rugbyunion
Latest News:

The COML Message Board

The place for discussion, debate and nonsense about Bath Rugby.

Join our new Facebook Group today!

New visitors please read the house rules before posting

Test your prognostications at our Prediction League


HMilner
Big Dog (IP Logged)

Champions Cup Position
18 December, 2017 11:04
Following two tremendous performances by the team - albeit one a narrow loss in France - we are in a strong position to qualify for the quarters of Europe provided we win at least one of our next 2 pool games.

We have appeared arguably to be the strongest of the English teams in Europe this year imo, especially given we are in arguably one of the toughest groups to advance from with the Pro14 Champions and the Real Madrid of rugby in Toulon. That is also discrediting Treviso who are an increasingly improving outfit too.

What are everyone's opinions as a result on our hopes for Europe and is just getting out the group an achievement in itself given the increasingly difficulty even some of the biggest teams have in making the quarters? When you consider the strength of some of the squads in this competition it is impressive in my opinion to make the last 8 alone but once you reach that point you would naturally hope to go further of course? Where do we think we could get to?

Are we also now a little more convinced that Todd and the team are really getting to know this squad better and get results from them in the big games?


(Additional note: What an atmosphere at the Rec Saturday. I made a comment about the Toulon crowd being superb in the game the week before but we really matched that and it must have been a boost for the team to have that atmosphere supporting them. I wonder whether it is because of the calibre of the opposition that it was so loud and passionate?)



Adopted players: 2017-18 Shaun Knight; 2018-19 Jonathan Joseph

 
by
by (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
18 December, 2017 11:27
I think the pool is wide open still although we have a good chance to go through at least as a runner up given that we still have to play Treviso.

If Scarlets beat us and Toulon, it could come down to points difference. If we beat Scarlets, then it will be Scarlets playing for the runner up spot or Toulon potentially taking the top spot.

 
MESSAGES->author
Clarkey3k (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
18 December, 2017 11:34
I think we will need to win the group to qualify as the 5th seed so will play the 4th seed away. As it stands we would be away at either La Rochelle or Munster and would prefer the Frenchies from those two having watched Wasps beat them yesterday. We will struggle to fight on 3 fronts, AP, AWC and HC, unless we get more players back from injury. I watched Scarlets at the weekend and they were impressive in Italy, Toulon only just won there with the last kick of the game.

I said on another thread the AP/AWC would be my focus and if I'm honest I don't think we are amongst the best 4 teams in Europe at the moment. Strong team required for the Scarlets home game and rest a few for the away fixture at Treviso as the French would do.

The next 3 AP games are challenging and would expect to win 2/3 given our current injury list. Wasps are on a 6 day turnaround and that should be to our advantage, Wuss are revived with Hougaard back and Sale are difficult to beat at home. If we get more depth in the squad we might just get 3/3 so I am hopeful.



Adopted players: 2018/19 Michael Van Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw

Change a life with a loan [www.deki.org.uk]

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
18 December, 2017 13:16
I think that we need to win both of the remaining games, for the reasons given above.

 
MESSAGES->author
Which Tyler (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
18 December, 2017 15:23
We're favourites to top our group, though it's far from a gimme.
Our group is likely to produce e the 5th seeds, and no runner up going through.
We would need a decent slice of luck to win an away QF.

At the beginning of the season, I'd have said that reaching a QF would have been ahead of expectations, expecting us to finish 2md or 3rd and failing to go through.

If we can collect 5 points when Scarlets come to visit, we'll really be in poll position, with 4 we can still do it, with 0-1 our campaign is essentially over.



A man who cannot change his mind, cannot change anything
http://www.rugbyrebels.co/board/download/file.php?id=608
RAEBURN SHIELD

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
18 December, 2017 15:29
With Treviso having taken their foot off the gas, you would really expect Toulon to thump them at home in January, clearing up the 5 points. Unless we get the 5 at home to Scarlets we are going to be relying on them (being out of the cup as they would be at that point) to hold off an eager Toulon in the final game. I think that we need to win both of the final games with bonus points to progress as winners of the group. We can definitely do it of course.

 
Boldangrey
Boldangrey (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
18 December, 2017 15:54
LBPs and TBPs will be what separates 1 and 2 in our group.

Will we rue not getting a fourth try against Treviso?

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
18 December, 2017 15:58
Quote:
Boldangrey
LBPs and TBPs will be what separates 1 and 2 in our group.
Will we rue not getting a fourth try against Treviso?

Well Toulon didn't either - but we will almost certainly need one over there...

The Independent thinks that we may both get through:

[www.independent.co.uk]

And so to Pool Five, the only one currently topped by an English side. Bath recorded one of their most famous victories in Europe outside of their triumphant 1997/98 campaign, and will head into January confident of gaining results at The Recreation Ground against the Scarlets before an away trip to Benetton. Should they do so, and Toulon do the same, both will qualify for the knockout stage and take one of the runners-up spots automatically as they will likely have more points than the other sides in second place – leaving a conundrum of six teams into two.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 18/12/2017 16:04 by BathMatt53.

 
MESSAGES->author
TCM2007 (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
18 December, 2017 17:10
Two wins should be enough. That would put us on 21 points. Mathematically we could be one of the two “worst” second place on 21, but it’s unlikely. Last year 16 points was enough, 17 the year before.



Stuart

Former ed.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 18/12/2017 17:10 by TCM2007.

 
MESSAGES->author
OutsideBath (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
18 December, 2017 18:02
It's entirely in our hands, but 1 win probably won't be enough.



Tom Dunn - Adopted player 2018/19

 
MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
18 December, 2017 18:22
Quote:
OutsideBath
It's entirely in our hands, but 1 win probably won't be enough.


Why not? Are you expecting Scarlets to beat Toulon and Bath?

 
MESSAGES->author
OutsideBath (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
18 December, 2017 18:44
Quote:
shipwrecked
Quote:
OutsideBath
It's entirely in our hands, but 1 win probably won't be enough.


Why not? Are you expecting Scarlets to beat Toulon and Bath?

Not necessary expecting Scarlets to win both, but it's not inconceivable and if they do we'd probably miss out.

Even if Toulon win both their games and we lost 1 it seems likely we'd miss out.

We probably just need 2 wins without TBP to make it



Tom Dunn - Adopted player 2018/19

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
18 December, 2017 18:45
Assuming that Toulon beat both it would put us on second with 17/18 points and there is a reasonable chance that we would miss out SW. I agree that we need to win both to be sure and get at least one bonus to top the group.

 
Bath Hammer
Bath Hammer (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
18 December, 2017 19:32
We have to perform at least as well as we did against Toulon to overcome Scarlets, who although we beat them away in dire conditions, are an impressive side. Hopefully we can kick on from here & become consistent for the best part of 80 mins which will take us to the next level.

 
sid the seagull
sid the seagull (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
18 December, 2017 23:55
We need to smack everybody (metaphorically of course) then let the rest scratch their heads.

HOPHOPHOP

 
Boldangrey
Boldangrey (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
19 December, 2017 08:28
Quote:
Bath Hammer
We have to perform at least as well as we did against Toulon to overcome Scarlets, who although we beat them away in dire conditions, are an impressive side. Hopefully we can kick on from here & become consistent for the best part of 80 mins which will take us to the next level.

Why shouldn't we?

Is this the start of a roll?

 
Olly_L
BathLad (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
19 December, 2017 08:33
Quote:
TCM2007
Two wins should be enough. That would put us on 21 points. Mathematically we could be one of the two “worst” second place on 21, but it’s unlikely. Last year 16 points was enough, 17 the year before.

In the new format their are 3 best second place teams that qualify. There used to be 24 teams but with the 20 and 5 pools there requires 3 runners up to complete the Q-Final line up. Our pool looks destined to be one of the three to supply one of these teams although now that Glasgow and Leicester are out competition in those pools may be reduced.

Im confident that well get 2 wins and qualify with 21 points (minimum), Treviso will surely play a weakened team in round 6 and well have to play very well (again) to beat Scarlets

 
MESSAGES->author
jayeatman (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
19 December, 2017 09:12
1. Two wins and we go through.
2. Two wins may not be enough to win the group but it will be enough to get through in 2nd.
3. Beat Scarlets at home and 2nd is guaranteed, but probably not enough to go through unless we beat Treviso too.
4. You've got to think Treviso won't prioritise their next two games, so expect them to finish 0/6.
5. Toulon have to play Scarlets away. Given Toulon's away form, Scarlets would be favorites for that game but if they've already lost to us, they only have pride to play for.
6. So I expect both us and Toulon to finish on 5/6 and qualify. Winner of the group will indeed depend on bonus points.
7. You've got to think Clermont and Leinster will go through 1st & 2nd seeds on 6/6. The other two groups are less certain as ASR still have to play away at Ulster and Munster at Racing, so two wins, top the group and a home tie as 3rd or 4th qualifier is a possibility.
8. Or just do what Sid says.

Nobody prioritizes the AWC. In the AP, top two is out of reach this season, so realistically the best we can do is a semi. So I say throw the kitchen sink at the next two ERC games, see if we can get a home QF. After that, who knows? I'd fancy our chances are greater than beating Sarries or Exeter away in an AP semi.



BATH supporter since 1975

Adopted players:
2015/6 Tom Homer
2016/7 Matt Banahan
2017/8 Jeff Williams

 
MESSAGES->author
Which Tyler (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
19 December, 2017 11:06
Quote:
jayeatman
Nobody prioritizes the AWC. In the AP, top two is out of reach this season, so realistically the best we can do is a semi. So I say throw the kitchen sink at the next two ERC games, see if we can get a home QF. After that, who knows? I'd fancy our chances are greater than beating Sarries or Exeter away in an AP semi.
Yeah, absolutely no way that we can make up 2 points over the course of 12 matches; utterly impossible, can't be done.

Well, that, or you're basing this on assumptions made in pre-season and ignoring what's actually happened since September (Saracens, Wasps and Leicester are nowhere near to being the teams we all expected them to be, whilst Glos (and Bath) are significantly better than expected



A man who cannot change his mind, cannot change anything
http://www.rugbyrebels.co/board/download/file.php?id=608
RAEBURN SHIELD

 
MESSAGES->author
jayeatman (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
19 December, 2017 11:20
Point taken, and Sarries have had a disastrous run recently. Incredible that they've lost 7 on the trot in all competitions, but they are still 3rd and I think over the whole season, Sarries and Exeter will comfortably end up as top two.



BATH supporter since 1975

Adopted players:
2015/6 Tom Homer
2016/7 Matt Banahan
2017/8 Jeff Williams

 
Barnoid
Barnoid (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
19 December, 2017 11:24
Aren't squads nominated at the beginning of the competition, meaning Treviso (and possibly Scarlets when playing Toulon, if we've already beaten them at the Rec and they're out by then) won't be able to play an especially weakened team?

They may be disinterested and not have any chance of progressing but I don't think that we'll be playing their reserves.

 
MESSAGES->author
jayeatman (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
19 December, 2017 11:29
Nominated squad size is 40-odd so plenty of scope for fielding a weakened team. As an example try taking the best 17 players out of our nominated squad: [www.epcrugby.com]

For instance, if they were all fit, we could start this 15:
Tom Homer
Darren Atkins
Aled Brew
Max Clarke
Jack Wilson
Josh Lewis
Darren Allinson
Lucas Noguera Paz
Michael Van Vuuren
Sam Nixon
Levi Douglas
James Phillips
Zach Mercer
Josh Bayliss
Paul Grant



BATH supporter since 1975

Adopted players:
2015/6 Tom Homer
2016/7 Matt Banahan
2017/8 Jeff Williams



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 19/12/2017 12:02 by jayeatman.

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
19 December, 2017 11:34
Hard to believe that Chris Cook is only a few months younger than Faletau and older than JJ. I feel old now, I still think of Cook as a kid.

 
Shep58
Shep58 (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
19 December, 2017 13:08
Anyone know when the Round 5 & 6 dates get confirmed?

 
Barnoid
Barnoid (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
19 December, 2017 14:47
Quote:
jayeatman
Nominated squad size is 40-odd so plenty of scope for fielding a weakened team. As an example try taking the best 17 players out of our nominated squad: [www.epcrugby.com]
For instance, if they were all fit, we could start this 15:
Tom Homer
Darren Atkins
Aled Brew
Max Clarke
Jack Wilson
Josh Lewis
Darren Allinson
Lucas Noguera Paz
Michael Van Vuuren
Sam Nixon
Levi Douglas
James Phillips
Zach Mercer
Josh Bayliss
Paul Grant

Thanks Jay, for clarifying. I don't know why I had it in my head that the nominated squads were smaller than that.

I guess that bodes well in that Treviso, in round 6, may field a team of kids against us.

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
21 December, 2017 12:03
Quote:
Shep58
Anyone know when the Round 5 & 6 dates get confirmed?

@ChampionsCup

3 hours ago

The confirmed fixtures for Rounds 5 and 6 will be announced at 3pm (GMT) today.

#ChampionsCup

(AWs second try was awarded the best try of Round 4.)

 
Mike the Taxi
Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
21 December, 2017 12:56
And there was me thinking that this was an alternative to the 'Missionary Position'

 
MESSAGES->author
CoochieCoo (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
21 December, 2017 13:32
This from FB on AW's try

Quote:
Your votes were counted and added to the expert opinion of Sky Sports' Will Greenwood and this try from Bath Rugby's Anthony Watson's is Round 4's Try of the Round!
Will Greenwood: “Anthony Watson’s angelic arc for his second try was a thing of rare rugby beauty. Even Eddie Jones’ poker face cracked as he watched from the stands. Watson is one of those players who terrifies defenders and gets fans on their feet.”



http://zdgzqa.bay.livefilestore.com/y1p7Mwi7pLXeM89TY2KFdDQ-UUDGSv1FKNdhYdrW-koAuRN3tsqCPfE3onFxuO-3cZ0057Tom1uJai3vjkz3dvY_Q/1998%20Euro%20Champs.jpg http://zdgzqa.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pFul9UAV5zEXOzeRc1kmmlgDKXTYTIlTnGoQzYelH6KzdCeU-exN0IGo74QN2OGvlSoEiVjzAESvHx9BFlBsNFA/Bath%202008.jpg

 
Jonny Fantastic
Jonny Fantastic (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
21 December, 2017 14:35
Round 5 and 6 date and kick offs as follows:

R5 v Scarlets (Home) Fri 12th Jan ko 1945
R6 v Benetton (Away) Sat 20th Jan ko 1730

 
Beergoggles
Beergoggles (IP Logged)

Re: Champions Cup Position
21 December, 2017 14:44
Thanks for nothing TV schedulers. Our Christmas game on a Friday night and our big Euro game on a Friday night. Thank heavens that Toulon was at an Ok time.

I'd love to see an estimate of cash taken St the ground and in the town Sat versus Friday night.


Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.
We record all IP addresses on the Sportnetwork message boards which may be required by the authorities in case of defamatory or abusive comment. We seek to monitor the Message Boards at regular intervals. We do not associate Sportnetwork with any of the comments and do not take responsibility for any statements or opinions expressed on the Message Boards. If you have any cause for concern over any material posted here please let us know as soon as possible by e-mailing abuse@sportnetwork.net
 
 

Who is online?

Total users online:  

Most users online:  

Users on this site:  

Where are they?