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dkexile
Mike brown on the wing again
dkexile (IP Logged)
14 June, 2018 20:55
Why....?

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Mike brown on the wing again
TeflonTed (IP Logged)
15 June, 2018 07:05
Because Eddie is one very stubborn bloke.

 
jgmorgan100
Re: Mike brown on the wing again
The Mailman (IP Logged)
15 June, 2018 08:19
As an out and out winger, Brown would probably be 4th choice (or similar) for Worcester. Think Bryce Heem, Josh Adams, and possibly Perry (and Dean too?) are better pure wingers than Brown. Eddie Jones is making some really weird calls.

 
usa warrior
Re: Mike brown on the wing again
usa warrior (IP Logged)
15 June, 2018 08:39
I'd add Tom Howe to that list...

 
Malvern Man
Re: Mike brown on the wing again
Malvern Man (IP Logged)
15 June, 2018 10:53
Ah, but our wingers aren't as grumpy.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Mike brown on the wing again
Fiver (IP Logged)
15 June, 2018 11:18
I don't understand how you can play someone out of position at test level. The only way I'd accept it is if you had two absolutely amazing players who both play the same position. However, on this occasion it isn't the case.

 
MSR-Worcester
Re: Mike brown on the wing again
MSR-Worcester (IP Logged)
15 June, 2018 14:09
Interesting Robshaw and Isiekwe are dropped completely too. Good to see Launchbury back.

I don't see why Brown and Daly don't just swap. Both got found out defensively last week and should be reinstated in their preferred positions.

 
Offa
Re: Mike brown on the wing again
Offa (IP Logged)
15 June, 2018 14:44
Reminds me of Andy Robinson picking cory at 6, moody at 7 and Sanderson at 8.Barking!

 
Underdog
Re: Mike brown on the wing again
Underdog (IP Logged)
15 June, 2018 15:25
Not saying I agree with it, but I think the logic is that Daly needs game time at 15 to see if he can have more impact on games than at 11.

Eddie likes a fast winger and a work rate one, someone who can take a pop pass off a ruck or track a break. I think this is Nowell at the moment, but he's injured.

Playing Brown means someone is there to help Daly or even slot in if need be, and he's also a tough one to being down. Also, the other wingers in the squad are novices, so it saves chucking one of them in at altitude against the Boks.

Now, EJ has referred to Nowell as an inside back before, and despite his experience, Brown is finding it tough defensively so it's not necessarily ironclad, but I think that's the logic.

 
Underdog
Re: Mike brown on the wing again
Underdog (IP Logged)
15 June, 2018 15:31
I forgot to add: more baffling to me is that there is no full time second row cover again. This went badly wrong last week - lineout ability and ballast in the scrum was lost.

Hughes and Vunipola aren't match fit and Shields and Wilson never play there for their clubs. Jonny Hill is a novice, but he's in one of the most physical packs in the country, and Isiekwe would surely be fired up to come on after last week.

 
epsom
Re: Mike brown on the wing again
epsom (IP Logged)
15 June, 2018 15:38
IMHO Robshaw should have been left out some time ago. Not being disrespectful to the man, but he wasn`t on song when Worcester beat Quins at home, and his form has dipped since then. Surprised he was selected for the SA tour.

 
dkexile
Re: Mike brown on the wing again
dkexile (IP Logged)
15 June, 2018 16:37
I agree with pretty much everything said in this thread and think TT has summed up the problem wonderfully.

Having watched the game again brown was so badly off the pace it was painful, the yardage made with ease against us due to his speed time and again, it's just madness to try it again.

I must say although robshaw has been a great servant for England his time has gone and I hope shields steps up (even though ewers is better) he looked good to me, although clearly not a lock.

Great to have launchbury back, I just hope he's fit and I hope itoje concentrates on playing rather than cheap shots on de Klerk which I think led to his slip allowing a try.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Mike brown on the wing again
Fiver (IP Logged)
16 June, 2018 14:19
One for the ex-forwards to answer; I just wonder whether Robshaw is the type of player you want when the pitches are soft and muddy. He is a strong lad and has a high work rate which may be more effective in an attritional grind. The issue in this modern age is the pitches are quicker these days.

Many pitches are now either artificial or hybrid, some have roofs. When you go to warmer countries the pitches are naturally hard and quick. I'd suggest you want your back row forwards to be more dynamic runners with good ball handling skills. Could this be why Eddie has gone for Shields?

 
A38
Re: Mike brown on the wing again
A38 (IP Logged)
17 June, 2018 06:59
Somewhat bemused this morning that there have been no comments about England's game yesterday.

I was lucky enough to miss the game live - and I don't think I'll watch the recording after reading various reports - so I'm not in a position to comment on the match.

My only observation however is to remember the Solomons prediction: that SA would win all the games. That prediction came I think from objective judgement rather than loyalty to his country; a prediction which is likely to be proved right.

Serious re-thinking to be done I think. Let's hope that the U20s can cheer us up later.

 
Whispering_Death
Re: Mike brown on the wing again
Whispering_Death (IP Logged)
17 June, 2018 07:29
Not a difficult prediction given our form and our record in SA. The players arenít right, they are not in a good place mentally. Our captain moaned like a petulant brat all game (Iíd like to use another word), Mike Brown is dropping high balls which never happens, Mako and Hughes should be dropped for their pathetic penalties, and we missed something like 25 tackles. Then weíve got Youngs interview and players arguing with fans. I think it runs deeper than just loosing but hope Iím wrong.

I feel for them, they way the press have just attacked them after every game. I know itís part of professional sport but it feels like itís getting personal with Jones.

 
Patgadd
Re: Mike brown on the wing again
Patgadd (IP Logged)
17 June, 2018 08:35
I was at a barbie, but managed a quick look at the telly just as the Sky commentator was saying "It's deja vu all over again", which tells me all I need to know - not about England, but about Sky sports commentators.

 
NW2
Re: Mike brown on the wing again
NW2 (IP Logged)
17 June, 2018 08:38
I remember reading a comment somewhere when Jones took over, that he had a "two year shelf life" - he would make a huge difference very quickly but then run out of steam.
Didn't take too much notice of it at the time, but unfortunately it looks like it may have been right.

 
Malvern Man
Re: Mike brown on the wing again
Malvern Man (IP Logged)
17 June, 2018 08:45
England might well win next week because they'll be at sea level. If they get another good start they might not fall apart this time and could hang on. They'd better!

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Mike brown on the wing again
Fiver (IP Logged)
17 June, 2018 09:00
Surprise surprise it was the two Harlequins meat heads arguing with fans. Owen Farrell showed why he hasn't got the temperament to be captain, I agree with the moaning brat comment.

The loss reminded me of the Harlequins game at Sixways. If Harlequins had spent more time concentrating on the game and less arguing with the ref, they might have achieved something.

The stupid penalties as mentioned above should see the players dropped as it shows they cannot be trusted. Send out a message and show who's boss. Youngs needs to be dropped for the awful interview. Make him watch the George Gregan interview when his team lost in the 2003 world cup final, that was a masterpiece in class. In fact, Hooper did the same after Ireland won yesterday.

Eddie made a comment about trusting in the team, whereas the players seemed to be trying to sort the mess out individually. Couldn't agree more. They looked clueless because they forgot their gameplan and training ground moves.

We've so much talent in England, I'd like to see Eddie use this as a chance to use it and get rid of a few experienced players in poor form. Starting with Brown, and then Mako and even Farrell. Get Cipriani starting, Daly in the 13 shirt and Slade at 12. Solomona should start on the wing, although I'm not sure who we've got as a 15.

 
Eternal optimist
Re: Mike brown on the wing again
Eternal optimist (IP Logged)
17 June, 2018 09:16
Woodward for full back.
As to Mahler and Brown arguing with England fans, yes the players should be disappointed but they are still professional players, being paid for there jaunt to South Africa as opposed to fans having to spend there hard earned.
Itís not the defeats that is so disappointing itís the manor and attitudes of certain team members.

 
Underdog
Re: Mike brown on the wing again
Underdog (IP Logged)
17 June, 2018 09:23
Not sure what to expect next week. I think EJ needs to drop some players who haven't been at the races, but then it's the only game at sea level, and they desperately need a win so you can see him playing favourites.

I would like to see some club partnerships given a go, so either Spencer, Farrell, Lozowski at 9,10, 12 or Hughes, Robson, Cipriani at 8, 9, 10.

Genge, Wilson, Williams and Hill ought to be given a go too, since our forwards have been getting battered.

 
Eternal optimist
Re: Mike brown on the wing again
Eternal optimist (IP Logged)
17 June, 2018 13:55
Genge is being sent home after a training injury
also Mako going home for personal reasons and Billy has re broken his arm.
I hope Iím wrong but I can see England being stuffed in the las5 game, the pack just arenít up to it and the whole team is over coached and just canít play whatís in front of them. A sorry state of affairs in my humble opinion, but there again who am I to question Eddie.


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