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MESSAGES->author
Something will have to give...
Powick Eastander (IP Logged)
10 April, 2012 15:31
Warriors v Chiefs preview

Quote:
The Warriors have not lost at Sixways since Leicester were the visitors on 27 December.

Quote:
The Chiefs have not lost away from home in the Premiership in 2012.



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usa warrior
Re: Something will have to give...
usa warrior (IP Logged)
10 April, 2012 15:32
Or its a draw...

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
Powick Eastander (IP Logged)
10 April, 2012 15:42
Huummm I doubt that but that would be fine by me!



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usa warrior
Re: Something will have to give...
usa warrior (IP Logged)
10 April, 2012 15:50
Yup, I'd agree. Still optimistic at this point in the week though.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
Shoutin' Bloke (IP Logged)
11 April, 2012 05:15
'16th' man should be the thing to make the difference, where form suggests the above.

Can't see past a defeat at present though with no LBP. They will put too much pressure on the pack and eek the Pens for Meires or Steenson to kick, then kick on later in the game.

It would be nice to keep 15 on the pitch at all time too, to lessen the damage.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
Powick Eastander (IP Logged)
11 April, 2012 06:46
The noise from The Tribe will be the loudest we have had at Sixways so we are going to have to respond in kind!!!



Sponsor me to "Go Sober in October"
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MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
knightstemplar (IP Logged)
11 April, 2012 06:51
What is the tomahawk chop?!

Game will be won by a score!

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
knightstemplar (IP Logged)
11 April, 2012 06:59
Game will be won or lost up front....

Admirably Chiefs front 8 are predominantly the same ones that won the Championship.

 
usa warrior
Re: Something will have to give...
usa warrior (IP Logged)
11 April, 2012 07:59
Tomahawk chop is an American cheer used for teams whose name is Native American related - i.e. Seminoles, Chiefs, Indians, etc. Youtube it, it's pretty cool.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
Shoutin' Bloke (IP Logged)
11 April, 2012 20:18
Didn't Tomahawk just get the chop from Warriors?(Sm13)

 
oldbean
Re: Something will have to give...
4everchief (IP Logged)
11 April, 2012 22:52
Just thought you would like to have a taste of things to come.

[
">www.youtube.com
]

Looking forward to my first visit to Sixways.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
12 April, 2012 07:20
And heres a couple of the travelling tribe hope you can learn the words and join in

[
">www.youtube.com
]

[
">www.youtube.com
]

Looking forward our trip to sixways

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
drifter (IP Logged)
12 April, 2012 07:32
think they might teach us a thing or 2 about support. mind it helps when they know the words to the song.(Sm161)

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
knightstemplar (IP Logged)
12 April, 2012 08:21
Admittedly that is very cool ......!

 
usa warrior
Re: Something will have to give...
usa warrior (IP Logged)
12 April, 2012 09:18
Quote:
Shouts loudly in rain
And heres a couple of the travelling tribe hope you can learn the words

Cool, but highly unoriginal. Many US universities been doing it for years.


">This is how it's done!!




Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/04/2012 09:20 by usa warrior.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
drifter (IP Logged)
12 April, 2012 09:27
well if the chop is going well I suggest we all join in with them and have a real good laugh. Watch the west stand wake up!!

 
usa warrior
Re: Something will have to give...
usa warrior (IP Logged)
12 April, 2012 09:36
Spine tingling if everyone is doing it. Why not!!

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
drifter (IP Logged)
12 April, 2012 09:48
could we pull it off though??

 
usa warrior
Re: Something will have to give...
usa warrior (IP Logged)
12 April, 2012 09:53
Doubtful. Mind you I think most of the Ex supporters are in my block so who'd notice if I did?? Up for it Neil??

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
knightstemplar (IP Logged)
12 April, 2012 10:04
We long term could do with a similar suitable 'warrior' trademark. Makes come on you warriors somewhat tame....

Seriously impressed with the chop proper war cry.........!

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
MagicJ_ (IP Logged)
12 April, 2012 14:58
Could be 'How the west was won' (Sm100)

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
Veston Pants (IP Logged)
12 April, 2012 15:56
Wig Wam Bam.

Anybody remember the dance?

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
Veston Pants (IP Logged)
12 April, 2012 15:58
Squaw. Huh! What is it good for? Absolutely nothing!

Edwyn Star(?)

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
Shoutin' Bloke (IP Logged)
12 April, 2012 18:11
Theme music to 'How' from the TV in late 70's with Fred Dinneige (probable spelling error) after every Warrior score on Saturday.

All the faithful need to learn is the word "How" and when to say it at the end of every line. What could possibly go wrong(Sm105)

That said, it my come across as a bit sarcastic to the Warrior players if we chant "How" when we score, given scoring difficulties this season(Sm100)

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
drifter (IP Logged)
12 April, 2012 19:37
how did the name warriors get attached to wuss in the first place?

worcester chiefs sound better anyway. or worcester braves.
or worcester ???????

or we need a new gimic to go with warriors.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
Drutz (IP Logged)
12 April, 2012 19:54
Quote:
drifter
or we need a new gimic to go with warriors.

How about Birmingham?

(Sm159)



Pulling the boots on for one more year

 
gold blue army
Re: Something will have to give...
gold blue army (IP Logged)
12 April, 2012 21:46
How about replacing the ohhhh ohh ohhhhh bit with warrrr-eee--orrrssss warrrrr-eeeee-oooorrss... It fits and it would sound better which would also p!ss the chiefs off- double win!

I'm not sure us singing the original would help at all- the Chiefs players may just think that there support are making a hell of a noise so we need to tweek it so our players know its for them.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
Moorsman (IP Logged)
12 April, 2012 22:15
Quote:
gold blue army
How about replacing the ohhhh ohh ohhhhh bit with warrrr-eee--orrrssss warrrrr-eeeee-oooorrss... It fits and it would sound better which would also p!ss the chiefs off- double win!
I'm not sure us singing the original would help at all- the Chiefs players may just think that there support are making a hell of a noise so we need to tweek it so our players know its for them.

Quins and the Shed have already done that this season and the extra volume was much appreciated by The Tribe (Sm100) Looking forward to Saturday (Sm134)

 
welsh
Re: Something will have to give...
welsh (IP Logged)
12 April, 2012 22:18
.. or "Come on you Warriors, Warriors come on!"

 
WorcesterSauce
Re: Something will have to give...
WorcesterSauce (IP Logged)
12 April, 2012 22:36
Sing along with Chiefs songs..... what? Am i missing something here or have we all suddenly got season tickets at Sandy Park?

The 'Tribe' may travel well in numbers at the moment, but believe me it will only be temporary. Remember how many we used to take when we were in our first couple of seasons in the top flight? Regularly 1000+ and sometimes even more and we were extremely vocal- much more so than now.

For a club who is 5th in the League Exeters home attendances are absolutely woeful- (8000). We have averaged way more (10,200) and we are 10th. If we were in Exeters position I would imagine we would be able to get 15,000.

As soon as Exeter fall down the table- which will happen at some point, their support will also fall and they'd probably get 4-5,000 like they did against Newcastle this season. I remember going to Exeter in the Old Division 1 and outnumbering the home fans, so can we please stop this love in.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/04/2012 22:37 by WorcesterSauce.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
Abberley (IP Logged)
12 April, 2012 23:06
Quote:
WorcesterSauce

For a club who is 5th in the League Exeters home attendances are absolutely woeful- (8000).


Conversely, for a Club who's home attendance is 8,000, 5th in the League is impressive (Sm16)

I've no idea what the demographics are, but I would hazard a guess that there is a significantly greater potential population within an hours drive of Sixways (not already attached to Glaws, Saints or Tiggers) than there is around Exeter (not already attached to Bath or Bristol)?




www.worcesterrugbyclub.co.uk --m(^0^)m-- www.philcot.co.uk

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
Shoutin' Bloke (IP Logged)
13 April, 2012 05:23
I think we might struggle to get 15k given that capacity is only just over 12k(Sm105)unless we start playing our 'home' fixtures at Wembley, then obviously we would get 50k no problem(Sm103)?

Now is not the time to change our unimaginative chants when we need to prove we are the best and loudest supporters. Keep to what we know, and belt it out. Could really do with belting it out, no matter how things might be going on the pitch as well, not just when it seems appropriate to do so. We really do need to be the '16th' tomorrow if we are going to get anything from the game IMO.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
drifter (IP Logged)
13 April, 2012 07:31
Of course it would now be impossible to change names or chants. but I would still want to know why Warriors.

I actually cannot see the worcester fans in indian head dresses as we, although are loud at times, but we do not seem to have that excentric streak. apart from a few.

But am equally glad that exeter and irish do bring some visual enjoyment to the game.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
clalan (IP Logged)
13 April, 2012 07:40
Its all a bit of fun the headress bit, we supporters don't take ourselves to seriously, our Team as with yours is a different matter. We will shout till we're horse if we think it will help get those boys over the line, again the same as you.
So let battle (vocal) commence, and let the winner be rugby itself a sport you and I love.
As for attendance at the moment SP holds 10,400 but IMHO not comfortably, we will grow at our own pace, deep strong support does not come overnight and stay, its a bit derogatory to say that we would stop supporting our team because the team lose a few matches.

All the best (apart from tomorrow) (Sm151)

 
Silverton Jack
Re: Something will have to give...
Silverton Jack (IP Logged)
13 April, 2012 07:56
Quote:
Worcester Sauce
As soon as Exeter fall down the table- which will happen at some point, their support will also fall and they'd probably get 4-5,000 like they did against Newcastle this season. I remember going to Exeter in the Old Division 1 and outnumbering the home fans, so can we please stop this love in.

That's right, we need to save our love for the Pirates. But that has gone all quiet now they are not doing so well.



Jacko

 
Exeforever
Re: Something will have to give...
Exeforever (IP Logged)
13 April, 2012 11:27
Quote:
WorcesterSauce
Sing along with Chiefs songs..... what? Am i missing something here or have we all suddenly got season tickets at Sandy Park?
The 'Tribe' may travel well in numbers at the moment, but believe me it will only be temporary. Remember how many we used to take when we were in our first couple of seasons in the top flight? Regularly 1000+ and sometimes even more and we were extremely vocal- much more so than now.

For a club who is 5th in the League Exeters home attendances are absolutely woeful- (8000). We have averaged way more (10,200) and we are 10th. If we were in Exeters position I would imagine we would be able to get 15,000.

As soon as Exeter fall down the table- which will happen at some point, their support will also fall and they'd probably get 4-5,000 like they did against Newcastle this season. I remember going to Exeter in the Old Division 1 and outnumbering the home fans, so can we please stop this love in.

The away support is growing steadily. Yes the results are helping but the camaraderie among supporters and the fact that we tend to stand together plus the away supporters coaches are also building a solid away support base - 10 years ago there were about 8 of us!! This season's home attendance has been disappointing but the SW has been hit very hard by the recession and the public sector job losses have been particularly heavy. At the County Ground we might get 1,000 if we were lucky even when we were regualrly in the top 3 of the old Division 1 and at Sndy Park we averaged about 3 to 4k in the last championship season so to develop that to 8k in 2 years is pretty good going.

There is also the travel distance for away supporters: Bath, Glaws, yourselves and Irish are the only away trips less than 200 miles Each Way. That lack of away supporters has been very obvious this year.

Of course, like you, the income generating stadium helps to take away the dependency on gates and once we aquire the P shares and so long as we can stay up for the next 3 or 4 years we will finally get to a financial level playing field with the rest of the Prem.

It will be interesting to see how well we can do when we aren't playing with one hand tied behind our backs financially.......(Sm14)

 
vigorniensis
Re: Something will have to give...
Keast Was Great (IP Logged)
13 April, 2012 11:33
Quote:
and once we aquire the P shares

Sounds like a very good idea. Can't see Cecil letting that happen with Worcester Trading, though.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
Shoutin' Bloke (IP Logged)
13 April, 2012 11:34
Second in their Play Off group isn't exactly bad news for the Pirates SJ, and could be top if the beat Bedford this weekend.

Vent your spleen at Sixways against Chiefs and enjoy the ridicule in the car on the way home, after they have beaten us.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 14/04/2012 11:22 by Shoutin' Bloke.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
Moorsman (IP Logged)
13 April, 2012 12:03
should be an interesting game and as you say something has to give. Still can't believe were where we are, you guys have consolidated well and will be looking to push on to finish as high as you can, much as we did last season. looks like Hilly is recruiting well and next season is going to be tough for whoever gets promoted from the championship.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
Abberley (IP Logged)
13 April, 2012 12:05
Quote:
Exeforever
...and once we aquire the P shares

A very interesting snippet that led me to unearth a couple more facts I hadn't appreciated about Exeter:

Quote:
Exeter AGM

...provided that the proposals are such that members maintain a controlling interest in the club...

...after expenditure, this has resulted in a net profit of 630,399...

...acquisition of the [P] shares which will mean that extra funding will be available from Premiership Rugby in the future.


Seems that Exeter are getting it right on and off the field?




www.worcesterrugbyclub.co.uk --m(^0^)m-- www.philcot.co.uk

 
Exeforever
Re: Something will have to give...
Exeforever (IP Logged)
13 April, 2012 13:48
Quote:
Abberley
Quote:
Exeforever
...and once we aquire the P shares

A very interesting snippet that led me to unearth a couple more facts I hadn't appreciated about Exeter:

Quote:
Exeter AGM

...provided that the proposals are such that members maintain a controlling interest in the club...

...after expenditure, this has resulted in a net profit of 630,399...

...acquisition of the [P] shares which will mean that extra funding will be available from Premiership Rugby in the future.


Seems that Exeter are getting it right on and off the field?

very briefly. We are looking to raise funds by floating a minority of the club via a share issue which will pay a "commercial rate". As the amount we are looking for is around 10million and we have capped the membership at 750 to prevent predators seizing the club we obviously need some external investment but not at the cost of selling the club.

Yes we made a profit last year on a turnover of about 8.5 million.

Bristol's p shares can only be sold to us as we went up and stayed up whereas Bris went down and stayed down. The amount payable is subject to arbitration but expected to be around 4.3 million. The return is about 650,000 next year and expected to rise as interest in the TV rights increases towards RWC 2015.

For thsi and last season we have not received that income and the Bris supporters insist that they didn't get it either, I've no idea where it went.

 
Brummagem Bertie
Re: Something will have to give...
Brummagem Bertie (IP Logged)
13 April, 2012 13:50
Quote:
Finance director Alan Quantick
We always knew being promoted into the Aviva Premiership would make a difference and so it proved as we raised our annual income from 4.62m in 2010 when we were in the Championship to a figure of 8.26m for 2011 in the Premiership.

Perhaps not surprising, given the hike in ticket prices. 41 for their Grandstand, as against 38 for Gold in the East, but no advance discount, whereas you can get Gold for 33 in advance at Sixways. Their equivalent of the Mad Stand 32, as against 28 (or 23 in advance). 26 for standing, albeit covered, against 21 (16 in advance).

Perhaps if we increased our prices, including season tickets, to Chiefs levels, and did away with advance discounts, we would break even too? I'm sure no-one would mind.



Whatever you do, do it safely!

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
Abberley (IP Logged)
13 April, 2012 15:11
Quote:
Brummagem Bertie
Perhaps if we increased our prices, including season tickets, to Chiefs levels, and did away with advance discounts, we would break even too?

In very round numbers, an extra 5 per head x 10k = 50k more revenue per game. Don't think that would go very far in solving our deficit that seems to run consistently around 4m per year?




www.worcesterrugbyclub.co.uk --m(^0^)m-- www.philcot.co.uk

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
Always A Warrior (IP Logged)
13 April, 2012 15:24
Quote:
Abberley
Quote:
Brummagem Bertie
Perhaps if we increased our prices, including season tickets, to Chiefs levels, and did away with advance discounts, we would break even too?

In very round numbers, an extra 5 per head x 10k = 50k more revenue per game. Don't think that would go very far in solving our deficit that seems to run consistently around 4m per year?

That's also assuming inelastic demand which I very much doubt it is!

 
Brummagem Bertie
Re: Something will have to give...
Brummagem Bertie (IP Logged)
13 April, 2012 15:42
An extra 5 per head assumes that most tickets are bought on the day, whereas most are bought in advance. So in very round numbers, an extra 100k per game, or 1.1m over a Premiership season. In reality, could be a lot more than that, given the 4k season ticket holders who had their prices held this season, as reward for sticking with the club in the Championship.

Sandy Park already has a David Lloyd - I suspect Trading's balance sheet will look a lot healthier next season, even more so if the wished for hotel development gets off the ground as well.



Whatever you do, do it safely!

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
Drutz (IP Logged)
14 April, 2012 07:38
Quote:
BB
Sandy Park already has a David Lloyd - I suspect Trading's balance sheet will look a lot healthier next season, even more so if the wished for hotel development gets off the ground as well.

Not sure why the hotel development will help the Warriors balance sheet. The land was sold to David Lloyd so no future income as far as I can see will be coming to Tradings coffers.



Pulling the boots on for one more year

 
usa warrior
Re: Something will have to give...
usa warrior (IP Logged)
14 April, 2012 07:56
Should benefit indirectly through conferences and non-rugby means though.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
Shoutin' Bloke (IP Logged)
14 April, 2012 08:37
I thought our loss was only circa 1m in more recent times?

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
Powick Eastander (IP Logged)
14 April, 2012 08:41
The losses are certainly is getting less and less of late.



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MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
Shoutin' Bloke (IP Logged)
14 April, 2012 08:52
Just working on Abberley quote of 4m deficit.

I cannot believe that our costs are 4m in excess of a potential income of circa 10m-12m max.

If it is, I can see why the Directors are trying to make the club more self sufficient, as few businesses can carry on for a prolonged in that manner.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
Drutz (IP Logged)
14 April, 2012 08:54
Quote:
usa warrior
Should benefit indirectly through conferences and non-rugby means though.

I agree but don't think it will make that many more conference users than they get now, though I would be happy to be proven wrong.

Also I thought I saw somewhere, not sure where so will have to have a look, that we are averaging over 2 million a year losses but as PE said might now be less we are in the premiership but losses are losses.



Pulling the boots on for one more year

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
Drutz (IP Logged)
14 April, 2012 08:56
SB bear in mind the Slick Stand is still being paid off so depends how much they are paying off a year on that to how high the losses are you might be making 10 million but then you have running the stadium, staff players, overdraft, stand repayments etc. I would be surprised as you say if it is 4 million but could easily be the 2 million I saw somewhere.



Pulling the boots on for one more year

 
Brummagem Bertie
Re: Something will have to give...
Brummagem Bertie (IP Logged)
14 April, 2012 09:51
Drutz, my recollection of the press reports is that the club still has the land that has been allocated as a possible site for the hotel, that it wasn't included in the package for the David Lloyd club.

I understand that the club feel that a hotel could make a significant difference to conference income, as it would allow the club to pitch for 2-3 day events. Currently, they cannot, because the nearest hotel accommodation is a Premier Inn, not exactly attractive to high end conference attendees on an expense account!

Any decent accommodation is at least a 15 minute taxi ride away - again, not a great selling point. One of the Hilton group hotels on site would be a real marketing asset, however.



Whatever you do, do it safely!

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
Shoutin' Bloke (IP Logged)
14 April, 2012 10:22
Under that scenario Drutz, unlikely to see a new North Stand within the next 4-5 years and will have to hope the 'team' punches above its weight to get higher up the league and into better income HC streams instead of Amlin, or acknowledge that we will not progress too much during high debt repayment times.

If deficit is ee cash flows, with the stand I could see the larger figure. With pure profit and loss activity, cannot see the 4 mill figure personally. Anyway, starting to turn this into a bus and holiday post for me. I don't know enough about the various club financials.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
Abberley (IP Logged)
14 April, 2012 11:24
Quote:
Shoutin' Bloke
Just working on Abberley quote of 4m deficit.

Apologies. A ball-park figure I've had at the back of my mind over the years and I seem to recall it tying in at some stage with Cecil's comments about how much he had contributed. (Tho Drutz's 2m also rings a bell now he's mentioned it).

If there are any bean counters out there with access to Companies House filings, it would be interesting to see what the official state is.

And as SB implies, there may be confusion between 'Cash Flow' & 'P & L' etc., but that is usually where I fall asleep...




www.worcesterrugbyclub.co.uk --m(^0^)m-- www.philcot.co.uk

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
TeflonTed (IP Logged)
14 April, 2012 11:31
Know what you mean SB, I went off this thread when someone mentioned elasticity of demand.

Don't think Warriors quite yet qualify for the Veblen Effect!

Although with the predictable rise in attendance which follows league success, and the inevitable rise in price which follows this, the "jumping on the bandwagon" scenario suggests that people prefer to be associated with success, and are prepared to pay extra for it.

Chiefs pricing policy would seem to suggest this, and our hold on prices for the first year back confirms the underlying theory.

Anyway, I still reckon we'll be lucky to squeeze a LPB out of today.

Pie and pint on the way now, and 2 games going into the Skybox for later.

Happy days.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Something will have to give...
Abberley (IP Logged)
14 April, 2012 12:48
From [levelbusiness.com]


2009: -2,830,286

2008: -2,465,394

2007: -2,479,139

It looks as tho full accounts can be downloaded (if anyone can interpret them).




www.worcesterrugbyclub.co.uk --m(^0^)m-- www.philcot.co.uk

 
just got into rugby
Re: Something will have to give...
Big Bird Warrior (IP Logged)
14 April, 2012 17:44
For 2 you can download accounts for WRFC Trading Ltd and WRFC Players Ltd for the year ended 30.6.11 direct from Companies House. Did it a few years ago and makes interesting reading. . . (Sm101)


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