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Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
HMRH (IP Logged)
28 November, 2017 06:51

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
HMRH (IP Logged)
28 November, 2017 06:58
Owen Slot in The Times also says both Worcester and Irish up for sale. I knew Irish were after increased investment but thatís different to a sale. Assuming Mr Slot is correct of course

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
waltham (IP Logged)
28 November, 2017 08:35
I guess it'd be understandable if all or a majority of LI's equity were to be potentially available in order to attract a major investor.

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
Narbia (IP Logged)
28 November, 2017 10:04
Quote:
HMRH
Owen Slot in The Times also says both Worcester and Irish up for sale. I knew Irish were after increased investment but thatís different to a sale. Assuming Mr Slot is correct of course

I'll bet no one is surprised by the alleged fact that Irish is up for sale.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 28/11/2017 10:15 by Narbia.

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
peejay (IP Logged)
28 November, 2017 11:02
Just our luck that Premiership is ring fenced the season after we go down.

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
cjm. (IP Logged)
28 November, 2017 12:30
I think ring fencing is probably the only way to get a somewhat fairer competition these days. The sums and the long term development needed require security. A minimum 10 year ring fencing is probably a good option even if I instinctively think side should have the chance to move up.

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
jimbo800 (IP Logged)
28 November, 2017 12:44
Itís got to happen, there isnít he money to keep the sexond tier competitive enough for them to challenge for promotion. I donít know what they are hoping will happen. All relegation is doing is creating a yo-yo effect. It makes it worse for the future of prem teams, not championship teams. Increase the league by one and drop an Anglo welsh game. Bring up Leeds, theyíre the only ones interested in promotion

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
Griff (IP Logged)
28 November, 2017 12:53
I think Bristol might disagree with that jimbo!

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
Fanski (IP Logged)
28 November, 2017 13:05
And ealing and Donny and Pirates

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
Steelman (IP Logged)
28 November, 2017 13:11
And Ealing who still have to play Bris at home.Ben Ward, their DOR,
Claims they have p/ship ambitions.They could be a big problem for us next year!

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
Steelman (IP Logged)
28 November, 2017 13:35
.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 28/11/2017 13:37 by Steelman.

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
jimbo800 (IP Logged)
28 November, 2017 13:37
I was counting Bristol as already promoted. There may be some who want it but are they anywhere close to achieving it? Do thyyou have the required grounds or finances? The super rugby league expanded when they needed to, the prem could as well.

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
CharlieG (IP Logged)
28 November, 2017 14:36
I can't help feeling that what is needed is stability to create a climate where the bottom teams can invest in players and the academy and medical/training facilities, etc.

I would welcome an increase in the AP to 14 teams (current 12 + Bris and Leeds). The AW Cup should be dropped to The AP should then be ring-fenced for (say) 3 or 4 years, after which there should be limited promotion/relegation available, such as:

1 Championship teams seeking promotion should clearly state this at the start of the season
2 Eligibility (stadium, admin, etc.) should be established by end of Jan
3 Team must finish top of the Championship
4 Playoff between Championship winner and AP bottom team to decide who plays in the AP next season
5 Once promoted, a Championship team will be guaranteed at least 2 seasons in the AP, to allow them to 'acclimatize' and stabilize.

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
Ajax Treesdown (IP Logged)
28 November, 2017 15:26
Quote:
Steelman
And Ealing who still have to play Bris at home.Ben Ward, their DOR,
Claims they have p/ship ambitions.They could be a big problem for us next year!

Are Ealing planning on installing 10,000 temporary seats or are they moving?

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
HonkyTonk (IP Logged)
28 November, 2017 15:50
Quote:
Ajax Treesdown
Quote:
Steelman
And Ealing who still have to play Bris at home.Ben Ward, their DOR,
Claims they have p/ship ambitions.They could be a big problem for us next year!

Are Ealing planning on installing 10,000 temporary seats or are they moving?

Thats is interesting. As well as being a Quins fan I also follow the London Broncos who ground share with Ealing. We are currently in the Championship, looking for promotion to Super League. It has been stated that should we get promotion there are plans in place for Ealing. What they are I have no idea although initially nothing would be permanent. Both sides are looking for promotion and as a result, I believe Ealing to have something up their sleeve re the ground

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
GHA (IP Logged)
28 November, 2017 16:13
Quote:
HonkyTonk
I believe Ealing to have something up their sleeve re the ground

Don't we all!

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
Steelman (IP Logged)
28 November, 2017 16:24
It could be a ground share with Qpr,Reading,or Quins,but I think you can forget the first although Wasps had a season there,or Reading if we are still here,although there is a ready made rugby crowd here,add Wasps disgruntleds.....which leaves Quins whom I think would find them a more comfortable fit than we were 15 years ago.

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
Aa545 (IP Logged)
28 November, 2017 17:40
Which begs the question IF Ealing are pushing for the premiership and have a new ground or ground share agreement in London where will the thousands of extra fans come from when we move back there?

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
JamboBris (IP Logged)
28 November, 2017 18:01
Without meaning to sound disrespectful, Ealing don't even get 1000 through the gates. How can they even think about the premiership with crowds that size?!

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
Margin_Walker (IP Logged)
28 November, 2017 18:14
Ealing's owner is a lot richer than ours to be fair. They would probably be more of a threat than Yorkshire if they did have premiership ambitions

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
cjm. (IP Logged)
28 November, 2017 20:59
And according to the guardian they are considering a 10 team premiership to reduce the number of games players play. So that wouldnt be good for us at all1

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
Narbia (IP Logged)
28 November, 2017 22:34
Quote:
cjm.
And according to the guardian they are considering a 10 team premiership to reduce the number of games players play. So that wouldnt be good for us at all1

Quote:
theGuardian
Premiership may be reduced to 10 teams in bid to avert player strike

Linky

(Sm19)

Actually, after the initial bad reaction. it's maybe not that grim. Still if I were Wuss or LI owner, I'd sell now.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 28/11/2017 22:41 by Narbia.

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
MikeL (IP Logged)
29 November, 2017 12:51
Maybe I haven't thought about it long enough but a 10-team Premiership and Championship with two up / two down sounds like a sensible proposal.

The current situation and increasingly wide gap between the Premiership and Championship is pretty broken (semi-pros vs internationals, and all that); ringfencing at 12 sees either a current Prem side or Bristol out in the cold, 13 is a (literally) odd number of teams in a league, 14 might work if the Anglo-Welsh is dropped but hardly helps player welfare issues.

As long as the funding gap is closed (doubtless the main problem) two 10-team leagues would make for a much more competitive Championship, two up / two down ought to cycle a fair number of sides through and still give ambitious sides like Ealing a decent shot at promotion. Interesting idea, anyway.

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
CharlieG (IP Logged)
29 November, 2017 15:38
Given that there seem to be several Championship teams with Premiership ambitions (see above comments0, perhaps a larger Premiership with 2 'conferences' and end of season playoffs to decide the final positions would sweeten the pill of ring-fencing.

I was thinking of something similar to the Pro-14 (or whatever it's called these days).

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
Steelman (IP Logged)
29 November, 2017 16:28
Strangely I wouldn't find that too terrible.maybe it can create opportunities for young homegrown players rather than retirement presents for Southern Hemisphere journeymen. I think we,ve absorbed much of what they offered, and have underused talent That can take it forward if Exeter are an example,toughening their lads up at Pirates.

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
PV (IP Logged)
29 November, 2017 17:27
Two leagues of 8 sides - home and away gives 14 matches, almost local derbies. Then top 4 from each play against each other in a knock out.

No relegation and 16 pro clubs with less games and more tribalism.

So one league could be

Newcastle
Leeds
Doncaster
Sale
Leicester
Northampton
Wasps
Worcester

The other

Gloucester
Exeter
Bath
Quins
Us
Bristol
Sarries
Ealing/Pirates

Then 1st plays 4th from different leagues
2nd vs 3rd

Times 2 as two leagues vs each other

Regional semi location and then final at HQ

Minimum 14 games, max 17

Oh and no Anglo Welsh, if we are to have a cup we should do the old school one that we won, have it just English sides.

So basically couple of games or 4 if you win it. Leave Europe as is.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 29/11/2017 17:38 by PV.

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
Steelman (IP Logged)
29 November, 2017 19:32
Perfect, next season sorted. That's how to make a decision
and we,re all happy,well done.next topic....are you incognito
Pres. Trump.?

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
PV (IP Logged)
29 November, 2017 22:24
Sorry?

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
harristocratt (IP Logged)
30 November, 2017 11:25
With less games where is the income to run the club going to come from?

Interview with Dai Young recently:

Interviewer: Dai have any of the players come to you and said that they will play for less money in return for playing less games?

Dai: Not so far.

The reduced games may be good for the players but what about the spectators?

Doncaster are currently 5th in the championship, Carnegie 6th and Pirates 7th.

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
CharlieG (IP Logged)
30 November, 2017 11:46
Quote:
harristocratt
With less games where is the income to run the club going to come from?

I think that that is the main sticking point. The players and the RFU want to limit the number of games to help with player welfare, while the clubs and the premiership want to keep (or even increase) the number of games to maximize income.

<pedantry alert>It should be 'fewer games', rather than 'less games'</alert>


Quote:
harristocratt
Doncaster are currently 5th in the championship, Carnegie 6th and Pirates 7th.

I think the discussion here is about clubs that have the facilities and the ambition to play in the premiership, rather than where they are in the table. You could argue that if they get Premiership status, then they will have the money to be able to attract the players to stay there, and the players will be prepared to move club to play in the premiership. Which does rather argue in favour of 'franchises' and ringfencing.

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
PV (IP Logged)
30 November, 2017 11:46
I picked those 5 in the championship but it could be a perm of 7 or 8 from there.

I donít think relegation/promotion is a sensible, sustainable financial option for rugby union. And as for enough games, the attendances arenít great anyway so maybe a focus on more local matches might improve attendances.

If you look at player welfare, I canít see how the current model is sustainable from that perspective either.

Also, all the current clubs in the prem only really survive from RFU contributions and major backers, not sure the gate receipts make that much impact

 
Re: Ring fenced Premiership back on the agenda
Foggy-Balla (IP Logged)
30 November, 2017 14:28
Quote:
Steelman
Perfect, next season sorted. That's how to make a decision
and we,re all happy,well done.next topic....are you incognito
Pres. Trump.?

Watch out if trying to grab them in the Tigers...



Faugh-a-Ballagh!

"Our prayer is 'God save Ireland' and pour blessings on her name!"

Vestigia Nulla Retrorsum


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