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Southstand(again)
BBC commentary
Southstand(again) (IP Logged)
19 November, 2017 10:17
I know, I know, It's not politically correct, but I've just watched the beeb's highlights programme and couldn't help but find Sara Orchard's commentary, once again, comparable to nails scraping down a blackboard.

She's an intelligent, attractive woman with a good knowledge of the game but she's simply guilty of trying too hard in what is obviously a male-dominated role.

for heaven's sake stop telling us what is blatantly obvious and please, please stop shrieking .

Sorry



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 19/11/2017 10:24 by Southstand(again).

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: BBC commentary
Fiver (IP Logged)
19 November, 2017 10:24
I wonder how experienced Sara is in that case. The men commentating on test matches have normally been schooled for some time before getting the top job. I just hope Sara hasn't been fast tracked by the beeb in a desperate attempt of equality. I personally couldn't care less if the commentator is male or female, as long as they're good enough.

I wonder, what with modern technology, if you could have a red button choice of commentator. Every game could then have the choice of male or female.

 
Southstand(again)
Re: BBC commentary
Southstand(again) (IP Logged)
19 November, 2017 10:52
Very experienced with BBC London
She is the beeb's first female rugby commentator.
I don't have a problem with the fact she is a woman, or her knowledge, which is good, I just find her style of commentary tends to "dumb down" the match for me as a viewer.
The shrieking is another matter though (Sm159)

 
Humps for 1 Mile
Re: BBC commentary
Humps for 1 Mile (IP Logged)
19 November, 2017 12:11
Can we not have a button which allows us to watch the game without ANY commentary.

Please????

 
Southstand(again)
Re: BBC commentary
Southstand(again) (IP Logged)
19 November, 2017 12:18
I did turn the volume button down in the end Humpsy (Sm14)

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: BBC commentary
TeflonTed (IP Logged)
19 November, 2017 12:37
Quote:
Humps for 1 Mile
Can we not have a button which allows us to watch the game without ANY commentary.
Please????

It’s on your TV, used to be called “volume”, now usually marked by things like these, ^

 
B-road
Re: BBC commentary
19 November, 2017 13:03
Quote:
Southstand(again)
She's an intelligent, attractive woman

Out of interest why is "attractive" relevant ?

Would you say "intelligent, attractive man" ?

If you don't like her as a commentator, then just say you don't like her as a commentator.

Why bring gender into it ?

 
hairyicecream
Re: BBC commentary
wusstawizard (IP Logged)
19 November, 2017 14:43
Quote:
KenDoddsDadsDogsDead
Quote:
Southstand(again)
She's an intelligent, attractive woman

Out of interest why is "attractive" relevant ?

Would you say "intelligent, attractive man" ?

If you don't like her as a commentator, then just say you don't like her as a commentator.

Why bring gender into it ?

#Triggered #Snowflake

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: BBC commentary
Abberley (IP Logged)
19 November, 2017 15:53
Quote:
KenDoddsDadsDogsDead

Why bring gender into it ?

Because of the suspicion:
Quote:
ibid: Fiver
I just hope Sara hasn't been fast tracked by the beeb in a desperate attempt of equality.

 
ROLLO on tour
Re: BBC commentary
ROLLO (IP Logged)
19 November, 2017 16:33
Sara is not good and does not compliment Brian Moore especially well. It would be better just to have him commenting. However as friend of mine who works for the BBC told me last night , the last thing you need to be in the BeeB at present is a white male who attended a comprehensive. We have to prepare ourselves for more of this intended bias in many strands of life.

 
Southstand(again)
Re: BBC commentary
Southstand(again) (IP Logged)
19 November, 2017 18:23
Quote:
KenDoddsDadsDogsDead
Quote:
Southstand(again)
She's an intelligent, attractive woman

Out of interest why is "attractive" relevant ?

Would you say "intelligent, attractive man" ?

If you don't like her as a commentator, then just say you don't like her as a commentator.

Why bring gender into it ?

Because, I was making a personal observation, about a female, who I have seen presenting on television on numerous occasions who I considered intelligent enough to hold my attention and, at the same time, quite pleasant to look at.

I can honestly say that I have never found another male attractive so I would be unlikely to ever make that observation. that said, I don't consider myself homophobic and accept the concept.

As for "Bringing Gender"into the topic, She is the first female Rugby commentator to be employed by the BBC, which I felt was relevant and worthy of mention. As such my impression was that she might be trying a little too hard.

My problem with "Political correctness" is that the self-appointed few who feel a need to embrace it seem to be on some Holy crusade to go out of their ways to find offence solely for the sake of it.

If you are offended by any of my post KDDDD, I really don't care. Life's too short.

 
B-road
Re: BBC commentary
19 November, 2017 18:43
Quote:
Southstand(again)
Quote:
KenDoddsDadsDogsDead
Quote:
Southstand(again)
She's an intelligent, attractive woman

Out of interest why is "attractive" relevant ?

Would you say "intelligent, attractive man" ?

If you don't like her as a commentator, then just say you don't like her as a commentator.

Why bring gender into it ?

Because, I was making a personal observation, about a female, who I have seen presenting on television on numerous occasions who I considered intelligent enough to hold my attention and, at the same time, quite pleasant to look at.

I can honestly say that I have never found another male attractive so I would be unlikely to ever make that observation. that said, I don't consider myself homophobic and accept the concept.

As for "Bringing Gender"into the topic, She is the first female Rugby commentator to be employed by the BBC, which I felt was relevant and worthy of mention. As such my impression was that she might be trying a little too hard.

My problem with "Political correctness" is that the self-appointed few who feel a need to embrace it seem to be on some Holy crusade to go out of their ways to find offence solely for the sake of it.

If you are offended by any of my post KDDDD, I really don't care. Life's too short.

 
Brummagem Bertie
Re: BBC commentary
Brummagem Bertie (IP Logged)
19 November, 2017 19:01
Quote:
Southstand(again)
Life's too short.

Yet such a long post on something so unimportant. (Sm16)



Whatever you do, do it safely!

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: BBC commentary
TeflonTed (IP Logged)
19 November, 2017 19:41
Anything, or anyone, who reduces Brian Moore’s airtime can only be a good thing.

 
centrethere
Re: BBC commentary
centrethere (IP Logged)
19 November, 2017 19:49
What did she commentate on? Watched / listened to the England game, but can't say I noticed her. Mind you wasn't really bothered after the Warriors win and didn't notice her commentating on our game either. By the time I'd watched the Scotland game, I'd had enough rugby.

Did notice DoC seemed to have a constant one way commentary with the ref and the opposition until he was taken off. No all refs / oppositions (next Tigers away and then Sharks at home) will take this - Saints were a bit muted yesterday for some reason, but don't expect the next two weeks to go our away so easily, even if Dimes has a stadium ban.

 
Southstand(again)
Re: BBC commentary
Southstand(again) (IP Logged)
19 November, 2017 20:27
Quote:
Brummagem Bertie
Quote:
Southstand(again)
Life's too short.

Yet such a long post on something so unimportant. (Sm16)

I answered four questions with four, two-line paragraphs Bertie and your point with one.

 
Sutton Warrior
Re: BBC commentary
Sutton Warrior (IP Logged)
20 November, 2017 13:44
Southstand,

The two line answers were suitably pithy and concise whilst illuminating very clearly the point KDDDID's. Even a pithy answer can deepen the hole one is in.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: BBC commentary
TeflonTed (IP Logged)
20 November, 2017 13:49
Well bug ger political correctness.

She’s nowhere near as good as Sara Elgan , and nowhere near as attractive either.

And her accent’s wrong.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: BBC commentary
Fiver (IP Logged)
20 November, 2017 14:10
Well, there we are.

 
Southstand(again)
Re: BBC commentary
Southstand(again) (IP Logged)
20 November, 2017 14:10
Quote:
Sutton Warrior
Southstand,
The two line answers were suitably pithy and concise whilst illuminating very clearly the point KDDDID's. Even a pithy answer can deepen the hole one is in.

Not quite sure what your definition of "Pithy" is ? if you mean terse , concise, honest I agree with your usage.
As for talk of "being in deep holes" I wasn't aware I was in one.

I remember when this used to be a Rugby site eye rolling smiley

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: BBC commentary
Teme Dream (IP Logged)
20 November, 2017 14:22
Quote:
Humps
Can we not have a button which allows us to watch the game without ANY commentary.
Please????

An excellent request Humps - I'm with you on this one. Volume button is not what is required. It would be great to have mikes rigged up around the stadium to get a sample of proper crowd noise (not just the obligatory SLSC.) as well as reflink. Possibly not an option for the easily offended! It would also allow me to use the "Stadium Sound" option on my sound bar.

 
TVM Rides Again....Again
Re: BBC commentary
TVM Rides Again (IP Logged)
20 November, 2017 15:09
I thought she was ok - nerves on her first big game I think. It happens.

There was one thirty second period when she seemed to lose her way and venture into the murky world of predictions all of which were proved wrong instantly. But she was ok on the whole.

I don't think it was shrieking - i think it's just a female voice jarred against what people are used to, but that won't be an issue once she has done a few and people are over the novelty. The only alternative is to get someone like Joanna Lumley.

It's better than a dry monotone packed with technical facts and figures - that said in Motorsport some people seem to LOVE that. I think they are mad personally

Brian Moore would be awful on his own. He's a good technical anchor, but he'd suffer as a summariser. I remember when Andrew cotter had to absent himself to throw up and left jiffy to man the Mike for 20 minutes. He was lost at sea.

As for the stating the obvious - speaking as someone with some experience at sports commentary it's something that everyone thinks they can do and then dry up in moments. A big job will give you nerves but then you'll settle in - aside from a very poor 30 second period I thought she was ok.

No better or worse than any other green commentator.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 20/11/2017 15:13 by TVM Rides Again.

 
B-road
Re: BBC commentary
20 November, 2017 15:41
Quote:
Southstand(again)
If you are offended by any of my post KDDDD, I really don't care. Life's too short.

Bemused, not offended.

 
Ake1985
Re: BBC commentary
Ake1985 (IP Logged)
20 November, 2017 15:48
After reading this thread I was expecting the commentary to be awful! I didn't mind it at all, much preferred her to Eddie Butler or Miles Harrison.

Also agree that her attractiveness had nothing to do with her ability as a sports commentator and is irrelevant and unnecessary. I don't think I'm being politically correct or a snowflake by thinking that

 
Patgadd
Re: BBC commentary
Patgadd (IP Logged)
20 November, 2017 15:57
Quote:
Ake1985
After reading this thread I was expecting the commentary to be awful! I didn't mind it at all, much preferred her to Eddie Butler or Miles Harrison.

Haven't heard it yet, but I'd prefer Joe Pasquale, or better still Sooty, to Eddie Butler

 
FlipFlop
Re: BBC commentary
FlipFlop (IP Logged)
20 November, 2017 16:09
Claire Balding has always been pretty good as a commentator on sporting events, so no problem with a female commentator personally.

Many male commentators have irksome ways- Jonathan Davies, Jeremy Guscott, Brian Moore, Eddie Butler have all bought their own flaws to the commentary sphere in the past.

If Ms Orchard were to deliver her commentary in a monotone manner, she'd most likely be called into question for lacking excitement, being enthused and should never be allowed to commentate again.

Female commentators are different. However, due to decades of Male commentators dominating, and not always improving the viewers enjoyment. There is not a requirement to quota female commentators, to redress an imbalance and accusations of male bias. Indeed, if the Beeb had they thinking caps on, given this years announcements about the highest paid personnel in their ranks, they could probably get about 3 Sara Orchards for the price of most male counterparts.

If we're talking screechy.....never listened to an excitable Murray Walker then Southstand, and he's regarded as one of our commentary greats.

 
Patgadd
Re: BBC commentary
Patgadd (IP Logged)
20 November, 2017 16:32
I do agree that Murray Walker's commentary grates.

 
Southstand(again)
Re: BBC commentary
Southstand(again) (IP Logged)
20 November, 2017 17:18
Quote:
KenDoddsDadsDogsDead
Quote:
Southstand(again)
If you are offended by any of my post KDDDD, I really don't care. Life's too short.

Bemused, not offended.

Life's still too short

 
TVM Rides Again....Again
Re: BBC commentary
TVM Rides Again (IP Logged)
20 November, 2017 17:59
Quote:
Patgadd
I do agree that Murray Walker's commentary grates.

Wash your mouth out, Patgadd, sir!

The man is an icon!

 
Underdog
Re: BBC commentary
Underdog (IP Logged)
20 November, 2017 18:36
The only commentators I really have no time for are Barnes and Harrison. Despite having worked on pretty much every big game for years and years, their knowledge and tactical references seem well out of date. I'm glad that Sky seems to be losing all of their rugby coverage. Long may it continue.

Lots of people I know find the banter on BT sport grating but I don't mind it as their analysis is so much better. When it comes to bias, Dallaglio is much worse to listen to than Monye IMO.

 
Patgadd
Re: BBC commentary
Patgadd (IP Logged)
20 November, 2017 20:39
For me (and I know he's a summariser, not a commentator) Ben Kay tops the list, although Brian Moore is good. I'd like to see them in tandem.

 
just got into rugby
Re: BBC commentary
Big Bird Warrior (IP Logged)
01 December, 2017 00:07
Quote:
SS
She's an intelligent, attractive woman with a good knowledge of the game but she's simply guilty of trying too hard in what is obviously a male-dominated role


She is a qualified Referee so think she covers the "good knowledge" part of that statement!

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: BBC commentary
TeflonTed (IP Logged)
01 December, 2017 09:21
Quote:
Big Bird Warrior
Quote:
SS
She's an intelligent, attractive woman with a good knowledge of the game but she's simply guilty of trying too hard in what is obviously a male-dominated role


She is a qualified Referee so think she covers the "good knowledge" part of that statement!

Not only a ref. (Is she called Sir or M’am?) but also a level 2 coach. [media.info]
How many of the male refs hold that dual qualification.

She’s still nowhere near as good as Sarra Elgan.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: BBC commentary
West Brom Warrior (IP Logged)
01 December, 2017 09:26
Quote:
Patgadd
For me (and I know he's a summariser, not a commentator) Ben Kay tops the list, although Brian Moore is good. I'd like to see them in tandem.

Brian Moore? Cannot stand him or to be fair any of the BBC commentators who I all think would make wonderful propaganda ministers for their respective countries. But much like rugby the commentary is a game of opinions

 
woodywuss
Re: BBC commentary
woodywuss (IP Logged)
01 December, 2017 09:53
Was Nicola Goodwin the first female rugby commentator to be employed by the BBC ?

 
TVM Rides Again....Again
Re: BBC commentary
TVM Rides Again (IP Logged)
01 December, 2017 09:57
I genuinely think Andrew Cotter is a decent commentator - always seems as fair and balanced as it is possible to be. Knows how to meter his voice to the situation, not usually short of something coherent to say, few mistakes.

One of the few really good sportscasters out there in my opinion.

Martin Brundle is another - not that many others I can think of.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: BBC commentary
Abberley (IP Logged)
01 December, 2017 10:29
My personal preference would be for something like Whispering Ted Lowe in the early days of Pot Black.
Just background stadium noise and informed comments only during breaks in play.
(The addition of RefLink might be a concession to progress).




 
TVM Rides Again....Again
Re: BBC commentary
TVM Rides Again (IP Logged)
01 December, 2017 10:54
I think there are sports where that works better - cricket, tennis and snooker being the obvious candidates.

It suits the 'feel' - though it wouldn't be my preference for rugby (for example).

They key to good commentary is balancing 'say what you see' and developing that into a bit of context, things people can't see and 'general experience'.

Rule of thumb I use is - yes they can see he has turned left into Bottom Ess, but was it any good.....

 
Southstand(again)
Re: BBC commentary
Southstand(again) (IP Logged)
01 December, 2017 12:17
As a spectator, I don't always need to be told what I am viewing and feel such commentary almost as annoying as that guy you've inadvertently sat next to and who you "Just know" isn't going to shut up for the entire eighty minutes.

I think Sara Orchard's efforts are probably better suited to radio commentary where the listener requires far more information in order to visualise what's happening.

I wonder if anyone on this forum is old enough to remember the numbered squares the BBC employed in the "Good old days" of the Radio times ?

 
Patgadd
Re: BBC commentary
Patgadd (IP Logged)
01 December, 2017 12:37
Quote:
Southstand(again)

I wonder if anyone on this forum is old enough to remember the numbered squares the BBC employed in the "Good old days" of the Radio times ?

A few of us can even bore everyone else by informing them that this practice is the origin of the phrase "back to square one".

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: BBC commentary
Abberley (IP Logged)
01 December, 2017 13:15
Quote:
Patgadd
A few of us can even bore everyone else by informing them that this practice is the origin of the phrase "back to square one".

...or possibly not?

Quote:
www.phrases.org.uk

Recordings of early commentaries also exist, including the very first broadcast sports commentary of any kind - a rugby match, as it happens. That commentary, and many others that followed, referred listeners to the printed maps and a second commentator called out the numbers as the ball moved from square to square. However, at no point in any existing commentary do they use the phrase 'back to square one'.

 
Patgadd
Re: BBC commentary
Patgadd (IP Logged)
01 December, 2017 14:44

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: BBC commentary
TeflonTed (IP Logged)
01 December, 2017 15:49
Play nicely boys.

Phrases.org.uk “However, at no point in any existing commentary do they use the phrase 'back to square one'.

Grammar Monster “When there was a goal kick by the home team, play could be described as being back at square one.

You could both be right!

T’internet is just like statistics, can be used to prove pretty much anything.

 
Xdream
Re: BBC commentary
Xdream (IP Logged)
01 December, 2017 16:34
yes indeed!

 
Southstand(again)
Re: BBC commentary
Southstand(again) (IP Logged)
01 December, 2017 16:37

 
gmem
Re: BBC commentary
Garym (IP Logged)
01 December, 2017 16:40
Quote:
Southstand(again)
Last time Everton won ?

Totally uncalled for, should be banned from this site and the internet in general for such comments. The answer by the way was Wednesday when they trounced the mighty (!) west ham

 
TVM Rides Again....Again
Re: BBC commentary
TVM Rides Again (IP Logged)
01 December, 2017 17:18
Is that the same West Ham that reluctantly unveiled David Miyse as manager whilst apologising?

 
Southstand(again)
Re: BBC commentary
Southstand(again) (IP Logged)
01 December, 2017 17:18
"Nuno says he doesn't want to come Mister Kenwright"

"Well just get someone who comes from Wolverhampton if you have to"

"Oh, OK then"

(Sm25)


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