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Quins Style
Banstead Quin (IP Logged)
18 May, 2018 11:04
Whilst stuck on the M25 yesterday, I was listening to a bunch of Wendyball fans whinging and moaning about how their Managers have misunderstood the 'West Ham/Everton/Southampton way'(delete as appropriate) and that they'd rather play Cavalier football and lose than defensive/hard to beat football and win.

That got me thinking. With Gustard & Edwards looking like strong candidates for the HC job, they have both built their reputations on defensive rugby that wears down the opposition into making mistakes and capitalising from there.

Now bearing in mind how critical many on this site were about Sarries between 2013 & 2016 who employed exactly this approach before they opened up their game a little more, would we as fans accept this approach to slowly build up towards the open, expansive game we're known for albeit with a steelier defence.

I for one would if it was going to lead to years of success.

 
Re: Quins Style
T-Bone (IP Logged)
18 May, 2018 11:05
Yes!

 
Re: Quins Style
le tiss (IP Logged)
18 May, 2018 11:09
Yes I definitely would. It is clear something has to change given the awful embarrassing performances we have had to sit through this season.

 
Re: Quins Style
WoTQuin (IP Logged)
18 May, 2018 11:12
I would, but I am not sure I remember Edwards’ Wasps team being all about defence

 
Re: Quins Style
Quinten Poulsen (IP Logged)
18 May, 2018 11:26
I'd love Quins to have a great defence but I wouldn't want them to be as dull as Sarries were back in the day. I also don't think there's any need to play boring rugby while focussing on getting the defence working well.

 
Re: Quins Style
Banstead Quin (IP Logged)
18 May, 2018 12:45
Quote:
WoTQuin
I would, but I am not sure I remember Edwards’ Wasps team being all about defence

Sorry WoTQuin, I wasn't trying to suggest they were, just that he has spent a few years now working on Wales' defence and did sure up the Wasps defence to complement their attacking flair.

Appreciate you can't have one without the other if you want success but as that's the harder part to achieve, will be a priority.

 
Re: Quins Style
TwickGreenQuin (IP Logged)
18 May, 2018 13:21
If we get defence right the rest will follow.
Might be a few boring games while we adapt, but with confidence in defence we can start going forward in a "style" more recognisable as Quins.

At the minute we have neither. Rather go back to scratch with a hope of being entertained in Oct (for example) than face another season of having neither good defence or good forward

 
Re: Quins Style
T-Bone (IP Logged)
18 May, 2018 16:37
It's not so much a question of focusing on defence and capitalising on mistakes as Sarries did. It's going back to basics and building from there, which we did under Richards. Exeter play a pretty basic game, but because their basics are so good, eventually games open up for them. Same with Sarries after a few years where they played some horrible rugby.

The old cliche, but they say you have to earn the right to throw it around, so get the defence and set piece sorted then we have the likes of Care, Smith, Walker and Alofa who can exploit stretched defences

 
Re: Quins Style
Boonie (IP Logged)
18 May, 2018 16:50
Defence is the bedrock upon which all else rests. I've watched Quins performances in the past, home and away, where the defence was rock solid, especially 5m out, and nothing got through. It is right, of course, that if you can score at will then even with a leaky defence you can still win, and scorelines of 30+ for both sides was not uncommon when we were doing that, but it is easier to score more points than the oppo if you don't let the oppo score any points!

Sort out the defence, soak up the pressure, tire the oppo, then cut loose. As T-Bone says, we have the players to cut loose; they need the platform to play from.



"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to bleat about it all over the internet"

 
Re: Quins Style
Kent Fan (IP Logged)
18 May, 2018 18:03
Isn’t this what Deano started at Quins first off. He got the boys drilled in defence and the confidence and team spirit grew and laid the foundations for the premiership win.

We just can’t go on with the type of game we have degenerated down to recently.

 
Re: Quins Style
raedarius (IP Logged)
18 May, 2018 18:29
I seem to recall that there was a stat less than ten years ago that if the opposition got to seven phases in attack, they would not score against us.

 
Re: Quins Style
Jammy Git (IP Logged)
18 May, 2018 18:47
Quote:
Kent Fan
Isn’t this what Deano started at Quins first off. He got the boys drilled in defence and the confidence and team spirit grew and laid the foundations for the premiership win.
We just can’t go on with the type of game we have degenerated down to recently.

Yes and no. His defence first approach led us to a winter dip that ultimately caused a bit of a showdown and a change of approach. He had to be convinced to let Care et al do their thing, because we were too negative.



O Fortuna, velut luna statu variabilis,
semper crescis aut decrescis

 
Re: Quins Style
Southpaw Grammar (IP Logged)
18 May, 2018 19:11
It is a really good question and debate! As a fan of Quins, Everton and Holland, I have felt this quite keenly over the last few months! All of my teams have lost their identity (am I cursed?!) And, while Allardyce stabled the ship, I am excited about the next step without him. And nervous. With Allardyce, I felt neither emotion. Next season we would fInish 8th again, with awful football. Another season of nothing but dull stability.

From a Quins' point of view, I really want a team that plays in the open tradition that all concerned with the club pride themselves on. However, there needs to be a real understanding of the modern game. Therefore, knowing when to be pragmatic is important too.

I have a lot of time for Shaun Edwardo but I think we need him, and someone else, to allow us to be tough-tackling and then creative and fleet of foot in attack! Am I asking too much?!

The new DOR and his team can work wonders with this squad, if they have the clarity of vision and the clarity of instruction.

 
Re: Quins Style
talkshowhost86 (IP Logged)
18 May, 2018 19:20
Get the basics right first and then build the 'style' on top of that.

You have to earn the right to be expansive and creative and in recent years we haven't even come close to doing that.

Our 'style' needs to be about winning to start with. Then we can start to work on how we win.

 
Re: Quins Style
QuinAlan (IP Logged)
18 May, 2018 20:07
We need to start with getting everyone fit & dynamic enough first..!!

 
Re: Quins Style
Scaramouche (IP Logged)
19 May, 2018 09:00
I don't know. I quite like the West Ham approach. You score 3 and we'll score 5.



If at first you don't succeed, Try, Try and Try again.

 
Re: Quins Style
Roaming Quin (IP Logged)
19 May, 2018 15:28
Defence wins games its that simple. I would take boring and winning over flambouyant and losing any day. Get the D right for the first 60 and pretty much score at will for the final 20 pret much like Chiefs and Sarries do on their best days.

We have to remember that Rugby at this level is all about titles and winning looking good while doing it is a bonus, that said if its done right you win and make it look good, just like our 2012 campaign.

 
Re: Quins Style
Yareet (IP Logged)
19 May, 2018 19:20
Quote:
Roaming Quin
Defence wins games its that simple. I would take boring and winning over flambouyant and losing any day. .

Two points:

Wasps have won plenty of games by focusing on attack
You might be happy with that style. Others wouldn’t (see Everton, Man U and even Sarries 3 years ago).

 
Re: Quins Style
HonkyTonk (IP Logged)
19 May, 2018 20:05
Quote:
Yareet
Quote:
Roaming Quin
Defence wins games its that simple. I would take boring and winning over flambouyant and losing any day. .

Two points:

Wasps have won plenty of games by focusing on attack
You might be happy with that style. Others wouldn’t (see Everton, Man U and even Sarries 3 years ago).

Not won any trophies though

The Sarries of today (that put a load of points on Wasps) was built on that team from 3 years ago etc.

You will win nothing shipping 30 points every game. We need to go back to basics to move forward. Defence and set piece. Then worry about playing like the Harlem Globetrotters.

The comparison with boring football is different to rugby. I've not seen any rugby side play for a draw. As a west ham fan I have seen us play plenty of games happy for a draw this season, no attempt to win, just attempts not to lose and take the point. That is where the complaints come from.

 
Re: Quins Style
Quinten Poulsen (IP Logged)
19 May, 2018 20:08
Sarries weren't still boring 3 years ago.

 
Re: Quins Style
Saintquin (IP Logged)
19 May, 2018 22:22
I started watching Quins because they entertained me. after a match I go to my local and was always asked how it went. I always tell them if it was a good or boing game , before telling them the score. It didn't matter if we won or lost.
This season though I was very rarely entertained but, I don't think that's got anything to do with defence!



Harlequins, (was once) probably the best rugby club in the world!
(Sm115)(Sm115)(Sm115)

 
Re: Quins Style
Roaming Quin (IP Logged)
20 May, 2018 11:13
Quote:
Yareet
Quote:
Roaming Quin
Defence wins games its that simple. I would take boring and winning over flambouyant and losing any day. .

Two points:

Wasps have won plenty of games by focusing on attack
You might be happy with that style. Others wouldn’t (see Everton, Man U and even Sarries 3 years ago).

1. The successful Wasps teams were well drilled in defence.
2. That’s the point of this board you can express opinion and that is my one.

 
Re: Quins Style
Banstead Quin (IP Logged)
20 May, 2018 16:40
As someone who keeps an eye out for West Ham results, I don’t remember many where they conceded 3 and scored 5 so don’t get that one.

As for not playing for a draw, isn’t the Rugby Equivilent the losing bonus point?

 
Re: Quins Style
Scaramouche (IP Logged)
21 May, 2018 11:14
I was watching Hammers in the sixties!



If at first you don't succeed, Try, Try and Try again.

 
Re: Quins Style
Brown Bottle (IP Logged)
21 May, 2018 13:20
Quote:
Scaramouche
I was watching Hammers in the sixties!

Quote:
Harry Redknapp on his time at West ham
Even when they had Moore, Hurst and Peters, West Ham’s average finish was about 17th. It just shows how useless the other eight of us were.



BB

 
Re: Quins Style
Scaramouche (IP Logged)
21 May, 2018 14:14
Love Harry. Just after his home had been raided by police and his computers impounded he was doing a press conference. Someone asked him a question about future plans and he said, "oh I'll send you an email about it. Oh, wait...."



If at first you don't succeed, Try, Try and Try again.

 
Re: Quins Style
Brown Bottle (IP Logged)
21 May, 2018 18:45
smiling smiley



BB

 
Re: Quins Style
HonkyTonk (IP Logged)
21 May, 2018 20:42
Ive been to a few Q & A nights with ex players (West Ham) and not many have good words to say about Redknapp!!!

 
Re: Quins Style
Brown Bottle (IP Logged)
21 May, 2018 22:27
Quote:
HonkyTonk
Ive been to a few Q & A nights with ex players (West Ham) and not many have good words to say about Redknapp!!!

As a manager or a player?



BB

 
Re: Quins Style
HonkyTonk (IP Logged)
21 May, 2018 22:46
Quote:
Brown Bottle
Quote:
HonkyTonk
Ive been to a few Q & A nights with ex players (West Ham) and not many have good words to say about Redknapp!!!

As a manager or a player?

As a bloke!!!


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