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Ali1969
Ali1969 (IP Logged)

Sam Underhill
20 November, 2017 08:26
Another HIA on Saturday, have lost count now how many head injuries he has suffered and only a quarter of the way through the season. First and foremost you have to be concerned for his health and secondly the club must be thinking how long can this go on before a medical professional is going to call time on his young rugby career.

There is no doubting how brave he is ala Lewis Moody but even with Lewis cannot remember him suffering so many head injuries in such a short period.

 
Boldangrey
Boldangrey (IP Logged)

Re: Sam Underhill
20 November, 2017 08:29
Isn't it 3 HIAs in a season then a long lay off?

This must be his third.

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Sam Underhill
20 November, 2017 08:46
It not rocket science that if you drive your head that hard into 15-20 stone men at high speed 20-30 times every game then the chances of a head bang are very high. It seems to be every game that he gets at least a couple of knocks / stinger or similar. He would need to have the skull of a bighorn sheep not to be affected by that.

 
Danchinho
Danchinho (IP Logged)

Re: Sam Underhill
20 November, 2017 09:05
I wouldn't worry, it's not like he plays for a club team that racks up nearly 200 tackles every game! Oh, wait.......



I probably don't know what i'm talking about.

 
HMilner
Big Dog (IP Logged)

Re: Sam Underhill
20 November, 2017 10:25
I must say I had the same thought seeing him trudge off for an HIA on Saturday Ali.

My concern is that although he does make dominant hits he perhaps needs to take a little more care for his body. Unfortunately though in his position at 7 the contact is very high and unforgiving if you get it slightly wrong - especially when breaking off the sides of scrums to hit 8's or 12's who are gathering up speed - not to mention in the rucks and mauls when sticking your upper body into those dark places trying to jackal.

Let's hope that he adapts his technique a little to keep his head a little safer because you have to love his commitment to the hit otherwise. Shoulders like that were made for barrelling men over...



Adopted players:
2018-19 Jonathan Joseph
2017-18 Shaun Knight

 
Beergoggles
Beergoggles (IP Logged)

Re: Sam Underhill
20 November, 2017 11:05
Is this down to poor tackling technique or is he just unlucky ? Flow and Garvey make plenty of tackles and I don't recall them having HIA issues.

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Sam Underhill
20 November, 2017 11:14
Quote:
Beergoggles
Is this down to poor tackling technique or is he just unlucky ? Flow and Garvey make plenty of tackles and I don't recall them having HIA issues.

Flouw has been knocked out / HIA'ed quite a few times and Garvey is only just out with a neck injury gained from a tackle against Newcastle.

[www.bbc.co.uk]

Underhill is lighter than both but pound for pound hits harder and lower than both (and tackles more to boot). Maybe more of a comparison as others have said is Lydiate.

 
MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked (IP Logged)

Re: Sam Underhill
20 November, 2017 11:36
Agree strongly with all of the above posts, I really DO think that going low increases the chances of head knocks. I think the RFU are tracking injuries to have a clearer picture, I just wonder how long we have to wait before they have enough data.

 
HMilner
Big Dog (IP Logged)

Re: Sam Underhill
20 November, 2017 11:38
You almost wonder whether Underhill tackles too low as he hits waists and knees which are bonier than that midrift. It is a difficult one as we want players to be tackling low but you actually see less HIA's result from tackles that are higher than tackles that are lower imo.

The only difference is the chance of hitting head on head with your opponent. If you aim it on the section below shoulders but above waist it is generally quite soft and stable compared to the knees and waist which are moving targets in the sense the legs are moving more than the torso during running.



Adopted players:
2018-19 Jonathan Joseph
2017-18 Shaun Knight

 
MESSAGES->author
woodpecker (IP Logged)

Re: Sam Underhill
20 November, 2017 11:56
There was a piece in the Times on Saturday about his tackling focuses only on the benefits of tackling low, not the risks, here are some excerpts:

There is an almost surgical quality about the way Sam Underhill tackles. So pure is his technique, so precise his execution — arms wrapped around the thighs, shoulder into the midriff, opponent dumped unceremoniously onto his backside — that as he rises swiftly to his feet again, it would not be a surprise to see him wiping his hands clean before moving briskly on to his next victim.

At 6ft 1in and 16st 3lb, Underhill is not the most physically imposing of forwards, but a low centre of gravity and hardened muscularity enable him to punch considerably above his weight.

“He gets his body height right, lines up his target and keeps the momentum going through the tackle on a horizontal plane,” Booth said. “That way no energy is wasted. In the first phase after a lineout, with many tacklers you’ll see them taking the ball carrier back over the shoulder. But Sam puts so much energy into the tackle, he has the ability to stop them stone dead.”

“Sam’s real skill is in chop tackling, around the legs, whereas until recently there had been a lot more two-man tackles, hitting high and wrapping up the ball,” Booth said. “If someone goes high now, they’re running the risk of a yellow card. There is still a place for the choke tackle and rip tackles, but we’re seeing more people going low and Sam’s up there with the best chop tacklers, the likes of Dan Lydiate and Justin Tipuric.”

 
MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked (IP Logged)

Re: Sam Underhill
20 November, 2017 11:59
Might be something to do with playing with Dan Lydiate at Ospreys, interesting that Lydiate had a different tackling style on Saturday with about 2/3rds of his tackles being with an upright body rather than the chop tackle he is famed for.

The problem is that as soon as you go for a horizontal tackle you loose sight of your target as you are head down. Even if you were aiming for a softer area there is no guarantee you are going to hit it.

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Sam Underhill
20 November, 2017 12:15
There is of course a drawback to having such an efficient and 'perfect' tackle. On the one occasion in a match that you get it wrong, maybe because the player bounces off someone else as you are going in for the tackle or another random event, you are 6" off and you are suddenly putting massive power into driving your head into a part of their body such as hip or knee where there is only going to be one result.

There is a reason why George Ford is so rarely injured even though he hits such big men, he bounces off them and there isn't the same kinetic energy.

On a related note, didn't Jonny W change his whole game exactly for this reason, i.e. he was hitting too hard and his body (shoulders etc.) couldn't take it?

 
MESSAGES->author
woodpecker (IP Logged)

Re: Sam Underhill
20 November, 2017 12:20
Yes JW did, but he had other aspects to his game, currently Sam doesnt do much other than tackle

 
Danchinho
Danchinho (IP Logged)

Re: Sam Underhill
21 November, 2017 10:45
One of the best chop tacklers i've seen in the leagues past couple of years is Tom Dunn.



I probably don't know what i'm talking about.

 
Bath Hammer
Bath Hammer (IP Logged)

Re: Sam Underhill
21 November, 2017 13:01
I’ve said this all along. His whole games is built around these massive tackles, rather like Sam Burgess but he is unreal. It cannot go on. His game needs to develop & he has to ration the tackles allied to making his technique safer. I would sooner he focuses on turnovers which are more difficult to achieve now but Bath really need to do better in getting ball back.

 
annie blackthorn
annie blackthorn (IP Logged)

Re: Sam Underhill
21 November, 2017 18:25
He is young. Sure he will develop his game with the right coaching. But no good getting HIA's on a regular basis at this stage - George North syndrome>
.


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