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Ben Botica
Quinky Kin (IP Logged)
13 May, 2018 10:47
Just reading about him in TRP. Seems he's had a really good season and is credited with being the main reason for Oyonnax nearly avoiding relegation. His kicking stats are very impressive too.

Makes me wonder if he just needed a consistent run of games.

 
Re: Ben Botica
DOK (IP Logged)
13 May, 2018 10:54
He needed enough experience to be able to handle pressure. Glad to see he can do it now.

 
Re: Ben Botica
T-Bone (IP Logged)
13 May, 2018 11:11
He always looked better as a starter and with a run of games. On the whole he was a good player for us, but hard to forget two massive brain farts

 
Re: Ben Botica
ironquin1886 (IP Logged)
13 May, 2018 19:14
I still hate him

 
Re: Ben Botica
blucherquin (IP Logged)
13 May, 2018 21:15
Quote:
ironquin1886
I still hate him

Bizarre or just a bit tragic.

 
Re: Ben Botica
plzd (IP Logged)
13 May, 2018 21:20
He wasn't a good signing

 
Re: Ben Botica
kevin (IP Logged)
13 May, 2018 21:50
Quote:
plzd
He wasn't a good signing
To put it mildly.

 
Re: Ben Botica
Quinky Kin (IP Logged)
13 May, 2018 22:13
Quote:
T-Bone
He always looked better as a starter and with a run of games. On the whole he was a good player for us, but hard to forget two massive brain farts

That's a fair summary.

 
Re: Ben Botica
NicoWilson (IP Logged)
14 May, 2018 08:51
Quote:
Quinky Kin
Quote:
T-Bone
He always looked better as a starter and with a run of games. On the whole he was a good player for us, but hard to forget two massive brain farts

That's a fair summary.

I will never forget the misjudged kick when we played Northampton

 
Re: Ben Botica
Someoldhooker (IP Logged)
14 May, 2018 09:28
Quote:
Quinky Kin
Quote:
T-Bone
He always looked better as a starter and with a run of games. On the whole he was a good player for us, but hard to forget two massive brain farts

That's a fair summary.

Seem to remember we had a bad run of injuries with Evans and Swiel from Feb into April. I may be wrong but I think Botica played all 80 minutes bar about 5 at the Pests for something like 9 games on the trot so I wouldnt criticise the guy too quickly. Agreed that you cant forget the Northampton game but think that all in all he was quite good for us. I think the last minute of the final was hardly where we lost it, pretty sure we didnt look like getting anything most of the game.

 
Re: Ben Botica
talkshowhost86 (IP Logged)
14 May, 2018 10:51
I think a lot of people make him out to be much worse than he was because of those two brainless moments, but at the same time I don't think there can be an equal amount of revisionism to suggest he was actually very good.

He was fine. A decent kicker most of the time both off the tee and out of hand, and he was a decent reader of the game when he wasn't doing daft things.

But he hardly got our attack going on a regular basis, and you only have to look at young Marcus to see how youth and inexperience don't necessarily mean you don't have the right head for the game.

 
Re: Ben Botica
never sleep (IP Logged)
14 May, 2018 11:08
I think he was a good kicker.
He was good when starting - but poor when coming off the bench. The 2 brain farts were off the bench.
We also tend to forget the games that he helped us win - e.g. the missed pass against London Irish.
Also, he was a centre who was forced to play FH due to an Evans injury and therefore never had a consistent run.
Had it not been for the 2 issues, I would have been sorry to see him go - but I am very pleased that he is having success in France.

 
Re: Ben Botica
Jammy Git (IP Logged)
14 May, 2018 15:23
He was an awful centre, though. Terrible tackler too.



O Fortuna, velut luna statu variabilis,
semper crescis aut decrescis

 
Re: Ben Botica
Guildford Saint (IP Logged)
15 May, 2018 15:49
Quote:
T-Bone
... On the whole he was a good player for us...

Even better for us as I remember!!!

 
Re: Ben Botica
never sleep (IP Logged)
15 May, 2018 16:01
That game wasn't lost just by Ben. The S/H could have dealt with the ball (i.e. dotted it down) instead of passing to Ben. The crowd could have counted down the clock so that both the SH and Ben could have realised that time was up. The touch judge could have ruled the ball out from the kick (which from memory, I think it actually was marginally out) - Also, the team could have realised that the ball was still in play and actually defended.
But, from memory, I think it was Ben Foden who actually scored a fairly good try. He should really get a great deal of the credit as there were a lot of opportunities for Saints to mess up between Ben kicking the ball and the try being scored.
Basically, Saints won the game by staying calm under pressure. We lost the game by not.

 
Re: Ben Botica
ChipsteadQuin (IP Logged)
15 May, 2018 16:29
Quote:
never sleep
That game wasn't lost just by Ben. The S/H could have dealt with the ball (i.e. dotted it down) instead of passing to Ben. The crowd could have counted down the clock so that both the SH and Ben could have realised that time was up. The touch judge could have ruled the ball out from the kick (which from memory, I think it actually was marginally out) - Also, the team could have realised that the ball was still in play and actually defended.
But, from memory, I think it was Ben Foden who actually scored a fairly good try. He should really get a great deal of the credit as there were a lot of opportunities for Saints to mess up between Ben kicking the ball and the try being scored.
Basically, Saints won the game by staying calm under pressure. We lost the game by not.

Agreed , he'd have been better off dropping it than kicking it , that being said , sadly he didn't learn from that brain freeze and then proceeded to boot the ball away with the clock in the red and us 7 points behind in the Challenge Cup Final ..

 
Re: Ben Botica
Arlequin (IP Logged)
15 May, 2018 17:32
I fell a bit sorry for the bloke, he was brought in as a second 10 behind Nev and in the main did a very good job, I think his kicking stats were better than Nevs and that includes the fact that Nev didn't take on anything long range! He wasn't bad ball in hand he made quite a few line breaks. He was never a 12 so bit harsh to judge him on that and will be remembered for handing Northampton the game and didn't he also kick the ball away when time was in the red against Montpellier when we needed a try? Good for him that he has got his career back on track.

 
Re: Ben Botica
thomh (IP Logged)
15 May, 2018 17:41
Quote:
never sleep
The touch judge could have ruled the ball out from the kick (which from memory, I think it actually was marginally out) - Also, the team could have realised that the ball was still in play and actually defended.

I think it looks out in real time but if you slow the video down using the settings button at the bottom right of the youtube video you can see it actually lands infield. Some sort of very minor optical illusion.

 
Re: Ben Botica
RodneyRegis (IP Logged)
15 May, 2018 18:01
Quote:
never sleep
That game wasn't lost just by Ben. The S/H could have dealt with the ball (i.e. dotted it down) instead of passing to Ben. The crowd could have counted down the clock so that both the SH and Ben could have realised that time was up. The touch judge could have ruled the ball out from the kick (which from memory, I think it actually was marginally out) - Also, the team could have realised that the ball was still in play and actually defended.
But, from memory, I think it was Ben Foden who actually scored a fairly good try. He should really get a great deal of the credit as there were a lot of opportunities for Saints to mess up between Ben kicking the ball and the try being scored.
Basically, Saints won the game by staying calm under pressure. We lost the game by not.

Nah. It was totally Botica's fault.

 
Re: Ben Botica
MickyThe Lunch (IP Logged)
20 May, 2018 09:52
At one of the points where he'd had a run of games and was looking quite handy a few were asking whether he could be England qualified, so he couldn't have been that bad. I don't think we can absolve him of the Saints injury time mess as the ball was passed to him to hoof which he spectacularly failed to do. I'm very pleased he's managed to unlock the halfway decent player in France. Bygones and all that.

 
Re: Ben Botica
Fearless Fred (IP Logged)
20 May, 2018 11:06
I think the issue is that NEv did to his understudies what Dan Carter did to him. If NEv was fit, he was always going to start. Heck, even when he was half fit, he would normally start, so whoever his backup was over the 9 years would get just handfuls of minutes at the end of games and no real run of games to play for a chance to show that they should start games head of NEv.

Over the years Luveniyali, Clegg, Urdapietta, and Botica (and to some extent Swiel too) have all found their development effectively at the mercy of NEv's fitness. Of that list, Botica & Urdapietta have gone to French clubs & seem to be moving forward & becoming players that we thought they had the potential to be.

 
Re: Ben Botica
Jammy Git (IP Logged)
20 May, 2018 12:10
Mediocre players for a relegated side and a mid-table fallen giant respectively?



O Fortuna, velut luna statu variabilis,
semper crescis aut decrescis

 
Re: Ben Botica
Quinky Kin (IP Logged)
20 May, 2018 13:26
Quote:
Jammy Git
Mediocre players for a relegated side and a mid-table fallen giant respectively?

According to the French press, Botica is hardly mediocre. His side was relegated, true. Does that reflect on him? Quins were relegated too once.

 
Re: Ben Botica
Jammy Git (IP Logged)
20 May, 2018 20:55
Yes, we were - with mediocre players.



O Fortuna, velut luna statu variabilis,
semper crescis aut decrescis

 
Re: Ben Botica
Quinky Kin (IP Logged)
20 May, 2018 22:40
Quote:
Jammy Git
Yes, we were - with mediocre players.

I'd be interested to know on what basis you deem Botica to be a "mediocre" player. Like, for example, whether you've been watching him play since he left Quins.

 
Re: Ben Botica
Jammy Git (IP Logged)
21 May, 2018 07:31
I have seen him a few times, yes. He just isn't particularly good as a player. He has half decent feet and is a good goalkicker; given the standard of fly halves in France I'm not surprised they like him.

They'd probably go nuts over Jamie Shillcock if he moved over there.

[edited to change amusing autocorrect]



O Fortuna, velut luna statu variabilis,
semper crescis aut decrescis



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 21/05/2018 09:24 by Jammy Git.

 
Re: Ben Botica
Quinky Kin (IP Logged)
21 May, 2018 09:37
Quote:
Jammy Git
I have seen him a few times, yes. He just isn't particularly good as a player. He has half decent feet and is a good goalkicker; given the standard of fly halves in France I'm not surprised they like him.
They'd probably go nuts over Jamie Shillcock if he moved over there.

[edited to change amusing autocorrect]

Fair enough. The French seem to think that his team nearly survived the drop because of him, rather than in spite of him. But that's opinions for you. I don't think he's world class, but I do think he's a good player who performs in the right setup.

 
Re: Ben Botica
Jammy Git (IP Logged)
21 May, 2018 09:41
Fair enough.



O Fortuna, velut luna statu variabilis,
semper crescis aut decrescis


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