rugbyunion
Latest News:

A philosophical post...
Blarney (IP Logged)
23 December, 2017 09:01
I have now come to terms with the fact that we will be relegated again. If a miracle occurs and we stay up then that will be amazing, but I have accepted our probable fate.

Taking that has fact allows one to take a longer term (and slightly more positive?) view of things. So here are some thoughts:

1) I thought relegation would be the end of this club. But we survived and bounced back. No reason why we couldnít do so again.

2) Recruitment next year could be better planned now the play-offs are gone.

3) We will lose Lewi. Itís gutting but it happens and we will find other wingers.

4) Our focus needs to be on building our current and future academy players into the core of a team. Our academy remains one of the best for churning out talent and we must take full advantage.

5) Now, the big question. I would stick with Kennedy for this season and next. Heís still learning and that has potentially cost us in the short term, as these things often do. But I think he could do a good job for us in the future. The one I would be looking at replacing (sadly) is Dodge. Whilst I think Kennedy has a future and the defence under Dec has actually got better, weíve seen no sign of improvement in attack.

Finally, think about this. It took Newcastle several years and being relegated twice before they went from an unfashionable, underfunded and underperforming club (sound familiar?) to where they are now. Crucially, they gave Richards time.

 
Re: A philosophical post...
Shawshank (IP Logged)
23 December, 2017 09:21
Blarney, I do admire your optimism but I'm not sure that the current owners can continue to fund another cycle of relegation and hopeful promotion.

I'm not sure I agree about Dec - anyone who saw the grisly away loss to Edinburgh will know that there has been no cultural improvement in the defence all season.

In many ways the only bloke in management who can feel reasonably happy is Skivs, as the forwards generally give a decent account of themselves (with one exception).

But clearly our worst aspect has been our attack, which is a shambolic mess.

 
Re: A philosophical post...
Steelman (IP Logged)
23 December, 2017 09:31
[quote Shawshank]Blarney, I do admire your optimism but I'm not sure that the current owners can continue to fund another cycle of relegation and hopeful promotion.

I'm not sure I agree about Dec - anyone who saw the grisly away loss to Edinburgh will know that there has been no cultural improvement in the defence all season.

In many ways the only bloke in management who can feel reasonably happy is Skivs, as the forwards generally give a decent account of themselves (with one exception).

But clearly our worst aspect has been our attack, which is a shambolic mess.[/quote

Agreed, that's my view too.

 
Re: A philosophical post...
waltham (IP Logged)
23 December, 2017 09:46
Could/would we potentially lose potential academy stars if we are relegated again and become a yo-yo club? Would parents simply avoid our territory?

 
Re: A philosophical post...
Aa545 (IP Logged)
23 December, 2017 09:47
Imo another relegation could wel be the end of the club .
Crowds are going to drop even further meaning less money coming in and with no one willing to fund further losses where will the money come from?
As for the coaches they all need to go, even in the championship bar the odd game we looked far from convincing and were predictable even though I did enjoy winning promotion and I think we have gone backwards. Injuries havenít helped and we could be a different position without them, but we seem clueless which I feel is down to the coaching.

 
Re: A philosophical post...
peejay (IP Logged)
23 December, 2017 11:12
For me it's over this year and may well be the end of top class rugby for the Irish. What frustrates me the most is the inability of the coaching staff to make changes. Terry Leahy's book needs a read - to succeed you must first acknowledge mistakes and then effect changes.
Afraid 'hill rather than mountain to climb' as NK said is perfect understatement.o

 
Re: A philosophical post...
x_ile (IP Logged)
23 December, 2017 15:11
Harking back to the Times article from earlier this week which implied that Irish have suffered an almost unprecedented injury list.

Does anyone have a list of LI's probable starters who are unavailable due to everyday rugby injuries, surgery complications (Nalaga) or non rugby related illness (Dawidiuk)?

I seem to recall that, when LI were relegated, they suffered another unfortunate run of injuries.

As I observed elsewhere, this is the last thing a newly promoted team needs since life is going to be hard enough anyway.

 
Re: A philosophical post...
Finno (IP Logged)
23 December, 2017 21:28
Quote:
x_ile
Harking back to the Times article from earlier this week which implied that Irish have suffered an almost unprecedented injury list.
Does anyone have a list of LI's probable starters who are unavailable due to everyday rugby injuries, surgery complications (Nalaga) or non rugby related illness (Dawidiuk)?

I seem to recall that, when LI were relegated, they suffered another unfortunate run of injuries.

As I observed elsewhere, this is the last thing a newly promoted team needs since life is going to be hard enough anyway.

Do you honestly believe thatís the problem?? Mmmm!!!

 
Re: A philosophical post...
x_ile (IP Logged)
24 December, 2017 12:04
Quote:
Finno
Quote:
x_ile
Harking back to the Times article from earlier this week which implied that Irish have suffered an almost unprecedented injury list.
Does anyone have a list of LI's probable starters who are unavailable due to everyday rugby injuries, surgery complications (Nalaga) or non rugby related illness (Dawidiuk)?

I seem to recall that, when LI were relegated, they suffered another unfortunate run of injuries.

As I observed elsewhere, this is the last thing a newly promoted team needs since life is going to be hard enough anyway.

Do you honestly believe thatís the problem?? Mmmm!!!


Not entirely but a long injury list most certainly doesn't help when a club lacks the financial muscle to support the backup necessary in such circumstances.

 
Re: A philosophical post...
GHA (IP Logged)
24 December, 2017 12:36
Poor recruitment doesn't help either

 
Re: A philosophical post...
Heaf (IP Logged)
24 December, 2017 13:09
And the stupid playoffs didn't help recruitment ...

 
Re: A philosophical post...
joshhbartholomew (IP Logged)
24 December, 2017 15:01
Our recruitment was actually very strong given the playoffs and how badly other promoted teams have recruited - sadly lots of the signings have taken time to adapt, and been injured for a while

 
Re: A philosophical post...
cjm. (IP Logged)
24 December, 2017 17:09
Guarantee a strong and experienced DoR would have got much more out of the current players. Injuries or no injuries. Coventry was effectively new to the DoR role too, so a long period of no battle hardened leader has left us adrift.

Not to go on too much about Cockerill but his conviction was all over Edinburgh's win over a complacent Glasgow even though Edinburgh played with 14 men for 75 minutes.

 
Re: A philosophical post...
SirBurger (IP Logged)
24 December, 2017 17:52
Why do people think Cockerill would have had any interest in joining us?

 
Re: A philosophical post...
cjm. (IP Logged)
24 December, 2017 18:29
Quote:
SirBurger
Why do people think Cockerill would have had any interest in joining us?

He may or may not have, who knows, not the point. The point is about experience and discipline that someone like him brings as opposed to 3 seasons of none of that. When you are struggling the last thing you need are weak and inexperienced leaders.

 
Re: A philosophical post...
SteveS (IP Logged)
25 December, 2017 17:10
Quote:
Shawshank
In many ways the only bloke in management who can feel reasonably happy is Skivs, as the forwards generally give a decent account of themselves (with one exception).
But clearly our worst aspect has been our attack, which is a shambolic mess.

Not sure the 120+ year history of forwards deciding who wins rugby matches has been overturned. They look underpowered, lacking any real physicality and generally make no impression on any gain line

 
Re: A philosophical post...
waltham (IP Logged)
26 December, 2017 00:14
Quote:
GHA
Poor recruitment doesn't help either

What exactly do you mean by this??

 
Re: A philosophical post...
GHA (IP Logged)
26 December, 2017 01:44
Injury list bad, recruitment badder

 
Re: A philosophical post...
Aa545 (IP Logged)
26 December, 2017 09:04
Quote:
waltham
Quote:
GHA
Poor recruitment doesn't help either

What exactly do you mean by this??
Would think it was obvious, some of the recruitment has been awful and the players simply not good enough.

 
Re: A philosophical post...
HMRH (IP Logged)
26 December, 2017 19:08
Going to call that as BS - the counter argument assumes there was a line of better players available and ďweĒ chose poorly. Hungry young players on the up ainít coming here for a while so itís down to academy and some seasoned recruits.

Maybe others have a few of the players we didnít sign when we could have? Then again maybe not

Weíve been poor at times, no doubt, but bad recruitment? Not so sure except for the obvious fact we recruited players and are bottom of the league but how could it have been better?

 
Re: A philosophical post...
olw131 (IP Logged)
26 December, 2017 19:29
Quote:
HMRH
Going to call that as BS - the counter argument assumes there was a line of better players available and ďweĒ chose poorly. Hungry young players on the up ainít coming here for a while so itís down to academy and some seasoned recruits.
Maybe others have a few of the players we didnít sign when we could have? Then again maybe not

Weíve been poor at times, no doubt, but bad recruitment? Not so sure except for the obvious fact we recruited players and are bottom of the league but how could it have been better?

Yep - I agree.

We were certain to go down and still recruited Hoskins, Hobbs-Awoyemi, De Chaves, Northcote-Green, Coman, McNally, Marshall, Bell... all of whom have proved to be key players. Porecki and Lloyd are extremely able deputies and do not let us down when they play.

Then, when it wasn't certain we'd go back up, we signed Reid, FVDM and Paulo, who have proved themselves to be key players, plus Fainga'a, Saulo and Nalaga who, if fit, have potential to be key players for us - all have played for winning teams and at international level.

I would say that our recruitment has actually been extremely shrewd given the circumstances of our past mismanagement and our financial restrictions. Signings like Hoskins, DHA, De Chaves and McNally have proved to be 'hidden' gems who will be mainstays of top-level teams, whether us or others, in the future.

It's the perennial failure of getting the team to perform to the sum of its parts which kills us. OK, we have a few mercenaries at the end of their careers, but that is the exception rather tha the norm.

 
Re: A philosophical post...
27 December, 2017 18:54
I don't think the recruitment has been too bad - I actually think we have a quality playing squad.

For me, it's the coaching that has let us down this season. Are all of the coaches fulfilling their roles? If the purpose of employing someone is to improve an element of the team and it's not working surely it's obvious changes are required...

I obviously don't wish for the coaching team to lose their jobs but maybe we could bring in some more experienced coaches who will work with the current crop to tighten things up, especially in defence.

 
Re: A philosophical post...
Margin_Walker (IP Logged)
27 December, 2017 19:29
We really don't have a quality playing squad for this league. For a number of reasons (primarily resources) we are shopping for the odd bargain that comes good and by that measure the recruitment has just been okay.

Reasons for it are understandable, but I can't remember the last time we signed a player that the other team was keen to keep. That's just the reality of where we are as a club. We are relying on uncovering a few more Lewingtons than we actually have and a few players kicking on a bit more than the likes of TBC, Williams, Smallbone, Palf and Fowlie have so far



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 27/12/2017 19:55 by Margin_Walker.

 
Re: A philosophical post...
Narbia (IP Logged)
27 December, 2017 23:04
Re : the recruitment policy and its effect.

We just don't have the resources or stature to pick and choose in whatever market. That's the sad reality.

FWIW, I think the club have been fairly astute under the circumstances.

The brutal fact is we are a feeder club to those of greater means.
Not least Lewington to Sarries, but the train-load to Bath in times past.

We've hired some real good 'uns who were 4th choices at Tigers.

But it's wishful thinking that you can out-recruit the market, without very deep pockets.

 
Re: A philosophical post...
HeavyCream (IP Logged)
28 December, 2017 07:40
Personally I think weíre done. The bottom line is without a home to call our own and the community, culture and identity that comes with it, we will NEVER pull in enough fans/funds to remain competitive in this league. We wonít survive financially in the lower leagues and a move to a new ground having been demoted wonít draw in any new fans. We are a team who has been in limbo for what feels like a lifetime now and although it pains me to think it, I can only see bankruptcy in the next couple of years. Sorry to be so miserable.


Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.
We record all IP addresses on the Sportnetwork message boards which may be required by the authorities in case of defamatory or abusive comment. We seek to monitor the Message Boards at regular intervals. We do not associate Sportnetwork with any of the comments and do not take responsibility for any statements or opinions expressed on the Message Boards. If you have any cause for concern over any material posted here please let us know as soon as possible by e-mailing abuse@sportnetwork.net
 
 

Who is online?

Total users online:  

Most users online:  

Users on this site:  

Where are they?