No comment

I don't get your point. The middle-lower social classes have also been hit hardest pre-Brexit.

In fact all economic downturns im recent history have hit the poorest classes hardest. Here we have another predicted downturn (we'll see if it happens) so all bets are they're hit hardest again.

Of course, knowing the AB classes could do something about it rather than snigger from their high horses?

Moving away from the referendum the statement was, in my opinion, a missed opportunity. They committed to additional spending that politically they didnt have to and provoded scant resource to boos our productivity and further outcompete our trading partners

This was more pointing out we had a problem rather than solving it.

 
MESSAGES->author
woodpecker (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
24 November, 2016 14:25
I didn't have a point, that's why I said no comment, I just posted 2 random unrelated pieces of analysis

 
Substitute
Substitute (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
24 November, 2016 14:55
Quote:
woodpecker
I didn't have a point, that's why I said no comment, I just posted 2 random unrelated pieces of analysis

Ok, I was worried you might be a Corbynista for a second.

Be careful though - there may be people out there who would look at that and feel that people's suffering is vindicated in order to make a political point...

 
Blessing
WilliamBlessing (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
24 November, 2016 15:01
Oh no!

Brexit can be stopped, insists Tony Blair as he rules out return to frontline politics

[www.telegraph.co.uk]

 
MESSAGES->author
woodpecker (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
24 November, 2016 15:07
Quote:
Substitute
Quote:
woodpecker
I didn't have a point, that's why I said no comment, I just posted 2 random unrelated pieces of analysis

Ok, I was worried you might be a Corbynista for a second.

Be careful though - there may be people out there who would look at that and feel that people's suffering is vindicated in order to make a political point...

Thanks Substitute, I will keep that in mind and at no point ever will I even think about joining the dots...

 
Blessing
WilliamBlessing (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
24 November, 2016 15:40
Nigel Farage to meet Donald Trump team on unofficial diplomatic offensive amid claims he is planning to move to US

[www.telegraph.co.uk]

 
MESSAGES->author
woodpecker (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
24 November, 2016 15:49
Farage moving to the US, that's the best news I've heard for ages

 
Substitute
Substitute (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
24 November, 2016 16:23
Quote:
woodpecker
Farage moving to the US, that's the best news I've heard for ages

Be careful - it comes from that well-known Fake News institution that we call The Times.

Wonder if Farage's friends work for Deloitte? Entirely possible with his background...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 24/11/2016 16:24 by Substitute.

 
MESSAGES->author
CoochieCoo (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
24 November, 2016 16:48
Quote:
woodpecker
Farage moving to the US, that's the best news I've heard for ages

Thought Trump was clamping down on immigration! winking smiley



http://zdgzqa.bay.livefilestore.com/y1p7Mwi7pLXeM89TY2KFdDQ-UUDGSv1FKNdhYdrW-koAuRN3tsqCPfE3onFxuO-3cZ0057Tom1uJai3vjkz3dvY_Q/1998%20Euro%20Champs.jpg http://zdgzqa.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pFul9UAV5zEXOzeRc1kmmlgDKXTYTIlTnGoQzYelH6KzdCeU-exN0IGo74QN2OGvlSoEiVjzAESvHx9BFlBsNFA/Bath%202008.jpg

 
MESSAGES->author
woodpecker (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
25 November, 2016 08:44
Not cheap! but not hard to get a European passport if you've got the cash:


Citizenship by Investment Cyprus
Cyprus offers the quickest, most assured route to European citizenship and a second passport through the Cypriot citizenship by investment programme. An investment of €2.0 million in real estate is required. Cyprus is unique in its offering of citizenship within just 2-3 months of such an investment. This grants a Cypriot passport and EU citizenship, allowing the freedom to work, travel, study and live anywhere within the EU including countries such as Germany, France and the UK. The investment can be reduced down after 3 years to just €500,000.


Golden Visa Portugal with €500,000 property investment. The Portugal Golden Visa program has proven to be the most popular scheme in Europe with investors attracted to its flexibility and benefits. Launched in 2012 the investor visa program has been actively promoted internationally by the Portuguese government. An investment of €500,000 in real estate in Portugal will gain a residency permit for a family including dependent children. The golden visa can be renewed every two years providing the applicant spends two weeks in the country every two years.

Permanent Residency and Citizenship
One of the most attractive options is that to apply for permanent residency after 5 years and citizenship after 6 years without the need to reside in Portugal. In fact, the applicant and their family need only visit for two weeks every two years in order to renew the Portuguese Golden Visa. Citizenship of Portugal and a second passport conveys the right to live, work and study anywhere in the European Union.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 25/11/2016 09:45 by woodpecker.

 
MESSAGES->author
hasta (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
25 November, 2016 10:25
If you've got £1.75m you can buy residency in Jersey. Frankly if you've got that much money I imagine you can probably get in anywhere...

 
Old Bath Tub
Old Bath Tub (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
25 November, 2016 16:17
Quote:
WilliamBlessing
Oh no!
Brexit can be stopped, insists Tony Blair as he rules out return to frontline politics

[www.telegraph.co.uk]

Blair says 'I'm an insurgent who can keep us in the EU '

Major says 'Don't rule out a 2nd referendum'

Cleggy has jumped on the Bandwagon.

Blair has damaged this country already and should take his oar and stick it where the sun don't shine and paddle his way to Syria and take the other two with him ! (Sm101)

 
MESSAGES->author
woodpecker (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
28 November, 2016 16:20
Another legal challenge, this time about whether article 50 also means we have left the EEA.

[www.bbc.co.uk]



The arch Brexiteers are saying that it was totally clear that people voted to leave the EU, single market, customs union, EEA etc.

Any of you guys (not Malco or Substitute as they already answered this) who voted to leave, but didn't want to go all the way?

The stumbling block appears to be the freedom of movement, looks like the Swiss have capitulated on this, with some vague law about employing Swiss people.

 
MESSAGES->author
hasta (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
28 November, 2016 16:28
I read the legal point more as:

* it's not clear if we're member of the EEA purely due to being members of the EU
* if we aren't then we'd need to trigger the EEA exit clause too

 
MESSAGES->author
woodpecker (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
28 November, 2016 16:36
Quote:
hasta
I read the legal point more as:
* it's not clear if we're member of the EEA purely due to being members of the EU
* if we aren't then we'd need to trigger the EEA exit clause too

Yes, they are essentially arguing the second point i.e. they don't want us to leave the EEA by accident

 
MESSAGES->author
Clarkey3k (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
28 November, 2016 16:38
Woodpecker - I voted to leave the EU to return sovereignty to the UK parliament. I don't have a prescription for the future; indeed whatever the UK parliament decides to do based upon the legal advice/decisions is fine by me, that is what I voted for...



Adopted players: 2017 D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw

Change a life with a loan [www.deki.org.uk]

 
Substitute
Substitute (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
28 November, 2016 16:53
Quote:
woodpecker
The stumbling block appears to be the freedom of movement, looks like the Swiss have capitulated on this, with some vague law about employing Swiss people.

The Swiss upper house have hedged their bets on a referendum to implement domestic hiring preferences a suitable alternative to the quotas specified in the previous referendum.

This is still in contravention of EU rules, but is likely to be seen as more palatable than quotas (and, in essence gives them more time).

 
Substitute
Substitute (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
29 November, 2016 20:38
Donald Tusk - now the second most influential Donald in Politics - has today written an open letter to Tory MPs to defend the actions of the EU commission's chief negotiator against charges that he is the one refusing to negotiate on reciprocal rights.

His defence for Barnier's reluctance to consider reciprocal rights: that it's the peoples fault for voting Brexit and causing this uncertainty.

Is it finally time to question the morality of the EU project?

And this from the Guardian...

 
gaz59
gaz59 (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
29 November, 2016 20:59
But he is right!

He also says, stop faffing around, trigger article 50 and then we can start negotiations

But our lot can't even work out what it is they want let alone get in position to start negotiating for it

 
Blessing
WilliamBlessing (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
29 November, 2016 23:23
More trouble ahead for EU.


Italian crisis can damage all of Europe: Fears country could be forced into a £34bn bailout ahead of crunch vote

[www.dailymail.co.uk]

 
Substitute
Substitute (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
30 November, 2016 06:57
Quote:
gaz59
But he is right!
He also says, stop faffing around, trigger article 50 and then we can start negotiations

But our lot can't even work out what it is they want let alone get in position to start negotiating for it

He's not right though is he. Because a proposed agreement to bilaterally secure the rights of Eu nationals was rebuffed by the EU.

OK the vote caused the question to be asked, the EU refused to answer it and then blamed you, me, us... It could have been addressed, they didnt want to.

I think May has made her Art. 50 position clear - and there are many on these shores who would force its delay. But Art. 50 does not adress the issue of reckprocal rights anyway.

The EU is using its people as pawns in these negotiations. Lets recognise who we're dealing with when we go into these negotiations and not tie the UKs hands...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 30/11/2016 06:57 by Substitute.

 
MESSAGES->author
TCM2007 (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
30 November, 2016 07:28
There are no negotiations for these people to be used as pawns in. Article 50 has not been triggered. Until it is then there's nothing to negotiate.

The EU has taken the logical and consistent position of no Pre-negotiations on anything.



Stuart

Former ed.

 
MESSAGES->author
CoochieCoo (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
30 November, 2016 07:48
Art 50 is clear no talks until triggered. So get on with it and start the negotiations!



http://zdgzqa.bay.livefilestore.com/y1p7Mwi7pLXeM89TY2KFdDQ-UUDGSv1FKNdhYdrW-koAuRN3tsqCPfE3onFxuO-3cZ0057Tom1uJai3vjkz3dvY_Q/1998%20Euro%20Champs.jpg http://zdgzqa.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pFul9UAV5zEXOzeRc1kmmlgDKXTYTIlTnGoQzYelH6KzdCeU-exN0IGo74QN2OGvlSoEiVjzAESvHx9BFlBsNFA/Bath%202008.jpg

 
Blessing
WilliamBlessing (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
30 November, 2016 10:21
Five-year ban on benefits for EU migrants: Plan would mean people arriving from Europe would have to wait as long as non-EU residents for access

[www.dailymail.co.uk]

 
Substitute
Substitute (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
30 November, 2016 13:03
Quote:
Stuart Anderton
There are no negotiations for these people to be used as pawns in. Article 50 has not been triggered. Until it is then there's nothing to negotiate.
The EU has taken the logical and consistent position of no Pre-negotiations on anything.

These people are real people and they can be rightly uncertain. Of course this uncertainty could be dispelled tomorrow if both parties took reciprocal rights off the negotiation table.

To let people live with this unnecessary degree of uncertainty because they're following procedure - I think immoral is the right word.

 
Substitute
Substitute (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
30 November, 2016 13:15
Quote:
CoochieCoo
Art 50 is clear no talks until triggered. So get on with it and start the negotiations!

European parliaments paper (written by a constitutional law expert) on Article 50 - and Brexiteers live in a post-fact world!? :

"The formal withdrawal process is initiated by a notification from the Member State
wishing to withdraw to the European Council, declaring its intention to do so. The
timing of this notification is entirely in the hand of the Member State concerned, and
informal discussions could take place between it and other Member States and/or
EU institutions prior to the notification. "


Let's be clear. The EU is intentionally behaving this way. How about we stop trying to rationalise it and realise it for what it is?

 
DanWiley
DanWiley (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
30 November, 2016 13:39
What is it?

 
MESSAGES->author
CoochieCoo (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
30 November, 2016 13:52
Quote:
Substitute
Quote:
CoochieCoo
Art 50 is clear no talks until triggered. So get on with it and start the negotiations!

European parliaments paper (written by a constitutional law expert) on Article 50 - and Brexiteers live in a post-fact world!? :

"The formal withdrawal process is initiated by a notification from the Member State
wishing to withdraw to the European Council, declaring its intention to do so. The
timing of this notification is entirely in the hand of the Member State concerned, and
informal discussions could take place between it and other Member States and/or
EU institutions prior to the notification. "


Let's be clear. The EU is intentionally behaving this way. How about we stop trying to rationalise it and realise it for what it is?

So the informal discussions say no negotiations without the trigger, so why don't you brexiteers bite the bullet and get on with it or are you hoping for a softer agenda?



http://zdgzqa.bay.livefilestore.com/y1p7Mwi7pLXeM89TY2KFdDQ-UUDGSv1FKNdhYdrW-koAuRN3tsqCPfE3onFxuO-3cZ0057Tom1uJai3vjkz3dvY_Q/1998%20Euro%20Champs.jpg http://zdgzqa.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pFul9UAV5zEXOzeRc1kmmlgDKXTYTIlTnGoQzYelH6KzdCeU-exN0IGo74QN2OGvlSoEiVjzAESvHx9BFlBsNFA/Bath%202008.jpg

 
Substitute
Substitute (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
30 November, 2016 14:31
Quote:
CoochieCoo
[
So the informal discussions say no negotiations without the trigger, so why don't you brexiteers bite the bullet and get on with it or are you hoping for a softer agenda?

Ok, so we're in agreement that the EU has chosen to exclude pre-negotiations including on EU residents rights post-Brexit.

That uncertainty that could be easily resolved the EU is choosing not to resolve. It is unnecessarily allowing these citizens (one of which is my wife) to live with uncertainty.

For what end? People rightly criticised May when she didn't include reciprocal rights in her leadership campaign. Why do the media, some of us, feel the EU is justified in doing so?

An institution that wont guarantee the rights of people living there, whether that's because of procedure or to get a better negotiating hand, is morally bankrupt.

I thought we had a date for Art. 50? Last I saw Brexiteers werent trying to frustrate it.

 
DanWiley
DanWiley (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
30 November, 2016 14:40
I don't get what you are so upset about? The EU are saying we won't start negotiating until you kick off the thing that starts the negotiations.

 
MESSAGES->author
CoochieCoo (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
30 November, 2016 14:47
Quote:
Substitute
Quote:
CoochieCoo
[
So the informal discussions say no negotiations without the trigger, so why don't you brexiteers bite the bullet and get on with it or are you hoping for a softer agenda?

Ok, so we're in agreement that the EU has chosen to exclude pre-negotiations including on EU residents rights post-Brexit.

That uncertainty that could be easily resolved the EU is choosing not to resolve. It is unnecessarily allowing these citizens (one of which is my wife) to live with uncertainty.

For what end? People rightly criticised May when she didn't include reciprocal rights in her leadership campaign. Why do the media, some of us, feel the EU is justified in doing so?

An institution that wont guarantee the rights of people living there, whether that's because of procedure or to get a better negotiating hand, is morally bankrupt.

I thought we had a date for Art. 50? Last I saw Brexiteers werent trying to frustrate it.

ALL the uncertainties could be easily resolved by triggering Art 50 now and getting on with it. It takes two to tango. I have a son in France who is contemplating dual nationality and his daughter, my granddaughter, studying in London not knowing what is going on but will be eligible for UK nationality. They are living with these frustrations since the vote. Businesses are holding back because of the uncertainty and my favourite watering hole, The Fox in Broughton Gifford has closed blaming a downfall in business since the vote. The Brexiteers in cabinet should be getting on with it, why wait till end of March as negotiating positions are known. So bite the frigging bullet!



http://zdgzqa.bay.livefilestore.com/y1p7Mwi7pLXeM89TY2KFdDQ-UUDGSv1FKNdhYdrW-koAuRN3tsqCPfE3onFxuO-3cZ0057Tom1uJai3vjkz3dvY_Q/1998%20Euro%20Champs.jpg http://zdgzqa.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pFul9UAV5zEXOzeRc1kmmlgDKXTYTIlTnGoQzYelH6KzdCeU-exN0IGo74QN2OGvlSoEiVjzAESvHx9BFlBsNFA/Bath%202008.jpg

 
Substitute
Substitute (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
30 November, 2016 15:13
Quote:
CoochieCoo
ALL the uncertainties could be easily resolved by triggering Art 50 now and getting on with it. It takes two to tango. I have a son in France who is contemplating dual nationality and his daughter, my granddaughter, studying in London not knowing what is going on but will be eligible for UK nationality. They are living with these frustrations since the vote. Businesses are holding back because of the uncertainty and my favourite watering hole, The Fox in Broughton Gifford has closed blaming a downfall in business since the vote. The Brexiteers in cabinet should be getting on with it, why wait till end of March as negotiating positions are known. So bite the frigging bullet!

Apparently it takes two - and a procedural notification - to Tango.

I am fortunate that this uncertainty does not apply to me but I can see that it does affect my partner. I can only presume the effect is similar for your family.

I'm sorry your pub closed - there are far too many pubs closing. Since the Leave vote the retail sector has seen record sales and record consumer confidence - so blaming it on the Leave vote seems like an oversimplification.

It may have escaped your attention but none of the Brexiteers are the PM. I imagine they are arguing for a quick break but if they trigger Article 50 somehow, I imagine it would be even less likely to get past the courts.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 30/11/2016 15:14 by Substitute.

 
MESSAGES->author
woodpecker (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
30 November, 2016 16:32

That uncertainty that could be easily resolved the EU is choosing not to resolve. It is unnecessarily allowing these citizens (one of which is my wife) to live with uncertainty
.


Substitute, you should have thought of that before you voted to leave! Does she know?

 
MESSAGES->author
CoochieCoo (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
30 November, 2016 16:55
The owner of the pub blamed the downturn in his business to the vote not me! This pub had a great reputation and even Rugby players supported it. Lee Mears used to have his own special table every Sunday!

I thought we were all brexiteers now, Substitute. I ask again what are we waiting for? A miracle?



http://zdgzqa.bay.livefilestore.com/y1p7Mwi7pLXeM89TY2KFdDQ-UUDGSv1FKNdhYdrW-koAuRN3tsqCPfE3onFxuO-3cZ0057Tom1uJai3vjkz3dvY_Q/1998%20Euro%20Champs.jpg http://zdgzqa.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pFul9UAV5zEXOzeRc1kmmlgDKXTYTIlTnGoQzYelH6KzdCeU-exN0IGo74QN2OGvlSoEiVjzAESvHx9BFlBsNFA/Bath%202008.jpg

 
MESSAGES->author
woodpecker (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
30 November, 2016 17:02
Quote:
CoochieCoo
The owner of the pub blamed the downturn in his business to the vote not me! This pub had a great reputation and even Rugby players supported it. Lee Mears used to have his own special table every Sunday!
I thought we were all brexiteers now, Substitute. I ask again what are we waiting for? A miracle?

CC, I'm guessing he was just one of those bremoaners, scaremongering again. I went to the pub on Friday and it was very full with proud British toasting their sovereignty and new found freedom.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 30/11/2016 17:03 by woodpecker.

 
Substitute
Substitute (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
30 November, 2016 17:26
Quote:
woodpecker
Quote:
CoochieCoo
The owner of the pub blamed the downturn in his business to the vote not me! This pub had a great reputation and even Rugby players supported it. Lee Mears used to have his own special table every Sunday!

CC, I'm guessing he was just one of those bremoaners, scaremongering again. I went to the pub on Friday and it was very full with proud British toasting their sovereignty and new found freedom.

They both sound a cut above my local. Of course, the retail statistics nationally (those including the public house industry) are overwhelmingly positive. That doesn't exclude local impact but anecdotal evidence does not equate to the whole picture.

 
MESSAGES->author
hemington (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
30 November, 2016 20:12
Quote:
Substitute

Of course, the retail statistics nationally (those including the public house industry) are overwhelmingly positive. That doesn't exclude local impact but anecdotal evidence does not equate to the whole picture.

The Bank of England has been quoted on BBC:

Figures from the Bank this week showed that credit card lending is at a record level, up by £571m in the last month.
Overall unsecured debt - which includes overdrafts - is rising at its fastest pace for 11 years.


So how much of those overwhelmingly positive retail statistics are built on sand?

 
Substitute
Substitute (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
30 November, 2016 20:28
Quote:
hemington
The Bank of England has been quoted on BBC:

Figures from the Bank this week showed that credit card lending is at a record level, up by £571m in the last month.
Overall unsecured debt - which includes overdrafts - is rising at its fastest pace for 11 years.


So how much of those overwhelmingly positive retail statistics are built on sand?

We are in a time of record prolonged low interest rates. Interest rates set at that level to target increasing borrowing to increase spending.

Of course, this has been monetary policy for a (relatively) long time and easily predated Brexit.

The shock and uncertainty of Brexit was by the majoroty of expert accounts going to damage sales and cause the kind of closures that CC anecdotally describes. On the whole it hasn't and if people are increasing their share of debt then that would imply that the negative impacts of uncertainty were overblown and that they and the lenders have confidence in the future.

Is increased consumer debt a good thing? Thats certainly debatable. But if anything, and judging by the expert predictions, it is in spite of Brexit rather than because of it.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 01/12/2016 07:01 by Substitute.

 
Blessing
WilliamBlessing (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
01 December, 2016 06:31
Leave voters’ patience is starting to wear thin as they fear betrayal

[www.telegraph.co.uk]


British expats would be left high and dry by quick EU deal, says Theresa May

[www.telegraph.co.uk]

 
Blessing
WilliamBlessing (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 06:40
Boris Johnson says Britain must lead fight against Putin and Assad's 'cult of the strong man'

[www.telegraph.co.uk]

 
MESSAGES->author
hasta (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 06:53
LibDems overturn a 20k+ majority in Richmond Park and kick out Zac Goldsmith. Serves the racist right.

 
BBandW
BBandW (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 08:27
Quote:
hasta
LibDems overturn a 20k+ majority in Richmond Park and kick out Zac Goldsmith. Serves the racist right.

Great encouragement for the remainers (Sm60)

 
malco
malco (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 08:31
Quote:
BBandW
Quote:
hasta
LibDems overturn a 20k+ majority in Richmond Park and kick out Zac Goldsmith. Serves the racist right.

Great encouragement for the remainers (Sm60)

Hardly. The Remain vote in the referendum there was 73 per cent. The vote last night was 53 per cent.

 
MESSAGES->author
woodpecker (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 08:51
One by-election at a time, the first blow for the single market!

 
malco
malco (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 08:54
Quote:
woodpecker
One by-election at a time, the first blow for the single market!

63 per cent of constituencies voted to leave. The Conservative Party is polling higher than at any point in history. Theresa May really ought to call a Spring general election and deal with this once and for all.

 
Rolfs_Cartoon_Club
@Hydor18 (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 08:58
I think you're right, Malco, but much of it has to do with the incompetence of the opposition as opposed to the competence of the incumbent. However, I am kind of fed up with being asked to vote all the time- democracy can be exhausting.

 
MESSAGES->author
woodpecker (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 08:59
Quote:
malco
Quote:
woodpecker
One by-election at a time, the first blow for the single market!

63 per cent of constituencies voted to leave. The Conservative Party is polling higher than at any point in history. Theresa May really ought to call a Spring general election and deal with this once and for all.

Yes, she might have to, as in spring before or after March?

 
MESSAGES->author
hasta (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 09:08
After that result (overturning a 20k majority) there is no way in hell May will call an early election. She has a 10 person majority. A progressive alliance between the Greens and LDs could easily swing 5 seats.

63% constituencies voted to leave, but we have no idea if Europe was the most important thing to them (I sincerely doubt it for most). Yes she has a strong lead in the polls at the moment, but that number is soft and would inevitably tighten in a general election.

Which do you think is more important to May:

a) Being Prime Minister
b) Leading Britain out of Europe

I don't think she's going to risk a for b. Particularly given her own constituency both voted remain AND would be affected by Heathrow 3rd runway.

 
DanWiley
DanWiley (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 09:26
It certainly shows that seats can be won by supporting remain. In that sense it is encouraging to those that would prefer to stay in the EU. Given what David Davis has been saying the prospect of a feather weight exit seems plausible.

 
MESSAGES->author
jayeatman (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 09:32
Quote:
woodpecker
Not cheap! but not hard to get a European passport if you've got the cash:

Citizenship by Investment Cyprus
Cyprus offers the quickest, most assured route to European citizenship and a second passport through the Cypriot citizenship by investment programme. An investment of €2.0 million in real estate is required. Cyprus is unique in its offering of citizenship within just 2-3 months of such an investment. This grants a Cypriot passport and EU citizenship, allowing the freedom to work, travel, study and live anywhere within the EU including countries such as Germany, France and the UK. The investment can be reduced down after 3 years to just €500,000.


Golden Visa Portugal with €500,000 property investment. The Portugal Golden Visa program has proven to be the most popular scheme in Europe with investors attracted to its flexibility and benefits. Launched in 2012 the investor visa program has been actively promoted internationally by the Portuguese government. An investment of €500,000 in real estate in Portugal will gain a residency permit for a family including dependent children. The golden visa can be renewed every two years providing the applicant spends two weeks in the country every two years.

Permanent Residency and Citizenship
One of the most attractive options is that to apply for permanent residency after 5 years and citizenship after 6 years without the need to reside in Portugal. In fact, the applicant and their family need only visit for two weeks every two years in order to renew the Portuguese Golden Visa. Citizenship of Portugal and a second passport conveys the right to live, work and study anywhere in the European Union.
#
This is little different from the UK scheme: [www.gov.uk]
40 month Visa if you have £2m to invest. Invest £5m within three years, citizenship. Bingo.

 
Bath Supporter Jack

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 10:03
Dear Mr CC

How can Article 50 be served when the Supreme Court are deliberating on the process?

 
MESSAGES->author
woodpecker (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 11:02
Quote:
jayeatman
Quote:
woodpecker
Not cheap! but not hard to get a European passport if you've got the cash:

Citizenship by Investment Cyprus
Cyprus offers the quickest, most assured route to European citizenship and a second passport through the Cypriot citizenship by investment programme. An investment of €2.0 million in real estate is required. Cyprus is unique in its offering of citizenship within just 2-3 months of such an investment. This grants a Cypriot passport and EU citizenship, allowing the freedom to work, travel, study and live anywhere within the EU including countries such as Germany, France and the UK. The investment can be reduced down after 3 years to just €500,000.


Golden Visa Portugal with €500,000 property investment. The Portugal Golden Visa program has proven to be the most popular scheme in Europe with investors attracted to its flexibility and benefits. Launched in 2012 the investor visa program has been actively promoted internationally by the Portuguese government. An investment of €500,000 in real estate in Portugal will gain a residency permit for a family including dependent children. The golden visa can be renewed every two years providing the applicant spends two weeks in the country every two years.

Permanent Residency and Citizenship
One of the most attractive options is that to apply for permanent residency after 5 years and citizenship after 6 years without the need to reside in Portugal. In fact, the applicant and their family need only visit for two weeks every two years in order to renew the Portuguese Golden Visa. Citizenship of Portugal and a second passport conveys the right to live, work and study anywhere in the European Union.
#
This is little different from the UK scheme: [www.gov.uk]
40 month Visa if you have £2m to invest. Invest £5m within three years, citizenship. Bingo.


Im talking about one of those lovely freedom of movement passports, if you want one of those the UK scheme isn't worth 2 quid, the way we're going.

That portugal one means you need to buy a house for around £420 GBP, rent it out, visit 2 weeks every 2 years, get a passport in 6 years for you and your family and it looks like you can sell it then too.

 
MESSAGES->author
OutsideBath (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 11:07
Quote:
hasta
LibDems overturn a 20k+ majority in Richmond Park and kick out Zac Goldsmith. Serves the racist right.

Interesting comment, on what grounds do you make the assessment that he's a racist?



Chris Cook - Adopted player 2016/17

 
MESSAGES->author
jayeatman (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 11:22
Quote:
OutsideBath
Quote:
hasta
LibDems overturn a 20k+ majority in Richmond Park and kick out Zac Goldsmith. Serves the racist right.

Interesting comment, on what grounds do you make the assessment that he's a racist?

His London Mayor campaign: [www.theguardian.com]

 
malco
malco (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 11:27
Zac Goldsmith ran an embarrassingy bad negative campaign for London Mayor and quite frankly got what he deserved. Unfortunately it has left London with an ineffective liar for mayor who has already backtracked on all his main promises, but the alternative was to elect a different type of idiot with, yes, racist overtones.

Zac is not my idea of a Conservative. Or most conservatives' idea of a conservative.

Richmond was the most pro remain borough in the country and Zac campaigned for leave. He then chose to make a principled stand over something that he clearly was going to lose, resigned from the Conservative Party and forced an election which was always going to be largely decided by people who resented him not representing their wishes on Brexit and remembered his embarrassingly bad Mayoral campaign.

Zac Goldsmith has got what he deserved.

However, trying to pretend that this marks some staggering indication of Liberal Democrat superiority is really laughably delusional.

The Conservative Party did not field a candidate in Richmond. Richmond was a Liberal Democrat stronghold before Goldsmith arrived. Elsewhere 63 per cent of constituencies voted to leave the EU and the Conservative Party is polling record levels. The boundaries commission is busy balancing the playing field, which has been bent away from Conservatives for 20 years.

I'm fervently hoping for a May/June general election.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/12/2016 11:31 by malco.

 
MESSAGES->author
jayeatman (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 11:36
Quote:
malco
Zac Goldsmith ran an embarrassingy bad negative campaign for London Mayor and quite frankly got what he deserved.

I'm fervently hoping for a May/June general election.

Blimey, that's 2 things I agree with.
BTW, with 5-year fixed terms, how do you go about calling an early election? Preferably pre-Art50.

 
DanWiley
DanWiley (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 11:39
I think it would be a tactical error for May to get rid or Corbyn so soon. As you indicate, polls suggest she'll pick up by-elections generally so why rid yourselves of an ineffective opposition for something that will come with time anyway (other than the obvious moral/in-the-interests-of-the-country grounds)? I still think lib dems will improve because they've lost the stigma of their union with the tories to a degree, they were overly punished for that union so i think a correction is quite natural and like it or not malco there's potentially about 15 million votes in saying "we want to minimize brexit". If they actually had a leader, I could see a reaction to the current populist politics. Shame they don't really.

 
BBandW
BBandW (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 11:51
You cam't read too much into a single bi-election result, which normally has the status quo reset at the next general election.

The EU referendum itself was in effect a mid-term bi-election with a knee jerk outcome typical of bi-elections.Notable that the only Brexit party at the previous general election got one seat.

 
Bath Supporter Jack

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 11:58
A May election would mean that UKIP would have little time to "get going" as they, in my view are going to become a serious alternative protest force in UK politics.

Labour are in disarray......Liberals could pick up some seats......even with the useless Farron.

The question would be how Conservative and Labour Remainers vote.......could they bring themselves to vote for a Liberal candidate?

 
MESSAGES->author
jayeatman (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 12:07
With the referendum done, no Euro-MPs (soon) and Farage gone (permanently we hope), UKIP are going to rapidly fade away. The Tories have moved in on their territory and are now the Brexit party. Trying to move in on some Labour seats in the North won't work.

 
MESSAGES->author
hasta (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 12:13
In order to call a general election you need either:

a) a 2/3rds majority
b) a motion of no-confidence in the government

Also, currently the electoral boundaries etc. favour Labour (in terms of % vote share needed to win a majority). The proposal to cut down MPs to 600 and redraw the boundaries is unlikely to be passed for a couple of years.

There is no appetite in the Tory machinery for another campaign. I can't see May taking the risk. It makes no political sense to do this.

To be clear on Richmond though - the Tories campaigned for Goldsmith. Don't pretend this wasn't a defeat for them. Yes, Richmond is not representative of the country, but there's an awful lot of Tory constituencies close to London without a clear Leave win with Lib Dems willing to make a big deal about it - and with a narrative the media will report on that the Lib Dems are credible again. A lot of those constituencies won't be super happy with Tory policy on schools and the NHS. May has a very small working majority.

Tl;dr - yes this result shouldn't be overplayed - but it shouldn't be underplayed either.

And good riddance to Goldsmith.

 
malco
malco (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 12:14
Quote:
DanWiley
I think it would be a tactical error for May to get rid or Corbyn so soon. As you indicate, polls suggest she'll pick up by-elections generally so why rid yourselves of an ineffective opposition for something that will come with time anyway (other than the obvious moral/in-the-interests-of-the-country grounds)? I still think lib dems will improve because they've lost the stigma of their union with the tories to a degree, they were overly punished for that union so i think a correction is quite natural and like it or not malco there's potentially about 15 million votes in saying "we want to minimize brexit". If they actually had a leader, I could see a reaction to the current populist politics. Shame they don't really.

WHy do you think losing a general election would mean theend for Corbyn? All his support is in his membership and all his opposition is within his MPs. Losing his MPs will strengthen his position!

I think UKIP will blow Labour out of the water in the North. A general election will be really bad news for remainers, with MPs of all parties being forced to either stick to their instincts, as Goldsmith has just done, or decide to represent the views of their constituents. With 63 per cent of constituencies voting to leave we will see a combination of MPs failing to represent their constituents being voted out of Parliament and some Remainer MPs doing an about turn in a desperate attempt to hold onto their seats.

 
Blessing
WilliamBlessing (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 12:45
Thanks for clearing that up for me Malco.

 
DanWiley
DanWiley (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 12:56
"All his support is in his membership and all his opposition is within his MPs."

His support is from the unions and, I have to be honest, fairly corrupt at that. If it continues this way it's just the end of the Labour party as we know it. Which might be a good thing, even the name is an anachronism. Perhaps that side of politics needs a reboot? An election sooner rather than later will only bring that forward.


"I think UKIP will blow Labour out of the water in the North. "

Someone will benefit from Labour's demise, I don't think it will be UKIP who are now a busted flush and even more so when it's shown they can't deliver on most of the things they promise and where they can it makes things worse for the people who support them.

 
gaz59
gaz59 (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 13:10
Interesting take on Sadiq Khan, Malco - where do you have the substance for the allegation he is an ineffective who has already backtracked on all his main promises?

There are many in the Labour party and the periphery who see him as the character around whom decent, reasonable centre - left people in and around London will start to move towards

Not saying he will emerge as a potential party leader but certainly someone who is capable of keeping enough people on board until the right candidate does emerge

By all means rubbish Richmond as a rogue result, a Remain backlash and comeuppance for an incompetent campaigner but many others see the scale of the Lib Dems victory as a clear indictment of the inept handling of Brexit and further evidence of politicians wildly and widely out of touch with the rest of us

 
MESSAGES->author
woodpecker (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 13:11
Dont know how true it is, but heard that 1/3 of previous tory remainers voted lib dem as they think the hardliners have taken over the tory party

 
malco
malco (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 13:18
Quote:
gaz59
Interesting take on Sadiq Khan, Malco - where do you have the substance for the allegation he is an ineffective who has already backtracked on all his main promises?
There are many in the Labour party and the periphery who see him as the character around whom decent, reasonable centre - left people in and around London will start to move towards

Not saying he will emerge as a potential party leader but certainly someone who is capable of keeping enough people on board until the right candidate does emerge

By all means rubbish Richmond as a rogue result, a Remain backlash and comeuppance for an incompetent campaigner but many others see the scale of the Lib Dems victory as a clear indictment of the inept handling of Brexit and further evidence of politicians wildly and widely out of touch with the rest of us

[metro.co.uk]

[www.mayorwatch.co.uk]

[www.independent.co.uk]

[order-order.com]

 
MESSAGES->author
CoochieCoo (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 13:32
Quote:
Bath Supporter Jack
Dear Mr CC
How can Article 50 be served when the Supreme Court are deliberating on the process?

By debating it in parliament and getting a vote to trigger it, instead of faffing around spending money on the courts to deliberate. May missed a trick there should have called for the debate as soon as the HC made their decision.



http://zdgzqa.bay.livefilestore.com/y1p7Mwi7pLXeM89TY2KFdDQ-UUDGSv1FKNdhYdrW-koAuRN3tsqCPfE3onFxuO-3cZ0057Tom1uJai3vjkz3dvY_Q/1998%20Euro%20Champs.jpg http://zdgzqa.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pFul9UAV5zEXOzeRc1kmmlgDKXTYTIlTnGoQzYelH6KzdCeU-exN0IGo74QN2OGvlSoEiVjzAESvHx9BFlBsNFA/Bath%202008.jpg

 
malco
malco (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 13:37
Quote:
woodpecker
Dont know how true it is, but heard that 1/3 of previous tory remainers voted lib dem as they think the hardliners have taken over the tory party

That's completely untrue. The vast majority of the party is now united and behind Brexit. The truth is that many Conservatives in Richmond simply chose not to bother last night because they were hacked off with Goldsmith.

 
DanWiley
DanWiley (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 13:40
There's a difference between Tory voters and party members. Mind you, I don't think it's true to say the party is united behind brexit, I don't think that's true of the parliamentary party and I don't see why a fair percentage of your grass roots party would have changed their minds?

 
malco
malco (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 13:50
Disaster for Sarah Olney. [order-order.com]

 
MESSAGES->author
hasta (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 13:57
Re: Sadiq - he's the only time in my life I've voted for a Labour candidate.

He has frozen bus and tube individual fares. Travelcards allow access to the commuter train network as well - which isn't controlled by TfL. So if individual fares rise there it directly impacts a travel card. Sure, you could argue it's spin, but it's not even close to being on the scale of the £350m outright lie.

Sadiq has done a pretty good job so far at representing London and has deliberately acted to try and build bridge between communities - something the government and Labour leadership have utterly failed to do. Not perfect. But a hell of a lot better than a bumbling narcissist or a dilettante racist.

 
DanWiley
DanWiley (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 13:58
Have you read the actual transcript, it doesn't take long. I think you might be over playing it a bit.

 
MESSAGES->author
hasta (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 14:01
Quote:
malco
Disaster for Sarah Olney. [order-order.com]

'Disaster'. Please.

 
malco
malco (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 14:30
Quote:
hasta
Quote:
malco
Disaster for Sarah Olney. [order-order.com]

'Disaster'. Please.

Have you listened to it? What words would you use to describe it? A perfect demonstration of the anti democratic and authoritarian approach the Liberal Democrats have taken on the entire Brexit issue.

 
MESSAGES->author
hasta (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 14:40
Yes I have. Hartley-Brewer tries (repeatedly) to draw an analogy between the referendum - a yes/no question which necessarily has one side with more than 50% - and a by-election - a multi-person choice where getting > 50% of the vote is rare. She (and you) might know what you voted for, but given the government seems to change their mind daily it's not unreasonable to assume that everyone didn't think they were getting the same result. Her 'gotcha' point that 'every remain campaigner said a vote to leave the EU was a vote to leave the single market' isn't even held up by David Davis.

When you say 'anti democratic' and 'authoritarian' about people asking for a vote you know how silly you look, right?

 
annie blackthorn
annie blackthorn (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 15:04
Belittling Zac Goldsmith, for whom I don't hold a particular brief, when he had the principled guts (and of course financial independence) to keep a promise to his electorate that if the proposed runway at Heathrow went ahead he would resign from Conservative Party, is petty.

It is a Conservative Government that has given the go-ahead for this, to the detriment of most of the poor sods living in Richmond and elsewhere on the flightpath so no wonder they voted for the likeliest candidate. The 'medja' obsessively believe it was simply about "Brexit" but I'll bet quite a few Conservatives either did not vote or did a protest vote about the number of extra very noisy polluting 'planes likely to be flying over them in a few years time. The Liberals threw the kitchen sink and house foundations (i.e. every available activist and most of their election piggybank at Richmond, just as they did at Witney) and their crowing this morning is farcical. 10-day wonder again.



Matt Garvey - one to add to my List of Forward Talented Adoptees since 2003/4!

 
malco
malco (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 15:10
Quote:
annie blackthorn
Belittling Zac Goldsmith, for whom I don't hold a particular brief, when he had the principled guts (and of course financial independence) to keep a promise to his electorate that if the proposed runway at Heathrow went ahead he would resign from Conservative Party, is petty.
It is a Conservative Government that has given the go-ahead for this, to the detriment of most of the poor sods living in Richmond and elsewhere on the flightpath so no wonder they voted for the likeliest candidate. The 'medja' obsessively believe it was simply about "Brexit" but I'll bet quite a few Conservatives either did not vote or did a protest vote about the number of extra very noisy polluting 'planes likely to be flying over them in a few years time. The Liberals threw the kitchen sink and house foundations (i.e. every available activist and most of their election piggybank at Richmond, just as they did at Witney) and their crowing this morning is farcical. 10-day wonder again.

The only residents of Richmond who I have any sympathy for are those who have lived there since before Heathrow was established in 1953.

I have nothing but contempt for people who move under the flightpath of the busiest airport in the world and then complain about the noise of aeroplanes.

 
MESSAGES->author
hasta (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 15:17
Quote:
annie blackthorn
Belittling Zac Goldsmith, for whom I don't hold a particular brief, when he had the principled guts (and of course financial independence) to keep a promise to his electorate that if the proposed runway at Heathrow went ahead he would resign from Conservative Party, is petty.
It is a Conservative Government that has given the go-ahead for this, to the detriment of most of the poor sods living in Richmond and elsewhere on the flightpath so no wonder they voted for the likeliest candidate. The 'medja' obsessively believe it was simply about "Brexit" but I'll bet quite a few Conservatives either did not vote or did a protest vote about the number of extra very noisy polluting 'planes likely to be flying over them in a few years time. The Liberals threw the kitchen sink and house foundations (i.e. every available activist and most of their election piggybank at Richmond, just as they did at Witney) and their crowing this morning is farcical. 10-day wonder again.

I belittle Goldsmith because he's a racist. I'm comfortable with that. The 'medja' obsessively believe it was about Brexit because it was. The LibDems, and Goldsmith, both have the same policy on Heathrow.

 
MESSAGES->author
woodpecker (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 15:26
Quote:
malco
Quote:
annie blackthorn
Belittling Zac Goldsmith, for whom I don't hold a particular brief, when he had the principled guts (and of course financial independence) to keep a promise to his electorate that if the proposed runway at Heathrow went ahead he would resign from Conservative Party, is petty.
It is a Conservative Government that has given the go-ahead for this, to the detriment of most of the poor sods living in Richmond and elsewhere on the flightpath so no wonder they voted for the likeliest candidate. The 'medja' obsessively believe it was simply about "Brexit" but I'll bet quite a few Conservatives either did not vote or did a protest vote about the number of extra very noisy polluting 'planes likely to be flying over them in a few years time. The Liberals threw the kitchen sink and house foundations (i.e. every available activist and most of their election piggybank at Richmond, just as they did at Witney) and their crowing this morning is farcical. 10-day wonder again.

The only residents of Richmond who I have any sympathy for are those who have lived there since before Heathrow was established in 1953.

I have nothing but contempt for people who move under the flightpath of the busiest airport in the world and then complain about the noise of aeroplanes.


I agree it serves them right the morons

 
MESSAGES->author
hasta (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 15:33
Given I have lived in that constituency and currently live pretty close to the Heathrow flight path I can understand people's frustration with the noise. It can start from 5:30am and be every 30s or so. The third runway will be to the north of Heathrow so wouldn't impact Richmond as much as it would where I live.

In an ideal world we would expand another airport. But there really isn't a sensible alternative. Gatwick is an absolute transport nightmare - other than the train line, the only other route into central London is a mostly single carriageway road through residential south London. At least Heathrow, for all its problems, has train, tube and four major multi-lane roads (M40, M4, A4, M3) in close proximity. Building an airport in the estuary is a pipe dream that would cost an absolute fortune.

 
Rolfs_Cartoon_Club
@Hydor18 (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 15:35
One thing Richmond is not is a litmus on Brexit. It was squarely in the remain court, and Goldsmith was at odds with his constituents.

The real test will be in a firmly "out" Labour constituency in Wales or the North of England where the sitting MP campaigned for remain. Then we'll see some feathers fly!

 
MESSAGES->author
hasta (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 15:42
It's not a national litmus on Brexit, I agree. It was about Brexit though.

 
MESSAGES->author
jayeatman (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 15:51
Quote:
malco
The only residents of Richmond who I have any sympathy for are those who have lived there since before Heathrow was established in 1953.

I have nothing but contempt for people who move under the flightpath of the busiest airport in the world and then complain about the noise of aeroplanes.

Says malco, ignoring anyone under the age of 63.

 
malco
malco (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 16:32
Quote:
jayeatman
Quote:
malco
The only residents of Richmond who I have any sympathy for are those who have lived there since before Heathrow was established in 1953.

I have nothing but contempt for people who move under the flightpath of the busiest airport in the world and then complain about the noise of aeroplanes.

Says malco, ignoring anyone under the age of 63.

I don't see how anybody can expect sympathy if they move near to Heathrow Airport and are bothered by the sound of aeroplanes.

Had the same thing at the airfield I used to fly from, where a housing estate was built nearby and the complaints immediately came flooding in.

It's no different to the townie moving into the village and complaining about the farmyard smells or the church bells.

Or the person moving to Bath and then complaining about the rugby club on the Rec...

 
MESSAGES->author
hasta (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 16:35
They're complaining about it increasing along with more air pollution Malco. Not that it exists at all.

 
MESSAGES->author
jayeatman (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 16:55
Quote:
malco
Quote:
jayeatman
Quote:
malco
The only residents of Richmond who I have any sympathy for are those who have lived there since before Heathrow was established in 1953.

I have nothing but contempt for people who move under the flightpath of the busiest airport in the world and then complain about the noise of aeroplanes.

Says malco, ignoring anyone under the age of 63.

I don't see how anybody can expect sympathy if they move near to Heathrow Airport and are bothered by the sound of aeroplanes.

Had the same thing at the airfield I used to fly from, where a housing estate was built nearby and the complaints immediately came flooding in.

It's no different to the townie moving into the village and complaining about the farmyard smells or the church bells.

Or the person moving to Bath and then complaining about the rugby club on the Rec...

It looks like I'm going to have to explain: There is a certain class of people who live in the area but have neither moved there before 1953 OR decided to move there after 1953. See if you can work out who they are?

 
MESSAGES->author
woodpecker (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
02 December, 2016 16:59
But still if you live in London, a place with quite a lot of cars and people and commerce etc. and you live right next to a massive fuk off airport and given the fact that in general things like people/cars commerce/travel increase, you might struggle to say you are surprised by the fact there will be more planes

 
Blessing
WilliamBlessing (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
03 December, 2016 05:32
The judges and the people: Next week, 11 unaccountable individuals will consider a case that could thwart the will of the majority on Brexit. The Mail makes no apology for revealing their views - and many have links to Europe

[www.dailymail.co.uk]

 
Bath Hammer
Bath Hammer (IP Logged)

Re: OT UK Politics
03 December, 2016 08:57
So what is your view William???

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Bath Poll

Where do you think we'll finish this season?

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