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MESSAGES->author
jayeatman (IP Logged)

2017/18 Squad almost complete?
23 February, 2017 16:39
So with the recent welter of announcements, comings and goings, apart from a marquee TH and a 3rd FH, the squad looks pretty complete.
Or do we think there could be any further signings?
Are we still over-manned in the back row?
Is Guy Mercer surplus to requirements?



BATH supporter since 1975

Adopted players:
2015/6 Tom Homer
2016/7 Matt Banahan
2017/8 Jeff Williams



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 24/02/2017 09:56 by Stuart Anderton.

 
opti
Optimist (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
23 February, 2017 16:46
I reckon there's still a bit of tidying up to do.I would have thought Mercer would want to play some rugby and he isn't going to get that at Bath next year. Is Denton a bit of a luxury when Mercer has come through so strongly. Are Fruean/Taps here for the long term? If Jeff Williams is finished will he be replaced (maybe by the Welsh lad who is currently on trial).

 
Danchinho
Danchinho (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
23 February, 2017 16:53
Cook could be off. Be surprised if Sisi is kept on too.
Knight is here to the end of the season, be surprised if he's resigned.
I'd be thinking about my career if i was KPN or VV.



I probably don't know what i'm talking about.

 
HamishMilner
Big Dog (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
23 February, 2017 17:03
KPN will stay as 3rd/4th choice I imagine (certainly won't be allowed to go until someone signed on at least). VV I believe is being trained to cover LH as well as Hooker apparently.

A third choice FH would be nice - perhaps a young up and comer to replace Hastings who seems to defo be leaving e.g. Billy Searle?

Tapuai signed for a couple of years I believe so will be staying. Fruean likely to be kept on but has such an awful injury history I wonder whether he would only replace Bowden in playing about 6 games a year...

Out and Out centres in squad defo confirmed for next year are only
Clark
Tapuai
JJ

With Brew/ Banners/ Roko able to cover at a push and Fruean/ Jennings able to play there but unsure on future. If Bristol go down maybe Hurrell a shout as is an out and out 13 and different option to JJ??

I see us still requiring the following therefore;
- 3rd choice FH
- 1st team quality TH (either top quality or can share with Thomas- injury free preferred)
- A centre > Fruean signed on permanently if can overcome injuries or another option

Possibilities to look into:
- A second row (Ewels/Attwood/Charteris/Stooke 4 strong options, a 5th out and out 2nd row may be useful although Douglas/Garvey/Ellis can cover)
- A scrum half (If Cook leaves - although Allinson signed up fulltime and have Homer and Kahn)

 
MESSAGES->author
jayeatman (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
23 February, 2017 17:19
I assume:
Sisi off.
Phillips replaces Williams.
Cook stays.
Fruean stays.
KPN stays and one or possibly both of Knight/Nixon leaves.

Who from the academy might get senior contracts:
Zach already announced.
Obano, Douglas, Davies?



BATH supporter since 1975

Adopted players:
2015/6 Tom Homer
2016/7 Matt Banahan
2017/8 Jeff Williams

 
HamishMilner
Big Dog (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
23 February, 2017 17:27
Quote:
jayeatman
Who from the academy might get senior contracts:
Zach already announced.
Obano, Douglas, Davies?

Very very glad Zach has been announced.

I suspect Obano has a chance of getting one if they keep Lahiff at TH permanently but Obano would still be 4th choice LH in my opinion behind Catt, Auterac and Lahiff as work to be done on his scrummaging.

Douglas and Davies will remain Academy players though I reckon until at least next season.

 
BathOtter
BathOtter (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
23 February, 2017 17:27
Nixon signed until 2019 I believe, so he's not off... Believe he is a loose head though?

 
MESSAGES->author
BathSalmon (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
23 February, 2017 17:42
You beat me to this Jayeatman! I was compiling the following for 2017-18 season.

My take on things:

Ages as at 1st Sept 2017

LH Nathan Catt (29) Nick Auterac (24) *Beno Obano (22) Sam Nixon (21) Will Vaughan (21)
HK Ross Batty (30) Tom Dunn (24) Jack Walker (21) Michael van Vurren (25) Gabriel Oghre (19)
TH Henry Thomas (26) Max Lahiff (27) AN Other (?) Kane Palma-Newport (26) Jack Edmonson (20)

LK Luke Charteris (34) Charlie Ewels (21)
LK Dave Attwood (30) Elliott Stooke (23) *Levi Douglas (22) Alex Humfrey (23)
BF Matt Garvey (29) Tom Ellis (22) David Sisi (24) Josh Bayliss (19)
OF Francios Louw (32) Sam Underhill (21) Guy Mercer (C) (27) Sid Blackmore (20)
N8 Taulupe Faletau (26) David Denton (27) Zach Mercer (20) Paul Grant (29)

SH Kahn Fotuali'i (35) Chris Cook (26) Will Homer (21) Darren Allinson (29)
FH Rhys Priestland (30) Freddie Burns (27) Rory Jennings (21)
LW Matt Banahan (30) Aled Brew (31) Harry Davies (23)
IC Ben Tapuai (28) Robbie Fruean (29)
OC Jonathan Joseph (26) Max Clark (21)
RW Semesa Rokoduguni (30) Jack Wilson (27) **Levi Davis (?)
FB Anthony Watson (23) Tom Homer (27) Darren Atkins (20)

* Anticipated academy promotion
** Anticipated addition to the academy

Assuming contract extensions signed for:
Kane Palma-Newport
Matt Garvey
David Sisi
Paul Grant
Robbie Fruean
Michael van Vurren

Assuming contract not renewed for:
Darryl Marfo
Shaun Knight
Jeff Williams

Gives a:
Senior squad of 42
Academy of 10

Salmon



Adopted Player 17-18 & 16-17: Dave Attwood
Adopted Player 15-16: Matt Garvey

 
MESSAGES->author
jayeatman (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
23 February, 2017 17:45
My mistake. Makes Marfo unlikely to stay on.
If a marquee TH is signed, does that make Knight surplus to requirements?



BATH supporter since 1975

Adopted players:
2015/6 Tom Homer
2016/7 Matt Banahan
2017/8 Jeff Williams

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
23 February, 2017 17:55
BD Searle would be crazy to join us next season - he can do better than our third choice warming the bench if he's lucky.

 
MESSAGES->author
jayeatman (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
23 February, 2017 18:06
Ha ha BS, I knew somebody would do the hard yards and list the squad. I'm too lazy!
95% agree with you.
Don't think Rory cuts it as a 3rd FH.
Don't think Sisi and G Mercer will both survive.
There'll be more academy comings and goings but Levi Davis is a good shout.



BATH supporter since 1975

Adopted players:
2015/6 Tom Homer
2016/7 Matt Banahan
2017/8 Jeff Williams

 
by
by (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
23 February, 2017 18:11
I think Knight will end up being retained, hes worked hard on his fitness and given a full preseason I think he'll make a useful addition to squad. Marfo probably depends on if Lahiff goes back to LH and how well Nixon does.

Surely Denton will be let go once his contract is up, just isn't an efficient use of the cap.

Another TH, another lock and another FH is what I'm hoping for.

Also I noticed that Bath united had an unlisted TH Kieran Verden who has been leading them out for the last few games. Can't find much on him other than that he was part of the England u16 squad last year.

 
MESSAGES->author
BathSalmon (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
23 February, 2017 18:21
Personally I think if we keep hold of those I listed in the contract extensions, I think we have the basis of a very stable and comprehensive squad.

I'd like to see another TH join. I don't see Shaun Knight having produced enough, but happy to be convinced otherwise. I don't see Knight staying AND a new TH signing happening at the same time.

Continuity is what I'd really like to see. This squad is becoming very unified and it showing in their performances.

Reducing the turnover in players should help Todd and Tabs impliment their playing strucures in more detail.

One thing I have picked up on the Wasps site is that Wade's contract is up in the summer - I wouldn't say no to signing him!

Give Jennings time to show what he can offer. He's one of our own and we should disguard them as easily as we did Devoto.

 
by
by (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
23 February, 2017 18:27
Blackadder has already mentioned that Knight was playing well, hes only 26, I'm certain that he'll come good, but your right, hopefully not at the expense of better TH.

I'd like to see Jennings get a run of games at 10, for whatever reason hes been denied that 10 shirt by Hastings and Herron, even though he was Englands u20 10.

 
Substitute
Substitute (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
23 February, 2017 20:20
Quote:
by
I'd like to see Jennings get a run of games at 10, for whatever reason hes been denied that 10 shirt by... Herron...

How many games did Herron play for the Senior side? I must have missed them.

 
BathOtter
BathOtter (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
23 February, 2017 20:48
Quote:
Substitute
Quote:
by
I'd like to see Jennings get a run of games at 10, for whatever reason hes been denied that 10 shirt by... Herron...

How many games did Herron play for the Senior side? I must have missed them.

Not the best on statbunker, if that is even the best source, but couldn't find a single appearance from Herron in the BBW... Only Roslyn Park and Ulster

 
MESSAGES->author
BathSalmon (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
23 February, 2017 21:21
Maybe add Will Partington to the academy next year.

Looks useful!

[www.fifteenrugby.com]

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
23 February, 2017 21:34
Quote:
BathSalmon
Maybe add Will Partington to the academy next year.
Looks useful!

[www.fifteenrugby.com]

Yes have seen him play a few times for the Beechen AASE, talented kid. Young de Glanville selected for England age grade too.

 
Boldngrey
Boldngrey (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
23 February, 2017 22:16
Garvie is having his second major operation on his neck.


It would be very sad, but not entirely surprising, if that was career threatening.

 
Dragon13
ElTorro (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
23 February, 2017 22:19
Quote:
Boldngrey
Garvie is having his second major operation on his neck.

It would be very sad, but not entirely surprising, if that was career threatening.

Second this year? As in the first Op didn't work? Or second in his career following the one a few years ago?

 
Boldngrey
Boldngrey (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
23 February, 2017 22:25
From the Chron 23 Feb 17

'I've already got a titanium disc in my neck from 2011. This time the disc below that has burst and put pressure on my spinal cord, so I've got to have more titanium put in.
When I had the operation five years ago I remember thinking: "Will I ever play again?"

When you've got kids, especially, you think about the potential consequences of an injury. There are priorities and you have to think about your quality of life as well.'

Read more at [www.bathchronicle.co.uk]
ll-his-limbs/story-30051252-detail/story.html#mDj1fgTGkxBQhc6W.99


Officially out for 3 months.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 23/02/2017 22:26 by Boldngrey.

 
Dragon13
ElTorro (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
23 February, 2017 22:34
Damn. He is a really good player. Let's hope he makes a recovery at least for his long term health if nothing else.

 
Boldngrey
Boldngrey (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
23 February, 2017 22:38
Me to.

I speak as someone who suffers badly from neck pain largely as a result of rugby.

 
Dragon13
ElTorro (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
23 February, 2017 22:42
Too many examples of paralysis. Neck and back need to be looked after.

 
by
by (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
23 February, 2017 23:27
Quote:
BathOtter
Quote:
Substitute
Quote:
by
I'd like to see Jennings get a run of games at 10, for whatever reason hes been denied that 10 shirt by... Herron...

How many games did Herron play for the Senior side? I must have missed them.

Not the best on statbunker, if that is even the best source, but couldn't find a single appearance from Herron in the BBW... Only Roslyn Park and Ulster

I was referring to Bath united where I believe Herron was 10, Jennings at 12, Hastings on the bench. Might be wrong, this was a couple of seasons ago.

 
nick holder
nick holder (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
24 February, 2017 10:31
Not sure why there are comments on here ref Chris Cook leaving, I thought he signed an two/three year deal at end of 2015 season

 
MESSAGES->author
BathSalmon (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
24 February, 2017 10:36
I agree. I think he's contracted till the end of 18/19 season.

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
24 February, 2017 10:58
Quote:
nick holder
Not sure why there are comments on here ref Chris Cook leaving, I thought he signed an two/three year deal at end of 2015 season

If he signed a 2 year contract in 2015 (it was Feb) then surely he would be off at the end of this season having played the 15/16 and 16/17 seasons?! The atricles at that time don't stipulate duration that I can see.

 
Bath Hammer
Bath Hammer (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
24 February, 2017 11:10
Quote:
BathMatt53
BD Searle would be crazy to join us next season - he can do better than our third choice warming the bench if he's lucky.
I hope I'm wrong but I expect FB & RP to be injured for periods of time, unlike GF, so a higher quality f/h like Searle could well get regular slots on the bench or occasionally starts.

 
Danchinho
Danchinho (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
24 February, 2017 11:20
Quote:
BathSalmon
Maybe add Will Partington to the academy next year.
Looks useful!

[www.fifteenrugby.com]

He certainly needs a step up in level because he's too good for that lot!

 
Bathovalballer
Bathovalballer (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
24 February, 2017 12:11
First and most important is Garvey makes a full recovery and is able to lead a normal life again. Sincerely hope so and we all wish him the best of luck with the new op.

Whether or not he is able to play any rugby again, particularly at the very attritional Premiership level, is IMO very much in the balance. I am sure he is sensible enough to put his long term health and family first and as much as I and most others want him back in the BB & W that has to be his first considerations. Get well soon big man, we certainly miss your selfless play and huge defensive tackling around the breakdown area.

Personally I hope we can develop Cookie further as he has shown flashes of a huge talent but has weaknesses in his game.

Again I am very ambivalent about Denton who has never in my eyes shown anything like his international experience or form when playing for us. I believe we should either cut his salary or let him go. Much rather we kept the younger Sisi who given a full preseason and injury free period could become the player Denton used to be and would probably be much cheaper.

Also Guy Mercer should be let go as he has never looked like being a top class AP player to me. Just not big or strong enough.

Shaun Knight was an absolutely devastating scrummagger when he first played for Gloucester at 18/19. If he can stay fit, he could be a very useful tighthead indeed. Well worth keeping along with KPN as squad players. I am sorry but Lahiff is not as devastating at scrum times as we need at TH although his work around the field is immense. He is 26/27 and should now be coming into his prime as a prop, so IMO we should use him at LH only. Therefore we need a new TH as a priority, someone more experienced than Henry and who is big, tough and strong in the scrum.

Fruen's run of injuries concerns me in that he cannot stay fit and again has never inspired huge confidence in his past abilities. Possibly he should be retained for 12 months, but not longer if he cannot get and stay fit. We cannot afford to have another like Bowden or Williams before him taking up a squad place.

IMO we don't need much tweaking apart from a new TH and possibly a top quality centre or flyhalf, someone like Henry Slade.

He would be a wonderful signing for us although probably away with England for much of the season. I have talked to Henry and his parents on occasions and know how embedded he is with Exeter and it would a seismic change of heart for him to be persuaded to leave, especially as it appears he is to take on the main playmaker, 10 and kicking role for the Chiefs. His horrific injury put him back but he is slowly getting back to his very best. IMO if we want an English qualified player who could become World class ( and IMO offer more than George Ford) he is worth breaking the bank for. I cannot see it happening but live in hope and who knows what the future might hold.

 
by
by (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
24 February, 2017 12:46
BathSalmon, similar to what you've done I've created a spreadsheet but contains all players that are confirmed, still in negotiations for an extension and only players who have made first team appearances.

http://i.imgur.com/Uz0JYBo.jpg?1

To me it highlights TH, Lock and wings as positions weak in depth.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 24/02/2017 12:49 by by.

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
24 February, 2017 12:50
lol, do none of you guys work?? Gotta love a spreadsheet though, especially one with coloured cells.

(Personally I think that you need to add - in amber maybe? - players to groups who can cover. We have plenty of wings when Watson and Davies etc are added. Similarly we have masses of back rows who are interchangeable and Denton and Garvey can cover lock too which would make those look better.)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 24/02/2017 12:54 by BathMatt53.

 
by
by (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
24 February, 2017 12:51
slow day in the office (network issues)

 
MESSAGES->author
BathSalmon (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
24 February, 2017 13:43
It's Friday, no one is ever in the office on Friday! Plus my boss is on leave!

 
MESSAGES->author
BathSalmon (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
24 February, 2017 13:46
Quote:
by
BathSalmon, similar to what you've done I've created a spreadsheet but contains all players that are confirmed, still in negotiations for an extension and only players who have made first team appearances.
http://i.imgur.com/Uz0JYBo.jpg?1

To me it highlights TH, Lock and wings as positions weak in depth.

I have a spreadsheet too, but I colour code mine to show who is available and who is injured. It's looking very red at the minute!!

 
ChippenhamRoman
ChippenhamRoman (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
24 February, 2017 13:56
Wrong thread and wrong comment



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 24/02/2017 13:57 by ChippenhamRoman.

 
BathOtter
BathOtter (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
24 February, 2017 18:45
Quote:
by
Quote:
BathOtter
Quote:
Substitute
Quote:
by
I'd like to see Jennings get a run of games at 10, for whatever reason hes been denied that 10 shirt by... Herron...

How many games did Herron play for the Senior side? I must have missed them.

Not the best on statbunker, if that is even the best source, but couldn't find a single appearance from Herron in the BBW... Only Roslyn Park and Ulster

I was referring to Bath united where I believe Herron was 10, Jennings at 12, Hastings on the bench. Might be wrong, this was a couple of seasons ago.

Apologies, re-reading this it seems a bit aggressive!! Didn't mean it to sound that way! More that Herron when he left seemed to be a big miss on this site, but having found him to have no senior appearances on statbunker I was shocked - absence and heart growing fonder etc...

 
MESSAGES->author
jayeatman (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
27 February, 2017 09:53
After yesterday's car crash, I hope I'm wrong about the squad being almost complete. If Cook, Priestland and Mercer G find themselves on the way at the end of this season, I won't object.
I don't see Marfo as being more than a stop-gap.
And what is the point of van Vuuren if all he's going to be trusted with is 5mins?

 
by
by (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
27 February, 2017 10:31
Marfo needs to get fit first, its too early to judge otherwise.

Completely agree about Van Vuuren though, Batty started to make a lot of passive tackles in the midfield around the 65 minute mark, worrying that he wasn't subbed. Rumoured that we Chris Brooker is coming to bath today as injury replacement for Dunn.

 
HamishMilner
Big Dog (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
27 February, 2017 14:30
After Sunday I have decided we need more than I had hoped tbh!!

A good second choice/first choice challenging scrum half being the main one. Cook was poor and Fotuali'i at 35 is the undisputed number 1 first choice scrum half! He needs decent competition/someone to share the game time with!

If Chris Brooker is coming to Bath he will definitely make more appearances in the last few weeks of this season than he did in his previous 4 years with us! Think he made 2 appearances only!!

 
MESSAGES->author
jayeatman (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
27 February, 2017 16:12
When he signed for Bath, Marfo was a already professional playing for a professional club. It is a sorry indictment of both him and LW if he really is that unfit.



BATH supporter since 1975

Adopted players:
2015/6 Tom Homer
2016/7 Matt Banahan
2017/8 Jeff Williams

 
MESSAGES->author
BathSalmon (IP Logged)

Re: 2016/7 Squad almost complete?
07 May, 2017 20:52
Quote:
BathSalmon
Maybe add Will Partington to the academy next year.
Looks useful!

[www.fifteenrugby.com]

Turns out Bath might think so too!

Partington just tweeted to say he's "excited to start professionally for Bath in June"

Good signing.

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
07 May, 2017 21:22
Given that we could do with adding another centre it's a shame that Francis Saili is looking like going to Quins to replace Roberts.

[www.independent.ie]

 
MESSAGES->author
BathSalmon (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
07 May, 2017 21:35
I liked the look of Charlie Ngatai for the Chiefs on the weekend.

26yr old, 16 stone inside centre that the commentators were raving about. Surely not on the All Black radar (at least I don't think so!)!

Worth a punt.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/05/2017 05:43 by BathSalmon.

 
BathBurger
BathBurger (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
07 May, 2017 23:11
Quote:
BathSalmon
I liked the look of Charlie Nagatai for the Chiefs on the weekend.
26yr old, 16 stone inside centre that the commentators were raving about. Surely not on the All Black radar (at least I don't think so!)!

Worth a punt.

I think this is a great shout! Laumape/Sonny Bill are the contenders for the All Blacks 12 jersey so he might not be totally out of the picture.

 
MESSAGES->author
joethefanatic (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
08 May, 2017 04:22
Quote:
BathBurger
Quote:
BathSalmon
I liked the look of Charlie Nagatai for the Chiefs on the weekend.
26yr old, 16 stone inside centre that the commentators were raving about. Surely not on the All Black radar (at least I don't think so!)!

Worth a punt.

I think this is a great shout! Laumape/Sonny Bill are the contenders for the All Blacks 12 jersey so he might not be totally out of the picture.

He absolutely is on the AB radar (and has already played for them), having just returned from nasty concussion related issues. The general view is that (fully fit), he offers mre than Crotty, SBW or Leinert-Brown, which is not too shabby.



... IMHO, of course.

Now in Honolulu

 
MESSAGES->author
BathSalmon (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
08 May, 2017 06:14
Quote:
joethefanatic
Quote:
BathBurger
Quote:
BathSalmon
I liked the look of Charlie Nagatai for the Chiefs on the weekend.
26yr old, 16 stone inside centre that the commentators were raving about. Surely not on the All Black radar (at least I don't think so!)!

Worth a punt.

I think this is a great shout! Laumape/Sonny Bill are the contenders for the All Blacks 12 jersey so he might not be totally out of the picture.

He absolutely is on the AB radar (and has already played for them), having just returned from nasty concussion related issues. The general view is that (fully fit), he offers mre than Crotty, SBW or Leinert-Brown, which is not too shabby.

He's got 1 cap back in 2015 in a one off test against Samoa (just looked at Wikipedia!)

1 cap at the age of 26 is hardly a resounding endorsement from the All Blacks.

Either way, I think it's this sort of player we should be targeting. Whether it's Ngatai or someone else. I'm not fussy.

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
08 May, 2017 06:27
Wow a full year out with concussion? I think that I would be worried to see him play, that's not good for the kid.

 
by
by (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
08 May, 2017 08:36
He was in really good form last year and was supposed to be ahead of Moala and Leinert-Brown in the pecking order but as others have already mentioned, he was forced to take a whole year off of rugby because of concussion.

I think he'll try and play his way back into the squad, Fekitoa is rumoured to be off to Europe and Crotty doesn't have size or age on his side, so there is a chance for him.

 
HamishMilner
Big Dog (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
08 May, 2017 11:23
Ngatai would be great but he is a very passionate Maori man, captains the NZ Maori side when fit and is definitely in All Black conversations.

I think they'll go with SBW and Crotty as 12 options for the Lions tour but Laumape and Ngatai are the longer term options going forward at 12 along with Lienert Brown.

Frankly I'd take any one of those 5 players to fill our midfield. I really like the look of Laumape this year. A try scoring centre who I think between him and his midfield partner Vince Aso at the Hurricanes have between them more tries than several teams in the competition haha!

 
MESSAGES->author
Lansdown12 (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
08 May, 2017 17:22
Ruan Pienaar is leaving Ulster and hasn't signed anywhere yet. Could be going to Montpelier but not confirmed. 32? Good 9 and backup 10.

Just saying.....

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
08 May, 2017 17:26
[www.irishtimes.com]

Announcement or not it sounds like a done deal to me.

Pienaar’s departure to Montpellier – brought about by the IRFU’s call not to allow the South African a contract extension after seven years at the club due to the requirement of an Irish-qualified player to play scrum-half at the northern province

 
MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
08 May, 2017 22:37
Well if AW and JJ are mates I'd say they are both staying, if there was any doubt Bruce wouldn't have missed out on Jason Woodward who has just signed for Glaws for cover.

 
by
by (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
09 May, 2017 08:39
[www.bathchronicle.co.uk]

Looks like Grant, G. Mercer and Williams are all in the process of signing a new deal.

Marfo, Charles, Brooker and Fruean are leaving.

 
DanWiley
DanWiley (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
09 May, 2017 09:11
I can't say I'm particularly disappointed or excited by any of those names, though I appreciate you need squad players. Fruean is possibly an exception, but I can't help but feel that we've had a look at his medical position and said "It's not worth whatever it would take."

I don't think we can say "because we didn't sign X, we know Y is staying" it just never seems to work like that.

I really can't see JJ or Watson going. I can't see how it would be down to Ford (either of them) or Blackadder. So if they are off it seems down to a more fundamental problem at the club and, whilst that was hinted at earlier, I don't see any evidence of it.

 
Danchinho
Danchinho (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
09 May, 2017 09:25
Keeping G. Mercer and Williams seems a bit of a waste to me.



I probably don't know what i'm talking about.

 
gaz59
gaz59 (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
09 May, 2017 10:00
Guy is one of the 'heartbeat of the club' players and every successful club in any sport needs a few of these and it shows the new coaches respect the contributions made by the less than stellar names in the squad when they arrived - great to see

Williams has speed and who knows if the coaches can work on other aspects of his game he could present a very different attacking option at times

Todd was very careful to spell out all the competitions we will be in next year and the need for a strong squad, all sound good to me

The only slight puzzle I have is why VV and not Charles? But that decision was made a while before Charles arrived and presumably the coaches had good reason

 
MESSAGES->author
JimDaff (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
09 May, 2017 10:08
Has VV actually played for the 1st XV yet? Seems odd that we're sending an international hooker away for an unproven squad player...

 
by
by (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
09 May, 2017 10:19
Yeah hes had a few appearances, hes definitely not a bad player.

 
MESSAGES->author
JimDaff (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
09 May, 2017 10:32
Quote:
by
Yeah hes had a few appearances, hes definitely not a bad player.

Thanks by, I thought he might have a couple of appearances from the bench but didn't think he had started. Just checked the offy and he played 18mins this season. Walker has only managed 3! The number 2 shirt really does have a curse on it this year!

 
dcsh
dcsh (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
09 May, 2017 10:37
There was talk of a positional change for VV at one point.

Interesting that Charles seems to have been behind Brooker and Batty in the recently match day squads, in fact I think the only time he started was when only he and Graham were available. Unless Charles is injured of course....

Guy is an interesting situation, a number of others have been picked ahead of him on the open side when Flouw hasn't been available including Denton and Ellis. Add to that competition from Underhill and Bayliss next season. But if we go for wholesale rotation by competition Guy can provide leadership in the lesser games.

Williams came in as a conversion project and bar a few outings towards the end of last season I haven't seen much from him, I wonder if energy would be better spent on a younger player.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/05/2017 11:27 by dcsh.

 
MESSAGES->author
hasta (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
09 May, 2017 11:28
Yeah, given how well Charles did in his one game it's certainly surprising he's been behind Brooker (in particular) who has been poor. Maybe some issue behind the scenes.

Keeping Guy Mercer around as an A team captain on a not exactly phenomenal wage is probably fine. Let's drop the 'club captain' stuff though please, he's nowhere near first XV.

 
MESSAGES->author
Which Tyler (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
09 May, 2017 12:32
Quote:
Danchinho
Keeping G. Mercer and Williams seems a bit of a waste to me.
Would you be saying that if our injury crisis had been at flanker or wing this year instead of #8 and hooker?
On the one hand we have calls that we really NEED a prem quality 5th choice hooker; and on the other we're told that having a 3rd choice OSF is a bit of a waste.


As for Charles vs Van Vuuren - one of those is on a multiple-season contract, and one was short-term cover until the end of the season, with no guarantee that he wants to stay in England longer, let alone Bath; whilst MVV would require us to pay off his existing contract (or find someone to take him) whilst costing 1/3 as much from the salary cap.



A man who cannot change his mind, cannot change anything
http://www.rugbyrebels.co/board/download/file.php?id=377
RAEBURN SHIELD

 
Danchinho
Danchinho (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
09 May, 2017 13:07
Mercer isn't 3rd choice as far as i can see. Flouw, Ellis and even Denton have played there. Then we have Underhill coming in. If VV is meant to be a conversion project to a Flanker he's hardly built for 6 is he?
As for Williams, we need better wings. I'd like to have seen him play more but it seems (when he was fit) the coaches didn't fancy him.



I probably don't know what i'm talking about.

 
MESSAGES->author
hasta (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
09 May, 2017 13:09
I think the issue with Mercer is that while he's apparently the 3rd choice OSF, the reality is that all of the 1st/2nd/3rd choice BSF/No. 8 would all be picked at OSF ahead of him.

 
HamishMilner
Big Dog (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
09 May, 2017 13:16
Quote:
hasta
Keeping Guy Mercer around as an A team captain on a not exactly phenomenal wage is probably fine. Let's drop the 'club captain' stuff though please, he's nowhere near first XV.

I think there's nothing wrong with Guy Mercer being Club Captain tbh. It isn't an on pitch position in most clubs it is the player who epitomises the club dynamic, is well respected and loves the team. Creates the culture of the club too imo.

Guy is a home talent and a great bloke. Sure he may not be a 1st XV regular but that's fine. He does the off pitch stuff, nurtures the young blokes in the united team, shows his face in the community and is a well liked gent of Bath.

I would say though that a designated ON FIELD 1st XV captain is required to go alongside this though. This would be someone who is an on pitch decision maker (please just one, no more "co'captain" crap). For me Dave Attwood is the best choice. Not on international scene but good enough to be when in form. A difference maker, a wise head as well as an excellent pro and strong competitor. Always a starter when fully fit imo too.

Garvey, Banners and Louw seem options too but think they are perhaps better suited to leadership roles in the team as opposed to the captaincy as Banners and Garvey not guaranteed of spot and Louw misses a fair bit of game time with Boks at the moment still, plus as mentioned in another thread, needs his gametime managed a little more as his body looks battered at the moment!

 
dcsh
dcsh (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
09 May, 2017 13:19
Will Louw be away with the Boks?? I seem to remember Malco saying that the writing was on the wall for his international days due to the politics in SA.

 
DanWiley
DanWiley (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
09 May, 2017 15:37
"Would you be saying that if our injury crisis had been at flanker or wing this year instead of #8 and hooker? "

I'd be ok with it. We can pick up a injury joker of at least their ability if we did have a crisis in their position. I really don't see the downside of that?

We're not burning money on a player that won't play if the other don't get injured. If they do, we replace them with a player of injured player's ability without impinging on the cap.


"I think there's nothing wrong with Guy Mercer being Club Captain tbh."

How can he "epitomises the club dynamic" if he doesn't play? I know there are other aspects of being a professional player, but actually playing some rugby is quite a big part. I'd also say his role has lead to this "co-captain" joke. If you make someone first team captain then no one is going to be interested in the club captain who barely plays.

 
MESSAGES->author
Which Tyler (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
09 May, 2017 15:52
Toby Flood released by Toulouse...


Probably to Newcastle, but still.



A man who cannot change his mind, cannot change anything
http://www.rugbyrebels.co/board/download/file.php?id=377
RAEBURN SHIELD

 
MESSAGES->author
hasta (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
09 May, 2017 15:57
I don't think 10 is our key position of need.

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
09 May, 2017 16:50
Quote:
by
http://www.bathchronicle.co.uk/bath-rugby-are-in-talks-with-paul-grant-over-a-new-contract-but-darryl-marfo-is-leaving/story-30320888-detail/story.html
Looks like Grant, G. Mercer and Williams are all in the process of signing a new deal.

Marfo, Charles, Brooker and Fruean are leaving.

Nowhere does it say that G mercer is in the process of signing a new deal.

- They 'are keen to retain' Grant
- some are definitely off
- In relation to JW 'The former England Sevens man is also in talks about his future'
- Guy Mercer is an 'other player whose contract will expire in the coming months'

I would have thought that he would have been more definitive about G Mercer given that he is the club captain, unless it is just vague journalism.

 
Bathovalballer
Bathovalballer (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
09 May, 2017 18:09
Madness to keep GM when Charles is a class act, albeit at hooker. Nothing VV has done has inspired me, and he just does not seem big enough- much like GM.

Fruean is a big loss IMO even allowing for his recent injury record. In his brief appearances he has shown his potential and with a full preseason could prove a top class signing.

Williams may be quick but again his defense is dreadful and he is not special enough or big and strong enough for the Prem.

We desperately need another experienced, hard nosed tight head, and definitely another centre with Fruean going.

 
MESSAGES->author
Which Tyler (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
09 May, 2017 20:59
Quote:
hasta
I don't think 10 is our key position of need.
I was thinking more as a 12 who can cover injuries at 10.
He'll still be heading home though.



A man who cannot change his mind, cannot change anything
http://www.rugbyrebels.co/board/download/file.php?id=377
RAEBURN SHIELD

 
MESSAGES->author
NattyCap (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
10 May, 2017 12:31
Quote:
BathMatt53
Quote:
by
http://www.bathchronicle.co.uk/bath-rugby-are-in-talks-with-paul-grant-over-a-new-contract-but-darryl-marfo-is-leaving/story-30320888-detail/story.html
Looks like Grant, G. Mercer and Williams are all in the process of signing a new deal.

Marfo, Charles, Brooker and Fruean are leaving.

Nowhere does it say that G mercer is in the process of signing a new deal.

- They 'are keen to retain' Grant
- some are definitely off
- In relation to JW 'The former England Sevens man is also in talks about his future'
- Guy Mercer is an 'other player whose contract will expire in the coming months'

I would have thought that he would have been more definitive about G Mercer given that he is the club captain, unless it is just vague journalism.

Oh good I'm Glad I'm not the only one who read it like that. The article definitely makes it sound like he is off to me.
I got a response on twitter regarding Shaun Knight too, it seems he has signed for another season and did so a while ago. Must've missed it when it was originally reported. Glad he is staying, he seems very grateful of his chance at Bath and very determined to improve. Wish I could say that about a few more players

 
by
by (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
10 May, 2017 12:58
I know its been on a couple of threads but the original article Dan Evans wrote in the Chronicle about the current contract negotiations was posted on Facebook and had a few follow up comments.

Quote:
Dan Evans: Contracts which are up this Summer and still to be publicly sorted... G Mercer, Williams, Fruean, Grant. Brooker is on loan until end of season. Marfo, Charles and Graham are on short-term deals until end of season. Those last three are likely to leave, although Marfo has an outside chance of staying. Phillips on trial.

Roy Newport: Thought Guy signed a two year deal Dan.
,don't believe Guy is going to leave Dan Evans.

Dan Evans: I didn't say he was. That's not public yet, Roy! I see why there are crossed wires. When I said 'all' I meant Marfo, Charles and Graham from the previous sentence. Will edit.


I think Roy Newport is KPN's uncle.

 
Tom Sutton
Tom Sutton (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
10 May, 2017 14:15
Father.

 
MESSAGES->author
JimDaff (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
10 May, 2017 20:05
Maybe we should keep Nathan Charles as he can cover hooker and fly half from the bench!
Twitter

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
10 May, 2017 20:51
Yes it was a nice touch to end the evening. Wish we had seen more of him.

 
JackRugby
JackRugby (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
10 May, 2017 21:21
@Bathovalballer

Ross Batty - 1.85m - 105kg
Tom Dunn - 1.87m - 110kg
Jack Walker - 1.85m - 109kg
Michael van Vuuren - 1.87m - 110kg

Please explain how in your mind VV isn't big enough? Bath could possibly have the biggest hookers in the premiership, and out of our hookers VV is probably the biggest. What has Charles done exactly to be a class act? He was released by the Western Force which is not exactly the cream of the crop in AUS, and Brooker started ahead of him?

As for GM ,he stands 1.8m and 100kg , N.Back stood at 1.78m and just over 90kg, now I'm not comparing them I'm just making a point that size isn't always everything . Michael Hooper who is in the conversation with the best in the game stands at 1.82m and 101kg.

And again, please elaborate on how JW has dreadful defense?

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
11 May, 2017 15:15
I would have Strings back as player-coach in a heartbeat - get Homer and Cook passing at their best and play him if necessary. The guy is awesome!

[www.salesharks.com]

 
BathOtter
BathOtter (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
11 May, 2017 16:31
Can't do the link thing, but Fruean article on BBC suggests he's close to moving to Edinburgh, no big surprise.

One thing that did stand out towards the end that hadn't struck me previously was his desire to play sevens for Samoa. Obviously we all knew that, but for me didn't click that he would miss huge chunks of the season playing sevens abroad.

Am I misinterpreting this? Or are Bath and TB tabling a relatively small offer with this absence in mind I wonder?

 
john fox
johnnyf (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
11 May, 2017 18:11
I think Bathovalballer has nailed it.

A hard-nosed tight-head - but can we afford it?
A bullocking, fast, experienced inside centre, (as an alternative to the very good and different skills Tapuai possesses) Defences do not like this sort of thing coming directly at them. Oh and perhaps he should have a pretty good off-loading game too.

 
gaz59
gaz59 (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
11 May, 2017 18:20
Quote:
A bullocking, fast, experienced inside centre, (as an alternative to the very good and different skills Tapuai possesses) Defences do not like this sort of thing coming directly at them. Oh and perhaps he should have a pretty good off-loading game too.[/quote

That has Banners written into the teamsheet for me for some games with Taps on bench for last 25

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
11 May, 2017 18:26
We have been talking about finding a bullocking, fast, inside centre and also whether Clark or JJ should be playing at 13. Clark played 12 for us before and in December he was quoted in the Chron 'Clark sees the benefit of playing at both inside and outside centre'.

He seems to be adding a bit of kicking to his game recently as well as well as tricky lines. I think a 12 Clark / 13 JJ combo could cause some damage.

[Edit: I see that we had this very debate 12 months ago:

[www.rugbynetwork.net]

Clark seems to have softened his position on 12 since then judging by the Chron]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/05/2017 18:29 by BathMatt53.

 
MESSAGES->author
BathSalmon (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
11 May, 2017 20:12
Quote:
BathMatt53
We have been talking about finding a bullocking, fast, inside centre and also whether Clark or JJ should be playing at 13. Clark played 12 for us before and in December he was quoted in the Chron 'Clark sees the benefit of playing at both inside and outside centre'.
He seems to be adding a bit of kicking to his game recently as well as well as tricky lines. I think a 12 Clark / 13 JJ combo could cause some damage.

[Edit: I see that we had this very debate 12 months ago:

[www.rugbynetwork.net]

Clark seems to have softened his position on 12 since then judging by the Chron]

That flashback to the old post made for interesting reading!

It was great to see Clark progress and perform well this year. He will definitely get more opportunities next year and he will flourish.

 
Danchinho
Danchinho (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
11 May, 2017 23:06
I'd rather have a class option at 12 rather than a guy who can maybe sometimes do an OK job for a bit.



I probably don't know what i'm talking about.

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
12 May, 2017 06:31
I would rather have all 15 of the all blacks first team to be fair! I think what I am saying is that Max Clark could potentially be better than someone who 'does an OK job for a bit' if that's the direction he wanted to go in. Banners isn't getting any younger as our reserve big 12.

 
by
by (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
12 May, 2017 07:37
Clark needs another season to develop, his body doesn't seem ready for first team rugby, week in, week out, as shown by his injury record.

Our midfield coverage isn't too bad, although I'm sure it will be stretched.

Taps, JJ, Clark, Banners, Burns/Priestland, Lewis, Wilson, Jennings?

 
MESSAGES->author
Which Tyler (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
12 May, 2017 10:43
Quote:
BathMatt53
[Edit: I see that we had this very debate 12 months ago:
[www.rugbynetwork.net]
I'm utterly delighted that I can have something I said a year ago quoted back at me... and that I can stand by every word of it (excecpt the typo.s obviously).
Am I allowed to tell Mrs Tyler?



A man who cannot change his mind, cannot change anything
http://www.rugbyrebels.co/board/download/file.php?id=377
RAEBURN SHIELD




Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/05/2017 10:43 by Which Tyler.

 
MESSAGES->author
hasta (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
12 May, 2017 10:51
I'm comfortable with what I said back then. Interesting to see how Clark has slowly improved but Mallinder has probably regressed a bit.

 
Danchinho
Danchinho (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
12 May, 2017 10:58
I'm very happy to have Taps, JJ and Clark. But I think we need a proper option /cover at 12 rather than a winger who's ok at some aspects of it. Hardly a contentious opinion...



I probably don't know what i'm talking about.

 
MESSAGES->author
Which Tyler (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
12 May, 2017 11:03
Quote:
hasta
I'm comfortable with what I said back then. Interesting to see how Clark has slowly improved but Mallinder has probably regressed a bit.
Has Mallinder regressed? or have we simply seen more of him and his flaws? or have those flaws simply been seen more by opponents and exposed? (If the latter, then I feel sorry for him next year when he'll get one hell of a second season syndrome as EVER targets him back in hand)


A man who cannot change his mind, cannot change anything
http://www.rugbyrebels.co/board/download/file.php?id=377
RAEBURN SHIELD

 
Boldngrey
Boldngrey (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
12 May, 2017 13:59
Quote:
Danchinho
I'm very happy to have Taps, JJ and Clark. But I think we need a proper option /cover at 12 rather than a winger who's ok at some aspects of it. Hardly a contentious opinion...


Priestland at 12 and Freddie at 10 would be fantastic cover.

 
by
by (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
12 May, 2017 14:08
Josh Lewis as well could be a handy option.

 
Danchinho
Danchinho (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
12 May, 2017 14:24
Quote:
Boldngrey
Quote:
Danchinho
I'm very happy to have Taps, JJ and Clark. But I think we need a proper option /cover at 12 rather than a winger who's ok at some aspects of it. Hardly a contentious opinion...


Priestland at 12 and Freddie at 10 would be fantastic cover.

I'm not really talking about cover I'm talking about a genuine 12 as competition or one who offers something different to Taps.

 
MESSAGES->author
Coalminer (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
12 May, 2017 15:25
Given that we made an offer to Robbie Freuan the coaches must feel we need an extra back so I assume they will be looking to fill that slot.

 
Bath Hammer
Bath Hammer (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
12 May, 2017 16:58
We certainly can't manage with just 3 centres. That would be asking for trouble.

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
13 May, 2017 09:07
Anyone know where jan serfontein is off to? Rumour was France but he has denied this.

 
MESSAGES->author
JimDaff (IP Logged)

Re: 2017/18 Squad almost complete?
13 May, 2017 11:19
Anyone take an intrest in Super Rugby? Are there any potential signings for us from rebels/force/kings/any other team they might be dumping?

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