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Now is your chance
Discussion started by Bedfordshire Boy , 21 February, 2017 14:06
Now is your chance
Bedfordshire Boy 21 February, 2017 14:06
To talk to the man himself

[www.facebook.com]

Re: Now is your chance
blucherquin 21 February, 2017 14:48
Quote:
Bedfordshire Boy
To talk to the man himself
[www.facebook.com]

What I find extraordinary is the people who've decided to post abuse.

It's perfectly acceptable to be disappointed at performance, but the ludicrous cowardice of people who would never say "when are you going to leave", "what are you going to do in May" in person is really pathetic.

Re: Now is your chance
RleQuin 21 February, 2017 14:55
Did they really think people would not ask the questions that have been posted so far?
Just about sums up the Club's belief that we are doing well.
RleQ

Re: Now is your chance
blucherquin 21 February, 2017 14:58
Quote:
RleQuin
Did they really think people would not ask the questions that have been posted so far?
Just about sums up the Club's belief that we are doing well.
RleQ

Actually I think it's because they're aware that people are not happy thay they're putting him out there - they hardly think they're going to get questions saying "why are we so great away from home"

Not sure why you think the club believes we're doing well.

I just despair at people who think that rather than ask a question it's better to just act like a five year old.

Re: Now is your chance
RleQuin 21 February, 2017 15:09
I hope you are right BQ but unless he is honest and doesn't use the usual excuses, it will be a waste of time
RleQ

Re: Now is your chance
DOK. 21 February, 2017 15:15
Well, he'll protect his players and staff (and probably management), whatever the truth about this season. So if you're expecting that, you're wasting your time.

Re: Now is your chance
Quinky Kin 21 February, 2017 15:33
Quote:
RleQuin
Just about sums up the Club's belief that we are doing well.
RleQ

Where has the club proclaimed that we're doing well?

Re: Now is your chance
Cookie 21 February, 2017 15:33
I'm not sure what this is designed to achieve. Those who support him will get platitudes like "we're working hard in training", "when we get our England/injured players back....", "lots still to play for", "planning for next season" and they'll be happy.

Those who want change will be further annoyed that either their questions don't get asked or they don't get the answers they want.

Ultimately, nobody is going to have their minds changed one way or the other from the standpoint they have. Half will be happy and the other half probably more angry than they were before.

This will be a waste of time unless he's going to answer the tough questions about himself, his coaches and some of the players. But he won't. So it will be.

Re: Now is your chance
RleQuin 21 February, 2017 15:46
Quote:
Quinky Kin
Quote:
RleQuin
Just about sums up the Club's belief that we are doing well.
RleQ

Where has the club proclaimed that we're doing well?

That's why I said "belief", I never said "proclaimed"

RleQ

Re: Now is your chance
blucherquin 21 February, 2017 16:05
I'm not sure why it has to "achieve" anything.

I think it's a positive move by the club - and I'm not a cheerleader.

I agree it's not going to change the world but I'm not sure anyone expects one interview to do so.

Re: Now is your chance
RodneyRegis 21 February, 2017 16:13
Great question there Rleq.

BQ - I'm not sure what you expect people to ask. People have asked him to justify his position and explain our poor results. If he puts himself forward whilst telling us week after week that we're playing ok, it's hardly surprising that the line of questioning is pretty frank. Perhaps you'd prefer "do you agree that we're historically a pretty weak club, so our performances this season have been as expected"?

Of course there's going to be the odd person suggesting he's not up to it, our own poll on here showed that sentiment pretty strongly. Whether you think we're improving or not, a lot of supporters think the club won't get back into the top 4 until there's a significant clearout.

There's not a single positive question on there.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 21/02/2017 16:17 by RodneyRegis.

Re: Now is your chance
T-Bone 21 February, 2017 16:16
A few people have just said more or less "why don't you quit / haven't you been fired?" but otherwise the questions seem fair enough, if quite frank and direct. Questions such as "who has been your stand out player this season" are probably of more interest if we'd been playing well. Understandably a lot of fans want to know why he thinks we're struggling and what he plans to do about it, beyond the players missing excuse, which doesn't explain our poor form while they have been available.

Re: Now is your chance
Quinky Kin 21 February, 2017 16:49
Quote:
RleQuin
Quote:
Quinky Kin
Quote:
RleQuin
Just about sums up the Club's belief that we are doing well.
RleQ

Where has the club proclaimed that we're doing well?

That's why I said "belief", I never said "proclaimed"

RleQ

I see.

Where have the club stated the "belief" that we're doing well?

Re: Now is your chance
blucherquin 21 February, 2017 20:33
Rodders I'm fine with tough questions, he should expect them - and frankly if the rugby media weren't so cozy (particularly the broadcasters) we'd get better questions.

There's just no need to be rude.

Re: Now is your chance
RodneyRegis 21 February, 2017 20:48
Yes, I get that, but a lot of people will have built up a lot of anger over the past year (rot really set in last 6N) and see this as their only opportunity to make their feelings known. An erudite critique does not convey the message they are trying to deliver.

Re: Now is your chance
blucherquin 21 February, 2017 21:50
Must just be me still expecting people to have manners

Re: Now is your chance
Bedfordshire Boy 21 February, 2017 22:44
No, not just you.

Re: Now is your chance
Quaking Quin 21 February, 2017 22:55
Only two key questions to ask JK:

1. What are your aspirations for winning trophies?
2. What is the time-frame for winning them?

If the usual 3 to 5-year opt-out for team building is given, then ask what are the targets for each of the intervening years.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 22/02/2017 01:49 by Quaking Quin.

Re: Now is your chance
thomh 22 February, 2017 00:05
Quote:
RleQuin
Did they really think people would not ask the questions that have been posted so far?
Just about sums up the Club's belief that we are doing well.
RleQ

The fact that unpleasant questions may have been predictable doesn't make them acceptable.

Re: Now is your chance
Cookie 22 February, 2017 06:44
Quote:
Quaking Quin
Only two key questions to ask JK:
1. What are your aspirations for winning trophies?
2. What is the time-frame for winning them?

If the usual 3 to 5-year opt-out for team building is given, then ask what are the targets for each of the intervening years.

If you listen to the Bath post match interview, we don't get "bogged diwn" with targets for a season.

Re: Now is your chance
Quinten Poulsen 22 February, 2017 09:34
Would you prefer that they did get bogged down with them?

Re: Now is your chance
T-Bone 22 February, 2017 11:51
No excuse for being rude when asking the questions, but I think uncomfortable, forthright questions are perfectly acceptable.


And before people say "well, would you ask them to his face or are you just another keyboard warrior?", if he chooses to go on facebook where he can dodge questions and give answers without anyone taking him up on them, I'd say it's fair enough to ask him those difficult, uncomfortable questions in the first place.

Still, doesn't mean it can't be done politely. Being rude or childish is fairly pointless.

Re: Now is your chance
RleQuin 22 February, 2017 11:59
Quote:
RodneyRegis
Great question there Rleq.

I thought so too! (Sm128)
RleQ

Re: Now is your chance
Jammy Git 22 February, 2017 12:06
"Can't believe he has the arrogance to talk about top 4 when we're clearly relegation contenders - how delusional are the club??"



O Fortuna, velut luna statu variabilis,
semper crescis aut decrescis

Re: Now is your chance
Cookie 22 February, 2017 12:34
Quote:
Quinten Poulsen
Would you prefer that they did get bogged down with them?

Yes. 100%. No target = no accountability.

How can you run a club on a 'we'll do our best and see what happens' basis, as JK suggested in his interview. This is at the root of the problem. We don't know what the club are striving to achieve, so therefore we don't know if we're achieving or not. Do we want to be winners? Top 4? Top 6? Top 10? Not relegated?

I personally think we should be looking for a top 6 spot as a minimum, with top 4 being a stretch target. Anything less (for the 3rd season in a row) is a major problem.

Re: Now is your chance
blucherquin 22 February, 2017 13:16
Quote:
Cookie
Quote:
Quinten Poulsen
Would you prefer that they did get bogged down with them?

Yes. 100%. No target = no accountability.

How can you run a club on a 'we'll do our best and see what happens' basis, as JK suggested in his interview. This is at the root of the problem. We don't know what the club are striving to achieve, so therefore we don't know if we're achieving or not. Do we want to be winners? Top 4? Top 6? Top 10? Not relegated?

I personally think we should be looking for a top 6 spot as a minimum, with top 4 being a stretch target. Anything less (for the 3rd season in a row) is a major problem.

I'm pretty sure that's exactly what they've talked about for the past few seasons and all year so far. If you start trying to imagine an entire strategy based on one comment in one interview you basically end up like Donald Trump and think that Sweden is under constant attack.

There's no way you could consider me happy with the performances this year -- and I'm really not sure that JK is the man to develop the team (as people bored enough to have read anything I've posted will know, my personal feeling and total guess based on nothing is that the senior players have too much power in the dressing room and maybe he's having trouble keeping the dressing room following his tactics -- but it's a total guess based on how teams in general behave and how that behaviour can manifest itself on a sports field)

BUT starting to imagine we know he's got no strategy and the club are just happy to see what happens as the meander through is a season is madness....even if that is the end result.

Re: Now is your chance
Quinky Kin 22 February, 2017 13:30
Quote:
Bedfordshire Boy
No, not just you.

+1

Re: Now is your chance
Brown Bottle 22 February, 2017 13:40
Apart from a quick rush of "When are you leaving..." questions at the end, the vast majority of the questions aren't rude at all. I'd say that's a pretty tame response for social media.

Quote:
RleQuin
Quote:
RodneyRegis
Great question there Rleq.

I thought so too! (Sm128)
RleQ

Agreed! smiling smiley



BB

Re: Now is your chance
RleQuin 22 February, 2017 13:47
Quote:
Quinky Kin
Quote:
RleQuin
Quote:
Quinky Kin
Quote:
RleQuin
Just about sums up the Club's belief that we are doing well.
RleQ

Where has the club proclaimed that we're doing well?

That's why I said "belief", I never said "proclaimed"

RleQ

I see.

Where have the club stated the "belief" that we're doing well?

Things I've picked up on in interviews etc
RleQ

Re: Now is your chance
Quinten Poulsen 22 February, 2017 16:31
Quote:
Cookie
Quote:
Quinten Poulsen
Would you prefer that they did get bogged down with them?

Yes. 100%. No target = no accountability.

How can you run a club on a 'we'll do our best and see what happens' basis, as JK suggested in his interview. This is at the root of the problem. We don't know what the club are striving to achieve, so therefore we don't know if we're achieving or not. Do we want to be winners? Top 4? Top 6? Top 10? Not relegated?

I personally think we should be looking for a top 6 spot as a minimum, with top 4 being a stretch target. Anything less (for the 3rd season in a row) is a major problem.

I think you've probably misinterpreted what he said. There is nothing at all to suggest they didn't set themselves targets, and yes, not having any would be ludicrous. But the season is not going as well as everyone would have hoped so I think he's right in that they don't want to be bogged down in targets they set 6 months ago. Not wanting to get bogged down doesn't equate to not having any.

Re: Now is your chance
Quinky Kin 22 February, 2017 17:12
Quote:
RleQuin
Quote:
Quinky Kin
Quote:
RleQuin
Quote:
Quinky Kin
Quote:
RleQuin
Just about sums up the Club's belief that we are doing well.
RleQ

Where has the club proclaimed that we're doing well?

That's why I said "belief", I never said "proclaimed"

RleQ

I see.

Where have the club stated the "belief" that we're doing well?

Things I've picked up on in interviews etc
RleQ

So you've picked up on an unidentified comment and decided that it means that the club believe they are doing well.

What did you pick up when the coaches and the DoR are interviewed, and say that they are bitterly disappointed with results, form etc? Perhaps that might suggest that they feel they aren't doing well?

Re: Now is your chance
RleQuin 22 February, 2017 17:54
I am not prepared to list all the things put out or said by the club which I interpret as them believing they are doing well.
As with all things, you will think something different and I respect your position.
RleQ

Re: Now is your chance
Cookie 22 February, 2017 18:21
Quote:
Quinten Poulsen
Quote:
Cookie
Quote:
Quinten Poulsen
Would you prefer that they did get bogged down with them?

Yes. 100%. No target = no accountability.

How can you run a club on a 'we'll do our best and see what happens' basis, as JK suggested in his interview. This is at the root of the problem. We don't know what the club are striving to achieve, so therefore we don't know if we're achieving or not. Do we want to be winners? Top 4? Top 6? Top 10? Not relegated?

I personally think we should be looking for a top 6 spot as a minimum, with top 4 being a stretch target. Anything less (for the 3rd season in a row) is a major problem.

I think you've probably misinterpreted what he said. There is nothing at all to suggest they didn't set themselves targets, and yes, not having any would be ludicrous. But the season is not going as well as everyone would have hoped so I think he's right in that they don't want to be bogged down in targets they set 6 months ago. Not wanting to get bogged down doesn't equate to not having any.

In business, during a financial year, you have a budget that you aim for. Then a re-forecast. And then maybe one or two more, the final one of which you have to deliver (or else!). Even if you're miles of your original target, you still have to strive to achieve things. And we have very tangible targets in top 4 and top 6. I don't accept that we should just be doing our best in every game and see what happens. It's bonkers.

Re: Now is your chance
Quinky Kin 22 February, 2017 19:09
Quote:
RleQuin
I am not prepared to list anything put out or said by the club which I interpret as them believing they are doing well.
RleQ

That's better.

Re: Now is your chance
Quinten Poulsen 22 February, 2017 20:00
Quote:
Cookie

In business, during a financial year, you have a budget that you aim for. Then a re-forecast. And then maybe one or two more, the final one of which you have to deliver (or else!). Even if you're miles of your original target, you still have to strive to achieve things. And we have very tangible targets in top 4 and top 6. I don't accept that we should just be doing our best in every game and see what happens. It's bonkers.

He said they're not getting bogged down by targets, not that they don't have any!



"to be/become so involved in something difficult or complicated that you cannot do anything else"

Re: Now is your chance
blucherquin 22 February, 2017 23:34
Quote:
RleQuin
I am not prepared to list all the things put out or said by the club which I interpret as them believing they are doing well.
As with all things, you will think something different and I respect your position.
RleQ

Could you amuse us by quoting just one?

Re: Now is your chance
Cookie 23 February, 2017 10:38
The questions seem to have been dried up, so if this goes on for any length of time, they'll have to use some of the more testy questions as there won't be enough namby pamby ones!

Re: Now is your chance
RleQuin 23 February, 2017 11:15
Okay, constantly banging on about how good our home record is - it's now down to just the Premiership. How we have got 14 points from our last four matches (obviously that has changed now).
This is showing the belief and giving the impression we are doing well (as far as I am concerned).
He is just like a politician and avoids talking about the real issues for example (as mentioned on here) - our lack of basic skills, lack of killer instinct, inability to defend properly most of the time. He just keeps saying how well they have done in training during the week.
Well, after the fifth time, you would think that someone might say - I don't think what we're doing is working - we need to change.
Obviously no one has and if they have, he isn't listening. If the players rule the roost, get rid of the offenders. The DoR must be in charge otherwise his position becomes untenable.
RleQ

Re: Now is your chance
brfc_quin 23 February, 2017 12:11
JK Out! JK Out! JK Out! JK Out!

Re: Now is your chance
blucherquin 23 February, 2017 12:16
Mate, no coach of any team ever is going to come out during a season and say "yep, we're pony, we can't pass or catch and we've got no defence against the maul"

Who would benefit? The players have to believe in him (away from arguments of whether they do or not) and you can't come out before a match and hand the opposition a massive psychological advantage by saying that you're terrible - even if you are.

You can think JK is terrible, you can think he's got no control - but you can't genuinely expect him to say so in a pre-match interview.

On the specific point of doing well - we are currently 6th in the Prem and in the semi finals of the Anglo Welsh cup.

I, like you, have no idea how either of those things is the case given how bad some of our performances have been this season - and I had to sit through the risible dog poop of the Sharks and Edinburgh cup games - but in this post-factual age, the facts are we haven't had an abysmal season yet.

Re: Now is your chance
ArchQuin 23 February, 2017 12:47
as had been said many times before,it comes down to individual supporter expectation - some expect us to be challenging for the title each year and some expect us to be mid-table - I would suggest that those who expect us to be challenging for top spot, will see this as a terrible season and those that don't think it is an 'okay' season - you can tell the differences in the posts !

Re: Now is your chance
blucherquin 23 February, 2017 12:55
Moved to another thread



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 23/02/2017 15:31 by blucherquin.

Re: Now is your chance
Quinky Kin 23 February, 2017 15:03
Quote:
RleQuin
Okay, constantly banging on about how good our home record is - it's now down to just the Premiership. How we have got 14 points from our last four matches (obviously that has changed now).
This is showing the belief and giving the impression we are doing well (as far as I am concerned).
He is just like a politician and avoids talking about the real issues for example (as mentioned on here) - our lack of basic skills, lack of killer instinct, inability to defend properly most of the time. He just keeps saying how well they have done in training during the week.
Well, after the fifth time, you would think that someone might say - I don't think what we're doing is working - we need to change.
Obviously no one has and if they have, he isn't listening. If the players rule the roost, get rid of the offenders. The DoR must be in charge otherwise his position becomes untenable.
RleQ

So, stating a few facts translates into believing we are doing well? And failing to harp on about the negatives supports that view?
Let's see... telling someone you can drive and you haven't had a head-on collision, whilst omitting to mention the minor scrapes you've had, well that must equate to claiming you're Louis Hamilton?

As for this:

Quote:
Obviously no one has and if they have,

So, not obviously then?

Re: Now is your chance
RleQuin 24 February, 2017 12:09
Whatever way you want to twist it QK, it's up to you. To be honest, I am past caring about what anyone at the club says - they all talk the same old rubbish week in, week out. JK, the playing and non-playing staff can blame anyone they want to but it all comes down to the fact we are not a very good side and the club loses money every year (unless some sort of injection is made).
From that I take it to mean
1 - We are not coached/managed very well or the players don't have the ability to improve (or they are doing a Leicester City)
2 - The non-playing side is run incompetently.
RleQ

Re: Now is your chance
Quinky Kin 24 February, 2017 12:24
Quote:
RleQuin
Whatever way you want to twist it QK, it's up to you. To be honest, I am past caring about what anyone at the club says - they all talk the same old rubbish week in, week out. JK, the playing and non-playing staff can blame anyone they want to but it all comes down to the fact we are not a very good side and the club loses money every year (unless some sort of injection is made).
From that I take it to mean
1 - We are not coached/managed very well or the players don't have the ability to improve (or they are doing a Leicester City)
2 - The non-playing side is run incompetently.
RleQ

But you also think that the club believes they are doing well.

Re: Now is your chance
blucherquin 24 February, 2017 12:25
Quote:
RleQuin
Whatever way you want to twist it QK, it's up to you. To be honest, I am past caring about what anyone at the club says - they all talk the same old rubbish week in, week out. JK, the playing and non-playing staff can blame anyone they want to but it all comes down to the fact we are not a very good side and the club loses money every year (unless some sort of injection is made).
From that I take it to mean
1 - We are not coached/managed very well or the players don't have the ability to improve (or they are doing a Leicester City)
2 - The non-playing side is run incompetently.
RleQ

If you don't enjoy it, you could just not support us...

Re: Now is your chance
RleQuin 24 February, 2017 12:39
Right, so I'm not allowed to say what I think and if I don't like it, I can go away - charming!!
Please do not tell me to stop supporting MY team!
RleQ

Re: Now is your chance
talkshowhost86 24 February, 2017 12:44
Quote:
ArchQuin
as had been said many times before,it comes down to individual supporter expectation - some expect us to be challenging for the title each year and some expect us to be mid-table - I would suggest that those who expect us to be challenging for top spot, will see this as a terrible season and those that don't think it is an 'okay' season - you can tell the differences in the posts !

I suspect you are right in most cases, but I think there is more nuance to it than that for some people.

I don't expect us to suddenly leap up the table and challenge Saracens, but I do expect us to be moving in that direction, particularly with a salary cap that means we should be able to match them financially.

And I do expect us to have some sort of game plan or style...something that makes us Quins.

At the moment it's just a stodgy mess, and if we limp to a 6th place finish (a reasonable achievement) that won't mask the fact it's been a poor season for me.

Re: Now is your chance
Jammy Git 24 February, 2017 13:06
Quote:
RleQuin
Right, so I'm not allowed to say what I think and if I don't like it, I can go away - charming!!
Please do not tell me to stop supporting MY team!
RleQ

No-one should tell you to not support your team.

Many of us would enjoy it if you started doing it, mind...



O Fortuna, velut luna statu variabilis,
semper crescis aut decrescis

Re: Now is your chance
RleQuin 24 February, 2017 13:25
Just because I can see the faults, I do praise when they do something good.
No one can accuse me of not supporting the team and I'm insulted when people say that I don't
RleQ

Re: Now is your chance
DOK. 24 February, 2017 14:14
Some people don't have really long memories RlQ! smiling smiley

Re: Now is your chance
RleQuin 24 February, 2017 14:16
Quote:
DOK
Some people don't have really long memories RlQ! smiling smiley

I guess not DOK!!
RleQ


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