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Welsh players not released
Buzzil (IP Logged)
16 May, 2018 22:08
Good on the PRL refusing to release the three English-based Welsh players (Francis, Charteris & Adams) for their match on 2nd June in the US

So what if they haven't played for a month and their next game is September - rules are rules!!!

[www.bbc.co.uk]

 
Re: Welsh players not released
Hucks (IP Logged)
16 May, 2018 23:05
What a colossal balls up. Wales should know better and the PRL should get their heads out of the sand.

Once again it's the players who suffer - particularly disappointing for Adams who has only broken into wales reckoning since playing in England so it's not like you can say 'well you knew this might happen when you left wales'.

Abysmal

 
Re: Welsh players not released
welsh wasp (IP Logged)
16 May, 2018 23:05
Is this the PRL trying to show their muscle? For what reason - because June is outside the international window. Rather petty of PRL and not conducive to good relations between the Six Nations.

 
Re: Welsh players not released
DGPWasp (IP Logged)
16 May, 2018 23:13
Admittedly it seems a touch petty by PRL with no matches left for those clubs, but why have Wales scheduled a game outside of the agreed international window again? Same happened in the autumn and Bath and Saints have been fined in recent seasons for releasing North and Faletau when they "should" have been gracing the Premiership. Not the players' fault mind.

 
Re: Welsh players not released
Trev's Big Tackle (IP Logged)
16 May, 2018 23:22
I hope prl told Wales that if they want those players then they better get the chequebook out. England pay prl for player release outside the international Windows so I don't see why Wales should get it for free.

 
Re: Welsh players not released
Raggs (IP Logged)
17 May, 2018 07:24
RFU pay the PRL for player release outside the window. If the PRL release the Welsh players for free, what are the RFU going to say/do?

PRL are acting within the regulations, WRU are trying to get extra cash by playing players even more.

PRL pay the players wages, why should their assets be used for free, at more risk of damage, and not receive any compensation?

WRU know what they need to do to get those players released. They need to pay, like the RFU. PRL cannot risk it's funding from the RFU.

 
Re: Welsh players not released
SarrieSaint (IP Logged)
17 May, 2018 07:54
Quote:
welsh wasp
Is this the PRL trying to show their muscle? For what reason - because June is outside the international window. Rather petty of PRL and not conducive to good relations between the Six Nations.

Or rather petty by the WRU to chuck all three AP players out of the whole tour because they can't make the WRUs extra money-grabbing game outside the agreed International window? L

Looks like a cheap and nasty way by the WRU to make a point that players working outside Wales will find themselves at a disadvantage. Poor form.

 
Re: Welsh players not released
Gaz (IP Logged)
17 May, 2018 09:11
Well done PRL is what I say.

Just broadening the discussion slightly but related - What happens if WLR is called up? Summer tour - fine, but what about the rugby championship? Is that an official test window in the NH? And then what about the autumn internationals? Is it feasible that we won't see WLR until December?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 17/05/2018 09:12 by Gaz.

 
Re: Welsh players not released
welsh wasp (IP Logged)
17 May, 2018 11:09
No evidence that the WRU did or did not offer payments for early release.
North had a clause in his Saints contract saying he could be released. As members of the PRL, Saints should have known that would be a cost to them.

 
Re: Welsh players not released
Raggs (IP Logged)
17 May, 2018 11:16
Quote:
welsh wasp
No evidence that the WRU did or did not offer payments for early release.
North had a clause in his Saints contract saying he could be released. As members of the PRL, Saints should have known that would be a cost to them.

WRU have previously said they would not offer payment for release. I'm absolutely positive that if they had changed policy, and offered money and still been refused, that would have been widely published about how mean the PRL is.

 
Re: Welsh players not released
RuggyBuggy (IP Logged)
17 May, 2018 12:59
Stupid of Wales to fix a match for then, I understand it is only a day before the window opens but they also need to allow for travel time and I assume some training before the game? There is another game weekend in the window, OK they won't get a big team but that's the way it has to be sometimes. They seem to play all the big three SH teams every November.

 
Re: Welsh players not released
bg (IP Logged)
17 May, 2018 13:56
Quote:
Gaz
Well done PRL is what I say.
Just broadening the discussion slightly but related - What happens if WLR is called up? Summer tour - fine, but what about the rugby championship? Is that an official test window in the NH? And then what about the autumn internationals? Is it feasible that we won't see WLR until December?

I read somewhere that there's only 2 World Rugby International windows.. June and in the Autumn.. which makes me think.. is the 6 Nations an International window? There are no other international games around the world when the 6N's is on.. so do the 6 nations countries unions have an internal agreement.

Greg Laidlaw played for Scotland one week-end in the 6N.. then the following week-end he played for his French club.. the following week-end he then played for Scotland.

So he wasn't allowed by his club to stay with the Scottish squad in a rest week.. but obviously was allowed to play for scotland either side of his club game.. but if the 6N isn't a International window.. the French club could refuse to let him represent Scotland in the 6N??

 
Re: Welsh players not released
Buzzil (IP Logged)
17 May, 2018 15:56
6N when there are games on are International Window but the rest weekends aren't

Interesting - North and Moriarty may not be able to tour either as the game is before their contracts with English clubs finish

 
Re: Welsh players not released
Raggs (IP Logged)
17 May, 2018 16:29
Quote:
bg
Quote:
Gaz
Well done PRL is what I say.
Just broadening the discussion slightly but related - What happens if WLR is called up? Summer tour - fine, but what about the rugby championship? Is that an official test window in the NH? And then what about the autumn internationals? Is it feasible that we won't see WLR until December?

I read somewhere that there's only 2 World Rugby International windows.. June and in the Autumn.. which makes me think.. is the 6 Nations an International window? There are no other international games around the world when the 6N's is on.. so do the 6 nations countries unions have an internal agreement.

Greg Laidlaw played for Scotland one week-end in the 6N.. then the following week-end he played for his French club.. the following week-end he then played for Scotland.

So he wasn't allowed by his club to stay with the Scottish squad in a rest week.. but obviously was allowed to play for scotland either side of his club game.. but if the 6N isn't a International window.. the French club could refuse to let him represent Scotland in the 6N??

June and November are the global windows. The 6N is in a NH window, and the Rugby Championship is in a SH window.

 
Re: Welsh players not released
Nomad_Wasp (IP Logged)
18 May, 2018 10:57
Windows are windows. Plater release should be guaranteed. That's why the NZRFU couldn't have blocked Shields despite what they were saying (and despite the tricks they've clearly pulled on a whole host of Islanders before) and was the cause of the massive furore surrounding the rumours and allegations that French and British clubs were "encouraging" their Islanders to make themselves unavailable for national sides.

 
Re: Welsh players not released
Raggs (IP Logged)
18 May, 2018 11:19
Quote:
Nomad_Wasp
Windows are windows. Plater release should be guaranteed. That's why the NZRFU couldn't have blocked Shields despite what they were saying (and despite the tricks they've clearly pulled on a whole host of Islanders before) and was the cause of the massive furore surrounding the rumours and allegations that French and British clubs were "encouraging" their Islanders to make themselves unavailable for national sides.

Actually there is a clause that could have stopped Shields being released, but it's not clear if that's what NZRU had in place.

Player release is otherwise guaranteed in their relevant windows. The first Wales game is not in the window, therefore no release. WRU compensate the regions for the release outside the windows, the RFU compensates the PRL outside the windows, but the WRU doesn't want to compensate the PRL for the same release, simple enough.

 
Re: Welsh players not released
Nomad_Wasp (IP Logged)
18 May, 2018 12:12
There's a strong argument to suggest that clause may go against World Rugby regs though.

 
Re: Welsh players not released
Raggs (IP Logged)
18 May, 2018 12:15
Quote:
Nomad_Wasp
There's a strong argument to suggest that clause may go against World Rugby regs though.

I'm talking about regulation 9.38 from world rugby. Basically it gives them a way to deny his release. However it's very specific, requires a particular letter to be signed and a named independent lawyer to advise the player of what he's signing. When nzru first said they might deny, they said it was nothing to do with world rugby regs which suggests they aren't using 9.38.

 
Re: Welsh players not released
Nomad_Wasp (IP Logged)
18 May, 2018 12:19
Quote:
Raggs
Quote:
Nomad_Wasp
There's a strong argument to suggest that clause may go against World Rugby regs though.

I'm talking about regulation 9.38 from world rugby. Basically it gives them a way to deny his release. However it's very specific, requires a particular letter to be signed and a named independent lawyer to advise the player of what he's signing. When nzru first said they might deny, they said it was nothing to do with world rugby regs which suggests they aren't using 9.38.

That's the one I'm talking about, clause 14 or something? The one that basically says only players called up for the All Blacks will be released - which is mostly counter to the WR regs

 
Re: Welsh players not released
Raggs (IP Logged)
18 May, 2018 12:32
Quote:
Nomad_Wasp
Quote:
Raggs
Quote:
Nomad_Wasp
There's a strong argument to suggest that clause may go against World Rugby regs though.

I'm talking about regulation 9.38 from world rugby. Basically it gives them a way to deny his release. However it's very specific, requires a particular letter to be signed and a named independent lawyer to advise the player of what he's signing. When nzru first said they might deny, they said it was nothing to do with world rugby regs which suggests they aren't using 9.38.

That's the one I'm talking about, clause 14 or something? The one that basically says only players called up for the All Blacks will be released - which is mostly counter to the WR regs

Schedule 3 is what it's called in NZ.

If schedule 3 is World Rugby regulation 9.38 then they can deny his release (according to world rugby's own regulations). However 9.38 is very specific (Shields qualifies) in terms of what is needed to be written, signed and how it needs to be done (independent lawyer etc), and the wording from the NZ rep makes it seem unlikely that their Schedule 3, is actually reg 9.38 (in my mind).


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