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Dave Ward's shiner
MrOther (IP Logged)
02 October, 2017 21:57
The full match video is now is now on the Premiership website.

Dave Ward gets his eye injury from Teimana Harrison at 27 minutes 43-45 seconds.

There is no foul intent (as far as I can see).

 
Re: Dave Ward's shiner
raedarius (IP Logged)
02 October, 2017 22:31
Yep, that's put that one to bed.

 
Re: Dave Ward's shiner
Quins4life (IP Logged)
02 October, 2017 22:37
Well Nathan Hughes got a penalty given against him for a similar high elbow whilst carrying the ball into contact and then received a retrospective yellow. Not sure there is much difference between the two. I don't agree with the rule, but if it is there it ought to be consistent.

 
Re: Dave Ward's shiner
shendy (IP Logged)
03 October, 2017 07:56
So what happened with Kingston's "Ward told me what happened"?



There ain't no Sanity Clause

 
Re: Dave Ward's shiner
DOK (IP Logged)
03 October, 2017 08:42
Depends whether Ward explained it like raedarius or Quins4life! smiling smiley

 
Re: Dave Ward's shiner
Quinky Kin (IP Logged)
03 October, 2017 13:15
Quote:
MrOther
The full match video is now is now on the Premiership website.
Dave Ward gets his eye injury from Teimana Harrison at 27 minutes 43-45 seconds.

There is no foul intent (as far as I can see).

There doesn't have to be intent, I believe?

 
Re: Dave Ward's shiner
MrOther (IP Logged)
03 October, 2017 14:09
Quote:
Quinky Kin
Quote:
MrOther
The full match video is now is now on the Premiership website.
Dave Ward gets his eye injury from Teimana Harrison at 27 minutes 43-45 seconds.

There is no foul intent (as far as I can see).

There doesn't have to be intent, I believe?

Interesting point.

When is intent relevant? I don't know, but a blow to the face can't be foul play in all circumstances. If I tackle someone haring away from me, catch him round the ankles and get a heel in my face, that can't be foul play. Can it?

(If all contact with the face were foul play a lot of people would have been carded playing against Jacques Burger :-)

I have the feeling that I am missing some obvious point or distinction here.

 
Re: Dave Ward's shiner
Quinky Kin (IP Logged)
03 October, 2017 15:41
Quote:
MrOther
Quote:
Quinky Kin
Quote:
MrOther
The full match video is now is now on the Premiership website.
Dave Ward gets his eye injury from Teimana Harrison at 27 minutes 43-45 seconds.

There is no foul intent (as far as I can see).

There doesn't have to be intent, I believe?

Interesting point.

When is intent relevant? I don't know, but a blow to the face can't be foul play in all circumstances. If I tackle someone haring away from me, catch him round the ankles and get a heel in my face, that can't be foul play. Can it?

(If all contact with the face were foul play a lot of people would have been carded playing against Jacques Burger :-)

I have the feeling that I am missing some obvious point or distinction here.

I agree that it's a little bit vague. I suppose if it were simply careless or reckless, then intent doesn't need to be shown. There was mention elsewhere that Nathan Hughes caused a similar injury accidentally, and was punished?

 
Re: Dave Ward's shiner
T-Bone (IP Logged)
03 October, 2017 15:43
Quote:
Quinky Kin
Quote:
MrOther
Quote:
Quinky Kin
Quote:
MrOther
The full match video is now is now on the Premiership website.
Dave Ward gets his eye injury from Teimana Harrison at 27 minutes 43-45 seconds.

There is no foul intent (as far as I can see).

There doesn't have to be intent, I believe?

Interesting point.

When is intent relevant? I don't know, but a blow to the face can't be foul play in all circumstances. If I tackle someone haring away from me, catch him round the ankles and get a heel in my face, that can't be foul play. Can it?

(If all contact with the face were foul play a lot of people would have been carded playing against Jacques Burger :-)

I have the feeling that I am missing some obvious point or distinction here.

I agree that it's a little bit vague. I suppose if it were simply careless or reckless, then intent doesn't need to be shown. There was mention elsewhere that Nathan Hughes caused a similar injury accidentally, and was punished?

Hughes handed a defender off with his forearm/elbow. Not sure why people were surprised he got penalised. I'm sure there was no intent to hurt, there never is, is there, but if a 20 stone bloke runs into someone and thrusts their rather large forearm into the defender's face, it is going to hurt.

 
Re: Dave Ward's shiner
Quinky Kin (IP Logged)
03 October, 2017 15:46
Quote:
T-Bone
Quote:
Quinky Kin
Quote:
MrOther
Quote:
Quinky Kin
Quote:
MrOther
The full match video is now is now on the Premiership website.
Dave Ward gets his eye injury from Teimana Harrison at 27 minutes 43-45 seconds.

There is no foul intent (as far as I can see).

There doesn't have to be intent, I believe?

Interesting point.

When is intent relevant? I don't know, but a blow to the face can't be foul play in all circumstances. If I tackle someone haring away from me, catch him round the ankles and get a heel in my face, that can't be foul play. Can it?

(If all contact with the face were foul play a lot of people would have been carded playing against Jacques Burger :-)

I have the feeling that I am missing some obvious point or distinction here.

I agree that it's a little bit vague. I suppose if it were simply careless or reckless, then intent doesn't need to be shown. There was mention elsewhere that Nathan Hughes caused a similar injury accidentally, and was punished?

Hughes handed a defender off with his forearm/elbow. Not sure why people were surprised he got penalised. I'm sure there was no intent to hurt, there never is, is there, but if a 20 stone bloke runs into someone and thrusts their rather large forearm into the defender's face, it is going to hurt.

Which demonstrates the point that intent isn't necessary. I still can't fathom how Ward's eye got injured, but it could have been punishable.

 
Re: Dave Ward's shiner
T-Bone (IP Logged)
03 October, 2017 17:09
Quote:
Quinky Kin
Quote:
T-Bone
Quote:
Quinky Kin
Quote:
MrOther
Quote:
Quinky Kin
Quote:
MrOther
The full match video is now is now on the Premiership website.
Dave Ward gets his eye injury from Teimana Harrison at 27 minutes 43-45 seconds.

There is no foul intent (as far as I can see).

There doesn't have to be intent, I believe?

Interesting point.

When is intent relevant? I don't know, but a blow to the face can't be foul play in all circumstances. If I tackle someone haring away from me, catch him round the ankles and get a heel in my face, that can't be foul play. Can it?

(If all contact with the face were foul play a lot of people would have been carded playing against Jacques Burger :-)

I have the feeling that I am missing some obvious point or distinction here.

I agree that it's a little bit vague. I suppose if it were simply careless or reckless, then intent doesn't need to be shown. There was mention elsewhere that Nathan Hughes caused a similar injury accidentally, and was punished?

Hughes handed a defender off with his forearm/elbow. Not sure why people were surprised he got penalised. I'm sure there was no intent to hurt, there never is, is there, but if a 20 stone bloke runs into someone and thrusts their rather large forearm into the defender's face, it is going to hurt.

Which demonstrates the point that intent isn't necessary. I still can't fathom how Ward's eye got injured, but it could have been punishable.

Quite agree that intent isn't necessary.

 
Re: Dave Ward's shiner
MrOther (IP Logged)
03 October, 2017 17:17
Quote:
Quinky Kin
Quote:
T-Bone
Hughes handed a defender off with his forearm/elbow. Not sure why people were surprised he got penalised. I'm sure there was no intent to hurt, there never is, is there, but if a 20 stone bloke runs into someone and thrusts their rather large forearm into the defender's face, it is going to hurt.

Which demonstrates the point that intent isn't necessary. I still can't fathom how Ward's eye got injured, but it could have been punishable.

I watched the Hughes incident back today. To my mind he delivered a forearm smash to the man trying to stop him. I think T-Bone's point ".. no intent to hurt, there never is, is there?" is right. He deserved to be penalised.

As for Dave Ward, if he'd gone bleating to Luke Pearce he might have got a TMO review and some sanction for Harrison, but that's not Dave Ward's style .. and good on him for that.

 
Re: Dave Ward's shiner
Quinky Kin (IP Logged)
03 October, 2017 18:20
Quote:
MrOther
Quote:
Quinky Kin
Quote:
T-Bone
Hughes handed a defender off with his forearm/elbow. Not sure why people were surprised he got penalised. I'm sure there was no intent to hurt, there never is, is there, but if a 20 stone bloke runs into someone and thrusts their rather large forearm into the defender's face, it is going to hurt.

Which demonstrates the point that intent isn't necessary. I still can't fathom how Ward's eye got injured, but it could have been punishable.

I watched the Hughes incident back today. To my mind he delivered a forearm smash to the man trying to stop him. I think T-Bone's point ".. no intent to hurt, there never is, is there?" is right. He deserved to be penalised.

As for Dave Ward, if he'd gone bleating to Luke Pearce he might have got a TMO review and some sanction for Harrison, but that's not Dave Ward's style .. and good on him for that.

Absolutely agreed. I did think that the Saints player made a huge fuss about the Kyle incident, especially since there didn't seem to be any visible evidence. But that's second-guessing what happened.

 
Re: Dave Ward's shiner
shendy (IP Logged)
03 October, 2017 19:14
Quote:
MrOther
Quote:
Quinky Kin
Quote:
T-Bone
Hughes handed a defender off with his forearm/elbow. Not sure why people were surprised he got penalised. I'm sure there was no intent to hurt, there never is, is there, but if a 20 stone bloke runs into someone and thrusts their rather large forearm into the defender's face, it is going to hurt.

Which demonstrates the point that intent isn't necessary. I still can't fathom how Ward's eye got injured, but it could have been punishable.

I watched the Hughes incident back today. To my mind he delivered a forearm smash to the man trying to stop him. I think T-Bone's point ".. no intent to hurt, there never is, is there?" is right. He deserved to be penalised.

As for Dave Ward, if he'd gone bleating to Luke Pearce he might have got a TMO review and some sanction for Harrison, but that's not Dave Ward's style .. and good on him for that.

I thought Dave Ward's entire style was bleating to referees? ;-)



There ain't no Sanity Clause

 
Re: Dave Ward's shiner
Scaramouche (IP Logged)
04 October, 2017 10:21
Nughes avoided sanction because his forearms initial contact was with the other blokes upper chest not the face/head.



Illegitimi non carborundum

 
Re: Dave Ward's shiner
Navyquin (IP Logged)
04 October, 2017 10:31
Quote:
shendy
Quote:
MrOther
Quote:
Quinky Kin
Quote:
T-Bone
Hughes handed a defender off with his forearm/elbow. Not sure why people were surprised he got penalised. I'm sure there was no intent to hurt, there never is, is there, but if a 20 stone bloke runs into someone and thrusts their rather large forearm into the defender's face, it is going to hurt.


Never let the truth in the way of a good story


Which demonstrates the point that intent isn't necessary. I still can't fathom how Ward's eye got injured, but it could have been punishable.

I watched the Hughes incident back today. To my mind he delivered a forearm smash to the man trying to stop him. I think T-Bone's point ".. no intent to hurt, there never is, is there?" is right. He deserved to be penalised.

As for Dave Ward, if he'd gone bleating to Luke Pearce he might have got a TMO review and some sanction for Harrison, but that's not Dave Ward's style .. and good on him for that.

I thought Dave Ward's entire style was bleating to referees? ;-)

Of course you did poppet but never let the truth get in the way of a good story.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/10/2017 10:32 by Navyquin.

 
Re: Dave Ward's shiner
Jammy Git (IP Logged)
04 October, 2017 11:38
Quote:
Scaramouche
Nughes avoided sanction because his forearms initial contact was with the other blokes upper chest not the face/head.

That's wrong, though, it was to the neck/jaw and he extended his arm away from the body as a strike. The TMO knew the ref had gotten it wrong sad smiley



O Fortuna, velut luna statu variabilis,
semper crescis aut decrescis

 
Re: Dave Ward's shiner
riverlodge (IP Logged)
04 October, 2017 12:13
nobody here making the distinction that Harrison's impact was with the ball carrying arm (not extended), whereas the (clear) commentary in the Wasps game was that the penalty was all due to him transferring the ball and then leading with his non carrying arm (extended)?

 
Re: Dave Ward's shiner
Jammy Git (IP Logged)
04 October, 2017 12:18
I haven't bothered to watch the Harrison thing because it sounded like a total non-event, but that's a fair point!



O Fortuna, velut luna statu variabilis,
semper crescis aut decrescis

 
Re: Dave Ward's shiner
MrOther (IP Logged)
04 October, 2017 16:36
Quote:
riverlodge
nobody here making the distinction that Harrison's impact was with the ball carrying arm (not extended), whereas the (clear) commentary in the Wasps game was that the penalty was all due to him transferring the ball and then leading with his non carrying arm (extended)?

I couldnt see which of Harrison's flailing limbs had caught Dave Ward. As the commentator I believe said, he was like "a whirling dervish".


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