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opti
Optimist (IP Logged)

Banners to Glos
07 January, 2018 16:36
Confirmed so it seems [www.bathchronicle.co.uk]

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
07 January, 2018 16:39
They are just quoting TRP.

 
opti
Optimist (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
07 January, 2018 16:52
Hard to imagine they would write it as they have unless they were sure?

If Glos are paying him more than we are prepared to pay him then I think they are mugs. A large part of his current value to Bath is his status as icon, senior pro, clubman, rallying point in a crisis. Thatís not a status heís necessarily going to take to Glos, and as a player heís handy but the more he slows up the more heíll look like a second row playing in the backs. Thatís not to say I donít think we should be trying to keep him, or that heís not a loss. But fair play to the club if they put the money to good use with a real flyer for the future. And fair play to him for looking after himself and his family.

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
07 January, 2018 16:59
I guess that joe cokanasiga is an almost direct (if green) replacement so seems like the better long term option. Banners owes us nothing and I wish him all the best. Iím sure we will see him back in some role eventually.

 
MESSAGES->author
CoochieCoo (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
07 January, 2018 16:59
Yep he is gone all but the ink drying bit. Agreed, Opti, a player's career is short so if Glos offer him double and a longer contract, Banners needs to bite their hand off with all six fingers! winking smiley



http://zdgzqa.bay.livefilestore.com/y1p7Mwi7pLXeM89TY2KFdDQ-UUDGSv1FKNdhYdrW-koAuRN3tsqCPfE3onFxuO-3cZ0057Tom1uJai3vjkz3dvY_Q/1998%20Euro%20Champs.jpg http://zdgzqa.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pFul9UAV5zEXOzeRc1kmmlgDKXTYTIlTnGoQzYelH6KzdCeU-exN0IGo74QN2OGvlSoEiVjzAESvHx9BFlBsNFA/Bath%202008.jpg

 
opti
Optimist (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
07 January, 2018 17:01
6 fingers - v. good CC!

 
DanWiley
DanWiley (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
07 January, 2018 17:09
Of the parties, I think we've done the best out of that. In the same vein as opti, he's a decent wing option but he's not really on form now and will only get older and slower from here. Banners might be on a bit more for a couple of years, but he's thrown away credit for things like a testimonial and future jobs. The desk would have to be hugely better. I'd like is to look at our next generation of wingers, we now have cap and space to do it, in fact we probably have to.

 
MESSAGES->author
OutsideBath (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
07 January, 2018 17:09
Could be worse, he could have joined Bristol.



Tom Dunn - Adopted player 2018/19

 
B4thB4ck
B4thB4ck (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
07 January, 2018 17:10
I can see the sense in it all but I just can't stand the thought of him in in a red shirt.

 
southgate
southgate (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
07 January, 2018 17:10
I wish him all the best a fine player and man.

 
Boldangrey
Boldangrey (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
07 January, 2018 17:12
Glos have overpaid.

It has cost us nothing and freed up some cap.

Still sorry to see him go.

 
MESSAGES->author
roywalker (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
07 January, 2018 17:15
Didnít Cokanisga just sign a new 4 year deal late last year? Iím aware that contracts mean nothing anymore so long as you have the financial clout to buy it out. Perhaps he has a relegation clause in there.

Lewingtons deal is up this season. Maybe jump in on and hijack the potential ďoff to Sarries to replace Wyles dealĒ.

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
07 January, 2018 17:31
Quote:
roywalker
Didnít Cokanisga just sign a new 4 year deal late last year? Iím aware that contracts mean nothing anymore so long as you have the financial clout to buy it out. Perhaps he has a relegation clause in there.
Lewingtons deal is up this season. Maybe jump in on and hijack the potential ďoff to Sarries to replace Wyles dealĒ.

Yes he did, with a relegation release clause TRP is reporting.

DW I certainly donít think that Banners has thrown away the potential for future jobs.

 
MESSAGES->author
CoochieCoo (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
07 January, 2018 17:39
The problem with a testimonial it needs a good promotional presenter to organise events etc. Not sure that it pays that well even though monies earned I believe is tax free. Better to go for the bigger deal than a hope of making a mint on events that may not be successful?



http://zdgzqa.bay.livefilestore.com/y1p7Mwi7pLXeM89TY2KFdDQ-UUDGSv1FKNdhYdrW-koAuRN3tsqCPfE3onFxuO-3cZ0057Tom1uJai3vjkz3dvY_Q/1998%20Euro%20Champs.jpg http://zdgzqa.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pFul9UAV5zEXOzeRc1kmmlgDKXTYTIlTnGoQzYelH6KzdCeU-exN0IGo74QN2OGvlSoEiVjzAESvHx9BFlBsNFA/Bath%202008.jpg

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
07 January, 2018 17:43
My guess is that the extra year on top whack (when he will be 34/35?) plus his salary increase (reported as double) is worth significantly more than a testimonial year?

 
MESSAGES->author
OutsideBath (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
07 January, 2018 17:44
Unlike amateur sport that's all about trophies, money is important in professional sport.

Winning trophies is not particularly likely at either club so money becomes the deciding factor. Don't blame him for moving and wish him all the best.



Tom Dunn - Adopted player 2018/19

 
DanWiley
DanWiley (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
07 January, 2018 18:15
"DW I certainly donít think that Banners has thrown away the potential for future jobs."

I said credit for future jobs. I'd be less bothered of he wasn't offered a job at the club now. I'm slightly less interested in seeing him as an after dinner speaker and so on. I don't know where he wants to go, but I can't see any options that have improved as a result.

How much do we think a testimonial is worth then? I'd have thought you could do well with one, but I must admit I don't know.

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
07 January, 2018 18:20
Iím the same and I guess it also depends on how well a club is supported and how popular a player has been. I have always imagined a couple of hundred grand? Would too would be interested to see a figure if someone can find an example.

 
Beergoggles
Beergoggles (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
07 January, 2018 18:35
Will always be a Bath legend to me and has given us 12 great years. Be odd seeing him in a Red top but wish him the best of luck and hope heís ****ed Glaws for as much as he can.

 
Kidney Stone
Kidney Stone (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
07 January, 2018 20:28
Quote:
Beergoggles
Will always be a Bath legend to me and has given us 12 great years. Be odd seeing him in a Red top but wish him the best of luck and hope heís ****ed Glaws for as much as he can.

Agree with this. Truly gutted that he is going but wish Banners all the very best. Personally I believe that his dressing room presence is going to be missed.

 
opti
Optimist (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
07 January, 2018 21:25
If Glos have doubled his salary - either he signed a rubbish contract 5 years ago, or they have lost their minds. I'd guess that he's 'doubling' his money only in as much as he's getting 3 years at, say, £150k, rather than 2 years at £125k?

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
07 January, 2018 21:56
Wasnít it someone who said that at a Q&A? Someone reported it on here, canít remember who.

 
bathleds
bathleds (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 08:43
I know for a fact that its nowhere near double his salary. Glos have offered him what he wanted Bath to offer him. We are talking a 30k per season difference.

 
MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 08:51
But for an extra year I believe, at this point in his career an extra year on better money means a great deal.

We will miss him, perhaps there is a clause in his contract stating he is allowed to give interception passes when playing against his old club!

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 08:55
Quote:
bathleds
I know for a fact that its nowhere near double his salary. Glos have offered him what he wanted Bath to offer him. We are talking a 30k per season difference.

That doesn't sound very much at all in the grand scheme of things, sadly.

 
Boldangrey
Boldangrey (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 09:02
Wasn't the main difference 3 years as opposed to 2?

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 09:06
Quote:
Boldangrey
Wasn't the main difference 3 years as opposed to 2?

So the Chron said, but Bath were chucking in the testimonial year. Oh well, cant cry over spilt milk.

 
dr.bath1865
dr.bath1865 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 09:19
A shame if true. And an even bigger shame if we only let him go over £30k a year.

But IF we get, maybe, Earle, Lewington or Cokanasiga as a replacement, then I can understand the club's thinking, from a business and playing perspective. A shame on an emotional level - Banahan is blue, black and white through and through - but with Roko and Watson here for the next few years, freshening up the left wing spot with some young blood might be a real point of improvement for the starting XV. It might weaken us from a squad perspective, though, especially on international weekends with JJ and AW away.

Let's see. IF we replace him well, I think the emotional loss will be mitigated somewhat.

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 09:28
Quote:
dr.bath1865
A shame if true. And an even bigger shame if we only let him go over £30k a year.
But IF we get, maybe, Earle, Lewington or Cokanasiga as a replacement, then I can understand the club's thinking, from a business and playing perspective. A shame on an emotional level - Banahan is blue, black and white through and through - but with Roko and Watson here for the next few years, freshening up the left wing spot with some young blood might be a real point of improvement for the starting XV. It might weaken us from a squad perspective, though, especially on international weekends with JJ and AW away.

Let's see. IF we replace him well, I think the emotional loss will be mitigated somewhat.

I thought that Lewington is off to Sarries and Earle to Quins (to replace Yarde)?

 
dr.bath1865
dr.bath1865 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 09:32
They're not confirmed. I guess much like Banahan isn't confirmed...

Cokanasiga the most likely target for us, as I understand it. My point is that if we replace Banahan well, then we might start next season with a better first XV back three (ducks, awaits incoming fire...).

 
Rolfs_Cartoon_Club
@Hydor18 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 09:52
My opinion has always been is that if you allow a player to leave, any replacement, be he recruited internally or externally, must be of equal if not better calibre.

Banners has been with us forever, and is consistent in form and valuable in versatility. I can only assume there is more to it than a disagreement over pay, because players of his type aren't ten-a-penny.

He will be missed and, as others have said, it'll make my toes curl to see him in grimm colours (please, please, please don't let him score against us!!).

 
bathstigg
bathstigg (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 10:03
Another player to mention waiting in the wings is Levi Davis who we should see in the Anglo Welsh cup soon. Cokanasiga and Davis would compliment Roko and Brew on the wings nicely. Watson is our established full back now. 12 years is outstanding service from Bannahan but like all things come to an end eventually.

 
DanWiley
DanWiley (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 10:06
"My opinion has always been is that if you allow a player to leave, any replacement, be he recruited internally or externally, must be of equal if not better calibre"

I don't think it is as simple as that. For one thing it applies that our squad gets continuously better, which would be great, but would also mean it would get continuously more expensive. But I think more fundamentally than that it not the model we want. Banner's "replacement" should have been recruited 2 or 3 years ago when he was 21-22 and coming into his prime now. We should now be looking for the 21 year old to become the understudy. That new understudy is very unlikely to anything like as good as banners is now, and certainly not as good as he was on top form, though hopefully he shows the potential to be that good or better.

Alongside banners I think we have 4 wingers in their late, late 20s/30s. I reckon we need to bring in a couple in their mid twenties and a couple just out of the academy in the next few years. Though with 4 wingers and the likes of Watson, Homer and JJ there's not a desperate need to bring anyone in right now.

 
sid the seagull
sid the seagull (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 10:08
The emotional/loyalty/money thing is so aggravating mentally, so shall personally park that for a bit.

On another angle though, one could argue that theirs for us have been better than ours for them. I.E. Fidler and Stooke versus Barkley and Tindall.


PECK

 
opti
Optimist (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 10:15
If the Club took a strict business decision on his value, and has a replacement lined up, then it's hard to argue. And if Matt then went out and got himself a pay rise elsewhere, good for him.

What i really, really hope didn't happen is that the Club took a view that they could get away with under-offering on the assumption that Matt and his family's ties to the Club and to the city would make him feel that moving clubs wasn't worth the hassle. That would be a shabby way to treat a club servant.

 
annie blackthorn
annie blackthorn (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 10:24
I too hope that your speculation isn't true. But he wouldn't be the first to be the victim of hard nosed accounting by the current management of this great club which will still be there when they are long gone.

Good luck Banners. As I commented on another thread, always remember him arriving, a bit lost' as an 18 year old from LI. He was a protťgť of Ashton. Later, another memory of fighting off the lurid attention of almost under age wannbe WAGS at a club supper, but maturing in to a fine club servant and there is no doubting his added extra value in showing incoming young players how things are done as a professional player at Bath. He will be missed. Just hope the Shed aren't too 'beastly to him!!!

 
Rolfs_Cartoon_Club
@Hydor18 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 10:24
Sid / Opti - both bang on.

 
MESSAGES->author
Clarkey3k (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 10:41
For me this illustrates the brutal, transactional nature of pro sports today. It doesn't surprise me but it does disappoint me...



Adopted players: 2018/19 Michael Van Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw

Change a life with a loan [www.deki.org.uk]

 
gaz59
gaz59 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 10:53
Inevitable and understanding parting of the ways

My only worry is that we are now very short on the Club Talisman role

Who does that leave as the longest serving first team squad players? Louw? Atwood? Batty?

 
MESSAGES->author
Which Tyler (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 10:54
Club legend; but I can't see any cause to "blame" anyone.
A winger's peak age is 25-30 years old; has he stayed, then next season our 3 first choice wingers would all have been over 31, with our back-ups all being 28+.
We need to start refreshing our wing stocks; who makes way would depend on value-for-money, and who's available as a replacement. Roko, Banas and Williams all seem to have their contracts up at the end of this season.

Bana's last contract was signed 5 years ago, when he was 26; so early in his prime, and would have been signed whilst he was a current international; so he signed that contract at the very peak of his earning potential.
Since then, the salary cap has increased, but so have squad sizes; whilst his value as a percentage of salary cap has decreased, and is only going to decrease further over the next few years as he ages, becomes more prone to injuries, and longer healing times, and slows down (though his game has ever revolved too much around outright pace).
An extra year at a higher salary has got to be very attractive for him, and I do not blame him for grabbing that with both hands - however, from Bath's perspective, it would be a gamble to match that. He probably earns more than Roko, whilst having more attrition in his body, and likely to go less far into his 30s as a top performer as a result of that attrition.
On top of that, it looks like the replacement we're courting is Joe Cokanasiga - stylistically a like-for-like replacement for Banas, who would complement Roko nicely, but would be a bit too same-y if paired with Banas. Joe's potential is probably higher that Bana's at his peak as well (though he may not fulfill that potential).

Great club-man that Banas is; if we're replacing him with Cokanasiga, then I'd consider that an upgrade, and a well timed replacement; but we need to make that signing to do so.
Banas gets extra security, an extra year on a really good wage, and is well worth it for him. Glos get... a big guy on the wing to inject some much-needed nouse into their backline, but are probably paying a little over the odds.


Fair well Matt, and good luck



A man who cannot change his mind, cannot change anything
http://www.rugbyrebels.co/board/download/file.php?id=608
RAEBURN SHIELD

 
MESSAGES->author
hasta (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 11:02
It's a professional environment now and that means Bath offering what they think Banners is worth and Banners trying to get the most for his career. I'm quite surprised that Glaws really need him tbh. Banners is a very useful squad player for us now, able to fit in across the back line, but it's tough to argue that he'd be first choice in any position now.

 
Awp24975
Awp24975 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 11:08
Well said WT!

A good club player but is now 31 we need to refresh our wingers. We have had the best out of him and there canít be sentiment in professional sport to offer him 3 years at his age doesnít make sense. I think Bath have done the right thing, he was offered what they thought he was worth, he thought different and so decided to look elsewhere. If we can use his wages to get a young exciting winger in then I think it is a good deal for us.

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 11:09
Quote:
sid the seagull
The emotional/loyalty/money thing is so aggravating mentally, so shall personally park that for a bit.
On another angle though, one could argue that theirs for us have been better than ours for them. I.E. Fidler and Stooke versus Barkley and Tindall.


PECK

Balshaw and Burns? Shaun Knight?

 
opti
Optimist (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 11:16
Another (potential) disappointment in this episode is that we appear to be once again raiding London Irish's resources and still failing to produce a successor from within.

Without trawling through it again, I don't think the name of Darren Atkins - who is the same age group as Cokanasiga - has cropped up on this thread. Wouldn't the ideal situation be that Banners is here next year helping to pass the baton on to Atkins? But that ideal is undermined by the fact that Banners won't be here, and Atkins is still a way short of being chucked in (which, given that Todd has a reasonable record of chucking youngsters in at the deep end must indicate something.

There are 7 backs listed in our Academy. 2 have been shipped in from Leeds. One - Partington - is too young to be judged; Rory Jennings is surely marking time before moving to a Championship club; Harry Davies joined from Cardiff, is going to be 24 in May, and is still listed as an Academy player. Levi Davis is the other option, but it doesn't appear that he's anywhere near the first team.

The next cabs off the rank in terms of backs are the Uni players who have featured for United this season ... hmmm, that's gone well.

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 11:37
Levi Davis is still very young and has just been offered a new contract so I think that we need to reserve judgement there. Harry Davies is certainly old enough that he should have shown more IMO. Surprised that there aren't any flyers on the 7s scene or in the championship who aren't promising - I was sad to see Jonah Holmes go to Tigers.

But yes, totally agree (and have made the point in the U20s thread for example) that our academy appears to be having a bit of a drought since Ellis, Ewels, Mercer, Bayliss etc have graduated. Looks like Partington, Ojomoh and de Glanville are the next ones coming through but are a long way from regular first team action.

(I'm not sure that 'raiding' is the correct term. According to the report we have enquired with LI about getting an option on him if he does indeed leave them? He is, after all contracted with them for another 4 years.)

 
MESSAGES->author
CoochieCoo (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 11:37
Quote:
sid the seagull
The emotional/loyalty/money thing is so aggravating mentally, so shall personally park that for a bit.
On another angle though, one could argue that theirs for us have been better than ours for them. I.E. Fidler and Stooke versus Barkley and Tindall.


PECK

...and Dave Attwood!



http://zdgzqa.bay.livefilestore.com/y1p7Mwi7pLXeM89TY2KFdDQ-UUDGSv1FKNdhYdrW-koAuRN3tsqCPfE3onFxuO-3cZ0057Tom1uJai3vjkz3dvY_Q/1998%20Euro%20Champs.jpg http://zdgzqa.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pFul9UAV5zEXOzeRc1kmmlgDKXTYTIlTnGoQzYelH6KzdCeU-exN0IGo74QN2OGvlSoEiVjzAESvHx9BFlBsNFA/Bath%202008.jpg

 
Bathovalballer
Bathovalballer (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 11:55
I believe Hasta has it right and as sad as it is to lose (if it is a done deal!) a long term servant like Banners, I cannot see where we would start him as first choice if all our squad was fit and available.

We offered what a 30 years plus winger is worth, he managed to negotiate more. Good luck to him and his family, and thanks for the memories and all your efforts.

If I have it right, Cockasigna is a big unit and definitely faster than Banners, plus youth on his side, means it sounds excellent business if we do sign him. This seems contingent on Irish getting relegated, which I personally will be sad to see.

But I also agree some of those in the Academy should be stepping up, like Atkins, Davies or Davis. Let see what they can do in the AWP games, just in case Big C doesn't come our way.

 
Lee Bideaux
Armchair Fan (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 12:39
Quote:
sid the seagull
The emotional/loyalty/money thing is so aggravating mentally, so shall personally park that for a bit.
On another angle though, one could argue that theirs for us have been better than ours for them. I.E. Fidler and Stooke versus Barkley and Tindall.


PECK

This is a Good Thought.



_____________________________________________________

I like turtles.

 
Lee Bideaux
Armchair Fan (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 12:42
...and of course, best of luck to Bananaman.

He has been the provider of some great moments for us.



_____________________________________________________

I like turtles.

 
HMilner
Big Dog (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 12:50
It would be a real shame to lose Banners - he's a fantastic man and representative without even taking into account the magic moments and wholly committed performances he still produces for us week in and week out when fit. Regardless of where he goes to finish off his career he will be a Bath legend for me, one of our most prolific try scorers and a fella that we can be proud to say represented us for the majority of his career. If it's confirmed for sure then I wish him the best with absolutely no hard feelings at all!

I hope the club take the time to find a good, young option. Someone that needs a chance to start regularly for their development but is not so green that they could not become an immediate regular starter. My preference would be someone like Nathan Earle perhaps who is not getting as much time as he would like to start at Sarries but could easily start every week for us. He's a big powerful lad with some wheels! Alternatively Josh Bassett at Wasps is supposedly out of contract soon if I read correctly elsewhere?



Adopted players: 2017-18 Shaun Knight; 2018-19 Jonathan Joseph

 
opti
Optimist (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 12:55
The other thing about Banners is that his presence does dictate that you use him in a specific and pretty limited way. I'd much rather see us looking to take on one of the really modern, non-stop wingers who crop up all over the pitch and give the playmakers lots of options in the way they bring their wingers into the game.

The more I think about it, the less I understand why Glos are bothering. Maybe they just liked the idea of upsetting us?

 
Bath Hammer
Bath Hammer (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 13:00
I am disappointed to be losing Banners as he seems to be playing as well as ever. Maybe he has lost a bit of pace but he seems to be more of s physical presence & leader. I tell myself that he is more prone to injury but Iím not even sure that is the case as the guy we are apparently interested in at LI doesnít have too good a record of injuries. It was obviously difficult to cough up the amount Gloucester are offering for 3 years but I wouldnít mind betting that in the end we will regret not doing so. Time will tell.

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 13:15
Quote:
Optimist
The other thing about Banners is that his presence does dictate that you use him in a specific and pretty limited way. I'd much rather see us looking to take on one of the really modern, non-stop wingers who crop up all over the pitch and give the playmakers lots of options in the way they bring their wingers into the game.
The more I think about it, the less I understand why Glos are bothering. Maybe they just liked the idea of upsetting us?

So that's Nowell then...? If we could grab anyone (national interest apart) that I've seen this season it would be Josh Adams - that kid is electric, amazing that he was on loan at Cinderford not all that long ago and Scarlets must be kicking themselves.

Banners certainly does crop up all over the pitch and is probably the least limited player that we have given that he has played every position from 11-15 this season (according to the Chron)? He still sucks in the opposition making the space for the tricky guys.

 
MESSAGES->author
Clarkey3k (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 13:19
I do wonder if all the other players in the Bath squad are as pragmatic about this issue as most COML posters seem to be? Are they all shrugging their shoulders and moving on or wondering if this has happened to Banners where does that leave me? Perhaps I am being to sentimental but it does say something to me about how the club chooses to manage talent...



Adopted players: 2018/19 Michael Van Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw

Change a life with a loan [www.deki.org.uk]

 
B4thB4ck
B4thB4ck (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 13:44
I believe Banners is the last current player or coach on my 2007/08 team poster as found in match day programmes of the day.

 
Rolfs_Cartoon_Club
@Hydor18 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 14:01
Interesting question, Clarkey. I think they'll be pragmatic; after all, it's a job. I would imagine contract situations such as Kyle Eastmond and George Ford's are more unsettle. Those and the likes of Stevens, Lipman, Crockett, Higgins and Harrison.

 
MESSAGES->author
Which Tyler (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 14:48
He isn't being kicked out
He isn't choosing to leave mid-contract
Overhead much doubt that he'll be put on gardening leave
He has been offered a contract
It doesn't even seem like the contract we offered was a piss-take

Why on Earth would it create any problems for the rest of the squad? It's just a player moving on at the end f his contract, having successfully negotiated a better offer from a different team.



A man who cannot change his mind, cannot change anything
http://www.rugbyrebels.co/board/download/file.php?id=608
RAEBURN SHIELD




Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 08/01/2018 15:36 by Which Tyler.

 
sid the seagull
sid the seagull (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 15:09
CC, Atters, of course!
Matt (only Balshaw really counts and can be added to list).

And both of the above underline my point.

FLAP

 
HMilner
Big Dog (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 15:26
I don't think this would unsettle anyone tbh. Players, especially of the younger generation, are as aware as anyone that playing sport professionally is a career now as well as of course a passion.

As a result they all have agents from 18/19 (potentially younger) who are trying to get them in there with the best teams and the best coaches. An older guy who has decided to try and get the best financial package possible to see out the end of his career is not going to be seen as unsettling for the squad as it isn't like Bath have said 'Banners, you're a long term servant but we don't want you anymore' is it!

I am sure he will justifiably move on with good grace from the club, coaches, fans and management and be welcome back anytime. He doesn't strike me as the sort of guy who'd want to leave with any bad blood or poor relationship and there would be no reason for either party to feel that way in these circumstances!



Adopted players: 2017-18 Shaun Knight; 2018-19 Jonathan Joseph

 
BathPatriot
BathPatriot (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 17:17
Never mind. Good luck to Banners. The wheel turns.

 
Ian E
Ian E (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 18:11
Thanks Banners it's been a blast here's to the future I hope it works out

 
AndyMGlos
Lebowski (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
08 January, 2018 20:39
Quote:
sid the seagull
The emotional/loyalty/money thing is so aggravating mentally, so shall personally park that for a bit.
On another angle though, one could argue that theirs for us have been better than ours for them. I.E. Fidler and Stooke versus Barkley and Tindall.


PECK

EFS and Balshaw. Barclay was one of the worst signings we ever made, but we were used.

 
MESSAGES->author
Griff (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
10 January, 2018 12:10
Who saw this coming then? (Sm161)

Confirmed on the Offy

Sad to see Banners go, good luck Matt (Sm128)



"You're going to need a bigger boat"

Sam Underhill Adopted Player 2018/19

 
Bathovalballer
Bathovalballer (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
10 January, 2018 12:18
Very best of luck Banners and thanks.

I will always remember your battering ram runs and some vital scores.

Your decision is fully understood for your family's long term benefit and hopefully you can continue in playing in a similar vein with Gloucester. (Preferably not against us!)

Now then Bath Rugby who have we coming in replacement/or addition to the backs?

 
supermarinematt
supermarinematt (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
10 January, 2018 12:19
Bendy also wading in on Twitter saying

"Well what can you say about this........ obviously something very wrong at the top if they are not willing to do everything to keep a world class player/bloke like Banners. Another player not given what he deserves. Great signing by @gloucesterrugby however. #200club"

Ex players saying this can't be good...

 
HugoBoss
HugoBoss (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
10 January, 2018 12:22
I'm very sad to see Matt go indeed. Over recent years its felt at times like he has dragged the side through with his efforts and endeavours. He leaves having given us many brilliant memories (Semi-final hat trick for starters....) Its a shame he leaves having not won anything in a long time, he very much deserves it IMO.

I totally understand both sides of the argument for this departure. Wanting a higher salary is entirely reasonable given he has a family and his belief he is worth it. Likewise, I very much appreciate Baths hesitation given his age, the salary involved, and need to freshen things up in our squad. I do regret the fact we are losing so long serving a player who knows the club the most out of our squad. That knowledge, pride and dedication is hard to come by. I hope therefore we will see a return in the future once he hangs up his boots.

My Xmas present this year was a signed shirt by the man himself, a bittersweet gift to receive!

Thank you Banners for all your efforts, memories and I wish you the very best in the rest of your career.



Adopted Player 2017-18.....Semesa "Freak of Nature" Rokoduguni

 
Yorkie2
Yorkie2 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
10 January, 2018 12:26
That has been coming but was hoping it was somehow wrong and the club would find a way to keep him on side
Quote from BBC site says

Bath wanted Banahan, their longest-serving player, to stay with them and had offered him a new contract.

However, boss Todd Blackadder admitted in November: "There are a lot of clubs with a lot more money than we can offer."

What a shame we could not find that little bit extra either in time span or cash, especially when you examine sone of the dross we have forked out for over the years.
He always seemed passionate about the club and cared, trying to pass on standards to those coming through the ranks, we never heard anything but good and he seemed happy to serve the club whatever they asked of him. He was always charming and always had a word for anyone, when did you last or ever hear a bad word about him.

What sort of message does it send out regards loyalty and service

Well I suppose everything these days it all boils down to business, similar to the number of Friday night fixtures.
Player loyalty and supporters loyalty means nothing these days

Matt sorry to see you go, I saw your first game and many in between, sometimes it didn't always work in your favour, but your work ethic and commitment could never be questioned.
I for one will miss you and look forward to the day you maybe return albeit in a different guise

Good luck in your new venture I really do hope it works out, (Perhaps they will excuse you two matches a year, art would just not look right)

 
MESSAGES->author
Rawce (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
10 January, 2018 12:36
Good luck Matt and thanks for some great memories. Other than his defender drawing, aerial play and commitment to the club, I think it's his versatility in the face of multiple injuries that we'll miss the most.

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
10 January, 2018 12:41
End of one chapter, start of a new one (for MB and Bath). All the best Banners.

 
BathBurger
BathBurger (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
10 January, 2018 12:45
Bath rugby hero. Will be so strange to see him in another jersey. Top player, top bloke, top memories. I wish him all the very best going forward.

 
opti
Optimist (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
10 January, 2018 13:37
ShedWeb are so excited about this news that there isn't even a topic on it. Have to say, if it was the other way round, the only thing that would excite me would be the possibility that it was destabilising a rival in some way. You can't exactly say that big, battering-ram wingers are out of vogue, but their selling point is when they are genuinely quick with it.

I reiterate though, that it's a very great shame to lose a character like this when there is so little continuity through the Club connecting one era to another.

 
P G Tips
P G Tips (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
10 January, 2018 13:43
Sad day.

Good luck Matt!

PG



P G Tips



Alex Davies: my adopted Player, 2018-19.

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
10 January, 2018 13:43
There are two topics on it. One on rumours and another of its own.

[www.rugb.co.uk]

(Iím off for a shower after going on there...)

 
MESSAGES->author
JimDaff (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
10 January, 2018 13:49
The club couldíve softened the blow a bit by announcing a couple of signings...

 
MESSAGES->author
woodpecker (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
10 January, 2018 13:58
I hope he does well there from the start, cos if he doesn't he won't have all the goodwill in the bank he has here

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
10 January, 2018 13:59
Quote:
JimDaff
The club couldíve softened the blow a bit by announcing a couple of signings...

Yes quite surprised at that. Or at least renewals.

 
opti
Optimist (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
10 January, 2018 14:10
The way the press release is worded: 'Matt Banahan has confirmed that he will be leaving Bath Rugby at the end of the season to join Gloucester Rugby', when it is usually 'the Club' confirming the news, implies to me that the Club wants us to stress that it was his decision and not theirs. To do that alongside a cheery note saying, 'but not to worry, because we've just signed up xyz' wouldn't really sync for me.

 
opti
Optimist (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
10 January, 2018 14:16
Quote:
BathMatt53
There are two topics on it. One on rumours and another of its own.
[www.rugb.co.uk]

(Iím off for a shower after going on there...)

Had no idea there is a 'ShedLoads' and a 'ShedWeb'.

 
dr.bath1865
dr.bath1865 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
10 January, 2018 14:40
The fact the update on the website doesn't have the usual from the player, "I've enjoyed my time here and I'll continue to do my best for the rest of the season" etc is telling.

But, for me, and I might be in the minority, I think we might have a more dangerous back three next year as a result. The squad might be weaker, however, but if we sign a dangerous left winger who scores 10+ tries a season, combining with Roko and AW, then I think we'll be a better team as a result.

Sad to see the big man go but excited about what's to come.

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
10 January, 2018 14:54
Quote:
dr.bath1865
The fact the update on the website doesn't have the usual from the player, "I've enjoyed my time here and I'll continue to do my best for the rest of the season" etc is telling.
But, for me, and I might be in the minority, I think we might have a more dangerous back three next year as a result. The squad might be weaker, however, but if we sign a dangerous left winger who scores 10+ tries a season, combining with Roko and AW, then I think we'll be a better team as a result.

Sad to see the big man go but excited about what's to come.

Yes that Sarto rumour was interesting.

 
MESSAGES->author
Toast and Marmite (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
10 January, 2018 16:03
Quote:
BathMatt53
Quote:
JimDaff
The club couldíve softened the blow a bit by announcing a couple of signings...

Yes quite surprised at that. Or at least renewals.
I suspect some of thaw targets won't be confirmed until near the end of the season....


"No sprinkles. For every sprinkle I find, I shall kill you."

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
10 January, 2018 16:34
Targets yes, but renewals? They had no issue with Stooke.

 
Ian E
Ian E (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
10 January, 2018 16:41
Sad day indeed

 
Awp24975
Awp24975 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
10 January, 2018 17:15
Quote:
dr.bath1865
But, for me, and I might be in the minority, I think we might have a more dangerous back three next year as a result. The squad might be weaker, however, but if we sign a dangerous left winger who scores 10+ tries a season, combining with Roko and AW, then I think we'll be a better team as a result..

Im with you in the minority then, think it is a good decision if we can get a young exciting winger as think it will improve our back 3.

 
AndyMGlos
Lebowski (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
10 January, 2018 18:46
Quote:
Optimist
ShedWeb are so excited about this news that there isn't even a topic on it. Have to say, if it was the other way round, the only thing that would excite me would be the possibility that it was destabilising a rival in some way. You can't exactly say that big, battering-ram wingers are out of vogue, but their selling point is when they are genuinely quick with it.
I reiterate though, that it's a very great shame to lose a character like this when there is so little continuity through the Club connecting one era to another.

As BathMatt says there are two topics. However we also have a Rumours thread which is 776 pages long - it has been discussed at length on there over the last few weeks.

One or two posters on Shedweb think he is garbage and a waste of money, but we all have those donít we? smiling smiley The vast majority think your loss is our gain. He will be made very welcome at Kingsholm.

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
10 January, 2018 19:04
Quote:
Lebowski
Quote:
Optimist
ShedWeb are so excited about this news that there isn't even a topic on it. Have to say, if it was the other way round, the only thing that would excite me would be the possibility that it was destabilising a rival in some way. You can't exactly say that big, battering-ram wingers are out of vogue, but their selling point is when they are genuinely quick with it.
I reiterate though, that it's a very great shame to lose a character like this when there is so little continuity through the Club connecting one era to another.

As BathMatt says there are two topics. However we also have a Rumours thread which is 776 pages long - it has been discussed at length on there over the last few weeks.

One or two posters on Shedweb think he is garbage and a waste of money, but we all have those donít we? smiling smiley The vast majority think your loss is our gain. He will be made very welcome at Kingsholm.

I have no doubt that, if you have the 'spare' cash he would be a good signing for anyone. The problem being that we either didn't have it, or didn't want to spend it on Banners for whatever reason (strengthening another position or just succession planning).

 
BathHalfFull
BathHalfFull (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
11 January, 2018 14:41
Next time Bruce or Tarquin spin a load of guff about trying to instill a culture into Brand Bath I hope everybody reminds them of this moment. You can splash your cash around on the latest shiny big name (Moody, Beaver, Burgess) all you like but the one thing you can't buy is culture - that comes from within and is built for years through people like Banners. It is a sad sign of the way rugby is going and our club in particular is going under this ownership that our great wise leaders don't recognise that evenputting sentiment to one side, it is worth investing in people like Banners who have lots to offer on the pitch and off it instead of some flashy new toy.

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
11 January, 2018 15:03
Quote:
BathHalfFull
Next time Bruce or Tarquin spin a load of guff about trying to instill a culture into Brand Bath I hope everybody reminds them of this moment. You can splash your cash around on the latest shiny big name (Moody, Beaver, Burgess) all you like but the one thing you can't buy is culture - that comes from within and is built for years through people like Banners. It is a sad sign of the way rugby is going and our club in particular is going under this ownership that our great wise leaders don't recognise that even putting sentiment to one side, it is worth investing in people like Banners who have lots to offer on the pitch and off it instead of some flashy new toy.

You realise that Moody signed 8 years ago? Have you been bottling this up all that time?

I assume that they weighed up the pro's and con's, made him an offer which they thought reflected his value at 31 years of age and it was gazumped by another team. None of us know what the state of the payroll is for the club so I'm not sure we should judge? For example would you prefer that we paid Banners more and then lost Watson somewhere else when his contract renews in 2019?

Sometimes in life (and business) two parties are just too far apart, but you assume that they didn't do everything that they can and, even worse, that they don't recognise the value of Banners to the team. I would counter that if anyone knew, it was them?

 
P G Tips
P G Tips (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
11 January, 2018 16:25
Todd Backadders' view:

[www.bathchronicle.co.uk]

In summary- "We wanted to keep him, Glos came in with a bigger offer. He chose what is best for his family. It is not about 'loyalty', we cant't keep everybody-though we anted to keep Banners & we thank him for what he has done here."


PG

 
opti
Optimist (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
11 January, 2018 16:31
Is it going to be a 'Moody to Bath' or a 'Catt to London Irish' scenario?

Only time will tell, but if i had to put a fiver on it, i'd go with the former.

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
11 January, 2018 16:35
Quote:
Optimist
Is it going to be a 'Moody to Bath' or a 'Catt to London Irish' scenario?
Only time will tell, but if i had to put a fiver on it, i'd go with the former.

A Barkley to Glos...see you next year MB!

 
MESSAGES->author
CoochieCoo (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
11 January, 2018 16:59
Quote:
BathHalfFull
Next time Bruce or Tarquin spin a load of guff about trying to instill a culture into Brand Bath I hope everybody reminds them of this moment. You can splash your cash around on the latest shiny big name (Moody, Beaver, Burgess) all you like but the one thing you can't buy is culture - that comes from within and is built for years through people like Banners. It is a sad sign of the way rugby is going and our club in particular is going under this ownership that our great wise leaders don't recognise that evenputting sentiment to one side, it is worth investing in people like Banners who have lots to offer on the pitch and off it instead of some flashy new toy.

Two words "salary cap" two overseas players coming in can be outside the cap nowadays. Matt has to be paid within. Any extra Matt is paid comes off a potential import. With the balancing of the 40 plus players and seeking to strengthen the squad pragmatism has to prevail over emotion.



http://zdgzqa.bay.livefilestore.com/y1p7Mwi7pLXeM89TY2KFdDQ-UUDGSv1FKNdhYdrW-koAuRN3tsqCPfE3onFxuO-3cZ0057Tom1uJai3vjkz3dvY_Q/1998%20Euro%20Champs.jpg http://zdgzqa.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pFul9UAV5zEXOzeRc1kmmlgDKXTYTIlTnGoQzYelH6KzdCeU-exN0IGo74QN2OGvlSoEiVjzAESvHx9BFlBsNFA/Bath%202008.jpg



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/01/2018 17:13 by CoochieCoo.

 
Ali1969
Ali1969 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
11 January, 2018 17:16
I have no doubt that Banners wanted to be a one man club - Todd Blackadder made it very clear he wanted to keep him, not just for the playing side but also what he brings to the squad and the club.

It is clear TB has very little say in the recruitment and retaining of players, this is not the first time he has been at total odds with the money men who clearly make the decisions.

Nick Abendonons tweet has more bite to it and he clearly has inside knowledge, this move could be a serious own goal in relation to the squad including the management and the boardroom, similar to what happened at Tigers only time can tell, but it certainly does not sit well with most Bath fans.

Anyway Banners you are a legend and a true BBW man, will never get used to seeing in the awful Cherry & White but best of luck and let's hope you go out with a bang and some silverware.

 
MESSAGES->author
hasta (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
11 January, 2018 17:16
'It is worth investing in people like Banners'. Of course it is, and it's not as if no or a derisory contract (a la Mike Catt) was offered. It's just a valuation difference - and a professional sport.

 
MESSAGES->author
Toast and Marmite (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
11 January, 2018 19:56
"The club will always be held very close to me and my family. I'm looking forward to giving my all to the end of the season and leaving my shirt in a better place."

Yeah, those sound like the words of a player that's been royally screwed over by the club.



"No sprinkles. For every sprinkle I find, I shall kill you."

 
Boldangrey
Boldangrey (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
11 January, 2018 20:56
Quote:
BathMatt53
Quote:
BathHalfFull
Next time Bruce or Tarquin spin a load of guff about trying to instill a culture into Brand Bath I hope everybody reminds them of this moment. You can splash your cash around on the latest shiny big name (Moody, Beaver, Burgess) all you like but the one thing you can't buy is culture - that comes from within and is built for years through people like Banners. It is a sad sign of the way rugby is going and our club in particular is going under this ownership that our great wise leaders don't recognise that even putting sentiment to one side, it is worth investing in people like Banners who have lots to offer on the pitch and off it instead of some flashy new toy.

You realise that Moody signed 8 years ago? Have you been bottling this up all that time?



And Leics probably treated Moody (and Hipkiss) worse than we treated Banners.

 
Substitute
Substitute (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
12 January, 2018 08:37
Transactions like this are an inevitable consequence of the salary cap - reward is for future performance and no value can be assigned for loyalty. The NFL with it's salary cap is a prime example.

I am sure without the salary cap Bath would have offered more and paid for something intangible (loyalty) rather than tangible (better player).

There are not many who wish to lose the salary cap, therefore moves like this are an inevitable.

Unless you wish for Bath to overpay for average players (or you are BOB and think we do already), then we just have to suck it up an accept it. Those days are gone.

 
Beergoggles
Beergoggles (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
12 January, 2018 08:47
I think Bendy would be better placed keeping his thoughts to himself. He's presumably still bitter about his departure many years ago.

Good luck Matt and I have every confidence that you'll give it your all to the end of the season. Just need to control the involuntary shudder that every Bath fan gets whenever they enter Kingsholm.

 
DanWiley
DanWiley (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
12 January, 2018 09:29
I think the cap just adds to the natural pressure of not wanting to pay more for something than its worth.

If there weren't a cap do you think Bruce would want to pay Banners more just because he's been here a while? If so, I'd say an easy solution would have been to offer him two contracts now: one the one we did, the second one that comes into force at the end of the first an appoints him official daisy counter for the rec (non-playing).

 
BathMatt53
BathMatt53 (IP Logged)

Re: Banners to Glos
12 January, 2018 09:37
I would like to think that he will finish playing and come back in some capacity anyway.

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