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Plans submitted for north stand & Hotel!
Discussion started by IanRed (IP Logged), 12 May, 2019 17:35
MESSAGES->author
IanRed
12 May, 2019 17:35
According to Daily Mail.

I had heard about a new stand to increase capacity, but not about a hotel and conferencing centre.

MESSAGES->author
TeflonTed
12 May, 2019 22:45
Well, there go the grandfather rights!

MESSAGES->author
Abberley
12 May, 2019 22:53
Quote:
Torygraph 2008

Worcester

Just need a successful team to complete the picture. Superbly appointed modern Sixways Ground now houses 12,000 after the opening of a new stand last weekend. A hotel/leisure complex is also planned. Owner Cecil Duckworth has formerly sunk large sums into the club, but they are now expected at least to pay their way.


MESSAGES->author
TeflonTed
12 May, 2019 23:03
Copied from the dailymail online.....

“Worcester Warriors have submitted a pre-planning application to the local council to expand Sixways and build a hotel conference centre. The club secured Premiership safety last week and have already started renovating the East Stand. They are hoping to increase capacity from 11,499 to 16,500 through additional seating, standing and luxury boxes.”

Detailed it ain’t!

WorcesterSauce
WorcesterSauce
12 May, 2019 23:33
With that capacity maybe grandfather rights will be merely altered so that season tickets include two seats per person instead!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/05/2019 23:33 by WorcesterSauce.

MESSAGES->author
Fiver
13 May, 2019 08:19
Well, grandfather rights are still working at the moment for my seat. Just bought my ticket for next season.

MESSAGES->author
Powick Eastander
13 May, 2019 09:18
The development won't start until this time next year



http://v4admin.sportnetwork.net/upload/130/130_0_1418121803.jpg Warriors Rugby Supporters Club http://v4admin.sportnetwork.net/upload/130/130_0_1418121803.jpg

MESSAGES->author
West Brom Warrior
13 May, 2019 09:34
Great news to see the club push on with some development of the club, the commercial side needs to bring in additional revenue to supplement the playing side.

Offa
Offa
13 May, 2019 12:02
I am sure that there was a Worcester News article a few weeks ago with Jed stating that they were looking to only increase the North Stand, with no hotel.

Is the story accurate, or have there been second thoughts?

usa warrior
usa warrior
13 May, 2019 17:03
It's accurate. North stand/hotel/seating/standing/boxes, etc. Should be very good!!

Need to fill 16.5k though!!

Inbox
Inbox
13 May, 2019 19:26
Quote:
usa warrior
It's accurate. North stand/hotel/seating/standing/boxes, etc. Should be very good!!
Need to fill 16.5k though!!

Play good rugby (as we have this year) and the numbers will come...

usa warrior
usa warrior
13 May, 2019 21:21
Hope so! What a sight that would be?!

Brummagem Bertie
Brummagem Bertie
14 May, 2019 18:03
Quote:
Offa
I am sure that there was a Worcester News article a few weeks ago with Jed stating that they were looking to only increase the North Stand, with no hotel.
Is the story accurate, or have there been second thoughts?

IIRC, the Worcester News story reported Ged as saying that they were in preliminary talks with the planners about the new stand. It could be that those plans always included a hotel but Ged was smart enough/well advised not to say anything at that time because they were still awaiting a response from the planners and didn't want to be seen as jumping the gun.

He could have risked souring relations and/or looked a prat if the response was "No chance".

Since the Worcester News article the club may have received a favourable response so can now reveal the full extent of the plans.

No inside knowledge, just guesswork.



Whatever you do, do it safely!

Offa
Offa
14 May, 2019 22:22
That would make sense.

Bushi
Bushi
15 May, 2019 09:33
A hotel makes such sense. If a company is looking at holding a conference, it looks for conference facilities with accommodation, therefore the club would get a double whammy. The location is good too, by the motorway and in the Midlands, perfect for national companies

ROLLO on tour
ROLLO
15 May, 2019 09:48
What Worcester needs is a good quality hotel , something in my 40 years of living here it has never had.
Too much to hope for a Malmason or Intercontinental but maybe a Crowne Plaza as part of ICH group?

TVM Rides Again....Again
TVM Rides Again
15 May, 2019 11:21
Would that be any use on a more general basis out at J6? One linked with a conference centre would make more sense mind,

usa warrior
usa warrior
15 May, 2019 12:17
Also means that visiting teams and supporters can stay on site which fills the hotel fairly regularly. All makes a lot of sense really.

WorcesterSauce
WorcesterSauce
15 May, 2019 13:33
Not sure any prem teams will stay next season to be honest. Newcastle would’ve been the only one who may have but teams like to just get back. European teams however I guess will.

TVM Rides Again....Again
TVM Rides Again
15 May, 2019 13:53
Quote:
WorcesterSauce
Not sure any prem teams will stay next season to be honest. Newcastle would’ve been the only one who may have but teams like to just get back. European teams however I guess will.

I think the stay thing can quite often be night before, rather than night of. I know some do that sometimes, though others get famously stuck in traffic

usa warrior
usa warrior
15 May, 2019 15:24
Yes, will often travel up the night before the game for an afternoon kick-off. Certainly doesn't apply to everyone though - Glaws, Wasps, Bristol, Bath for instance.

ROLLO on tour
ROLLO
15 May, 2019 17:10
I think that Puckrup Hall is often used, there is a golf course there as well. I am not suer that a team would want to stya that close.

centrethere
centrethere
15 May, 2019 17:23
It’s a pre-planning advice request , certainly not on the Wychavon planning portal . But others may know more or not

Eternal optimist
Eternal optimist
15 May, 2019 17:55
Quote:
centrethere
It’s a pre-planning advice request , certainly not on the Wychavon planning portal . But others may know more or not
Pre Apps are not shown on the portal, only actual applications once validated are recorded.
You generally use a pre app to test the water with the planning case officer who will comment only on planning policy, but sometimes offer advice on potential problems.

usa warrior
usa warrior
16 May, 2019 10:47
Quote:
ROLLO
I think that Puckrup Hall is often used, there is a golf course there as well. I am not suer that a team would want to stya that close.

That's right. Possibly not, but nice to be able to offer it. Supporters might, although town may be more of a draw.

A38
A38
22 May, 2019 09:19
[www.worcesternews.co.uk]

Just to update those of us who didn't buy a programme on Saturday.

Offa
Offa
22 May, 2019 13:52
Good to hear that Cecil approves of our new owners. I realise that he would not say otherwise, but he could always have said nothing.

MESSAGES->author
Faithful_City
22 May, 2019 14:12
He pointedly states how well he gets on with the two directors from Morecombe FC but not a lot re Ged??

ROLLO on tour
ROLLO
23 May, 2019 21:02
JP that is becasue he rarely sees Jed but has had a lot of contact with Jason and Colin.

MESSAGES->author
Faithful_City
24 May, 2019 07:52
Why does he rarely see McCrory

JP

TVM Rides Again....Again
TVM Rides Again
24 May, 2019 08:34
Presumably becasue he takes more of a sleeping role day to day, and the others are the hands on managers?

Not everything HAS to be sinister, though I think many sort of want it to be.

ROLLO on tour
ROLLO
24 May, 2019 10:55
JP it is as TVM says Jason and Colin are the two chaps doing the heavy lifting nothing particulary sinister. Jed is around 2/3 days a week.

Freypal
Freypal
24 May, 2019 11:13
Be exciting to see the plans once submitted - seems like this has been a long time coming with many false starts.

Anything to help make the club financially self-sustaining has to be good in my book.

Royal Warrior
Flip Flop
24 May, 2019 13:23
I think sinister is not the right term too, however...

Jed was made as the 'face' of this takeover, yet in comparatively short time, has become 'back office' while 2 chaps from up North Football fraternity arrive from stage left, to add to the invisible financier registered in the Carribean named in Co House details IIRC to really operate the club, from the nuggets we see or hear.

Although CD appears to be getting on well with the 2 new faces and their plans and expectations, as they were not in the original picture, their involvement is something that throws more questions than answers, particularly when most, if not all, of the dialogue is coming via WEN articles, and less of the 'horses mouths', on the face of it.

Of course the Board can do what they blydi like in truth, but if Jed was only the 'face' of the Consortium (presumably Allens / Legal knew this during purchase negotiations and the likely 2 new real Board members) then all the to do about Jed's previous track record counts for sweet FA as he doesn't have his fingers in the pie. The 2 new guys may have found their latest play thing, which providing it gets Development approval may handle their property interests. But furore about them, does seem less than against Jed.

The playing squad has been trimmed financially we can reasonably guess via a reasonable perspective that replacement bodies have not, or cannot match, departing ones financially or playing wise, to enhance next season survival chances. Do the Board know that there will be no trap door next season and for the future to take this stance, or is there something in the team management view, that we will screw the large funds buys success model, and get 6th due to stabiliy?

Is there any cause for concern over late filing of accounts? From my insight from within the Ministry of Dark Arts, delays tend only to linked to disputes over accounting treatments or valuations included in the numbers, and how those wrangles wash through with the relevant Auditing Firm. If due diligence prior to purchase didn't throw up issues, then that will have been a shabby reflection on both or either of the Allens potential financial wizardry, and / or the Consortium's Financial Forensic team lack of attention to key aspects and how they had been treated in the numbers presented. Resolving such issues is generally quite simple, but can make financial reporting matters look horrific and create black holes, Stephen Hawking would gasp at! However, horrific figures are not a reason to delay publication. Horrific figures to which Prem Shares / Other financing could be linked, may be more troublesome, and lead to struggles over agreement that records show the 'True and Fair' view they are expected to, to avoid drawing attention to areas of questionable practices.This ignores issues arising from any potential litigation matters that may also be linked to such events, if they have occurred at all.

With the unanswered questions, informed and ill informed judgements will attempt to fill the vacuous silence unless they are addressed, and if the Board does not feel it has an obligation to inform, they won't, and this chatter cycle continues.

Some will suspect there is trouble ahead in such a matters- it's much more interesting to suggest this, than merely suggest that this is just a reflection of the sometimes, hum drum tedium of corporate life.

centrethere
centrethere
24 May, 2019 23:44
Floppy is that the longest post ever. did read it and sort of agree ‘who are these guys?’

kiddykid
kiddykid
25 May, 2019 03:18
Does anyone know how the cricket club are doing with their PRemier Travel Innn at New Road? Does it bring in the cash?
Lancs CCC also have one at Old Trafford.

MESSAGES->author
TeflonTed
25 May, 2019 08:03
Quote:
kiddykid
?........their PRemier Travel Innn at New Road? Does it bring in the cash?

I doubt it’s “theirs”.

From The Daily Mail, March 2012....
“Whitbread, Premier Inn's parent company, is investing £7.5m in the hotel and restaurant and Worcestershire are investing in excess of £2.5m in the new facilities.”

This does not imply that the Worcestershire investment is directly in the hotel itself rather than the other concurrent site improvements.

There’s no doubt some benefit to the cricket club, but I’d imagine the hotel is run just like any other Premier Inn, and the revenue goes to Whitbread (or whoever now runs Premier Inns, I haven’t checked).

There may have been a one-off initial payment, a lease on the land, an annual payment of some sort or whatever, but I very much doubt there’d be an ongoing profit share or revenue stream directly linked to hotel income.

Clearly there’s opportunity for the club to use their conference facilities, catering and other onsite services, but I think to describe it as ‘their Premier Inn” is not correct.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 25/05/2019 08:03 by TeflonTed.

Eternal optimist
Eternal optimist
25 May, 2019 09:44
Certainly from the early feasibility scheme that I’ve seen it’s an interesting project. I know that most of the “groundwork’s” and the SUDs have already been done when the east stand was built I can’t help but think this project would sit better on the west stand. I appreciate that this would mean moving the training centre and locate it adjacent to the grass training pitch but by doing so you can provide a more inclusive suite. The one we’ve just built at Hartpury really ticks all of the boxes.

MESSAGES->author
Faithful_City
25 May, 2019 10:36
I agree with the Hotel being better placed at the West Stand due to the size it could be, privacy for guests and a big are at the back of the stand which could be made use of.

JP

Patgadd
Patgadd
25 May, 2019 10:38
But then where would you put the library?

A38
A38
25 May, 2019 11:20
I suppose if one was starting from scratch there would be every argument to the resiting as suggested above - save, of course, that a hotel where the West Stand is would be marginally closer to the noisy A449.

But what is there is there - and paid for. A hotel and additional conference facilities would bring in additional income one way or another but resiting the indoor training facilities would be a significant cost which would be hard, though I suppose not impossible, to justify.

Brummagem Bertie
Brummagem Bertie
25 May, 2019 11:45
The other problem with placing the hotel development on the West Stand is that it's a bit tight to the A449 embankment at the South end. Far from being more private for guests you would also have the prospect of motorists queueing for the roundabout at the same level as the guest bedrooms, conference facilities, etc., and able to have a good old gander.

The other problem is that Highways would likely object to that sort of development of the West Stand, judging by their response to the application for a big screen in the North East corner of the ground.

That was rejected because Highways felt it would be too distracting for drivers on the approach to the roundabout and detrimental to safety. I imagine they would raise similar concerns for a large hotel and conference building occupying most, if not all, of the West Stand car park.



Whatever you do, do it safely!

kiddykid
kiddykid
25 May, 2019 20:40
IF we build the new stand and hotel is it an opportunity to move the pitch south to north to enlarge the try areas and dead ball area.....they must be one of the smaller ones in the Prem with Exeter probably having the biggest.
I remember four or five years ago having a chat with one f our lovely ladies in the ticket office and she told me then that plans for a new standing and sitting stand were in place and would be along the lines of the Frankins Gardens arrangement.

MESSAGES->author
Faithful_City
25 May, 2019 22:16
I had heard the pitch will be moved northwards to provide bigger in goal areas. You can see where by looking at the windows in the corner office and stairs block.

JP

TVM Rides Again....Again
TVM Rides Again
26 May, 2019 08:31
Regarding hotels - on the (sensible IMHO) assumption it is a Premier Inn or similar, they often buy land, build themselves, then grant themselves a lease and sell the lease on to an investor.

I guess a JV partnership could work, but the operators tend to fund building themselves, and they recoup that money, and a little something for the trouble of developing it themselves in the sale.

I am sure this could be tweaked to keep Worcester the beneficiary of the income. But the operator would want to recoup the fact they aren't making profit on the development somehow I am sure.

Brummagem Bertie
Brummagem Bertie
26 May, 2019 09:59
TVM, I think the problem with the usual model that you've outlined is that in our case the hotel will be part of the stand, if I've understood the proposal correctly, rather than a separate building.

Whether Warriors are going to agree plans with an operator, then fund the development themselves, using the CVC money, with a lease arrangement for the hotel part, so that the lease income and income from the conference centre, which will presumably be in-house, provide a return on investment, or some other arrangement, we will have to wait and see, I guess.



Whatever you do, do it safely!

Abmatt
Abmatt
26 May, 2019 11:52
I hope it’s a holiday inn. I’ve got a ton of ihg points I need to get rid of.


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