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We need to talk about David
Shawshank (IP Logged)
02 December, 2017 17:07
Does anyone have the slightest idea what must go through the head of a bloke who is captain of a struggling team, and is supposed to set an example to his teammates?

(Sm105)

 
Re: We need to talk about David
cjm. (IP Logged)
02 December, 2017 17:40
He's always been like that and has probably been emboldened due to his close ties to the amigos. He's a poundshop Dylan Hartley.

The biggest problem today was that the guy wasn't even close to having the ball. If he did I would see it as no more than a yellow cause I'm not convinced it was a clear hit to the head ( my stream was pixelly so... ) and the guy milked it.

As I said it the main thread he probably should have been moved on a couple of years ago to freshen up the squad, instead it is all a bit stale.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Aa545 (IP Logged)
02 December, 2017 17:57
Probably should have been moved on a couple of seasons ago , but he is a great bloke, made my boys day last season when he was a mascot, even recognised a few weeks later and came over and spoke to him.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
waltham (IP Logged)
02 December, 2017 18:22
Jeez! this is a guy who plays his heart out for us week after week. This season he's been THE goto crash ball servant (I presume because we have been missing Trev and/or another line breaking number 8. Poundland version of Hartley? how insulting is that for such a passionate LI player who I'm sure would have attracted and rejected offers from other clubs in the past and would probably be snapped up if on the market today...Hot headed? yes but that does go with his passion.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Margin_Walker (IP Logged)
02 December, 2017 18:24
Plenty of passionate players don't do that in games Waltham. Great servant for the club, but that's so poor, especially wearing the armband.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
cjm. (IP Logged)
02 December, 2017 18:29
Quote:
waltham
Jeez! this is a guy who plays his heart out for us week after week. This season he's been THE goto crash ball servant (I presume because we have been missing Trev and/or another line breaking number 8. Poundland version of Hartley? how insulting is that for such a passionate LI player who I'm sure would have attracted and rejected offers from other clubs in the past and would probably be snapped up if on the market today...Hot headed? yes but that does go with his passion.

I stand by it. It's not saying that he's a bad player but that he is a penalty, yellow and red card machine. Those are not a sign of passion just a lack of cool under pressure. I have never read a single thing about clubs chasing his signature so that is pure conjecture. We were competitive today until his rush of blood to the head.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
GHA (IP Logged)
02 December, 2017 19:41
A lot of people on this message board would show passion and play their heart our and give their all if they were picked to play next week. Paicey's been a great servant but he's had his day, in my opinion a little while ago. Jobs for the boys though...

sad smiley

 
Re: We need to talk about David
GHA (IP Logged)
02 December, 2017 19:43
The guy milked it? He failed his HIA too, obviously to really ram the point home (well after the red had been shown)

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Finno (IP Logged)
02 December, 2017 19:44
What really annoyed me about today was that, I thought we were as good as them,and it showed in the first half, apart from the cheap penalties given away, and the missed kicks both from the tee and the hand, and the final 'coup de grace' delivered by our experienced captain! (incredible..and I'm a huge Paicey fan, always have been, but he let himself be wound up today by the oppo)

The second half display was spirited...but if we had 15 on the pitch and were still in touch at half time, we might have got something out of the game!

I suppose all we'll hear about will be the spirited second half, instead of the rocket they all should get for 'effing up yet another opportunity to bag some points, yet again!

This loss,IMHO, had nothing to do with lack of skill or coaching...we just kept trying to push the self destruct button in the first half until Paicey succeeded,

So disappointing!!!!

 
Re: We need to talk about David
GHA (IP Logged)
02 December, 2017 19:48
They won the first half 20-8 and the second half against 14 men only 19-7

Which shows that they didn't take full advantage of the space, we put up a reasonable fight, and we definitely could've got something from the game had Paicey not been so utterly stupid

 
Re: We need to talk about David
cjm. (IP Logged)
02 December, 2017 19:54
Quote:
GHA
The guy milked it? He failed his HIA too, obviously to really ram the point home (well after the red had been shown)

I only saw it once and it looked like he was OK on the ground but staying there waiting for the ref to do something. My impression.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Margin_Walker (IP Logged)
02 December, 2017 20:09
Quote:
cjm.
Quote:
GHA
The guy milked it? He failed his HIA too, obviously to really ram the point home (well after the red had been shown)

I only saw it once and it looked like he was OK on the ground but staying there waiting for the ref to do something. My impression.

Nah, was a bad hit. Stayed down because he was rattled. No milking required anyway as it was a red all day

 
Re: We need to talk about David
cjm. (IP Logged)
02 December, 2017 20:18
Quote:
Margin_Walker
Quote:
cjm.
Quote:
GHA
The guy milked it? He failed his HIA too, obviously to really ram the point home (well after the red had been shown)

I only saw it once and it looked like he was OK on the ground but staying there waiting for the ref to do something. My impression.

Nah, was a bad hit. Stayed down because he was rattled. No milking required anyway as it was a red all day

I have already agreed it was a bad hit and a stupid hit. However, the reaction seemed a bit off that's all.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
St Jimmy (IP Logged)
02 December, 2017 20:43
Quote:
cjm.
Quote:
Margin_Walker
Quote:
cjm.
Quote:
GHA
The guy milked it? He failed his HIA too, obviously to really ram the point home (well after the red had been shown)

I only saw it once and it looked like he was OK on the ground but staying there waiting for the ref to do something. My impression.

Nah, was a bad hit. Stayed down because he was rattled. No milking required anyway as it was a red all day

I have already agreed it was a bad hit and a stupid hit. However, the reaction seemed a bit off that's all.

I just don't understand how you thought Heinz's reaction seemed a bit off. He took a shot to the head which clearly hurt him, hence the failed HIA.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Neale Harvey (IP Logged)
02 December, 2017 21:06
Players who take head knocks are advised by medics to remain still where they fall until they can be checked out in case there's something amiss in the neck or spine area. I doubt Heinz was milking it. Fair play to Nick Kennedy, he didn't mince his words after.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
olw131 (IP Logged)
02 December, 2017 22:35
Great response from Kendo in his post match interview, actually very refreshing not to have more of the same "we're going to keep improving as one big family" bollox and sees it how it is

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Florida (IP Logged)
02 December, 2017 23:10
That was one of the harshest, yet potentially best lessons Kendo could learn.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Finno (IP Logged)
02 December, 2017 23:37
Perhaps, now some real ass will be kicked, instead of the 'we like to concentrate on the
Positive' way of working that Kendo spoke about at the LISC AGM.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Florida (IP Logged)
02 December, 2017 23:41
Quote:
Finno
Perhaps, now some real ass will be kicked, instead of the 'we like to concentrate on the
Positive' way of working that Kendo spoke about at the LISC AGM.

Yup, I think that it might. It will be incidents like this that will put the steel in Kendo's spine. Our inexperienced coaching setup are getting experience

 
Re: We need to talk about David
GHA (IP Logged)
03 December, 2017 08:12
Hopefully this is the incident that does it, rather than one of them. We're gonna run out of games soon

 
Re: We need to talk about David
orsoncart (IP Logged)
03 December, 2017 11:22
Quote:
GHA
Hopefully this is the incident that does it, rather than one of them. We're gonna run out of games soon

I really hope so. I am no expert (completely acknowledged) but IMHO the kicking game and the consequences for knackering the defence, hasn't worked, and the odd selection of players who look out of form, just hasn't worked either.

To me, if we carry on as we are, relegation is a nailed on certainty. So, time to kick ass and only select the players who are really up for it. If that means bring some of the younger, less experienced players in and leaving some of the bigger names out, then so be it. If, as a consequence, we get hammered and go down, then ditto.

But, for sure, it isn't working right now

 
Re: We need to talk about David
John H (IP Logged)
03 December, 2017 12:11
I was quite proud of the boys at the end, the way they defended everything that Gloucester threw at them in the last ten minutes just to get another try and really humiliate us.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Derby Irish Fan (IP Logged)
03 December, 2017 14:24
1
I and my partner was at the game and my observations on it were as such, the red card was a stone walled one, you lead with you head at pace into the head of another player when that player is nowhere near the ball its red all day.
The interesting aspects, was they did not cope with our rolling maul, but got nowhere with theirs, yes they scored try's in the second half but only because we were stretched out wide. The 14 men and the subs where terrific in heart and body. Now we are thin with hookers but maybe a short term loan with help cover.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
SteveS (IP Logged)
03 December, 2017 14:34
It’s probably odds against us getting out of the mess we are in this season but still am pretty sure we are more likely to do so with Paice in the line-up

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Florida (IP Logged)
03 December, 2017 15:10
Quote:
SteveS
It’s probably odds against us getting out of the mess we are in this season but still am pretty sure we are more likely to do so with Paice in the line-up

There's a good interview in TRP this week with Fainga'a, sounds like he's itching to play and has experience not only being at a club bottom of the heap, but also in helping them rise up the table. Really looking forward to seeing what he can do.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
SirBurger (IP Logged)
03 December, 2017 15:19
Quote:
SteveS
It’s probably odds against us getting out of the mess we are in this season but still am pretty sure we are more likely to do so with Paice in the line-up

Yes, totally agree. He messed up big time, but we don't have the luxury of punishing him by leaving him out of the team once his suspension is served.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Steelman (IP Logged)
03 December, 2017 15:37
Quote:
SirBurger
Quote:
SteveS
It’s probably odds against us getting out of the mess we are in this season but still am pretty sure we are more likely to do so with Paice in the line-up

Yes, totally agree. He messed up big time, but we don't have the luxury of punishing him by leaving him out of the team once his suspension is served.

I'm with you,he lost it big time,but a true warrior.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
GHA (IP Logged)
03 December, 2017 18:29
I'm crossing my fingers for Fainga'a... We need skill more than just 'heart'

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Hugo.LI (IP Logged)
03 December, 2017 20:23
Yep fiangaa will hopefully be a bit of an upgrade on paicey! Against Worcester we have to put out a side similar to....
Reid
Faingaa
Hoskins
Paulo
Franco
Coman
Cowan
Treviranus
Steele
Bell
Lewington
Mulchrone
Fowlie
Cokanasiga
Marshall
Woolstencroft
Elrington
Franks
De chaves
Northcote-green
Meehan
Tonks
Williams

 
Re: We need to talk about David
GHA (IP Logged)
03 December, 2017 21:02
36 caps for Australia, you'd hope so

Hopefully he's here to play and make an impact rather than a last payday before retirement

The saiaviour

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Steelman (IP Logged)
04 December, 2017 01:43
Quote:
Hugo.LI
Yep fiangaa will hopefully be a bit of an upgrade on paicey! Against Worcester we have to put out a side similar to....
Reid
Faingaa
Hoskins
Paulo
Franco
Coman
Cowan
Treviranus
Steele
Bell
Lewington
Mulchrone
Fowlie
Cokanasiga
Marshalltt
Woolstencroft
Elrington
Franks
De chaves
Northcote-green
Meehan
Tonks
Williams

Reid walked off after 5 minutes, not right.
Fowlie and Bell had mares.
Tonks must start.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
04 December, 2017 09:21
I could be on my own here, but having seen just one angle of the incident, I didn't see anything that doesn't happen in every single game of rugby. Unfortunately David has a reputation that opposition players are trying to take advantage of and referees are picking on.

We had many hookers come and go over my 13 years as a London Irish supporter, but David has been the constant number one choice over the years.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
cjm. (IP Logged)
04 December, 2017 09:46
Quote:
Props are not stupid
I could be on my own here, but having seen just one angle of the incident, I didn't see anything that doesn't happen in every single game of rugby. Unfortunately David has a reputation that opposition players are trying to take advantage of and referees are picking on.
We had many hookers come and go over my 13 years as a London Irish supporter, but David has been the constant number one choice over the years.

Kind of takes the heat off my "milking it" comment.

However, I'm not sure what games you watch but I don't see it every game and I watch a lot. David earned his reputation and he simply lived up to it.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Florida (IP Logged)
04 December, 2017 09:50
Quote:
Steelman
Reid walked off after 5 minutes, not right.
Fowlie and Bell had mares.
Tonks must start.

I agree Bell had a nightmare, that was easy to see from his kicking. What did Fowlie do (or not do) for him to have had a nightmare?
Why must Tonks start and at what position? What games has he played that make you feel he should start?

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Steelman (IP Logged)
04 December, 2017 11:04
Quote:
Florida
Quote:
Steelman
Reid walked off after 5 minutes, not right.
Fowlie and Bell had mares.
Tonks must start.

I agree Bell had a nightmare, that was easy to see from his kicking. What did Fowlie do (or not do) for him to have had a nightmare?
Why must Tonks start and at what position? What games has he played that make you feel he should start?

Fowlie in his defence would not have been prepared to come on after 2 minutes.After 6 minutes he was supporting Lewy in the left wing breakaway and fumbled a not very good pass,no try.then after joes epic run, he threw a try scoring pass at Cowans ankles.Again in his defence,TB s defence had been so woeful that he may have been compromised in Burns first try, but Fowlie was as guilty as hell in Burns second try, and why was he not chasing him to the try line.No axe to grind,reporting wot I saw.
Bell needs to refocus, he doesn't have the defence for our needs at the moment.Marshall back to 15 , Tonks to 10, you can pick the rest!!
Anyway,wot do I know,I'm just a fan.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/12/2017 12:25 by Steelman.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Margin_Walker (IP Logged)
04 December, 2017 11:20
Bell's defence at 10 is much better than Marshall's. Tackle stats were by a distance the best if any of our backs on Saturday regardless of any error for the try (don't fancy watching that game back and re living it, so will take your word for it)

Not his best game at the weekend, but he plays in the big games for me until anyone else shows any evidence of being as good from the tee as him.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
GHA (IP Logged)
04 December, 2017 11:24
If the opposition player was milking it why did he bother failing his HIA considering Paicey had already been sent off?

(Sm164)

 
Re: We need to talk about David
cjm. (IP Logged)
04 December, 2017 12:15
Quote:
GHA
If the opposition player was milking it why did he bother failing his HIA considering Paicey had already been sent off?
(Sm164)

He's the Robert De Niro of rugby. Fully committed to the role on and off the field :-)

 
Re: We need to talk about David
bisach (IP Logged)
04 December, 2017 14:00
David knows what he did wrong, the Management know and his fellow players know.

And they'll tell him to his face, not write anonymous comments.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
GHA (IP Logged)
04 December, 2017 14:41
If they want to invite me in, I'll tell him to his face too

Cheers,

Steve

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Lebowski (IP Logged)
04 December, 2017 20:45
Glos fan here. I thought your boys did you proud. With ball in hand you looked very dangerous indeed, and the rolling maul was very effective. The defence in the last 5-10 minutes was outstanding - plenty to be optimistic about.

My own view of the red card was that Paice actually tried to pull out when he realised Heinz wasn’t getting the ball, hence the hands to the face (if it was malicious it would have been a forearm). It was very unfortunate but by the letter of the law it was a red card. If you knew Willi Heinz you’d know he would never milk anything. CJM you are way off the mark - just accept it and stop digging!

 
Re: We need to talk about David
cjm. (IP Logged)
04 December, 2017 21:27
Quote:
Lebowski
Glos fan here. I thought your boys did you proud. With ball in hand you looked very dangerous indeed, and the rolling maul was very effective. The defence in the last 5-10 minutes was outstanding - plenty to be optimistic about.
My own view of the red card was that Paice actually tried to pull out when he realised Heinz wasn’t getting the ball, hence the hands to the face (if it was malicious it would have been a forearm). It was very unfortunate but by the letter of the law it was a red card. If you knew Willi Heinz you’d know he would never milk anything. CJM you are way off the mark - just accept it and stop digging!

Never started digging, it's others that turned it into a thing. I had an impression, nothing more than that.

The theme of this thread seems to be don't criticise unless you have personally met the player and done a detailed assessment on his character. bullrocks to that. I didn't see any evidence that Paice tried to avoid the collision either, he went straight through.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/12/2017 21:27 by cjm..

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Hugo.LI (IP Logged)
04 December, 2017 21:57
Quote:
Lebowski
Glos fan here. I thought your boys did you proud. With ball in hand you looked very dangerous indeed, and the rolling maul was very effective. The defence in the last 5-10 minutes was outstanding - plenty to be optimistic about.
My own view of the red card was that Paice actually tried to pull out when he realised Heinz wasn’t getting the ball, hence the hands to the face (if it was malicious it would have been a forearm). It was very unfortunate but by the letter of the law it was a red card. If you knew Willi Heinz you’d know he would never milk anything. CJM you are way off the mark - just accept it and stop digging!

As someone who didn't make it to the game on Saturday it's nice to hear some positive feedback, makes a change to the doom and gloom on here all the time!

Brilliant progress from Gloucester this year, would love it if they won the whole thing just to spice it up a bit! Good luck and see you back at the madstad!

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Lebowski (IP Logged)
05 December, 2017 10:44
Cheers Hugo. Good luck to you guys too - long way to go!

 
Re: We need to talk about David
DrV'sHairyCraic (IP Logged)
05 December, 2017 15:42
I've just hears on the BBC Rugby Union podcast that Paice has had more cards than any other player in the Premiership. Ok, he's been around longer than most but that's not a record to be proud of.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Florida (IP Logged)
05 December, 2017 17:43
Quote:
DrV'sHairyCraic
I've just hears on the BBC Rugby Union podcast that Paice has had more cards than any other player in the Premiership. Ok, he's been around longer than most but that's not a record to be proud of.

I just hopped on statbunker to take a look, 18 yellows and 2 reds. Then haf a quick think about who could be close to that and had a look at Hartley; 8 yellows, 1 red, played 2 years less.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Margin_Walker (IP Logged)
05 December, 2017 18:03
I bet Hartley has infinitely more ban time though. Paice is mainly persistent niggly professional fouls barring the two reds.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Aa545 (IP Logged)
05 December, 2017 18:23
What records do you hold?
Certainly something to tell the grandkids about and gets him into the record books.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Xprop (IP Logged)
05 December, 2017 18:25
That's 3 reds now. IIRC one for saying something inappropriate to sir after getting a yellow and one for fighting with Jim Hamilton after they'd been given yellows. Only Julian White had more - 5.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Margin_Walker (IP Logged)
05 December, 2017 18:52
Quote:
Xprop
That's 3 reds now. IIRC one for saying something inappropriate to sir after getting a yellow and one for fighting with Jim Hamilton after they'd been given yellows. Only Julian White had more - 5.

Ah yes. Forgot about the middle one. Paice has often been one to double down on stupidity.

Some going by Julian considering a fair chunk of his career spanned a slightly more lenient time.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Shawshank (IP Logged)
05 December, 2017 19:00
He's up before the Beak tonight.

6-7 weeks is my guess, as there is very little mitigation available.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Steelman (IP Logged)
05 December, 2017 19:15
I think 1 week only,cause in his favour Heinz is a chippy little windup.
Not good but understandable,shocked by the lack of support!

 
Re: We need to talk about David
GHA (IP Logged)
05 December, 2017 20:06
Infinitely more ban time?

winking smiley

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Exile_Dave (IP Logged)
05 December, 2017 21:14
Any news on Paicey yet?



I'd rather be a Paddy then a Quin!!

C'mon the boys in Green!!

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Steelman (IP Logged)
05 December, 2017 21:37
No tea, still on the naughty stair...

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Florida (IP Logged)
05 December, 2017 22:55
Should appear on here at some point

[www.englandrugby.com]

 
Re: We need to talk about David
DrV'sHairyCraic (IP Logged)
06 December, 2017 11:25
Could it have been postponed for some reason?

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Mark W-J (IP Logged)
06 December, 2017 12:02
They've probably been stuck on the section headed 'Player’s status as an offender of the Laws of the game 19.11.10(a)' for the last 16 hours. (Sm100)

 
Re: We need to talk about David
RodB (IP Logged)
06 December, 2017 13:20
Still taking "previous" into account?

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Exile_Dave (IP Logged)
06 December, 2017 13:58
As the saying goes “No news is Good news”.



I'd rather be a Paddy then a Quin!!

C'mon the boys in Green!!

 
Re: We need to talk about David
LI Bohemian (IP Logged)
06 December, 2017 14:14
I heard that the verdict was delayed as the black cap is in the wash.



Bohemiansingles@yahoo.com
631-563-9892

 
Re: We need to talk about David
paddym (IP Logged)
06 December, 2017 16:26
Quote:
Florida
Should appear on here at some point
[www.englandrugby.com]

May be waiting on this at site, hasn’t been updated for about 3/4 weeks!!

 
Re: We need to talk about David
DrV'sHairyCraic (IP Logged)
06 December, 2017 16:39
[www.premiershiprugby.com]

Is normally up to date. Nothing yet though

 
Re: We need to talk about David
paddym (IP Logged)
06 December, 2017 18:59
Quote:
DrV'sHairyCraic
https://www.premiershiprugby.com/aviva-premiership-rugby-news/
Is normally up to date. Nothing yet though

Wild Geese hearing from three weeks ago not up yet as aren't several others from Nat2 and Nat1.

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Hugo.LI (IP Logged)
06 December, 2017 20:29
5 weeks for paicey

 
Re: We need to talk about David
paddym (IP Logged)
06 December, 2017 20:37
Quote:
paddym
Quote:
DrV'sHairyCraic
https://www.premiershiprugby.com/aviva-premiership-rugby-news/
Is normally up to date. Nothing yet though

Wild Geese hearing from three weeks ago not up yet as aren't several others from Nat2 and Nat1.

I take that back, Geese hearing result now up there!

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Florida (IP Logged)
06 December, 2017 21:52
Quote:
Hugo.LI
5 weeks for paicey

I read that as "5 weeks for piracy"

Available 9th Jan.

[www.englandrugby.com]

 
Re: We need to talk about David
HMRH (IP Logged)
07 December, 2017 22:14
5 weeks not that bad considering his record

 
Re: We need to talk about David
HMRH (IP Logged)
07 December, 2017 22:15
Adjust that as his record more yellows as opposed to foul play

 
Re: We need to talk about David
Foggy-Balla (IP Logged)
08 December, 2017 07:23
Quote:
Florida
Quote:
Hugo.LI
5 weeks for paicey

I read that as "5 weeks for piracy"

Available 9th Jan.

[www.englandrugby.com]

Ah-Haaaarrr!



Faugh-a-Ballagh!

"Our prayer is 'God save Ireland' and pour blessings on her name!"

Vestigia Nulla Retrorsum


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