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Last result: Exeter Chiefs 36-5 Newcastle Falcons


Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Horus (IP Logged)
19 February, 2018 08:02
The SRU is keen to buying a share ofup to 10-20% of the Falcons, with the attempt to buy up Wuss fizzling out.Semore has said no formal discussions had yet taken place. He is reported to have said: "What we are talking about is a marriage and we haven't even gone on our first date." Semore also said "we are an English club and my alliances and links are all England -based." There is more to this story, but, like me, you will need to buy a copy of the Times.

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
pa8 (IP Logged)
19 February, 2018 09:28
The article:-
SCOTLAND EYE A STAKE IN NEWCASTLE FALCONS.

The Scottish Rugby Union is so keen to gain a foothold in the top flight of English club rugby that it is pursuing the possibility of buying a share of up to 20 per cent of Newcastle Falcons.

The SRU had looked at buying Worcester Warriors this season, but it has now set its sights on Newcastle, a club where there is already a long history of Scottish players. There were three Newcastle players in the Scotland squad in their latest NatWest Six Nations game against France eight days ago.

There are only two professional teams in Scotland, which is why the SRU wants to expand its playing base. It also hopes that the move will help it to secure more of those players who are qualified to play for both nations.

The SRU has already begun the process of sounding out Falcons. The owning company, Newcastle Rugby Ltd, recorded losses of £2.6 million in its last set of accounts. It regularly loses more than £2 million a year.

Semore Kurdi, the Falcons owner, told The Times that no formal discussion had yet taken place. He said: ďWhat we are talking about is a marriage and we havenít even gone on our first date.Ē

Any significant change in ownership would require the consent of the RFU and this would be hard to come by. The RFU is not in the business of helping its neighbours. Their rivalry is the oldest in the history of the game and will recommence in the Calcutta Cup at Murrayfield on Saturday.

However, a bid for a share of Newcastle has a greater chance of succeeding than the Worcester project did. The Worcester move was for a complete takeover while the Newcastle bid is for a share, not a controlling interest.

The Times understands that the SRU would be interested in up to a 20 per cent share. If it was to scale back its interest to 10 per cent or less then, according to RFU regulations, it would not require RFU consent. The other option, rather than paying for a share, is for the SRU to provide players for Newcastle and therefore lighten the wage bill. The SRU has already bought a shareholding in Stade NiÁois, the third division club in France, where it places developing players. However, it wants a foothold in the Aviva Premiership where senior players can be battle-hardened. Geographically, Newcastle is the obvious solution.

Kurdi said: ďWe are an English club and my alliances and links are all England based. There is no way I would step back from that and say, ĎI am probably better off with Scotlandí. I am not. I may have a small advantage by doing more in Scotland, but this is an English club in England and everything in the club is set up for England.Ē

The SRU yesterday refused to comment on the Newcastle situation. However, a spokesman did say that Scottish Rugby is always looking for opportunities for its players.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 19/02/2018 09:31 by pa8.

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Horus (IP Logged)
19 February, 2018 10:06
Thanks for getting the Times article up pa8. I am just off to the club to buy a Doddie charity top (in time for the home match V Saints),just mentioned on local breakfast TV.

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Bedlington Lad (IP Logged)
19 February, 2018 11:30
Interesting - if they provided players I'm presuming they paid them and it didn't count against the salary cap? Would that be the case? Would Prem Rugby be ok about it? Who dictates when the players are selected, etc?

Likewise if they bought a 20% stake how much input / influence would they have?

Lots to consider here

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Falcons_Thunder (IP Logged)
19 February, 2018 11:33
That's would be a win-win for us getting some great Scottish players. The list of players north of the boarder that have contributed to the Falcons since professionalism is to many to mention and that could help increase our competitiveness in the team.

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
GeordieFalcon (IP Logged)
19 February, 2018 11:38
Yeah..how much influence comes about from 20%.

What financial value would that be.

Is it in the Falcons interest. Especially as we are making those financial losses each year.

On the other hand...we already have strong links with Scotland anyway...and a rich heritage of Scottish players playing for us.

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Cantabrian (IP Logged)
19 February, 2018 12:07
Ancient rivalries on one hand and pound notes in the other. Hmmm, very interesting..... fascinating to see if and how this develops.

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Monkey1 (IP Logged)
19 February, 2018 12:48
I have said for years that there would be mutual benefit in working with SRU, without in any way affecting our obligations to the RFU. For many practical reasons it makes a lot of sense.

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Falc Dancer (IP Logged)
19 February, 2018 12:59
Very interesting
£20m for 20% plus Stuart Hogg should sweeten the deal

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
GeordieFalcon (IP Logged)
19 February, 2018 13:30
Pah...Hogg wouldn't get in the team of Taity! winking smiley

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
AJfalc (IP Logged)
19 February, 2018 13:56
Would we play some home games at Murrayfield ?

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
dick g (IP Logged)
19 February, 2018 14:07
Given the requirement to field a large number of EQPs in the matchday squad, how would we accommodate a number of Scots? Would they have to be accommodated at the expense of our English lads and our overseas contingent?

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
19 February, 2018 14:18
Quote:
dick g
Given the requirement to field a large number of EQPs in the matchday squad, how would we accommodate a number of Scots? Would they have to be accommodated at the expense of our English lads and our overseas contingent?

Is it a requirement other than for financial kick backs? If so then the SRU could fund the shortfall.

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
dick g (IP Logged)
19 February, 2018 15:15
Quote:
There's 35 seconds to go
Quote:
dick g
Given the requirement to field a large number of EQPs in the matchday squad, how would we accommodate a number of Scots? Would they have to be accommodated at the expense of our English lads and our overseas contingent?

Is it a requirement other than for financial kick backs? If so then the SRU could fund the shortfall.

So we would cease to develop EQPS and develop SQPS instead?

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Leipziger (IP Logged)
19 February, 2018 16:18
I can't imagine we'd be allowed to have the SRU fund or subsidise a player's wages outside of the salary cap. I also can't imagine Deano allowing anyone outside the coaching team to have any influence on team selection or who to sign in the squad.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 19/02/2018 16:18 by Leipziger.

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Monkey1 (IP Logged)
19 February, 2018 18:07
Quote:
dick g
Given the requirement to field a large number of EQPs in the matchday squad, how would we accommodate a number of Scots? Would they have to be accommodated at the expense of our English lads and our overseas contingent?

We already accommodate a number of Scots. I imagine we would have priority access to Scots who have international potential. or who are already international standard, which surely must be good for the squad. I don't see why it would reduce our focus on local player development, just that more of our non-English players would have names that are easier to spell.

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Falcons_Thunder (IP Logged)
19 February, 2018 19:34
The RFU has no imput to premiership rugby. Premiership rugby is owned by the 12 stakehold club which the Falcons are. The EQP is not a requirement it's just a finical sweetener from the RFU. And to be honest Eddie and the RFU has turn their back on us for way to long

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Timeshock! (IP Logged)
19 February, 2018 20:02
If we get these training pitches and changing facilities built before the start of 18/19 season the RFU are picking up 100% of the tab, I just can't see that sitting comfortably at all.

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Horus (IP Logged)
19 February, 2018 20:23
As has previously pointed out,While SRU money would help with our wage bill& 2m+ annual losses, Falcons cannot risk our share of the £30million the RFU pay Premiership clubs to identify and develop England players. So Falcons 23 man match-day squads, must still contain 15 EQ Falcons, however many and how brilliant Jocks we may end up with . Also our academy is funded by the RFU because it produces EQ players, not Scot qualified players. How much dosh would the SRU put into Falcons' pockets ?

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Falcons_Thunder (IP Logged)
19 February, 2018 21:22
Quote:
Horus
As has previously pointed out,While SRU money would help with our wage bill& 2m+ annual losses, Falcons cannot risk our share of the £30million the RFU pay Premiership clubs to identify and develop England players. So Falcons 23 man match-day squads, must still contain 15 EQ Falcons, however many and how brilliant Jocks we may end up with . Also our academy is funded by the RFU because it produces EQ players, not Scot qualified players. How much dosh would the SRU put into Falcons' pockets ?

30 million where's the source?

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
19 February, 2018 21:40
some of the players in the academy do qualify for Scotland through parents etc the reason they are in the academy is because they are from the catchment area. although the remit of the academy is to develop players for England some may well play for another nation in the end. If a player is deemed good enough when going through Development player pathway from u-13 to u-15 they may be offered a place they dont have to be English or play for England although the RFU do fund academies.

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Monkey1 (IP Logged)
20 February, 2018 07:16
Quote:
Horus
Falcons 23 man match-day squads, must still contain 15 EQ Falcons...

Really? Some of the team sheets must use very creative definitions of EQP!

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Falcons_Thunder (IP Logged)
20 February, 2018 08:16
Quote:
Monkey1
Quote:
Horus
Falcons 23 man match-day squads, must still contain 15 EQ Falcons...

Really? Some of the team sheets must use very creative definitions of EQP!

I hear sinoti sinoti is from Apia (hebburn) not Samoa. And Kyle Cooper is actually from the west end of Newcastle not Joburg lol

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Rafpilot2000 (IP Logged)
20 February, 2018 09:07
Extra investment in any business can only be a good thing. Didnít our Sevens team a couple of years ago basically consist of the Scottish 7ís national team?
Mr Kurdi has been taking a £2M a year hit to get us where we are and with all the extra developments going on any help we can get him to keep the vision on track seems a positive.
15 of the 23 March needing to be EQP surely canít be too difficult. As that still allows 8 of the first 15 to be foreign. What do we currently have?
After all , Kingston Park is North of Hadrianís wall!!

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Leipziger (IP Logged)
20 February, 2018 10:11
Quote:
Rafpilot2000
Extra investment in any business can only be a good thing.

Depends what the implications are. The SRU won't be doing it for the Falcons' benefit, they will be doing it for the benefit of their own national team, and there could be a clash there.

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
dick g (IP Logged)
20 February, 2018 11:58
Quote:
Rafpilot2000
Extra investment in any business can only be a good thing. Didnít our Sevens team a couple of years ago basically consist of the Scottish 7ís national team?
Mr Kurdi has been taking a £2M a year hit to get us where we are and with all the extra developments going on any help we can get him to keep the vision on track seems a positive.
15 of the 23 March needing to be EQP surely canít be too difficult. As that still allows 8 of the first 15 to be foreign. What do we currently have?
After all , Kingston Park is North of Hadrianís wall!!

But the Scottish Border is a further 50 miles north. I shall still be wearing my England shirt at the weekend, much as I dislike nationalism.

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Kath... (IP Logged)
20 February, 2018 15:46
Quote:
But the Scottish Border is a further 50 miles north. I shall still be wearing my England shirt at the weekend, much as I dislike nationalism.

I am with you Dick...........

I am not keen on this idea. What if they go for another referendum and leave the United Kingdom - you would def., get a border force then.

This could lead to a can of worms yuk

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Exiled Falcon (IP Logged)
20 February, 2018 19:31
Quote:
Falcons_Thunder
The RFU has no imput to premiership rugby. Premiership rugby is owned by the 12 stakehold club which the Falcons are. The EQP is not a requirement it's just a finical sweetener from the RFU. And to be honest Eddie and the RFU has turn their back on us for way to long

Err Gary Graham, England under 20s v Wales.......

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Falcons_Thunder (IP Logged)
20 February, 2018 19:36
I've read that if the SRU takes a 10% stake in the Falcons it doesn't need approving. Now nobody is thinking of raising the Scottish flag above KP but as a business idea it could make sense to send a few players south of the boarder to accommodate the SRU's project players who still only need 3year residency. And the EQP is NOT mandatory in fact we bearly hit it on a premiership game and we make up for it in the European games. It's a finical sweetener from the RFU which in our current state we shouldn't knock.

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Exiled Falcon (IP Logged)
20 February, 2018 19:48
Weíve gone through this a while ago and personally my stance hasnít changed, if this happens I would hope at a bare minimum the RFU remove us from the league and send us forthwith to the Scottish leagues.

We are an English club playing in the English league system; if Wales and Ireland who both have smaller populations can avoid parasiting on another countryís resources then Iím sure Scotland can also. I would gain no satisfaction from one of our Scotland plants scoring a winning try to deprive England of a World Cup, grand slam etc etc.

I felt really sorry when some of the Worcester supporters expressed dismay at something similar happening to them and have the same feeling for us. I have no problem with us having numerous players from whichever country, but to make it a formal arrangement is a complete no no.

And before I get whinged at for being anti Scottish, Iíve lived there for 30 years and one of my proudest moments was watching my son mumble Flower of Scotland whilst representing Scotland at a World Championship.

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
DB23 (IP Logged)
20 February, 2018 21:33
Quote:
Leipziger
Quote:
Rafpilot2000
Extra investment in any business can only be a good thing.

Depends what the implications are. The SRU won't be doing it for the Falcons' benefit, they will be doing it for the benefit of their own national team, and there could be a clash there.

Completely right, Leipziger, this is not an altruistic move by the SRU to benefit the Falcons.

Individual players from all nations are always made very welcome at the Falcons but a formal arrangement to help develop players for Scotland doesnít sit right with me.

As Exiled Falcon said we are an English club in an English league, so why would an English club do that? I canít imagine it happening the other way round.

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Falcons_Thunder (IP Logged)
20 February, 2018 22:54
[quote Exiled Falcon]Weíve gone through this a while ago and personally my stance hasnít changed, if this happens I would hope at a bare minimum the RFU remove us from the league and send us forthwith to the Scottish leagues.

Premiership rugby has 12 stakeholders and the RFU isn't one of them!!!. And the RFU has done a great job with the championship (which they run nearly into the ground) the teams in the championship heavily rely on premiership teams loaning or duel contracting players to survive, with only two maybe three teams actually wanting to play in the championship. I used to think you couldn't get any worse than the FA but unfortunately the RFU is ran by the 1% private school toff brigade that has no actual connection with the wider rugby community.

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Kath... (IP Logged)
20 February, 2018 23:45
[quote Falcons_Thunder][quote Exiled Falcon]Weíve gone through this a while ago and personally my stance hasnít changed, if this happens I would hope at a bare minimum the RFU remove us from the league and send us forthwith to the Scottish leagues.

Premiership rugby has 12 stakeholders and the RFU isn't one of them!!!. And the RFU has done a great job with the championship (which they run nearly into the ground) the teams in the championship heavily rely on premiership teams loaning or duel contracting players to survive, with only two maybe three teams actually wanting to play in the championship. I used to think you couldn't get any worse than the FA but unfortunately the RFU is ran by the 1% private school toff brigade that has no actual connection with the wider rugby community.[/quote]


......................... Falcons thunder you are talking from a lack of knowledge, I suggest you do some research before you espouse any more thinking. You might want to read the following.



About the RFU
The Rugby Football Union is the national governing body for grassroots and elite rugby in England, with 2,000 autonomous rugby clubs in its membership.

The clubs are grouped within 35 Constituent Bodies (CBs), comprised of counties Ė some individual, some combined Ė the three armed forces, Oxford and Cambridge Universities, England Rugby Football Schools' Union and England Students.

All of this is supported by the RFU's 50 Rugby Development Officers, six Area Managers and 120 Community Rugby Coaches across the country, who provide some 30,000 coaching sessions a year for young people.

The RFU employs approximately 500 paid staff and helps to train and support more than 60,000 volunteers whose roles include:

Organising rugby activity, including the playing, coaching and refereeing of matches and recreational rugby at all levels
Supporting the volunteer workforce
Working with clubs to secure grants and loans for facilities
Fundraising, handling money and insurance
Offering medical advice and support
Committee member/trustee
Secretarial, administration and clerical help
The RFU endeavours to operate to PLC standards but it is neither a company nor a charity. It is a society established under the Co-operative and Community Benefit Societies Act 2014 and is, in layman's terms, a ďFriendly SocietyĒ. This means that the RFU is owned by its member clubs and aims to make a profit to reinvest in rugby union in England.

The RFU has committed to comply with the Sport England Governance Code, with a minimum of 30 % of each gender represented on the Board of Directors. Our ambitions go beyond this, and our Strategic Plan sets out a number of aspirations regarding diversity and inclusion throughout the game, from players to volunteers. To help structure and monitor these, we have worked with Sport England and Inclusive Boards to develop a Diversity and Inclusion action plan, which can be found here.

Its income is made up of funding from sponsorship, government, ticket sales from international matches at Twickenham, merchandise and licensing, hospitality and catering, a travel company, and television rights.

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Bedlington Lad (IP Logged)
21 February, 2018 09:04
I think the way Mr. Kurdi expressed this has it right - wanting marriage before a first date. There are a myriad of things to be considered and discussed, there must be mutual benefit for this to go any further.

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Falcons_Thunder (IP Logged)
21 February, 2018 09:39
Premiership rugby has 12 stakeholders and the RFU isn't one of them!!!. And the RFU has done a great job with the championship (which they run nearly into the ground) the teams in the championship heavily rely on premiership teams loaning or duel contracting players to survive, with only two maybe three teams actually wanting to play in the championship. I used to think you couldn't get any worse than the FA but unfortunately the RFU is ran by the 1% private school toff brigade that has no actual connection with the wider rugby community.[/quote]


......................... Falcons thunder you are talking from a lack of knowledge, I suggest you do some research before you espouse any more thinking. You might want to read the following.


A copy and paste job kath. Kath out of 13 board members 3 are women and how many come from a working class background? This is the same RFU that made nearly £500 million last year while cutting the woman's elite squad by half because they don't wanna fund an elite women's 15 and 7's team at the same time. The RFU is a disgrace just like the FA

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Kath... (IP Logged)
21 February, 2018 11:09
Falcons thunder. The RFU is there for all the union clubs as well as the premiership clubs.

You say they are useless but the broader picture which you failed to read above is they attempt to cover all aspects of the union game and give funding for all sorts of ventures. Wallsend got money for new pitches, Ponteland got money for floodlights just to name a couple of local teams. You can't just dismiss out of hand the work they do.

I can't remember off hand but I do believe that the Falcons are getting some money from the RFU for their stadium development.... no doubt someone will correct me if I am wrong on this.

Plus thnk about it all the local clubs are feeders for the Falcons just again to name one player Callum Chick + many more.

As for your comment re cut and paste I can't see the problem. You really seem to have a chip on your shoulder about all of this.

But I do think you need to give the benefit of the doubt sometimes.

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Exiled Falcon (IP Logged)
21 February, 2018 19:03
Itís really easy to criticise any governing body like the RFU or the FA, my Scottish mates are forever moaning about the SRU and SFA, just as itís easy to come up with the inverse snobbery krud that just because they arenít working clas heroes they out of touch. Iím sure all four do a load of work behind the scenes that people donít know about or fail to acknowledge, itís simply easier to moan about them.

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Falcons_Thunder (IP Logged)
04 March, 2018 22:27
Quins have apparently struck a deal with NZR to provide a place for NZ players to go on their year sabbatical and the RFU hasn't even raised an eyebrow

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
pa8 (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 03:57
Quote:
Falcons_Thunder
Quins have apparently struck a deal with NZR to provide a place for NZ players to go on their year sabbatical and the RFU hasn't even raised an eyebrow

I donít think that involves NZ buying a stake in Quins though.

 
Re: Scotland(SRU) want a stake in the Falcons
Monkey1 (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 07:22
The Premiership is now recognised as the toughest league in the world. International coaches will want their players experienced in that environment, so expect these arrangements to become more common.


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