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Bathovalballer
Bathovalballer (IP Logged)

Bath Mid Season Torpor
11 November, 2017 01:03
Is it me or are Bath after a very encouraging result wise start to the season, even with injuries to top players, when we thought this would give confidence and would be built on going forward, but instead are going the way of previous seasons?

We are presently playing dreadfully with virtually no attack to speak of, reliant on the speed and opportunism of Roko and Priestland's penalty kicking to get us out of trouble, cannot win more than 40 % possession and give that up in contact far too easily, have a very insecure lineout, and continue to make the same mistakes and decisions on the field we have watched for more seasons than I care to remember.

Losing one tight game at home to an admittedly resurgent Newcastle side who obviously wanted it more, was up setting, but then doing exactly the same to a Gloucester side whose away form has been appalling. Since then we have struggled to beat a struggling Irish side and then one of the youngest, least experienced Tigers sides to ever take the field, with little signs of any improvements, is in my view extremely worrying and incredibly disappointing. I am sure people will say look at our wins against Sarries, Wasps, Leicester and Scarlets, but surely that should give confidence and desire to kick on and be more consistent, showing a steady improvement, especially with the return of the wounded?

But no, in the last 4 games we have gone backwards and tonight's performance was fairly shocking. No doubt with internationals away it will get worse and the coaches will point to their absence for our lack of form.

Where is the players' pride, why is there no significant improvement, what is going on at the Farleigh Spa because it cannot be anything to do with playing or practicing rugby union?

We appear to be in the doldrums and caught in this torpor yet again! Lets snap out of it and start to show the ability this expensively recruited and pampered squad should be capable of, given the facilities and reputations the players and staff enjoy. Second best and mid table league positions will not do.

 
nick holder
nick holder (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
11 November, 2017 06:53
Yes it is you.

 
MESSAGES->author
Robbinho (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
11 November, 2017 07:18
Wonder why Todd hasnít told them to snap out of it and play better? Seems such a glaring omission.

Almost as if there is more to it than that....

 
B4thB4ck
B4thB4ck (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
11 November, 2017 07:25
Maybe it coincides with losing our head coach in unfortunate circumstances?

You should apply for the role. Don't forget to mention at the interview that the players are pampered and don't want it.

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
11 November, 2017 07:37
Maybe pop up to Farleigh and ask the players where their pride is BoB? You will undoubtedly find them in the bar (as they donít practise rugby union) fighting over who wants the last mars bar more...

(A QC told me once that a decent point made badly carries no more weight than a bad point and you do have a habit of serving up your views with such lashings of bile and hyperbole that they just turn you into a caricature.)

BUT, we do seem to be very limp in attack so far this season. Iím not sure that we have really got materially worse, but the other teams that had bad starts have pulled it together (like Tigers). I think that we are very reliant on a few top class players such as Louw (Underhill), TF, Roko and KF and when they are missing it is a big step down in quality. We had two boshing centres last night and Iím sure that JJ and Tapuai would have shown a bit more exciting play outside burns than we saw last night.

So, frustrating? Yes. Players not wanting it and not practising etc etc blah blah? Thatís just a bit silly.

 
B4thB4ck
B4thB4ck (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
11 November, 2017 07:43
While you are there don't forget to tell Charlie that he needs to punch someone BoB.

Don't forget to duck.

 
fat lock
fat lock (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
11 November, 2017 08:48
Lost your road Atlas to Devon BOB?

 
MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
11 November, 2017 09:25
Incredible...BoB has initiated a thread so that forum members can simply dissect his arguments, point out errors and assess his defeatest attitude.

BoB read the post below then read it again.
Quote:
B4thB4ck
Maybe it coincides with losing our head coach in unfortunate circumstances?
You should apply for the role. Don't forget to mention at the interview that the players are pampered and don't want it.

Last season you demanded young talent players seeing them as the future, now we have them you attack their attitude and accuse them of not wanting it.

We are 4th in the Aviva Premiership and Top of our group in the Anglo Welsh cup.

But take no notice BoB I am probably a vitriolic apologist.

 
MESSAGES->author
OutsideBath (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
11 November, 2017 09:30
We don't look like a club that's capable of winning trophies, but to suggest the players don't want it or are pampered is just wrong.

I only ever see 100% effort from whoever plays for us.



Jack Wilson - Adopted player 2017/18

 
gaz59
gaz59 (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
11 November, 2017 10:18
Away from the drivel of the opening post

Last week I was at a conference with Roger Black as the closing speaker - inspirational stuff and sprinkled with some great humour. But one big thing I took away was when he spoke about his Olympic silver and the single stand out reason why he achieved it.

Not because he wanted it more than the other 6 on the start line [he'd factored Johnson as impossible to beat]. He knew they all wanted it but it was because through his period of injury recovery he had developed the mindset that he needed that medal, not wanted it and that was the difference

He also showed his medal and proudly said that we may see it as silver but to him it was gold - another great message of controlling the controllables. Beating Johnson simply was not within his gift, it required a howler from Johnson, an injury etc - all he could was to run his perfect race

If you ever get a chance to hear Roger Black speak, don't miss it

 
MESSAGES->author
hasta (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
11 November, 2017 11:04
A truly horrible set of results in the last four matches.

 
dcsh
dcsh (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
11 November, 2017 11:13
Quote:
shipwrecked
We are 4th in the Aviva Premiership and Top of our group in the Anglo Welsh cup.
We are also top of our Champions Cup pool!

 
dcsh
dcsh (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
11 November, 2017 11:15
I thought the way Bath came back at the end of last nights match and then closed out the final minutes showed they had clearly learned from the Gloucester match, that is encouraging.

 
Bathovalballer
Bathovalballer (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
11 November, 2017 13:07
Very interesting post Gaz59 and I am sure RB would be well worth a listen.

In my commercial working life, I have had the privilege to hear Frank Dick (athletics coach of people like the great Daly Thompson) and Kriss Asabuki speak and they were truly inspirational in their attitudes and in particular how and why the pursuit of excellence is an absolute must if you ever seriously want to be the best.

That is what I want for Bath Rugby and after the number of years we have been 'just jogging along' with no consistent improvement unlike Saracens and even new comers like Exeter, you have to ask the reason why. We have possibly the best training facilities in the land, top class coaching, and an owner who has certainly done his best to bring World class players to the club. And we are still so inconsistent it is very frustrating and are still making the same errors and lack basic skills we were in previous seasons. Without a fundamental change in our approach and attitudes, we will never achieve the levels of excellence advocated by those who have won Olympic medals. Now come on Bath Rugby lets grasp the nettle and really start steadily improving all round.

 
john fox
johnnyf (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
11 November, 2017 13:40
I think that you have to agree with the opinion that the loss of Tabai Matson has had a serious affect on the squad.
He was definitely a charismatic head coach who related incredibly well with the players and that is a hard skill to replace.
I wonder how it has also affected TB - his close friend and partner in work?
After all the time and effort it took to recruit this pair it will surely take as much time to repair the hole left by his departure.

 
Danchinho
Danchinho (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
11 November, 2017 16:11
I'm not sure our attack was potent, imaginative and consistent last season either so I'm not sure the loss of Matson is a good indicator.



I probably don't know what i'm talking about.

 
southgate
southgate (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
11 November, 2017 16:20
After coming back and winning a hard fought game I find BOBs post a bit below the belt.I commented to a friend last night that a number of the bath players were exhausted ,not because of fitness but because they had given there all.

 
Long Term
Long Term (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
11 November, 2017 19:25
BoB I get the impression that you feel your constant attacking of players performances for lacking heart, aggression ,pride etc ( whilst making the odd valid point) marks you out as the ultimate Bath supporter with the true insight as to what this club needs/lacks. You present as someone with the fervour of a recent fan who has all the club merchandise and is desperate to be associated with a 'successful' club.

 
MESSAGES->author
Rawce (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
11 November, 2017 21:52
Iím loving the fact that BOBís deliberate and predictable trolling actually galvanises supporters rather than divides us.

 
MESSAGES->author
liquidmonkey (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
11 November, 2017 22:13
Absolute drivel but I expect nothing less.




The measure may be thought bold, but I am of the opinion the boldest are the safest.
Horatio Nelson


Adopted players:
2017-18 Freddie Burns
2016-17 Nick Auterac
2015-16 Guy Mercer
2014-15 Juan Pablo Orlandi
2015-16 Guy Mercer

 
malco
malco (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
12 November, 2017 08:01
This is one of the most stupid posts I have ever read on this website.

Our first choice XXIII is probably

Catt
Dunn
Thomas
Charteris
Attwood
Garvey
Louw
Faletau
Fotualiíi
Burns
Banahan
Tapuai
Joseph
Rokoduguni
Watson

Batty, Auterac, Perenise, Ewels, Underhill, Cook, Priestland, Clark.

Then we have players of the Calibre of Obano, Lahiff, Walker, Stooke, Ellis, Mercer and Homer who are all putting huge pressure on for places.

Now compare this to the players who have been running out this season and especially the team that beat Leicester of Friday night.

The players that have in any case got us to fourth in the Premiership and top of our groups in both the Champions Cup and the Anglo Welsh.

You would have to be either completely clueless or hopelessly trolling to criticise them in the way Bathovalballer does on a continual ongoing basis.

Or both.

 
DaveOfTrow
GrumpyDave (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
12 November, 2017 08:04
Quote:
malco
This is one of the most stupid posts I have ever read on this website.
...

You would have to be either completely clueless or hopelessly trolling to criticise them in the way Bathovalballer does on a continual ongoing basis.

Or both.

+1

I vote for completely clueless,

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
12 November, 2017 08:25
Maybe he was just hoping to post something so outrageous as to entice you back to the board Malco? Bingo!

 
BBWBaaBaa
BBWBaaBaa (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
12 November, 2017 08:39
"Maybe he was just hoping to post something so outrageous as to entice you back to the board Malco? Bingo!"

Above all, welcome back smiling smiley

 
malco
malco (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
12 November, 2017 08:58
I just nipped in because I have heard that there might be something significant happening and I wondered if there might have been some news on here. I should have known better.

The team on Friday night was:

Auterac (second choice, limited recent game time due to recuperation from injuries)
Van Vuuren (fourth choice)
Andrews (sixth choice, temporary contract)
Douglas (Academy)
Philips (fifth choice, first start)
Garvey (limited recent game time due to recuperation from injuries)
Bayliss (Academy)
Grant (third choice)
Green (first start, fourth choice)
Burns (returning from suspension)
Davis (Bath University, trying to get an Academy contract)
Banahan (limited recent game time due to recuperation from injuries, out of position)
Clark (second choice)
Wilson (third choice)
Homer (second choice, limited recent game time due to recuperation from injuries)

And we won.

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
12 November, 2017 09:40
As you should know Malco, the people who actually have important news / information wouldn't be sharing it on an open forum. I have heard things from friends about players etc which I would never share on here especially. Loose lips sink (friend)ships.

Levi Douglas is first team now. I do like the way he plays / his aggression actually.

 
B4thB4ck
B4thB4ck (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
12 November, 2017 10:22
Hi Malco,

Regarding your comment 'there might be something significant happening', any clues please?

Nothing specific required, just new coach, new player, or someone leaving etc.

 
MESSAGES->author
hasta (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
12 November, 2017 13:26
There is a middle ground you know. Between the extremes of a record this season of 8 wins and 3 losses not being the catastrophic end of the world and also the acceptance that we're not really gelling and performing (particularly in attack) in a way that engenders confidence that we're on course for a trophy.

 
Boldangrey
Boldangrey (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
12 November, 2017 16:53
But the glass is very definitely half full rather than half empty.

 
dr.bath1865
dr.bath1865 (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
12 November, 2017 18:18
I thought, amongst other positive bits and bobs, including beating Leicester, that Bayliss was really excellent. A prospect I donít know much about but Iím excited to see develop.

 
MESSAGES->author
OutsideBath (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
12 November, 2017 18:35
Quote:
Boldangrey
But the glass is very definitely half full rather than half empty.

Really? Didn't losing at home to Falcons and Glos empty the glass?



Jack Wilson - Adopted player 2017/18

 
bathstigg
bathstigg (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
12 November, 2017 18:55
Then again, Outside Bath most people would have thought we wouldnít beat Sarries or Wasps! I think 2/2 in Euro Cup 2/2 in Anglo welsh and 4th in Prem at this stage is a glass better than half full let alone empty. Shame you were absent Friday night it wasnít vintage Bath but spirit and a way to win was encouraging.

 
MESSAGES->author
OutsideBath (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
12 November, 2017 19:07
I'm sure Friday was good, but I tend not to go to AW games even though I've paid via my ST.

What actually irritates me more than anything is the away wins and the way we beat Sarries actually raised my hopes of us finally challenging the best teams.

Then the home loss to Falcons emptied my glass and the loss to Glos smashed it.



Jack Wilson - Adopted player 2017/18

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
12 November, 2017 19:14
But then that does seem to be your view on things, not big on PMA are you? We have had some really good and some really bad results and have ended up in an OK position on several fronts. Now if you were a Worcs supporter I could understand as you really would have something to worry about.

 
gaz59
gaz59 (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
12 November, 2017 19:29
Quote:
malco
I just nipped in because I have heard that there might be something significant happening and I wondered if there might have been some news on here. I should have known better.

Recruitment or departure?

 
HMilner
Big Dog (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
13 November, 2017 17:21
I really don't see any issue with how we are doing so far this season personally..

We are top of our Champions Cup pool (which is a tough one at that), we are top of our Anglo-Welsh pool (we usually don't even try in that and yet with recuperating players and youngsters have won 2/2) and 4th in the Premiership - where let's be honest we are not at the same level as a Saracens or Exeter on playing style currently so are in the chasing pack of 5/6 that could all fill the other two top 4 spots.

For me we are doing pretty well given the number of new faces, the injuries to a couple of very key players e.g. Attwood (1st choice second row), Thomas (first choice tight-head), not to mention those who have been in and out of the physio room already this season like Garvey, Auterac, Catt, Charteris, Banahan, Tapuai, Homer and those who play key positions and are new comers to the squad like Burns, Lewis, Underhill, Green, Andrews et al.

Given all of this, not to mention we lost our first choice 10 at the end of last season who is England's (the second placed team in world rugby) first choice 10, it is not surprising our attacking shape has dipped at times!

What I do like though is that we are grinding out victories, finding scores where we haven't deserved them and defending exceptionally well a lot of the time too. If you are struggling offensively the least you can ask is that everybody commits defensively and the two games we lost at home that you referenced - Newcastle and Gloucester - I think we were just outperformed across the 80 minutes and did well to be in it at all really given that I thought our opposition on both day's came out and just wanted it more than we did!



Adopted players: 2017-18 Shaun Knight

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
13 November, 2017 17:26
Quote:
Big Dog
...just wanted it more than we did!

Go an sit on the naught step BD - you said the bad words.

 
MESSAGES->author
OutsideBath (IP Logged)

Re: Bath Mid Season Torpor
13 November, 2017 18:16
Quote:
BathMatt53
Quote:
Big Dog
...just wanted it more than we did!

Go an sit on the naught step BD - you said the bad words.

+1

Totally wrong to suggest other teams want it more than we do. We may not be that good, but I'm sure our players always want to win as much as anyone.



Jack Wilson - Adopted player 2017/18


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