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MESSAGES->author
The Future
08 October, 2017 12:44
Dear Mr Bolsover

As an active Warriors supporter for over 10 years and a season ticket holder for 7 years (2 seats), I write in serious sadness.

If the board continue down the current path, there will be little left to support. I write in response to today's article in the Rugby Paper where JJvV longs for the support for Edward Griffith return in the interests of the players. We all can see the track record he has and have read his views in a recent thread on this forum.

Therefore, by combining a multitude of recent conversations (some possible speculation, but many probably true true) and not in the order below, but taking it as a whole:

1.If EG wants to get a property developer to build a hotel behind the East Stand on club owned land to strengthen the finances of the club - good.

2 If EG wants to get a property developer to build a shopping centre on club owned land between the canal and Hidlip Hall to strengthen the finances of the club - good.

3. If the income stream from 1 & 2 creates sufficient cash to retain, attract and fund top class players and develop the academy - great.

4. If the package includes a top class DoR that buys into the concept - even better.

5. If the above means that we are temporarily relegated to the Championship - then OK, so we can build with less pressure.

If not, I have no idea where the board is taking us - apart from definite implosion and with little end to that pain in sight. The current situation is more than depressing - the club seems to want to rule by mismanagement.

As far as I am concerned. if we have the same as now post Christmas I will not be renewing my 2 season tickets, I have had enough and will spend my hard earned money and misplaced rugby emotion elsewhere. I have also currently cancelled 3 proposed away trips to support the club.

yours sincerely

A previously loyal, but now totally disillusioned supporter

 
Patgadd
Re: The Future
Patgadd (IP Logged)
08 October, 2017 12:45
Have you actually sent that?

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
08 October, 2017 12:49
No. I am guessing someone will pass it on to him. Others I know have written to Mr Mackey and have received no reply.

Why do you ask? Is it treason?

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
Faithful_City (IP Logged)
08 October, 2017 13:12
McKay who??

What did I suggest would happen with him and his success?

He has sod all customer focus or care.

JP

 
FlipFlop
Re: The Future
FlipFlop (IP Logged)
08 October, 2017 14:04
Guessing someone will pass it on?

Maybe, but personally having gone to the trouble of collating your views, don’t you want to make sure yourself that it gets to Mr Bolsover and make its intended point?

Treason? Nothing wrong with your points and that wasn’t what Patgadd was getting at imo.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
Fiver (IP Logged)
08 October, 2017 16:09
I'm starting to think that the rugby side of the business is nothing more than an inconvenience to the owners. The investment in the team isn't anywhere close to what's required, as such I'm not sure what the business model is anymore.

Is the investment they're after anything to do with a rugby club? Is it simply something like a hotel in a good location?

Or is it the case of anything, just anything to reduce their lost investment.

 
The Pen is Mightier than the Sword
Re: The Future
08 October, 2017 17:37
I know Dave Allen has links with Worcestershire and cared about Worcester Warriors. Does he still have an influence on the Board or is everything in the hands of his son? If EG is unacceptable, what did he offer and what is wanted that is different?

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
TeflonTed (IP Logged)
08 October, 2017 17:58
Quote:
The Pen is Mightier than the Sword
If EG is unacceptable, what did he offer and what is wanted that is different?

In my opinion the answers to your 2 questions are:-

1) Not enough money

2) More money

 
Patgadd
Re: The Future
Patgadd (IP Logged)
08 October, 2017 17:59
I think I can answer the first part; Greg stood up before a meeting and said that his father had passed everything on to him. (Incidentally, I also remember the Allens saying they did not want to be on the board; they just wanted to support the club with money. It was CD who insisted that, since they had put in more money than him, they should be on the board.)

As to the second part, who knows?

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
Faithful_City (IP Logged)
08 October, 2017 18:28
For me the club just do not think big enough, it is all rural and halfhearted.

We need to think and act bigger much bigger. Forget we are a small west midlands city. The club has to believe this is a great city where 1,000’s of people come from all over the world to visit, because this IS Worcester.

For heavens sake all you PR folks get off your ass, get out there, come up with the ideas that you’re supposed to be good at and SELL THIS CLUB to the WHOLE West Midlands.

Think BIG, act BIG and be have another level of ambition.

Who built the East Stand with the pathetic and totally inadequate bars below. Wasted real estate that cannot be used for anything else.

Who put together the pathetic meet and greet area, it should have been the whole area behind the North Stand fully paved with proper food halls and bars, get some buskers or music laid on. Make it fun to be there and meet friends, be extravagant, show off.

Use the land we have to our benefit(financial. Why do we want a training pitch opposite David Lloyd’s when we have spent mega bucks on a nylon pitch. Make some income from it. Knock down the West Stand and build a much needed high quality hotel with a new West Stand Raddisson/Hilton can pay for it.

We need to step in 3very way possible, we are too nervous to think and act big enough.

Above all else make RUGBY the most important part of the plan and priorities the recruitment and quality of the team, it will pay dividends and will create USP’s for all the other departments.

JP

 
WorcesterSauce
Re: The Future
WorcesterSauce (IP Logged)
08 October, 2017 18:47
Unfortunately I think the club got stuck in between wanting to be the team of the west midlands and the team of worcester. They didn't really do either and now pay the price. Now Wasps are in town they should just focus on giving local people a team that they can be proud of and relate to.

I agree, the ground has been dreadfully planned. The west was outgrown almost immediately, the south stand was built with an emphasis on hospitality and the same could be argued for the east. The roof is far too high and any atmosphere that is created is lost. The north is temporary, although it's been in its current form for over 10 years. We are one of only 2 rugby grounds (the other being the stoop) in the English league system that does not have a terrace (I can't bring myself to call the bar area an adequate terrace).

The ground just feels so plastic and poorly designed. If the north is built well then that will help but to be honest, I don't have a lot of faith in the design to be any good. Hopefully I'm proved wrong.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
TeflonTed (IP Logged)
08 October, 2017 18:52
Quote:
Faithful_City
Who built the East Stand with the pathetic and totally inadequate bars below.
JP

The same incompetent idiot who thought that rugby stadium gents' toilets could function properly with a single domestic sized door instead of the in/out system used in (probably) all other stadia in the U.K.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
Fiver (IP Logged)
08 October, 2017 19:25
I find myself agreeing with both JP and Saucie. Maybe selling the shares to Richard Branson would be a smart idea, or someone with his outlook.

The problem with a hotel at the ground would be the car parking and traffic on a match day. I wouldn't book into a hotel if I knew the traffic would be a nightmare, only to find nowhere to park within a half mile radius. Is there an option of additional land available for purchase next to the stadium, or do we need to pave over some of the pitches on the other side of the canal?

Whoever buys in, I just hope it's someone who does it wholeheartedly. The last couple of years have truly been neither one thing nor the other.

 
FlipFlop
Re: The Future
FlipFlop (IP Logged)
08 October, 2017 20:05
“ Think big, extravagant stadia” what then complain the owners have sunk too much money into bricks and mortar and not enough in the playing side? Let’s not pretend that has never been said on here.

Of course make the club for locals.....loosely translated as get The Pears back and “bring it home” to the City Centre floodplain. No further mention of playing staff spend sacrifice to finance it.

Let’s gloss over the dismay at getting a 4G pitch which has gone from potential moneyspinner to playing staff injury causation.

We know a winning team gets a full house irrespective of the above perceived “failings” as we’ve seen in in patches where folk buy and queue for the “overpriced” food and drink, overlook First bus failings and the clubs “bonkers” ticket prices policy( others words, not mine)

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
Faithful_City (IP Logged)
08 October, 2017 20:45
FF it is a symbiotic relationship, facilities and playing.

You have to be ambitious with both and that is going to take a lot of money. To get that sort of investment there has to be a return or potential return on their investment.

Sugar Daddies are not the future!

We have the land, we have the location, we could provide much needed leisure and pleasure facilities Worcester.

Fiver all the land between the club and the roundabout is up for grabs.

Don’t be frightened by the scope of what we could achieve and should be aiming for.

Don’t go half hearted at this.

Thinking big and building big will not be too big. Just remember the official growth plan for Worcester 25k homes 75k more people just 1% capture rate and that is another 7,500 customer/Supporters. The City will need hotels, bars, restaurants and lots of other leisure facilities. The new business parks are going to need hotels and confrencing facilities. If we don’t provide it someone else will.

JP



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/10/2017 20:52 by Faithful_City.

 
A38
Re: The Future
A38 (IP Logged)
08 October, 2017 20:50
Before we look at the future, we should acknowledge the present.

Premiership clubs are expensive animals. Whatever may be said about the salary cap, player salaries are on an upward spiral. Even more £ms will need to be found in the future by all clubs if they wish to retain Premiership status.

The current owners of Warriors have decided that they no longer wish to sink their £ms into the club each and every year especially as they see the gap between income and expenditure growing significantly. The £ms they have sunk into the club have not brought success on the pitch.

They are therefore looking either for a partner who would generate income from the site as well as help subsidise the playing staff OR to sell outright.

At the same time a new DoR has to be found at a time when the team is winless.

The club is therefore very much at a fork in the road. Either we see a new monied ownership come in simultaneously with a new DoR and significant recruits or everybody accepts that Premiership rugby at Worcester is in doubt.

It frankly doesn't matter what has happened in the past. To use the cliché, we are where we are.

Will there be anyone out there who sees the sort of potential which JP speaks about and who can tap into it? Maybe I don't know.

Meanwhile, beancounter that I am, I fear that Premiership rugby in Worcester is unaffordable and that we should resign ourselves to that reality.

 
Patgadd
Re: The Future
Patgadd (IP Logged)
08 October, 2017 21:13
Quote:
Faithful_City
Sugar Daddies are not the future!
JP

JP, I accept everything that you say except for the above. Sugar daddies are, were and always will be the future just as long as the sugar keeps flowing (or whatever sugar does).

 
OverTheBoarder
Re: The Future
OverTheBorder (IP Logged)
08 October, 2017 21:35
First time poster, long time reader (ST holder for 2 years).

Here goes....

My first trip to Bath left me in complete awe of the spectacular setting of the Rec. However in terms of facilities (by which I think we all mean toilets and bars), probably the worst experience of all my away trips to date. In fact myself and fellow travellers received a number of compliments from surrounding Bath supporters on Sixways and its offerings and it lead me to appreciate what we have. Certainly the service can be a bit hit and miss from time to time, however I’ve never had to miss large chunks of the game to spend a penny. Parking facilities around the ground are dare I say, excellent.

Of course I’d like to see a purpose built North Stand, however I don’t know why if truth be told as we can’t fill the seats in it’s current format. I understand the argument around “thinking big” and I agree that the PR in terms of attracting wider support in surrounding areas has failed. However I really disbelieve in the notion of “build it and they will come”. Is there a viability arguement or demand for another hotel on the outskirts of the city? Will a new West and North Stand attract greater numbers? None of the Wasp defectors I know have gone for the shortened queues - it’s for the quality and success of the team.

Whilst romantic as the notion sounds, I firmly believe that any potential investor should do so in the knowledge that investment should be in the team or rugby piece first and only then with its success will generate demand for ground improvements and further development.
Chicken and egg situation, however investment must be a long term project.

As for “The Future”, I’m not giving up on the present.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
TeflonTed (IP Logged)
08 October, 2017 21:49
OTB, good post.

I'm not giving up either!

 
FlipFlop
Re: The Future
FlipFlop (IP Logged)
08 October, 2017 22:11
But JP, we don’t get 1% of Worcester’s current population at games

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
Faithful_City (IP Logged)
08 October, 2017 22:25
Just because we don’t does not mean we can’t.

JP

 
Latecomer
Re: The Future
Latecomer (IP Logged)
08 October, 2017 22:46
Quote:
TeflonTed
OTB, good post.
I'm not giving up either!

I'm with TT on this !!

 
Big T 15
Re: The Future
Big T 15 (IP Logged)
08 October, 2017 23:30
If no one can afford it at the mo', surely the salary cap should go down?

Or is that too logical.

 
w4rriorz1980
Re: The Future
w4rriorz1980 (IP Logged)
08 October, 2017 23:48
Quote:
OverTheBoarder
First time poster, long time reader (ST holder for 2 years).
Here goes....

My first trip to Bath left me in complete awe of the spectacular setting of the Rec. However in terms of facilities (by which I think we all mean toilets and bars), probably the worst experience of all my away trips to date. In fact myself and fellow travellers received a number of compliments from surrounding Bath supporters on Sixways and its offerings and it lead me to appreciate what we have. Certainly the service can be a bit hit and miss from time to time, however I’ve never had to miss large chunks of the game to spend a penny. Parking facilities around the ground are dare I say, excellent.

Of course I’d like to see a purpose built North Stand, however I don’t know why if truth be told as we can’t fill the seats in it’s current format. I understand the argument around “thinking big” and I agree that the PR in terms of attracting wider support in surrounding areas has failed. However I really disbelieve in the notion of “build it and they will come”. Is there a viability arguement or demand for another hotel on the outskirts of the city? Will a new West and North Stand attract greater numbers? None of the Wasp defectors I know have gone for the shortened queues - it’s for the quality and success of the team.

Whilst romantic as the notion sounds, I firmly believe that any potential investor should do so in the knowledge that investment should be in the team or rugby piece first and only then with its success will generate demand for ground improvements and further development.
Chicken and egg situation, however investment must be a long term project.

As for “The Future”, I’m not giving up on the present.
Wasps' defectors? From Warriors? How many?
Couldn't do that myself personally.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
knightstemplar (IP Logged)
09 October, 2017 07:31
The future will be affected by the present! We need to win some rugby games to give a prospective DOR and buyer some confidence in the potential of what the future could return!

We need key signings ASAP

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
Fiver (IP Logged)
09 October, 2017 07:32
There was a time when the city really got behind the club, around the time of promotion in 2004 and a couple of years beyond. You couldn't move down the high street for people wearing Worcester shirts. Mind you, that was when there was an optimism for the club. 13 years later and in the eyes of most residents, we're rubbish. Chicken and egg in regards to investment in players or facilities? I'd say the team's success brings in the fans, Bath is the case in study for that answer.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
knightstemplar (IP Logged)
09 October, 2017 07:44
Quote:
Fiver
There was a time when the city really got behind the club, around the time of promotion in 2004 and a couple of years beyond. You couldn't move down the high street for people wearing Worcester shirts. Mind you, that was when there was an optimism for the club. 13 years later and in the eyes of most residents, we're rubbish. Chicken and egg in regards to investment in players or facilities? I'd say the team's success brings in the fans, Bath is the case in study for that answer.

I agree IF we were winning most home games, playing in the HC and a top 4 playing play offs and finals you wouldn't be able to move a Sixways (or whatever its going to be called) on a matchday.

Local supporters just see another failure season and expect game losses



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/10/2017 12:35 by knightstemplar.

 
FlipFlop
Re: The Future
FlipFlop (IP Logged)
09 October, 2017 11:42
JP,

Clearly sell outs suggest of course we can fill the ground, but we don't. That isn't because the ground is less than a mini Millenium or Twickenham in appearance or stature, it's because the players on the pitch are not mustard.

Most visitors like our ground when they come to watch their teams. Not necessarily down to the surroundings, but possibly due to the 'gifting' of 4 or 5 points, more than any loyal Warrior support wants to see.

If locals were asked

"Would you prefer to watch winning rugby in poor facilities or would you prefer top facilities but poor rugby" they'd plump for the obvious winning rugby in poor facilities.


The club has tried via CD to go with the 'Field of Dreams' approach and it hasn't worked IMO.

While i don't advocate tearing down Sixways or moving 6k folk to all standing on Weston's, the playing element is the only thing to help attract and retain local interest in Prem rugby, not a new logo, or a shiny stadium in a city centre location.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
Faithful_City (IP Logged)
09 October, 2017 12:37
FF I feel you are missing a massively important point.

To recruit and pay for a side that wins 60%+ of its games and possible 90% of its home games costs a great deal of money.

Where is that coming from?

A Sugar Daddy with deep pockets is only going to do that for a very limited time or when his bank balance is under threat.

It is absolutely imperative to have income streams which can provide the funds necessary to fund such a world class side.

You may say other clubs are funding teams without such lines of income, but we have heard that already there are 4/5 clubs in financial difficulties, as salaries rise(to secure the best players) it is only going to get more difficult.

We have at our disposal a huge amount of "owned" land which we are not maximising its earning potential.

We are in a fantastic location near to a motorway which makes getting there very easy for visitors and our wider catchment area. It also makes it a great location for big national competitions if we had the facilities to look after them, hotel, bars, restaurants. Improve the links into town and then establishments in the City will benefit(sell that to the council and business community)

We need mega investment from investors who will want to see some sort of return. It has to go into real estate as well as the playing side.

If you have only got so much then yes the majority has to go into the playing side for it to be successful and become a USP for the bigger business links.

Priority has to be given to the Rugby side of the business but you cannot sustain and grow the business/club without some very good income streams.

Why not a buy a pub in town and turn it into "The Warrior", install a manager organise events through the week, have players, coaches, senior staff give talks down there, show old game, latest games and profits to the club.

Profits may not be huge but the exposure would be massive.

There are many ways but we have to think a lot bigger than we presently are.

JP



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/10/2017 12:45 by Faithful_City.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
Abberley (IP Logged)
09 October, 2017 13:10
Quote:
Fiver
There was a time when the city really got behind the club, around the time of promotion in 2004 and a couple of years beyond. You couldn't move down the high street for people wearing Worcester shirts.

Would that have been when the Worcester shirts had the Three Pears Club badge?

(Sm159)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/10/2017 13:10 by Abberley.

 
WorcesterSauce
Re: The Future
WorcesterSauce (IP Logged)
09 October, 2017 13:15
Quote:
Faithful_City

Why not a buy a pub in town and turn it into "The Warrior", install a manager organise events through the week, have players, coaches, senior staff give talks down there, show old game, latest games and profits to the club.

JP

Essentially this is almost what the crown in st johns already is and i believe they do ok. A pub in town owned by the club could be a really good idea but feel a warrior theme may just be too niche when it isnt a match day.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
Fiver (IP Logged)
09 October, 2017 13:17
I'm wondering if JP is suggesting going down the route most football teams have which is a training ground away from the stadium. If we used the prime location at Sixways for hotels etc.... and bought some cheap farmland somewhere and turned that into the training ground/junior pitches then would this make commercial sense? I have no idea, but I'd be interested to know.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
Fiver (IP Logged)
09 October, 2017 13:21
If a pub in town was called the Warrior, served good beer, played matches on the telly and had people who enjoy conversation about rugby, then I'm sure a few of us might be interested. Especially if there were meet the players/coaches evenings etc... held there. Those events at Sixways require most of us to drive, and as such prevents sinking several pints.

Make sure it's along the bus route and I think it's a winner.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
Faithful_City (IP Logged)
09 October, 2017 14:22
Not at all Fiver, we have huge training facilities the other side of the canal and one pitch is a synthetic all weather one. It is actually unusable at present but I am sure the contractor will get it sorted.

A short walk from the club won’t hurt anyone.

Which leaves a massive space opposite David Lloyd’s.

JP

 
chastt
Re: The Future
chastt (IP Logged)
09 October, 2017 14:31
It seems to be accepted that Warriors cannot create a competitive team within the current available budget, and so either the supporters have to accept performances on the pitch (as we have done for over a decade) or the owners have to find (quite a lot) more money.
As a supporter I'd like the owners to find more money as I'm fed up of supporting a team that looses more often than it wins.
That extra money HAS to come from a Sugar Daddy type investment, be it a straightforward cash investment giving them (part) ownership of the team or a more conventional capital investment in additional facilities which brings in new regular income which the Sugar Daddy the chooses to put back into the playing squad instead of his own bank account.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
Faithful_City (IP Logged)
09 October, 2017 14:35
As part of the West Stand there could be a pretty fantastic hotel built

Hotel Specifications

Traffic would not be an issue, we have 15 Home games and would take an hour to clear out of 365 days.

JP

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
Abberley (IP Logged)
09 October, 2017 14:46
Quote:
Fiver
Those events at Sixways require most of us to drive, and as such prevents sinking several pints.
Make sure it's along the bus route and I think it's a winner.

Bearing in mind the perceived need to draw on a much wider public than just Worcester, I'd be interested to know what percentage of current supporters could actually make use of public transport for an evening event in town?

I've been the proud owner of a Bus Pass for over 10 years but, apart from the novelty of the odd day's random sightseeing around Cornwall, have never been able to make use of it for a specific task. (Though it has been handy as 'proof of age' for OAP rates at the barber etc.) Just checked the Yarrabang schedule and, on a weekday I could get to Worcester for 6pm - but the next bus back would be 8am the following day sad smiley

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
West Brom Warrior (IP Logged)
09 October, 2017 15:11
Any potential owner is going to look at how to maximise revenue from the site, personally I would build a hotel rather quickly on the site. As JP says traffic is not an issue except 15 days a year, the hotel location is perfect for business travellers on long journeys and if enough care is taken to partner with the right company then it could become a destination for food in its own right. I went to London Irish years ago and before the game ate at the hotel on the site and it was fantastic food. I also hope that any potential redevelopment includes a better clubhouse style bar area for all supporters with a few more seats.

On the future in general I understand from a very well-placed source that there are a number of interested parties in Warriors but they have no idea on seriousness of the interest.

 
FlipFlop
Re: The Future
FlipFlop (IP Logged)
09 October, 2017 15:43
Of course, the perceived 'marooned' status of Sixways as a site from anything worth visiting, may play against plans for a hotel on site. Business people are rarely going to be on the outskirts of a city for their convention of overnight stay. Yeah they can bump up the company expenses and get a taxi into town and back, but would you really want to be doing that if you're staying at a what is suggested above, should be a high end hotel? Not sure the Premier Inn is regularly rammed with guests despite having the proximity to the M5 factor in its favours.

WBW, i am pleased you mention Madjeski as it belongs to the football club i have the current misfortune to follow. My sporting teams are dire so far this year(Sm40).

Yeap, it has a hotel and restaurant facilities which are pleasant enough, yet pretty much across the board, rugby followers hate the place as a place to view rugby as it is another "souless football ground" for the rugby devotee. Personally think it facilities for drinks and 'waterworks' are okay. Whether it will be the same in a few years time when most of the on site parking is swallowed up by a massive multi million pound high end property development around the the 3 sides of the ground without a retail park in front of it, is another question, following recent approval.

There is only one chance to sell such ventures, as the site cannot offer already occupied land. David Lloyd might not be chuffed if Radisson or similar appear nearby with their own in house facilities, as i am sure with the Pear Tree at Smite. How the traditionalists have never persuaded the club to link up with The Pear Tree is beyond me, given the on going furore regarding the holy fruit.

It is clear though that you believe that the Sixways site should be a commercial venture primarily, with rugby in the vacinity, as opposed to how it has come about to this point.

I guess we'll see if the current or future owners have a similar view.

 
Old Col
Re: The Future
Old Col (IP Logged)
09 October, 2017 16:21
So--build something attractive ,develop sometnings people want to come to for a day out etc

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
West Brom Warrior (IP Logged)
09 October, 2017 16:22
Quote:
FlipFlop

It is clear though that you believe that the Sixways site should be a commercial venture primarily, with rugby in the vacinity, as opposed to how it has come about to this point.



Not at all FlipFlop the Sixways site should be the home of Worcester Warriors rugby team first and foremost however a business that is losing £3 million a year plus needs to look at how to improve its commercial arm otherwise it will simply go out of business.

A hotel located at Sixways would be next to the M5 motorway so perfect for those who do long journeys with work for an overnight stay and also its located next to a business park so there would be an amount business generated from that side I accept there are a few better located hotels for those working in the centre of town. Sixways would also open as a more viable wedding venue, conference facility and also be able to generate more income from other events it hosts through the year.

The argument of developing the site like the Madjeski will always be unpopular with ‘traditionalists’ if you like who believe we should only ever be a rugby club and while I agree rugby should always be our main focus no sports club can survive while sustaining such financial loss year after year. The only hope sports clubs have in avoiding running other commercial ventures is a TV deal so huge that money is no longer an issue, I don’t see that happening with rugby anytime soon so I am afraid I will always support the club maximising the potential of the Sixways site in order to sustain a future at the top for Worcester Warriors.

 
BrumBrum
Re: The Future
BrumBrum (IP Logged)
09 October, 2017 16:34
I am baffled why no one has built a hotel at Sixways or near Sixways.
To me it would be a gold mine.

Forget the club/supporters, look at the businesses around it.
These tend to be international business, with domestic/global customers and global/national colleagues coming and going all the time. They tended need overnight rooms.
In addition companies need meeting rooms throughout the day. Sixways already have that but having used them in the past, they are currently not as slick or professionally as a hotel, as they just don't have the staff or lunch facilities.

Believe such a hotel would generate additional income from new sources, but it would also generate more income from those already using sixways and open up new sponsorship, supporters and season ticket opportunities.

Currently as far as I aware there is no real business hotel around Sixways. Sorry having used the Pear Tree it's more Faulty Towers than Hilton.
Believe Bosch current use the cricket hotel that's 1/2 hr away which is not ideal for meeting rooms or bedrooms.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
Fiver (IP Logged)
09 October, 2017 16:48
Mmm, I'm not so sure some of the posters on here understand the modern needs of the business traveller. I've stayed at something like 200 different PermierInns, to the point where I used to wake up staring at the same picture and wonder where the hell I was. City centre location, no thanks, the traffic is a nightmare. Just by the motorway with a decent restaurant and bar is what I wanted. Given that almost every Premierinn is full on a weekday, I'm not the only one.

BTW, the modern business traveller wearing a suit is in the minority. I used to share the restaurant/bar with loads of sparkies, shop fitters, builders etc... There were more totecters than broges on display.

I would guess that the PremierInn and Pear Tree Beefeater do quite well, so a HolidayInn Express or Travel Lodge would fit in niceley. The Holiday Inn Express next to junction 5 even featured on their advert, and that location is about as dreadful as most could imagine.

 
FlipFlop
Re: The Future
FlipFlop (IP Logged)
09 October, 2017 16:50
You only get the one chanced to sell the land and reap the funds from that unless the suggestion is that Sixways builds its own Hotel and seeks to run it. I do not see how otherwise Sixways Rugby benefits with additional income streams that will belong to an independent hotel.

If it is only a one time sale of land to a lucrative option, as has been mentioned, the funds will quickly be swallowed by an expensive sport, with maybe no more land to sell off.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
knightstemplar (IP Logged)
09 October, 2017 17:07
Quote:
FlipFlop
You only get the one chanced to sell the land and reap the funds from that unless the suggestion is that Sixways builds its own Hotel and seeks to run it. I do not see how otherwise Sixways Rugby benefits with additional income streams that will belong to an independent hotel.
If it is only a one time sale of land to a lucrative option, as has been mentioned, the funds will quickly be swallowed by an expensive sport, with maybe no more land to sell off.

Agreed. If its losing £3 million plus a year how long will the sale of just a bit of land fund that? It's not a long term cash cow.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
Faithful_City (IP Logged)
09 October, 2017 17:09
We don’t need to keep throwing negatives of why this won’t work, and stop thinking of reasons not to do it.

Turn it round and say we will fin a way that will work.

Be ambitious, be positive and low and behold we will find a way.

There are many excuses not to, but isn’t time we did.

JP

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
Faithful_City (IP Logged)
09 October, 2017 17:25
Why sell? Lease it.

If it was a sale the part of the deal would be construction of an all singing, dancing West Stand with 8,000 seats, conferencing facilities, weddings, entertainment, training facilities. Could be a saving of £millions

Then increase sale of seats, increase use of a bigger capacity stadium. Increase revenue streams of a possible 7,000 seats(if we get the rugby right that is why it is a symbiotic relationship)could(repeat could) generate another £350k a game or £5millionpa

Much of it will depend on the success of the team, that is why money has to be invested in both at the same time to give us that step change.

Of course all the nay sayers will come up with why we can’t but let’s be positive, be ambition put the thinking caps and find how we CAN do it..

JP

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
West Brom Warrior (IP Logged)
09 October, 2017 17:31
Quote:
FlipFlop
You only get the one chanced to sell the land and reap the funds from that unless the suggestion is that Sixways builds its own Hotel and seeks to run it. I do not see how otherwise Sixways Rugby benefits with additional income streams that will belong to an independent hotel.
If it is only a one time sale of land to a lucrative option, as has been mentioned, the funds will quickly be swallowed by an expensive sport, with maybe no more land to sell off.


You wouldn’t sell the land outright you sell them the opportunity to develop the land and make a business out of it. You grant them a long leasehold (999 years sort of thing) for the use of that land for its sole purpose and in return they pay a small but not insignificant ground rent. In addition, with Sixways events already having a solid base business they would be able to expand their offering to potential customers and in return the hotel will offer reduced rates to Sixways Events Ltd and therefore we increase our sales of events etc. to our customers meaning that side of the business becomes more profitable. Therefore while we will get the main chunk of money when it is originally sold any developments that take place on the Sixways site should also have future income generation for the club.

 
Abmatt
Re: The Future
Abmatt (IP Logged)
09 October, 2017 18:46
I really like the idea of a hotel, it could be one of the long term solutions to financing the club.

In the short term we need a large cash injection.

What I wouldn’t relish though is the disruption it would cause around the ground during the building. But with an upturn in on pitch performance coupled with increased revenue we could turn the corner.

I just wish we could see some movement on all the current issues as the uncertainty is becoming toxic and if we don’t see something soon I think it will be too late.

 
BrumBrum
Re: The Future
BrumBrum (IP Logged)
09 October, 2017 19:26
The hotel works very with our already good facilities.
That's why I like it, it generates new money from a new venture and makes our current facilities work harder generating more money. Thus it makes sense.
It also increases the footprint of Warriors. There is a whole world of rugby supporters outside the 5 mile limit of Worcester. Some as far away as Birmingham...imagine that.

The idea of a car show room below a stand also makes sense. Although I did think it very strange when I first heard it. It's allabout making our facilities work hard for the club.

I just hope the new investors arrive ASAP because it's the fear of the unknown that will kill this season. I always loved that phrases, "there is nothing to fear but fear itself" from one of the smarter Americans.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
Faithful_City (IP Logged)
09 October, 2017 19:40
Good to see the ambition can it spread?

If we as bunch of amateur entrepreneurs can start to come up with ideas, what could a professional team come up with. Doesn’t matter if they are none starters it at least eliminates them.

Get all the ideas up on the table. But, remember the supporters.

JP

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
10 October, 2017 10:44
In answer to your question, Patgadd, I was away and not able to send my letter to Mr Bolsover till today.

It has now been posted to him with a couple of amendments. He also now has my real name.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
15 October, 2017 08:08
If Fissler in the Rugby Paper today as got it right (not necessarily a given) the Scottish Rugby Union are in talks to invest alongside the Allens; the Freehold not being up for sale. Apparently the thought being to use Worcester as a feeder club for Scottish Players in the Premiership.

If true, that is really the end of a local club to breed pride in the locality. Pearists will have no chance with their ideas. In addition, I have no interest at all to follow a Scottish franchise in an English county. Again, if true, The thought process of the board gets weirder by the day.

My interest in supporting the club is waning very fast indeed.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
West Brom Warrior (IP Logged)
15 October, 2017 08:26
There is no way Premiership rugby will allow the Scottish Rugby Union to invest in a premiership club and use it as a feeder club as it would devalue the league.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
Faithful_City (IP Logged)
15 October, 2017 08:33
The Premiership does not have a say.

However I would be mighty pi55ed off we are used to make Scotland a better team to beat England, mighty pi55ed off.

JP

 
Whispering_Death
Re: The Future
Whispering_Death (IP Logged)
15 October, 2017 08:37
Apparently the Allens just want what's best for the club and city and will give it away for free to the right person. So this can't be true....

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
Faithful_City (IP Logged)
15 October, 2017 08:44
Right...(Sm49)

 
Poolbrook
Re: The Future
Poolbrook (IP Logged)
15 October, 2017 08:45
Anyone for the 3 thistles as a club badge?

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
West Brom Warrior (IP Logged)
15 October, 2017 09:44
Quote:
Faithful_City
The Premiership does not have a say.
However I would be mighty pi55ed off we are used to make Scotland a better team to beat England, mighty pi55ed off.

JP


[www.bbc.co.uk]

ACtually they do

 
centrethere
Re: The Future
centrethere (IP Logged)
15 October, 2017 10:34
Agree the training pitch on the main site could be used for a hotel, but suggest it would be needed for more parking - most of the hotel daily clientele would be lorry and van drivers and they need to park their vans and lorries. So probably need to push the D. Lloyd parking to the back behind their inflatable and build a restaurant there. Leaving where for a hotel - the car park next to the training pitch.

 
vigorniensis
Re: The Future
vigorniensis (IP Logged)
15 October, 2017 11:02
I am slightly confused, so nothing unusual there. But I always thought the ground and land actually belongs to Worcester Rugby Club and that Worcester Warriors simply lease a part of that ground but own none of that land. Therefore it seems that surely Worcester Rugby Club would have a major say, and interest, in any of these hotel plans. Or am I mistaken?

 
WorcesterSauce
Re: The Future
WorcesterSauce (IP Logged)
15 October, 2017 11:06
Believe the club bought it off them last year and then built them a club house on the new land too. Not a bad deal for them all things considered.

As a side note if we become a Scotland feeder side i'll stop supporting, but cant see it. Didnt the scottish rfu already try something similar with London Scottish?

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
TeflonTed (IP Logged)
15 October, 2017 11:15
Saucie, yes, good point. Although LS would seem a bit better fit than the strugglers from the midlands.

I’m getting a sense of increasing chaos around affairs.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
knightstemplar (IP Logged)
15 October, 2017 11:35
Solomons was at Edinburgh for three years last so would be known to the SRU.

 
BrumBrum
Re: The Future
BrumBrum (IP Logged)
15 October, 2017 13:30
As I said in another thread, don't quite get the SRU and Warriors.
SRU are setting up a semi-Pro league which I believe starts next year.
Prior to that there was a need for additional top clubs to give players just outside either Glasgow or Edinburgh experience.
Currently if not in Edinburgh/Glasgow pool, these players go back to their club that plays at low level. The semi-pro league should stop that.

Currently SRU have arrrangements with SA, NZ & Oz Clubs where they encourage players with a Scottish link to play/develop.
Don't think there is a need for that in England.

Thus don't think it will happen...thus fully expect it to be announced next week.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
Faithful_City (IP Logged)
15 October, 2017 14:06
A point to remember is that Hogg and Cross are both Scottish!

Worcester is known as the Faithful City because of its support for the Crown!

However the Battle of Worcester was between the English Parliamentary Army and The Royalists the vast majority of whom were Scottish Regiments/Mercenaries.

So I suppose we do have a very close and Historical link with Scotland.

JP



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 15/10/2017 14:15 by Faithful_City.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
Faithful_City (IP Logged)
15 October, 2017 14:10
Full Details Battle of Worcester

Remember our A team are called The Cavaliers!

JP

 
Brummagem Bertie
Re: The Future
Brummagem Bertie (IP Logged)
15 October, 2017 15:05
Re all the talk of a hotel.

This was part of the Charlie Little plans to expand the ground, with the new North and East Stands, and David Lloyd. There was even talk with a group of businessmen, who were looking to build a Hilton. In the end, it came to naught, I think because of the strangling of investment cash following the crash.

I believe that the land behind the East Stand, between David Lloyd and the Worcestershire CC Highways Depot is earmarked for a hotel still.

The idea was that the hotel wouldn't need leisure or conference facilities, because the former would be provided by David Lloyd, the latter by the club. As such, it wouldn't need too big a footprint and parking would also be provided by the club.

The hotel would support the club's efforts to expand it's conferencing and hospitality business, by providing accommodation for multi-day conferences and corporate events, e.g. team building events, and weddings/parties.

Perhaps this is a key part of EG's plan to significantly reduce losses: rental income from a hotel plus a big expansion of commercial income.



Whatever you do, do it safely!

 
OverTheBoarder
Re: The Future
OverTheBorder (IP Logged)
15 October, 2017 16:52
Fully acceptant of and welcome players of all nationalities into the team (I’m sure FC must have a stat on the percentage of foreign players in the squads over the years). Gladly receive foreign investment as long as it’s channelled into the team. However investment made with the primary purpose of feeding another nation’s team doesn’t sit well when spending my children’s inheritance. If this is the case then in the words of a well known Scottish entrepreneur....I’m oot!

Hopefully this is one rumour that can get filed with the signing of Hartley, Halfpenny etc.

 
FlipFlop
Re: The Future
FlipFlop (IP Logged)
15 October, 2017 19:09
Oh how I wish for our own Scottish independence if this has any truth near it.

 
Brummagem Bertie
Re: The Future
Brummagem Bertie (IP Logged)
15 October, 2017 19:18
Quote:
West Brom Warrior
Quote:
Faithful_City
The Premiership does not have a say.
However I would be mighty pi55ed off we are used to make Scotland a better team to beat England, mighty pi55ed off.

JP


[www.bbc.co.uk]

ACtually they do

Well, if potential conflicts were the reason Altrad got turned down, I can't see PRL agreeing to the SRU taking a significant stake in Warriors. They appear to have been prepared to agree to a 20% stake but that wouldn't seem to be enough to satisfy the Allens, from what we've been told so far.



Whatever you do, do it safely!

 
usa warrior
Re: The Future
usa warrior (IP Logged)
15 October, 2017 19:52
Do the SRU own the Scottish clubs though? If not then is that issue relevant? However would the RFU like their sporting rival using their tournament/soil to better themselves? Could be stopping EQP players from coming through in favour of SQP for example.

On the other hand send Hogg, Russell, and Gray and I'll overlook the above points...

 
w4rriorz1980
Re: The Future
w4rriorz1980 (IP Logged)
16 October, 2017 23:52
Corby is more Scottish than Worcester!

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
TeflonTed (IP Logged)
17 October, 2017 09:35
Quote:
w4rriorz1980
Corby is more Scottish than Worcester!

Very true....but relevance?

 
A38
Re: The Future
A38 (IP Logged)
17 October, 2017 14:04
WN been at the cuttings?

[www.worcesternews.co.uk]

Nothing new here?

 
WarriorsBB
Re: The Future
WarriorsBB (IP Logged)
17 October, 2017 14:40
"Livingstone, an international mid-market mergers and acquisitions firm, have been appointed by Worcester’s owners to find a buyer."

'Livingstone' comes with its own Scottish connotations. Coincidence or hint? (Sm156)

 
Brummagem Bertie
Re: The Future
Brummagem Bertie (IP Logged)
17 October, 2017 14:54
Livingstone Partners. No Scottish office. (Sm14)



Whatever you do, do it safely!

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
TeflonTed (IP Logged)
17 October, 2017 15:02
And they claim no particular expertise in professional sports ...,

“We focus on five core industries, with dedicated teams across our offices serving the Business Services, Consumer, Healthcare, Industrial and Media & Technology sectors,”

Or perhaps we’re so sick we come under healthcare.

 
Brummagem Bertie
Re: The Future
Brummagem Bertie (IP Logged)
17 October, 2017 15:30
Perhaps they wear the right ties?



Whatever you do, do it safely!

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: The Future
TeflonTed (IP Logged)
17 October, 2017 15:51
Quote:
Brummagem Bertie
Perhaps they wear the right ties?

Most likely explanation.


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