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Do we have to start paying £5 again...
Geoff P (IP Logged)
12 June, 2018 08:55
When we talk about Danny on here now he's gone west?

I would start both him and Dan on Saturday - we need more control at half back and though Ford showed his usual brilliant passing in attack, the match direction went awol after that great first 20 minutes.

And Dan versus Youngs...need I say more?

 
Re: Do we have to start paying £5 again...
jonnydeane (IP Logged)
12 June, 2018 10:32
Never going to happen.
Cipriani will only come in for Francis on the bench, more as FB cover but won't happen as Loz is probably ahead of him too, and Robson will only come in for Spencer and highly doubt Jones will not start youngs in all three tests



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/06/2018 10:34 by jonnydeane.

 
Re: Do we have to start paying £5 again...
neils (IP Logged)
12 June, 2018 10:36
Totally agree. Sadly for Danny I think he has fallen for an "Eddie".

 
Re: Do we have to start paying £5 again...
FishingWasp (IP Logged)
12 June, 2018 10:52
If EJ does not play Cips at FH, (even if he has an ulterior motive), then he's a bigger fool than I would have believed, IMHO. To not allow him or Dobbie for that matter, the opportunity to prove themselves in their best positions is a disservice to English rugby, particularly when the incumbents have hardly covered themselves in glory.
That said I will not be surprised if EJ makes no changes for next weekend.

 
Re: Do we have to start paying £5 again...
John Tee (IP Logged)
12 June, 2018 11:08
Jones needs to be careful... Players will know about Cips from the whole of the season, their team talks woukd concentrate on him. His performances would have been noticed and have now seen him up close in camp.
There may be ulterior motives for not writing him.in your position but if anyone is a team player and they perceive an injustices over selection, they may register it.
In extreme cases this can manifest into player mutinees
but it can also fester degrees of mistrust which is the start of losing players.
That is no good to anyone.
Conversely if Jones continues to show favouritism then that can have an adverse effect.
I don't think Jones can afford to alienate any player at this point with the team moral in a less than a robust state....after 5 bad losses.

 
Re: Do we have to start paying £5 again...
Geoff P (IP Logged)
12 June, 2018 11:51
It may prove to be wishful thinking, but the fact he selected neither Danny nor Dan for the opening test might imply he is intending to play them both together at a later point in the series.

That could mean the next test - which would be a good comparison with the incumbents, as it's also at altitude - but I think the chances of that may be small - especially if the captain pressurises Jones to keep playing his old mate to give another chance at getting a victory.

I rather think it might have been Jones' plan to win the first two tests and then give Danny and Dan a run out in the dead rubber.

 
Re: Do we have to start paying £5 again...
Wilberforce (IP Logged)
12 June, 2018 12:12
or lose the first two tests and then give the Dans a run.

 
Re: Do we have to start paying £5 again...
neils (IP Logged)
12 June, 2018 12:22
He needs to win the next one so will he take a chance on Cips who can be forced into flakey play. Robson a more likely starter or on bench as he more or less fits the Eddie mold.

 
Re: Do we have to start paying £5 again...
DoubleChampions (IP Logged)
12 June, 2018 14:51
Quote:
FishingWasp
If EJ does not play Cips at FH, (even if he has an ulterior motive), then he's a bigger fool than I would have believed, IMHO. To not allow him or Dobbie for that matter, the opportunity to prove themselves in their best positions is a disservice to English rugby, particularly when the incumbents have hardly covered themselves in glory.
That said I will not be surprised if EJ makes no changes for next weekend.

Saracen here - Cips should start at 10 this weekend - no question. The Lions axis worked with Faz at 12 when he had a strong attack and defensive 10 (Sexton) inside and Cips defence is miles better than Ford. Robson is another matter - he is more akin to Youngs than Spencer and that is the problem - if he does not start then why bring the same off the bench? No impact.

 
Re: Do we have to start paying £5 again...
Geoff P (IP Logged)
12 June, 2018 15:15
Quote:
DoubleChampions
Cips should start at 10 this weekend - no question. The Lions axis worked with Faz at 12 when he had a strong attack and defensive 10 (Sexton) inside and Cips defence is miles better than Ford.

Not sure we could honestly present Cips as one of the hardest-tackling 10s in the league (Sm6)

 
Re: Do we have to start paying £5 again...
DoubleChampions (IP Logged)
12 June, 2018 15:41
Quote:
Geoff P
Quote:
DoubleChampions
Cips should start at 10 this weekend - no question. The Lions axis worked with Faz at 12 when he had a strong attack and defensive 10 (Sexton) inside and Cips defence is miles better than Ford.

Not sure we could honestly present Cips as one of the hardest-tackling 10s in the league (Sm6)

In his younger days Cips was a fine tackler and with a World Cup place up for grabs? I think you would find he suddenly remembered!

 
Re: Do we have to start paying £5 again...
John Tee (IP Logged)
12 June, 2018 16:29
Not something that old forwards want to hear but do you really want your key playmaker trying to bone big forwards...?
No, you want them to stand their ground and get the man to the ground with assistance from a forward.
Wilko should have learnt that as if would have given a good few more years. Loz and Farrell should learn that trying to cream a man of 18 St plus will likely bust them at some point.
Big guys will run at 10's, of course, and as long as the 10 stands up to the tackle that should be OK...
Imo.

 
Re: Do we have to start paying £5 again...
Buzzboy (IP Logged)
12 June, 2018 17:09
“I would start both him and Dan on Saturday - we need more control at half back”

When I think of Danny, control is not the first word that springs to mind Geoff. Happy to see him on bench, which is the most I think we can hope for. Dan too. Spencer did nothing wrong when he came on...

 
Re: Do we have to start paying £5 again...
RossM (IP Logged)
12 June, 2018 17:27
Shaun Edwards once said that he never wanted his 10 buried at the bottom of a ruck but wanted him in place to take advantage of any possible turnover ball.

 
Re: Do we have to start paying £5 again...
DoubleChampions (IP Logged)
12 June, 2018 17:41
Then we can stick with Ford then on Edwards logic?

 
Re: Do we have to start paying £5 again...
StevieWasp (IP Logged)
12 June, 2018 18:59
Quote:
RossM
Shaun Edwards once said that he never wanted his 10 buried at the bottom of a ruck but wanted him in place to take advantage of any possible turnover ball.

But he said that when we had a back row including Paul Volley and eventually Tom Rees whereby turnovers were a very common occurrence

England have had until recently, Haskell and Robshaw

 
Re: Do we have to start paying £5 again...
Geoff P (IP Logged)
12 June, 2018 19:54
Quote:
Buzzboy
When I think of Danny, control is not the first word that springs to mind Geoff. Happy to see him on bench, which is the most I think we can hope for. Dan too. Spencer did nothing wrong when he came on...

Danny is an excellent tactical kicker when he needs to be. Not an aspect of his game Wasps style of play required a lot of, but the skill is there when it's needed. And yes, I was joking a bit earlier - Cips was clearly uncomfortable for a while after his injury with the physical side of the game, but he's a perfectly competent tackler these days.

 
Re: Do we have to start paying £5 again...
Trev's Big Tackle (IP Logged)
12 June, 2018 22:29
Shaun may have, perhaps, possibly, said that purely because Cips was our fly half and he was trying to deflect criticism aimed at our (then) playmaker. It is not something he has repeated while coaching Wales (unless I've missed it).

I remember King smashing then England captain Martin Corry from a Leicester scrum 5 yards from our try line. I doubt Shaun was too upset King wasn't in position for a would-be counter attack.

 
Re: Do we have to start paying £5 again...
cb@wasps (IP Logged)
13 June, 2018 08:39
I remember very clearly (and it still make me smile) Shaun saying we weren't going to target a certain Irish 10, well until the whistle blew anyway. Don't think anyone told Josh not to target him.

Just shows don't believe everything someone says.

 
Re: Do we have to start paying £5 again...
RossM (IP Logged)
13 June, 2018 08:51
One of my all time favourite clips.

Shaun Edwards on Frank Murphy

And as usual we made a complete bollux of the kick offsmiling smiley

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