rugbyunion
Latest News:

The Unofficial Northampton Saints Supporters' Message Board




Eif Jones
Rolling Maul
Eif Jones (IP Logged)
31 December, 2012 02:29
Over the last year there have been 3 occasionsthat I've seen where a team has rolled a maul but all the defenders have disengaged so that the 'maul' goes on unopposed with the ball in possession of the player at the back.
In Australia, Joubert penalised Wales for a full penalty, deliberate obstruction apparently.
Earlier this season in a Rabo game, Owens gave an accidental off-side scrum suggesting that the maul is only legal if the ball is at the front.
Yesterday, Small penalised the Glos second row for tackling the ball player, apparently in the side so yellow card.

Three all but identical situations, three different refereeing decisions. Not a popular man on this board but Owens is the one who got it right. Its not a full penalty as the guys at the back can't know there is no opposition so its hardly deliberate. Its not a maul, therefore its open play and the ball carrier can be tackled.

 
Rubadubdub; remember Seb Tubb?
Re: Rolling Maul
31 December, 2012 07:41
I Remember Italy not engaging in a maul from a line-out. Literally all eight players stepped away from the maul, it began to move forward and one of the Italian players just walked around to the back of the maul and tackled the ball player; not a maul, because no opposition involved. As Eif said, I suppose strictly speaking that it should have been a free kick for accidental off side. Ever since this I have wondered why other teams have not adopted the same tactic?

 
St.Rich Joe's Dad
Re: Rolling Maul
31 December, 2012 08:10
Because it relies on sir to get it right and the opposition not to disengage and make you look silly



No alcohol for January. I'm a dryathlete in aid of cancer research.

Dryathlon

 
Rubadubdub; remember Seb Tubb?
Re: Rolling Maul
31 December, 2012 08:26
Sir will get it right if dialogue is made prior to the match via the captain, something along the lines of, "sir, what would happen if...etc." It's a captain's prerogative to query a referees interpretation of the laws.

 
Stopsy
Re: Rolling Maul
Stopsy (IP Logged)
31 December, 2012 11:41
I think the difference between the Italian example above and the Gloucester one is that Gloucester were engaged in a maul and then disengaged, so it was a maul, whereas a maul was never formed in the Italian game.

 
tubby shark
Re: Rolling Maul
Saint Tub (IP Logged)
31 December, 2012 12:16
Have to say - with the use it on twice ref call - I think the rolling maul definitely has its place

Defending teams can either step away - the ref will give a pen as long as no player engages or one player (only) can pull down the maul (brave given the weight that will land on them)

A lot of teams including us have been done for early shift - the lifters getting ahead of the ball in the lineout setting up the maul and so 'blocking' offside

As Sarries showed - a decent maul can be stopped as Gerrit did - going straight though it (classiest moment of his saints career so far) or by using pillars to stop it once putting the onus on the mauling side to do something

It stops the game being 15 man rugby league - ties in 'generic' big hitting locks and flankers and creates space out wide - and if your technique is flawed and you go too high - its unstoppable (as Quins last season and Sarries yesterday both did to us)

Eif - in your examples
- Wales got ahead of the ball in the lineout pre maul - clear offside penalty
- Hard to comment re the rabo example - clearly the ball is NEVER at the front of a controlled maul - so Owen got the call as you described totally wrong - did the maul roll into a player from their own side ?
- James - maul was engaged - he came in at the side.. tried to 'creep' along the maul and then tackled the last man - the pen (and yellow) wasn't for the tackle - it was for the offside and deliberate killing of the maul - Will knew exactly what he was doing - we should have done the same -v- Quins and we might have been in the prem final last year

 
Sometime lurker
Re: Rolling Maul
Sometime lurker (IP Logged)
31 December, 2012 13:33
Owens call for accidental offside can only have been accurate if the ball carrier at the back had the ball before he bound to the maul.

 
tubby shark
Re: Rolling Maul
Saint Tub (IP Logged)
31 December, 2012 13:46
I thought of that too SL - but isn't that then truck and trailer (and a straight arm pen) ?

Sort of thing I was thinking of would be a guy running back around on-side - the maul rolls into him as he comes around (kind of thing)..

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Rolling Maul
MoANjAm (IP Logged)
31 December, 2012 17:10
Quote:
Rubadubdub; remember Seb Tubb?
Sir will get it right if dialogue is made prior to the match via the captain, something along the lines of, "sir, what would happen if...etc." It's a captain's prerogative to query a referees interpretation of the laws.

I suppose its the captains perogative to also enquire "What if their number 8 Karate Kicks the ball out of our scrum half's hands, whilst still bound - is that ok Sir?".



"supĚportĚer"

Noun:
1.A person who approves of and encourages someone or something (typically a public figure, a movement or party, or a policy).
2.A person who is actively interested in and wishes success for a particular sports team.



http://www.smurfomatic.plus.com/mo.gif

 
Rubadubdub; remember Seb Tubb?
Re: Rolling Maul
31 December, 2012 17:20
Quote:
MoANjAm
Quote:
Rubadubdub; remember Seb Tubb?
Sir will get it right if dialogue is made prior to the match via the captain, something along the lines of, "sir, what would happen if...etc." It's a captain's prerogative to query a referees interpretation of the laws.

I suppose its the captains perogative to also enquire "What if their number 8 Karate Kicks the ball out of our scrum half's hands, whilst still bound - is that ok Sir?".

...'fraid you've lost me there old boy... Have I missed something??

 
St Owen
Re: Rolling Maul
St Owen (IP Logged)
31 December, 2012 17:26
What a good post from Eif (I'll gloss over the bit about Owens). A bit of rugby debate. Proof that he isn't just the automated-welsh-spam-bot he usually makes himself out to be.



You can't always get what you want, But if you try sometimes well you might find, You get what you need.

Richards/Jagger


Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.
We record all IP addresses on the Sportnetwork message boards which may be required by the authorities in case of defamatory or abusive comment. We seek to monitor the Message Boards at regular intervals. We do not associate Sportnetwork with any of the comments and do not take responsibility for any statements or opinions expressed on the Message Boards. If you have any cause for concern over any material posted here please let us know as soon as possible by e-mailing abuse@sportnetwork.net
 
 

Who is online?

Total users online:  

Most users online:  

Users on this site:  

Where are they?