[www.espnscrum.com]

As CR says "innocent until proven guilty", but beats me why any top level professional sportsman would behave like that - unless you are as unhinged as Mike Tyson

Or Danny Grewcock! But seriously, if someone has hooked their fingers in your mouth and is pulling, I can see the temptation!

If its a finger how can you prove its deliberate and what the hell was ferris doing putting his finger in someones mouth, got what he deserved if you ask me.

Hmm. Tough one.

On one hand we do have a player or two with reputations of unsavoury behaviour.

On the other hand, Ferris seems to go looking for this stuff.

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O Fortuna, velut luna statu variabilis,
semper crescis aut decrescis

Was Ferris not in trouble a few seasons back for gouging or something similar?

Pots and kettles...............

Quote:

HSBC
If its a finger how can you prove its deliberate and what the hell was ferris doing putting his finger in someones mouth, got what he deserved if you ask me.

Seconded. If there was a bite (and ESPN has said that the Beeb doesn't believe there's anything conclusive on tape), then the citing commission needs to look at how and why Ferris's fingers got within biting range as well.

Sounds like a case for the CSI

When I was at school, I played in a game at loosehead, where my opposing player bound underneath and had his hand on my face.
I warned him - he did it again...I got him!!! I didn't draw blood, but he didn't do it to me again.

Quote:

Samquin
Was Ferris not in trouble a few seasons back for gouging or something similar?
Pots and kettles...............

I don't think so, though he did get into trouble with the law for some violence.

He is usually the target of stamps, gouges, etc. It's very odd - he obviously upsets people.

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Quote:

Jammy Git

Quote:

Samquin
Was Ferris not in trouble a few seasons back for gouging or something similar?
Pots and kettles...............

I don't think so, though he did get into trouble with the law for some violence.

He is usually the target of stamps, gouges, etc. It's very odd - he obviously upsets people.

You are right. Having checked he was the target of an alleged eye gouging from a couple of French players.

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Samquin

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Jammy Git

Quote:

Samquin
Was Ferris not in trouble a few seasons back for gouging or something similar?
Pots and kettles...............

I don't think so, though he did get into trouble with the law for some violence.

He is usually the target of stamps, gouges, etc. It's very odd - he obviously upsets people.

You are right. Having checked he was the target of an alleged eye gouging from a couple of French players.

Um, surely it's not "alleged" as David Atoub and Julian Dupuy both served bans for it?

Quote:

Jammy Git
Hmm. Tough one.
On one hand we do have a player or two with reputations of unsavoury behaviour.

On the other hand, Ferris seems to go looking for this stuff.

-On the other hand, only 3 fingers now.



Sorry, couldn't resist it. Coat, getting.

there was nothing alleged about it. He was gouged a few times, and dupuy and attoub both were banned. Attoub got over a year's ban. There's this thing caled google lads- its really really easy to use. It took 6 post for you to even correct each other, a wealth of information literally at your finger tips, and there's five of you bizarrely ruminating on the 'possible' past gouging incident. Berks.

Someone above there also said he 'obviously upsets people'....what an irrelevant thing to say and imply that he deserves to be bitten possibly....

Ferris is the hardest hitting 6 in world rugby, thats why oppositions dont like him. He was as good as the welsh mutants for player of the tournament. I look forward to seeing who is accused, because theres one man in that england team that needs no introduction as a man who gets biting filty. Looking forward to the inquiry,



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 18/03/2012 21:04 by Oldoneeye.

Quote:

Oldoneeye
there was nothing alleged about it. He was gouged a few times, and dupuy and attoub both were banned. Attoub got over a year's ban. There's this thing caled google lads- its really really easy to use. It took 6 post for you to even correct each other, a wealth of information literally at your finger tips, and there's five of you bizarrely ruminating on the 'possible' past gouging incident. Berks.
Someone above there also said he 'obviously upsets people'....what an irrelevant thing to say and imply that he deserves to be bitten possibly....

Ferris is the hardest hitting 6 in world rugby, thats why oppositions dont like him. He was as good as the welsh mutants for player of the tournament. I look forward to seeing who is accused, because theres one man in that england team that needs no introduction as a man who gets biting filty. Looking forward to the inquiry,

Must be a "plastic paddy"...they come out of their trolling cupbards at this time of year!!

Quote:

Oldoneeye
Ferris is the hardest hitting 6 in world rugby, thats why oppositions dont like him. He was as good as the welsh mutants for player of the tournament. I look forward to seeing who is accused, because theres one man in that england team that needs no introduction as a man who gets biting filty. Looking forward to the inquiry,

Uh-huh. Strange that the other hard-hitting 6s don't get as much attention. And given that Ferris was pretty anonymous during the England game I doubt it was the sheer force of his raw talent that provoked it...

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O Fortuna, velut luna statu variabilis,
semper crescis aut decrescis

He has a point, I remember Australia targeting Rich Hill in the Lions simply because he was good.

Having said that, biting of fingers is an odd one, as there is always the question raised of why was his finger anywhere near a mouth.

In my mind it just make Ferris arrogant and a bad loser!

Just had another look at this. In the 27th minute Ferris has his hands on Hartley's neck/face in a ruck, when he comes out he's shaking his hand a bit.

As an Englishman I can hardly claim to be totally unbiased but it does appear as though Ferris was trying a bit of nastiness and got a nip for his efforts.

Perhaps he was testing if Hartley had some jam around his mouth? Name of a very good jam-making family after all......

Just to add a little context.....


[www.bbc.co.uk]

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Adventure before Dementia!

Quote:

Jammy Git

Quote:

Oldoneeye
Ferris is the hardest hitting 6 in world rugby, thats why oppositions dont like him. He was as good as the welsh mutants for player of the tournament. I look forward to seeing who is accused, because theres one man in that england team that needs no introduction as a man who gets biting filty. Looking forward to the inquiry,

Uh-huh. Strange that the other hard-hitting 6s don't get as much attention. And given that Ferris was pretty anonymous during the England game I doubt it was the sheer force of his raw talent that provoked it...

look im not gonna get into a subjective debate on a layers abilities, but what i will say is, if you dont rate him as one of the best players in Europe right now then you really haven't a clue abotu the game of rugby.

And Dan Carter would have had a hell of a time standing out playing for Ireland last saturday. No scrum in the rain= case closed. Using that as your only examle further shows you probably havent a clue. But hey, you stay in your Quins prism, and look forward to your likely beating in the semis....and for 100% certain in the final should you be lucky enough to progress. No league for you this year, no chance.

Quote:

deadlyfrom5yardsout
Just to add a little context.....

[www.bbc.co.uk]

how is that context to hartley or whoever biting him?

Idiot.

What is a 'layers abilities?'

And you can't spell the words about and example.

Silly boy.

Quote:

PickledPelican

Quote:

Oldoneeye
there was nothing alleged about it. He was gouged a few times, and dupuy and attoub both were banned. Attoub got over a year's ban. There's this thing caled google lads- its really really easy to use. It took 6 post for you to even correct each other, a wealth of information literally at your finger tips, and there's five of you bizarrely ruminating on the 'possible' past gouging incident. Berks.
Someone above there also said he 'obviously upsets people'....what an irrelevant thing to say and imply that he deserves to be bitten possibly....

Ferris is the hardest hitting 6 in world rugby, thats why oppositions dont like him. He was as good as the welsh mutants for player of the tournament. I look forward to seeing who is accused, because theres one man in that england team that needs no introduction as a man who gets biting filty. Looking forward to the inquiry,

Must be a "plastic paddy"...they come out of their trolling cupbards at this time of year!!

Let me get this straight....I'm a troll because i point out that 5 posters continue to speculate on Ferris getting gouged (allegedly...etc) when the answer is in their search bars on the top right of their screen?? You're all either really really daft, or living in that wonderful place called 'denial'. Did you think the citing commissioner was going to be reading the Quins boards before he made his decision??

That's not trolling dude, that's social commentary. Idiocy, or sticking your fingers in your ears and shouting la la la over and over again really loudly. You decide.

Quote:

Nicksb
What is a 'layers abilities?'
And you can't spell the words about and example.

Silly boy.

There's a couple of letters broken on my keyboard, notably the P. My sincerest apologies oh wise one. You might consider using parentheses the next time you want to place emphasis on two words within a sentence.

@sshole.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 19/03/2012 14:10 by Oldoneeye.

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Oldoneeye

Quote:

Jammy Git

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Oldoneeye
Ferris is the hardest hitting 6 in world rugby, thats why oppositions dont like him. He was as good as the welsh mutants for player of the tournament. I look forward to seeing who is accused, because theres one man in that england team that needs no introduction as a man who gets biting filty. Looking forward to the inquiry,

Uh-huh. Strange that the other hard-hitting 6s don't get as much attention. And given that Ferris was pretty anonymous during the England game I doubt it was the sheer force of his raw talent that provoked it...

look im not gonna get into a subjective debate on a layers abilities, but what i will say is, if you dont rate him as one of the best players in Europe right now then you really haven't a clue abotu the game of rugby.

And Dan Carter would have had a hell of a time standing out playing for Ireland last saturday. No scrum in the rain= case closed. Using that as your only examle further shows you probably havent a clue. But hey, you stay in your Quins prism, and look forward to your likely beating in the semis....and for 100% certain in the final should you be lucky enough to progress. No league for you this year, no chance.

That's a pathetic post.

1) I mentioned the England game as an example because it's the game where the incident occurred. Trying to take a player out of the game when he's already having little effect isn't much of a plan.

2) I said nothing about not rating him. I think you need to stop going overboard about him. There's plenty of excellent players in world rugby who don't attract anywhere near as much attention. Some of them - like Jerome Kaino or Juan Smith - are better players.

Basically your argument boils down to "OMG FERRIS IS THE BEST".

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O Fortuna, velut luna statu variabilis,
semper crescis aut decrescis



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 19/03/2012 14:27 by Jammy Git.

Sorry to trouble you again. It's "idiot" speaking. Not wishing to incur your wonderfully loquacious and erudite ire again, but who was talking about Ferris getting gouged?

Or was that a Freudian slip?

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Adventure before Dementia!

Oldoneeye, no need to get personal. It's not my fault that you're not intelligent enough to spell correctly.

Your punctuation and grammar aren't up to much either.

Silly boy.

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Jammy Git

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Oldoneeye

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Jammy Git

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Oldoneeye
Ferris is the hardest hitting 6 in world rugby, thats why oppositions dont like him. He was as good as the welsh mutants for player of the tournament. I look forward to seeing who is accused, because theres one man in that england team that needs no introduction as a man who gets biting filty. Looking forward to the inquiry,

Uh-huh. Strange that the other hard-hitting 6s don't get as much attention. And given that Ferris was pretty anonymous during the England game I doubt it was the sheer force of his raw talent that provoked it...

look im not gonna get into a subjective debate on a layers abilities, but what i will say is, if you dont rate him as one of the best players in Europe right now then you really haven't a clue abotu the game of rugby.

And Dan Carter would have had a hell of a time standing out playing for Ireland last saturday. No scrum in the rain= case closed. Using that as your only examle further shows you probably havent a clue. But hey, you stay in your Quins prism, and look forward to your likely beating in the semis....and for 100% certain in the final should you be lucky enough to progress. No league for you this year, no chance.

That's a pathetic post.

1) I mentioned the England game as an example because it's the game where the incident occurred. Trying to take a player out of the game when he's already having little effect isn't much of a plan.

2) I said nothing about not rating him. I think you need to stop going overboard about him. There's plenty of excellent players in world rugby who don't attract anywhere near as much attention. Some of them - like Jerome Kaino or Juan Smith - are better players.

Basically your argument boils down to "OMG FERRIS IS THE BEST".

Sorry, but you're wrong. His argument is "OMG FERRIS IS THE BEST. QUINS WON'T WIN ANYTHING THIS YEAR!!!1!!!"

I didn't do justice to the subtleties of his post

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O Fortuna, velut luna statu variabilis,
semper crescis aut decrescis

i really really love the insight i'm getting into the Quins fans right now. Great stuff all, bravo.

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Adventure before Dementia!

Quote:

Oldoneeye
i really really love the insight i'm getting into the Quins fans right now. Great stuff all, bravo.

What do you expect coming on to our board with several patronising posts and labelling us "idiots, berks and @ssholes?"
Perhaps if you were to engage us in debate in a more friendly tone you might find that we reciprocate.

Quote:

Oldoneeye
i really really love the insight i'm getting into the Quins fans right now. Great stuff all, bravo.

You have never gained any insight from any of your postings on this board as they appear to be designed to provoke with little attempt at discussion. If you're not happy with the manner of engagement you could try altering your approach or better still, find somewhere else to post on the internet where you are more at home with "like minded souls".

Quote:

Oldoneeye
Ferris is the hardest hitting 6 in world rugby...

I must have been watching the wrong hemisphere!!! Oh and let me guess, Ronan O'Gara is the tallest player in the whole of Ireland...

Hartley's been cited, by the way. Here's the incident in question:

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O Fortuna, velut luna statu variabilis,
semper crescis aut decrescis

Dylan Hartley cited

[www.sportinglife.com]

JG - what am I looking for?

Damn good question. You can see Ferris 'cleaning out' Hartley by his head/neck, but that's it. Ferris starts complaining at the end of it.

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O Fortuna, velut luna statu variabilis,
semper crescis aut decrescis

Not looking good for Hartley. I remember Grewcock getting in trouble for biting Mealamu (?) after being fish-hooked. Seems a natural reaction to me if someone sticks their finger in your mouth.

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Reinstate the Fulham 1!

Hartley will get a ban, but he can bad mouth Ferris, pun intended, and make him out as another bad loser who is happy to dish it out, but not happy when it's returned.

(If that is indeed what happened)

If Hartley does get a ban and there are no mitigating factors, Joe Gray will probably tour to South Africa. He'll need a bit of luck to get a game ahead of Webber and Mears as things stand, but it would be richly deserved. Feel even sorrier for Chris Brooker, though.

Webber is broken

Ban will probably have been served by the South Africa tour.

Interesting. I notice best wasn't cited for trying to snap cole's neck at 8:45. I also notice that cole didn't run across to tell matron. I think Hartley is dirty player, certainly has previous, but mr ferris does appear to attract more attention than others. Dh doesn't look like he has much room to manoeuvre in ferris' headlock, so one has to wonder why his hand was so near hartley's mouth. Also seems odd to me that he doesn't retaliate, rather backing off and waiting for a chance to mince over to the ref.

[www.youtube.com]

Precedent: 0 weeks

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Quote:

Heath Quinn
Ban will probably have been served by the South Africa tour.

But if Lancaster is still in charge, I would imagine he wouldn't be in a hurry to pick Hartley again.

Biting the finger of someone trying to fishhook you is self defence - given you're (presumably) wearing a gum shield it is likely to do less harm to the player who chose to fishhook you than the fishhook could to you.

If the fishhook suggestion is untrue then I hope Hartley gets what he deserves. If it isn't I hope Ferris does.

If Hartley found guilty he should get maximum 4 year ban.His previous will make sure this is the case

Now, I'm not for one second condoning Hartley's actions and if he's found guilty of biting, he should be banned.

However, I'd like to know what Ferris was doing in the first place. I've been having a 'discussion' about this on FB (which is going to turn into WW3, so I'm not reading any more comments or replying to them!) and that's what I asked. The replies I had were 'it was a ruck' and 'Ferris was looking at Hartley's back' and neither 'argument' stand up. I'm sorry, but you know where your hands are (or have a pretty good idea). Secondly. Ferris was off his feet in the ruck and shouldn't have been using his hands (I thought hands in the ruck was a penalty offence). So, if Ferris is using his hands, in the ruck, near Hartley's face, that surely isn't 'allowed'. If nothing else, with all the concentration on gouging at the moment, you'd be pretty stupid to be near someone's face with your hand unless you're doing a hand-off (which Ferris wasn't doing at this point in time!). Now, again, I'm not saying that Ferris was doing this (I'm not alleging it either), but I am saying that having your hands around someone's face is going to end you in hot water or the person whose face you're on. Either way, there's no real place for it in rugby and they're both idiots as far as I can see.

Precedent?

When Danny Grewcock was in New Zealand in 2005 with the Lions, he was banned for two months for biting Keven Mealamu's finger, which had somehow found its way into Grewcock's mouth. The suggestion that Mealamu had been in the process of hooking Grewcock's mouth was not proven (natch, him being an All Black' a fine Christian gentleman and it was in New Zealand), but the length of suspension given to Grewcock was way below that usually given to a player found guilty of biting.

Quote:

RossM
Precedent?
When Danny Grewcock was in New Zealand in 2005 with the Lions, he was banned for two months for biting Keven Mealamu's finger, which had somehow found its way into Grewcock's mouth. The suggestion that Mealamu had been in the process of hooking Grewcock's mouth was not proven (natch, him being an All Black' a fine Christian gentleman and it was in New Zealand), but the length of suspension given to Grewcock was way below that usually given to a player found guilty of biting.

Ah yes, thefamous"Kevvy" defence. He's a nice guy, he wouldn't do stuff like that etc etc...

By the way, did anyone see the first Super 15 games this season? Dear, kind Kevvy gave a couple of nice forearm smashes into the face of a prone player... what a lovely guy.

He's guilty and given 8 weeks.

Available to tour though...

I still want to know what Ferris' finger was.doing in or near his mouth?

Looking forward to reading the details on this one. Presumably there's some proof we've not seen.

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Quote:

Presumably there's some proof we've not seen.

He might have pleaded guilty with mitigating circumstances, i.e. Ferris stuck his finger in his mouth. I thought minimum ban was 12 weeks - not sure how much Hartley would get off for previous good record since he hasn't got one.

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BB

Disagree BB - he's been a good boy for over 5 years.

Still think he's been hard done by - awaiting the details...

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Terrace 'B' next to Mav, Shaddo, AB, Jeremy and Spud.

Quote:

Beef
Disagree BB - he's been a good boy for over 5 years.

Fair enough. Didn't realise it was that long!

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BB

Someone made a point on another forum that even if Ferris was guilty of putting his finger in Hartley's mouth, DH would have to get a ban as there's no way any authorities could be seen to condone biting under any circumstances. I can't help thinking that giving him 8 weeks when the entry point is 12 weeks suggests they were as lenient as possible.

But as JG says - the report will make for interesting reading.

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Reinstate the Fulham 1!

What if Hartley had pleaded that Ferris had been gouging his mouth and it was while he was being pinned to the ground so only way he could defened himself is by biting...

Well, Hartley is still guilty of biting, and Ferris can't be cited as the citing window has closed.

Can't wait to see the full verdict.

Hartley has been quoted as saying he is disappointed, and wants to see the full verdict. Also Ferris gave evidence over a live feed. So must have been more than someone bite me, because that could have been a written statement.

As I said, can't wait to see the full verdict.

Quote:

claire_m
He's guilty and given 8 weeks.
Available to tour though...

Since Lancaster dropped DC for a season after his drink driving, I'd be interested to see whether any sanction is taken against Hartley for this. Assuming Lancaster remains in charge.

According to Northampton Chroncile newspaper this morning, Ferris admitted to have fingers (plural) in Hartleys mouth..

I guess they are the mitigating circumstances?

Fridays readings should be interesting

Quote:

Quinten Poulsen
Someone made a point on another forum that even if Ferris was guilty of putting his finger in Hartley's mouth, DH would have to get a ban as there's no way any authorities could be seen to condone biting under any circumstances.

I'm a little surprised that such an argument is ... a surprise. It's retaliation. If he had been punched, and then punched back, he would get a ban and nobody would question it.

But if someone punches you back, you don't normally run the to ref crying like a little girl because you've been punched.

Quote:

Quin Like Flint

Quote:

Quinten Poulsen
Someone made a point on another forum that even if Ferris was guilty of putting his finger in Hartley's mouth, DH would have to get a ban as there's no way any authorities could be seen to condone biting under any circumstances.

I'm a little surprised that such an argument is ... a surprise. It's retaliation. If he had been punched, and then punched back, he would get a ban and nobody would question it.

The difference is that biting fingers that are ripping at the tissue of your mouth would be done to stop the damage being caused - not retaliating to it.

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Ed Pope

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Quin Like Flint

Quote:

Quinten Poulsen
Someone made a point on another forum that even if Ferris was guilty of putting his finger in Hartley's mouth, DH would have to get a ban as there's no way any authorities could be seen to condone biting under any circumstances.

I'm a little surprised that such an argument is ... a surprise. It's retaliation. If he had been punched, and then punched back, he would get a ban and nobody would question it.

The difference is that biting fingers that are ripping at the tissue of your mouth would be done to stop the damage being caused - not retaliating to it.

Quite, if Ferris did have his fingers in Hartley's mouth then he should be banned, ad Hartley get a slap on the wrist.

But even if Ferris admitted to putting his fingers in Hartley's mouth, which apparently he has admitted, the citing window has closed so he's home free.

The only difference between the two? Hartley didn't whine to the ref like a big girl, so it wasn't in the referees report.

What always seemed strange to me was that if hartley had been biting to do damage, surely he'd have drawn blood? At the very least ferris would have been in serious pain. Seemed clear to me at the time that ferris was up to no good, if he's now admitted to having had his fingers in hartley's mouth then he should pick up a lengthy ban and be forced to make a public apology to hartley. Window or no window.

Hartley to soon be next England captain.

[www.guardian.co.uk]

the citing report in full is here
Ferris seems to have a vivid imagination about the so called evidence which is even at odds with the Irish medic's opinion

Quote:

St_Bart
the citing report in full is here Ferris seems to have a vivid imagination about the so called evidence which is even at odds with the Irish medic's opinion

Yes, having read that through it seemed that Ferris lied several times about what happened.

Big surprise. Ferris lying about blood (ahem), being contradicted by his own doctor, the panel declaring the video evidence showing him up...

Ferris looks really bad coming out of this. Hartley is a bit of a cheap shot merchant IMO but he does pretty well to control himself these days.

"That's a bit rich" was funny too!

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O Fortuna, velut luna statu variabilis,
semper crescis aut decrescis

Oh dear oh dear, when I recently referred to Drunk Care as Drunk Care I received a private message from The Prof telling me this was not to continue and that it was “very unpleasant for his family who use this site”.

I replied asking if he would be sending private messages to everyone (including himself) who posts comments in a similar vein which might upset someones family. He of course declined to answer the question but did say that he knew “a lot more about the situation than you do.” I replied saying that he was acting like a pompous hypocrite and he of course banned me saying I had abused him. I had not and this is a lie.

If anyone doubts my word then please send me a private message (or email me at WatchingThePoodle@yahoo.co.uk) and I will happily send you a full copy of the private message correspondence which will prove that Mr Franklin is telling lies. Mind you you will probably need to be quick with private messages because no doubt he will try to hide his behaviour by banning me again as soon as he reads this.

It is of course entirely Mr Franklin’s choice as to whether he bans me or not just as it is my choice to believe it is his weak and spineless leadership over the last few years which has tolerated the real serial abusers on this board resulting in so many posters giving it a wide berth and it being held in such contempt by most other rugby boards on Sportnetwork. What I do object to is the lies he tells to justify his actions and the cowardly way he bans people so they can’t answer back.

I will leave you with one last thought. Mr Franklin referred to knowing things that I don’t. Could it just be that our new Club management have had a word with The Prof and he is now going to start to censor posters that say things that don’t meet corporate approval? Sounds very much to me that The Prof has turned into The Poodle.

Pity he didn’t turn into someone with some integrity.

(Quick, you better delete this quick Poodle in case people find out what you are really like. Oh wait a moment, it seems it’s too late. Other than the usual sycophants here it seems everyone else already does).

Still Watching … the hypocritical, lying poodle.

Some people just don't know when to give up. I do wish there was an "ignore" button, like they have on some BBs...