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One Sarries observation (left field)
Discussion started by St tub , 17 October, 2017 17:34
One Sarries observation (left field)
St tub 17 October, 2017 17:34
Could just be "marketing" but I'm pretty sure the players own the concessions at the ground from the "banter" pre match vs Wasps

Brad B owning the coffee franchise
Wyles owns the double decker beer bus concession called Wolfpacker lager with Hargreaves
Apparently (this is 100% hearsay) other guys have held sports festivals at the grounds etc..

That's clever (if true)

Re: One Sarries observation (left field)
SarrieSaint 17 October, 2017 18:04
Not sure about the last bit but the first two bits are correct. Barritt has a coffee company called "Tiki Tonga" which I think he set up last season but this season has a presence at the ground. Wyles and Hargreaves set up Wolfpack Lager several years ago and sell in numerous pubs as well as at the ground.

Happens at other clubs too, Ollie Kohn with the Jolly Hog at Quins being the other example that springs to mind.

Re: One Sarries observation (left field)
bg 17 October, 2017 18:20
I think tubs was inferring something else..

Re: One Sarries observation (left field)
shendy 17 October, 2017 19:08
Impressive that people starting up in business get such lucrative contracts *

Re: One Sarries observation (left field)
stjj 17 October, 2017 19:18
Outside the cap?

Re: One Sarries observation (left field)
Innings 17 October, 2017 19:18
Brilliant deduction. Are you privy to the terms of the concessions?

Given that Wolfpack lager sells in over 50 London pubs, I doubt that a site that opens for five hours a maximum of 18 times a year is hugely important to them in financial terms. But then, they're probably being paid in gold bars in SA to be there.

However, harping on an on, and yet more on, about dodgy payments does excuse you from having to wonder about things like the action on the pitch.



Innings

Points win matches: tries win hearts and minds.

Re: One Sarries observation (left field)
Squawker2 17 October, 2017 19:26
Innings, you missed out Brad and Wyles then subsidising the other players by way of bitcoin transfer!



-----------------------------------------------------

Stuart Barnes is a Cock Womble

Re: One Sarries observation (left field)
andysaint 17 October, 2017 19:36
Coffee sounds like a popular business to be in at the moment. Looking on Twitter, some of our lads have got some fancy machines, some of the Bath players have/had an interest in a coffee shop. Jimmys iced coffee is popular in clubs. Mujati of course has his beer.

Tom Wood has quite an interest in wood work as does Waller I think. Are more and more players starting up businesses on the side now as an alternative to rugby post a playing career?

Re: One Sarries observation (left field)
herbie85 17 October, 2017 19:40
If you were looking for bites you got a couple! Bravo. But in all seriousness why would you look to go around the cap when there is no sanction?

Re: One Sarries observation (left field)
ch saint 17 October, 2017 20:06
I think its laudable that a club encourages its player to develop any form of alternative income.
However before people start getting excited I suggest you look at the crowd size at Sarries, its pretty thin gruel to use as a launch pad for a business, but good experience nonetheless.

Re: One Sarries observation (left field)
saracen1971 17 October, 2017 21:36
Edit.. what's the point. We won cos the refs bent we cheat.. Owens a thug.. we're always offside and we pay our players in under the counter cash.

Oh and we have 6 fans.

Don't sack Jim. We want him to stay.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 18/10/2017 01:07 by saracen1971.

Re: One Sarries observation (left field)
herbie85 18 October, 2017 07:40
Quote:
saracen1971
Edit.. what's the point. We won cos the refs bent we cheat.. Owens a thug.. we're always offside and we pay our players in under the counter cash.
Oh and we have 6 fans.

Don't sack Jim. We want him to stay.

Almost lost an arm with this bite...*

Re: One Sarries observation (left field)
Stevie Myler's right boot 18 October, 2017 09:45
We are coming across as bad losers here
The by far the better team won on the day
We need to look at ourselves rather than bleating
It's not luck as they have put 50+ points on us twice in little over 6 week
We should aspire to get to the level of intensity that they have shown
From me well done Sarries

Re: One Sarries observation (left field)
St tub 18 October, 2017 10:14
Wasn't my point at all

I was curious as to how Sarries do fund things

If you offered someone 50k to play (rather than 100k) you'd expect to be laughed at
Separately (and totally legally) give a commercial business loan to a limited company to set up a coffee franchise
Then guarantee that franchise prime position at a sporting ground with no competition (albeit 18 times a year) to cut its teeth
Provide mentoring and support to these guys, from tax advice, commercial contacts
They still have to succeed but what a perk!
Plus - it's no wonder the guys eulogize about Sarries - its more than just a 2 year contract

Contrast to Saints
Mooj had no presence selling his craft beers at our ground, there's no (pre Xmas) stall letting Woody / Alex sell their chopping boards etc to fans (who would buy them).. not a fortune but if they made a couple of thousand..

There was no implied (or even veiled) criticism of Sarries, more why the #@~% do we not do things like that, in the same way I'd said to Chris W - the plastic returnable cups

One per player - numbered - people will collect them
Limited edition ones for special games..
Does that get us a million, no
Does it make us more money than today - probably yes

Re: One Sarries observation (left field)
TringSaint 18 October, 2017 12:30
Very good St Tub.
I think you have something there!!

How many players are paid as individuals or as companies? Easy to lose cash in a commercial loan that has nothing to do with the playing side of the game.

Bit like Ryanair allegedly forcing all of its pilots to set up Irish companies and sell their services to the airline via a 3rd party thus removing all need to pay holiday, sickness or pensions!!

Nice!*

Re: One Sarries observation (left field)
riverlodge 18 October, 2017 12:37
got to agree St Tub.

it's intelligent, its enlightened, its encouraging player off field development and further increases their interest in the commercial development of the club where their 'business' operates.

unless you begin to have rules around trading commercial contracts at under-value, its also legitimate and almost impossible to argue against.

Foden's hair salon anyone?

Re: One Sarries observation (left field)
Wilson Pickett 18 October, 2017 14:29
Quote:
saracen1971
Edit.. what's the point. We won cos the refs bent we cheat.. Owens a thug.. we're always offside and we pay our players in under the counter cash.
Oh and we have 6 fans.

Don't sack Jim. We want him to stay.


“We are gonna need a bigger boat”


Saracens rugby-wise are to be absolutely admired.... not sure anyone doesn’t think this and if they do, they should have a re-think.

Re: One Sarries observation (left field)
tedge 18 October, 2017 18:18
If Saints managed to poach Mark McCall as DoR would he be able to achieve similar results in the FG environment ?

Re: One Sarries observation (left field)
Tom Paine 18 October, 2017 18:32
The Dorian West Book Club? Sorry, couldn't resist.

Re: One Sarries observation (left field)
Waldo 19 October, 2017 15:58
Quote:
St tub
Wasn't my point at all
I was curious as to how Sarries do fund things

If you offered someone 50k to play (rather than 100k) you'd expect to be laughed at
Separately (and totally legally) give a commercial business loan to a limited company to set up a coffee franchise
Then guarantee that franchise prime position at a sporting ground with no competition (albeit 18 times a year) to cut its teeth
Provide mentoring and support to these guys, from tax advice, commercial contacts
They still have to succeed but what a perk!
Plus - it's no wonder the guys eulogize about Sarries - its more than just a 2 year contract

Contrast to Saints
Mooj had no presence selling his craft beers at our ground, there's no (pre Xmas) stall letting Woody / Alex sell their chopping boards etc to fans (who would buy them).. not a fortune but if they made a couple of thousand..

There was no implied (or even veiled) criticism of Sarries, more why the #@~% do we not do things like that, in the same way I'd said to Chris W - the plastic returnable cups

One per player - numbered - people will collect them
Limited edition ones for special games..
Does that get us a million, no
Does it make us more money than today - probably yes

Can i just say that it is generally well known that one of the "perks" at Sarries is that they actively help all the squad in activities that prepare them for life after rugby. Whether that be education , mentoring , training , placements etc

Can only be a good thing in my view - a rugby career is relatively short - and far from it being "dodgy dealing" it can act as a good incentive. Win - Win .

Re: One Sarries observation (left field)
Innings 19 October, 2017 19:34
I think it's a clear duty of clubs in any professional sport to prepare players for life after the sport. Not all players can be coaches, commentators hospitality ambassadors, and after ten - fifteen years as a professional, most will have at least thirty years of working life ahead of them. Clubs that take them in, use them and spit them out deserve to be well down the pecking order when players and their agents are weighing up the options.



Innings

Points win matches: tries win hearts and minds.

Re: One Sarries observation (left field)
Wrench 20 October, 2017 10:40
As much as I don't / didn't like the original Sarries model of funding an improving team with a bucket load of outside cash that can't be sustained through rugby activities, they've started to absolutely lead the way in many areas of what professional rugby clubs should be doing. This is probably the best example, recognising that a pro rugby career is very short and actively helping players to set up outside interests and gain skills that will help them as and when retirement comes. That extra life security will have huge benefits on the playing field too as fostering start up initiatives within the club will help strengthen ties between players and club. Your good players are then much less likely to accept a big contract elsewhere because having access to facilities and seeding captital for your fledgling business idea becomes more important than a short term extra 20 or 30k per annum.

It also adds to the sense of community around the club in general. Keeps old faces that have forged the culture and had success involved. How much better would you enjoy your match day pint if it had come from the hard work of one of the players than carlsberg group plc? We may well not have seen Mujati moving onto racing when he did if we'd done something similar on a regular basis with the beers he was producing.

Something i'd be looking at hugely if I were at saints at the moment would be transitioning Daisy into some kind of 'player outside interest' role as he winds down his playing career. He's clearly got the nouse and the passion for improving the player's lot in life given his great work with the PRA - why not see if we can persuade him to focus on that purely for saints players and see if we can reap the benefits as a selling point for us as a club.

Also, final added point, but if the player's start up ventures are successful, you can bet sarries will be generating shareholder money with a generous stake they've taken given the seed money they have made available. Wouldn't it be wonderful if the beers at the ground were provided by a brewery that the saints part own...

Re: One Sarries observation (left field)
riverlodge 20 October, 2017 12:50
exactly wrench, and a really good point about Daisy thumbs down


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