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SaintsAsh
Saints VS Sale
SaintsAsh (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 15:11
Getting killed at the breakdown, our lightweight back row cannot clear them out. Our back row look like little ants trying to move bears.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/03/2018 15:25 by SaintsAsh.

 
Nath-coys
Re: Saints VS Sale
Nath-coys (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 15:17
Would let the rest of the game pan out yet.

Body positions, technique, support play.

England had a bigger back row than Scotland and they killed us at the breakdown.

 
SaintsAsh
Re: Saints VS Sale
SaintsAsh (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 15:27
Quote:
Nath-coys
Would let the rest of the game pan out yet.
Body positions, technique, support play.

England had a bigger back row than Scotland and they killed us at the breakdown.

Scotland killed us on our own ball by getting to the breakdown first, Sale are doing the same.

 
Nath-coys
Re: Saints VS Sale
Nath-coys (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 15:30
You just said it was down too size mate?

But if they are getting there first that would imply support play and mobility?

We are getting the push on in the srum though....

 
Christoff
Re: Saints VS Sale
smitferbrainz (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 15:32
Still in a relegation battle for me. Relying on Irish remaining awful. How lucky we are. We continue trying to give them something to play for.

 
SaintsAsh
Re: Saints VS Sale
SaintsAsh (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 15:33
Quote:
Nath-coys
You just said it was down too size mate?
But if they are getting there first that would imply support play and mobility?

We are getting the push on in the srum though....

I said we cannot clear them out, which means they had to be there first for them to get on the ball. They are getting there slightly before us and we cannot move them.

 
SaintsAsh
Re: Saints VS Sale
SaintsAsh (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 15:35
Brookes standing waaaay offside, how does he not know he is offside, HIA?

 
TringSaint
Re: Saints VS Sale
TringSaint (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 15:37
Eek, 3 tries down. Iím off to Tesco to do some shopping as this looks like itís gojmg to be painful.

Note to saints, Solomona is fast and a good finisher. Might want to tackle him early!!

 
Whiston Saint
Re: Saints VS Sale
Whiston Saint (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 15:38
Bonus point try to Sale.

Obviously worth all the effort of getting the match on.

 
jdusty964
Re: Saints VS Sale
jdusty (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 15:39
U cant listen to this anymore what is happened to us?

 
Deesaint
Re: Saints VS Sale
Deesaint (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 15:39
I wonder if saints are aware that they can compete at the breakdown ?

 
SaintsAsh
Re: Saints VS Sale
SaintsAsh (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 15:41
Brussow just went into a breakdown, got there first and was swatted like a fly. When we try to clear them out after they get there first, we cannot budge them at all. The difference is night and day.

 
SaintsAsh
Re: Saints VS Sale
SaintsAsh (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 15:41
Brussow just went into a breakdown, got there first and was swatted like a fly. When we try to clear them out after they get there first, we cannot budge them at all. The difference is night and day.

 
TringSaint
Re: Saints VS Sale
TringSaint (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 15:42
Sooooo, who still thinks the issue was Jim, or the 15 muppets wearing the shirts??

 
Saint Wilf
Re: Saints VS Sale
Saint Wilf (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 15:43
Solomona running riot.

I recall being pilloried on here for suggesting he was a good union prospect - seems I was right after all!!

 
Saint_ST
Re: Saints VS Sale
Saint_ST (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 15:46
Only about 50% attendance. If only that many of the team had shown up. They've lost interest.

 
Welby1977
Re: Saints VS Sale
Welby1977 (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 15:47
I think the players are still on snow day! Roll on next season, a good clear out required.

 
Duckonstilts
Re: Saints VS Sale
Duckonstilts (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 15:48
Jim hired the 15 Muppets. We have a weak squad. 6 wingers and none fit or good enough to play? No beef in the back row?

We might improve after the break though

 
andysaint
Re: Saints VS Sale
andysaint (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 15:50
What an absolute shower playing and coaching wise. Is anyone playing or coaching wise bothering to stand up and be counted?

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Saints VS Sale
Stockers (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 15:50
Thatís at least 17 who havenít shown up. Me, the Mrs and 15 professional rugby players.....

 
SaintsAsh
Re: Saints VS Sale
SaintsAsh (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 15:52
I think our back row balance is the worst in the league, maybe not the worst players but the balance is really bad, really really bad.

 
HungryLikeTheWolf
Re: Saints VS Sale
Wilson Pickett (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 15:52
The defence is a joke


All of the rest is irrelevant, if you ship 30 points in a half when possession stats arenít hugely in their favour .... you know you have a problem?

Is Hopley still defence coach? I canít keep up with it these days...

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Saints VS Sale
SaintMaul (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 15:54
Try bonus to the mighty Sale side by half time.

How many players are there in the match-day 23 who are unlikely to be with us next season? Why are we giving them game time when we have seen them capitulate time and again. We're not going to be relegated. Give players who will give their all and be here next season a go.

If we had Sarries or Bath's money we'd be letting a number of players and coaches go who are in contract and accepting the cost and writing off bad debts.

Oh and yet another lightweight Saints pack picked.

My heart goes out to the volunteers who helped clear the snow just so they could watch this.

 
Saint Wilf
Re: Saints VS Sale
Saint Wilf (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 15:54
We can always blame Wayne Barnes!!

 
Christoff
Re: Saints VS Sale
smitferbrainz (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 15:56
Following it on Saints Live. Well was following it. Bl00dy embarrassing sitting several hundred miles away and following it. It's just staggering at how bad we have become. Like I said before we're lucky to have Irish the way they are. Hopefully the dressing room will be an interesting place to be at half time. Need 18 unanswered points just to get a losing bonus. They're a joke.

 
ElySaint
Re: Saints VS Sale
ElySaint (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 16:00
Quote:
SaintsAsh
Brussow just went into a breakdown, got there first and was swatted like a fly. When we try to clear them out after they get there first, we cannot budge them at all. The difference is night and day.

I was skeptical about him signing and so far I've seen nothing exceptional from him

 
tedge
Re: Saints VS Sale
tedge (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 16:01
I am ashamed to say that I went home at half time. Whatever the outcome the first half performance was an insult to the supporters who bothered to turn out.

 
OlneySaint2
Re: Saints VS Sale
OlneySaint2 (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 16:09
Scrum showing promise. If we score next, we're in the game. I know it's disappointing, but I don't see this particular match as embarrassing.

 
SaintsAsh
Re: Saints VS Sale
SaintsAsh (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 16:13
Thankfully we look much better against 14 men, and with Sales two best players at the breakdown off the pitch smiling smiley

 
Christoff
Re: Saints VS Sale
smitferbrainz (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 16:17
Quote:
OlneySaint2
Scrum showing promise. If we score next, we're in the game. I know it's disappointing, but I don't see this particular match as embarrassing.

6-31 at HT not embarrassing? Okay.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Saints VS Sale
SaintMaul (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 16:26
Quote:
OlneySaint2
Scrum showing promise. If we score next, we're in the game. I know it's disappointing, but I don't see this particular match as embarrassing.

Saints' starting 15 has 11 internationals. We are at home playing the team in 8th place in the league. We concede 4 tries and the try bonus point at home in the first half.

How bad does it have to be before it's embarrassing?

 
tedge
Re: Saints VS Sale
tedge (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 16:27
It was the most embarrassing performance I have seen in 40 years and I've seen some bad ones

 
SaintsAsh
Re: Saints VS Sale
SaintsAsh (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 16:28
Getting very angry, we missed a tackle then spent 5 seconds on floor feeling sorry ourselves, get on your f*&k*n feet and sort your ****** life out. Show some passion.

 
OlneySaint2
Re: Saints VS Sale
OlneySaint2 (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 16:39
Didn't expect my post about it being disappointing, but not embarrassing to met with universal agreement. We've done well in the scrum, not given up and shown that, with the bounce of the ball, we can play good rugby. As I said, we're in this.

 
SaintsAsh
Re: Saints VS Sale
SaintsAsh (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 16:44
Quote:
OlneySaint2
Didn't expect my post about it being disappointing, but not embarrassing to met with universal agreement. We've done well in the scrum, not given up and shown that, with the bounce of the ball, we can play good rugby. As I said, we're in this.

A class response mate smiling smiley

 
SaintsAsh
Re: Saints VS Sale
SaintsAsh (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 16:46
Nice attacking play that is again ended by a poor clearout.

 
St.Sinner
Re: Saints VS Sale
St.Sinner (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 16:47
Think I just witnessed the worst clear out attempt ever from Van Wyk, just cuddled him and fell on his a$$. Penalty to Sale for saints player holding on. Brilliant 😂

 
SaintsAsh
Re: Saints VS Sale
SaintsAsh (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 16:51
Barnes just wasted 10 seconds sending of a Sale ball boy. Sale kicked it out on the 80 mins and 7 seconds. But two penalties to to get the bonus turned down?????



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/03/2018 16:52 by SaintsAsh.

 
St.Sinner
Re: Saints VS Sale
St.Sinner (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 16:53
Quote:
SaintsAsh
Barnes just wasted 10 seconds sending of a Sale ball boy. Sale kicked it out on the 80 mins and 7 seconds.

Damn him, I had a feeling we were going to score 2 converted tries in those 3 seconds....

 
Chris1850
Re: Saints VS Sale
Chris1850 (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 16:53
Quote:
Saint Wilf
We can always blame Wayne Barnes!!

Why would you blame him? He was your extra man!

 
andysaint
Re: Saints VS Sale
andysaint (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 16:54
What can you say? Our season finished months ago, all parties are seemingly just winding down until the summer break.

 
CoventrianSaint
Re: Saints VS Sale
CoventrianSaint (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 16:55
Using my Mystic Meg PR/Media ball, i predict the following sentence will be mentioned post match ďthat first half was not acceptable, however there are some positives to take away, and we did win the second halfĒ............ sounding all too familiar this season

 
Angus67
Re: Saints VS Sale
Angus67 (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 16:56
Angry, I am very, very angry.

but to make myself feel better, next week I shall go to work on Monday morning, do sweet FA until Wednesday lunch time, then work really hard but still fail to achieve anything. But at knock off on Friday I will go home feeling safe knowing that 2 other people in my company are performing even worse the me.

Does that sound familiar ?

 
Christoff
Re: Saints VS Sale
smitferbrainz (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 16:58
So we get nothing from a home match against Sale. Story of the season. Hopefully Wasps will continue the "let's help Saints" run tomorrow. Fortress Gardens eh? Do you think we can stop Saracens bagging another 50?

 
The Buck
Re: Saints VS Sale
The Buck (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 16:58
Absolutely rubbish. Stat after the game Saints made 77 tackles missed 20 tackles - that is dreadful

We try and play a power game but donít have the players to do it - only Harrison can get us going forward

Our first team Squad is very average and as soon as we clear out some of the average players we have we will continue to lag behind.

Letís not expect Boyd to work miracles with this lot

 
17 stone bull
Re: Saints VS Sale
Bustabloodvessel (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 16:59
Lol saints are like a cheap Christmas cracker joke this season.



"I HAVE A BIG ONE".

 
SuffolkSaint
Re: Saints VS Sale
SuffolkSaint (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 17:02
We need to stop picking players by name and start picking by form!

Have a look at the team that beat a strong Sale away just a few weeks back.

 
andysaint
Re: Saints VS Sale
andysaint (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 17:03
Yes the squad is not good enough but what can you do if they are in contract? There are many I would like to see move(d) on but we are stuck. I just hope that there is more movement out than some are letting on.

 
HungryLikeTheWolf
Re: Saints VS Sale
Wilson Pickett (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 17:08
They are scoring 25, 30 points per game


We are conceding over 30 per game


Itís not hard to see which part of our game is not up to scratch



Desperately need a full time defence expert

 
SaintsAsh
Re: Saints VS Sale
SaintsAsh (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 17:13
Quote:
HungryLikeTheWolf
They are scoring 25, 30 points per game

We are conceding over 30 per game


Itís not hard to see which part of our game is not up to scratch



Desperately need a full time defence expert

Opposition are always getting over the gain line, it is making tackling hard. Not sure a coach can fix that easily.

 
Deesaint
Re: Saints VS Sale
Deesaint (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 17:17
Quote:
Chris1850
Quote:
Saint Wilf
We can always blame Wayne Barnes!!

Why would you blame him? He was your extra man!

He is in our top three for clearing out breakdown

 
Walks11
Re: Saints VS Sale
Walks11 (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 17:34
Not sure what people expect. The malaise is deepset and is not a quick fix. We wil continue to see glimpses of good play or good games but will have some periods of really poor play right through to end of the season.

If you look at the block of games since the new year as a whole we have improved from first half but as above the problems are deep rooted so donít take much to re-surface.

Decision to move Jim on has been made, patience is now required for Boydís arrival or earlier for him putting his stamp on things both on and off the field. Set expectations low and you wonít be disappointed.

 
Hollywood JK
Re: Saints VS Sale
Hollywood JK (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 17:41
Either way, itís another loss...

That first half was simply not acceptable, no desire, totally apathy..

If I was Gaffney, I would have them in training at 8am tomorrow!

There is zero leadership in our side, and not enough players that care about the shirt!

And there is not enough recruitment for this to change next year either, regardless of a new DOR!

Itís pretty miserable all round at the moment!

 
fleetg
Re: Saints VS Sale
fleetg (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 17:47
I have stated many times that getting rid of Jim only would sort nothing. West, Dickens, Hopley need to go plus numerous players who simply are now past it or never had it. I thought this would take 2 or 3 years to sort out and still believe that to be the case. Just my opinion of course.

 
tboullem
Re: Saints VS Sale
Houghton Saint (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 17:47
1st Half : Going through the motions, not bothered, feeling sorry for themselves with Day and Wood off.

2nd Half : Better but too little too late.

Conclusions: Francis is a 12 not a 10.
Playing a genuine winger rather than makeweights can be advantageous.
Give game time to players who will be here next season.
Arguing against myself, start Myler or Grayson at outside half.
Find some real leaders.

Key Moment for me was when Saints had attacking ball despite being two tries down. Francis had already missed a regulation three points. Barnes is on the cusp of yellow carding the next Sale offender. We get a penalty in front of the posts. Nobody wants to make a decision, not Foden, not Mikey, nobody ! The scrum is going ok, Sale are on the back foot....it seems like an eternity but on comes the tee. Look, we are not going to get relegated ( even after today ) but ninth, tenth or eleventh place makes damn all difference - go for the scrum, think big points not safety three, the only way to get back into this game is tries not penalties. Sure, Francis gets the three but for Sale its a let off and before you know it they have a try bonus point before half time. This team, this squad is going to have to play their way out of this mess. What we saw today in the first half was an insult to the ground staff, academy players and supporters who worked so hard to get the game on in the first place.

Rant over !

 
Christoff
Re: Saints VS Sale
smitferbrainz (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 17:53
How many times have I heard Francis is not a 10? So many think it so you can't all be wrong, still he gets on as a 10. What's worrying for me is that we have loads of dead wood but don't appear to be recruiting to any great extent. It's obviously going to be a long job to recovery.

 
The Buck
Re: Saints VS Sale
The Buck (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 18:15
I am sure Gaffney said on his Wednesday radio Northampton interview a month / 6 weeks ago that the young players need to be given an opportunity to see what they can do

Since that interview I think we have gone the other way

Pisi and Tuitavake instead of Collins
Burrell instead of Stephenson
BrŁssow instead of Ludlum
API instead of Ribbans
Brooks instead of Hill

Why donít we give these guys ago?

They canít do any worse than the tosh served up in the first 40 today

 
SaintsAsh
Re: Saints VS Sale
SaintsAsh (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 18:37
Francis looked okay at 10 for me.

 
tboullem
Re: Saints VS Sale
Houghton Saint (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 18:41
Ash, the point is, he looks good at twelve rather than just ok at ten.

 
Sans Culottes
Re: Saints VS Sale
Sans Culottes (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 18:41
Quote:
TringSaint
Sooooo, who still thinks the issue was Jim, or the 15 muppets wearing the shirts??

Did Jim employ the muppets?

 
Brackleysaint
Re: Saints VS Sale
Brackleysaint (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 18:58
Francis can't control the game good enough for a 10, poor decision making and poor execution kicking from hand, he's far better suited to 12.

 
Big daddy 3
Re: Saints VS Sale
Big daddy 3 (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 19:12
Just absolutely clueless ,disinterested . 15 players plus coaching staff.
Should be stripped of the shirt and Marched off the premises.
Goodness knows what weíre paying mr G but is now clear JM wasnít the only one that should have fallen on his sword

 
HungryLikeTheWolf
Re: Saints VS Sale
Wilson Pickett (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 19:31
Quote:
fleetg
I have stated many times that getting rid of Jim only would sort nothing. West, Dickens, Hopley need to go plus numerous players who simply are now past it or never had it. I thought this would take 2 or 3 years to sort out and still believe that to be the case. Just my opinion of course.


if Boydy gets a full new coaching with a big number 8, lock and prop... we should be fine

 
Angus67
Re: Saints VS Sale
Angus67 (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 19:54
I don't think we will get relegated, although frankly we deserve it. As an interested observer looking in and trying to analyse, i just have a feeling that there is more to the state of the club than meets the eye.

Jim left, Gaffer arrived, a win V GLos, and Clermont suggested that things were back on track. A decent run in the LV also suggested that was the case, Bath, Saracens suggested otherwise, well, more than suggested actually but Rome wasn't built in a day.

A squeaky win against Irish, an awful first half today, but yet a massive effort against Chiefs. IT s almost a case of which team will turn up, the reports of a player not wanting to take part today is so worrying.

I will be so happy when this season is over, My expectations for next season have hit reality. Mr Boyd is a talented coach / DOR/ but he isn't a miracle worker. Mid table mediocrity with an outside chance of returning to top 6 maybe.

 
SuffolkSaint
Re: Saints VS Sale
SuffolkSaint (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 20:15
Quote:
The Buck
I am sure Gaffney said on his Wednesday radio Northampton interview a month / 6 weeks ago that the young players need to be given an opportunity to see what they can do
Since that interview I think we have gone the other way

Pisi and Tuitavake instead of Collins
Burrell instead of Stephenson
BrŁssow instead of Ludlum
API instead of Ribbans
Brooks instead of Hill

Why donít we give these guys ago?

They canít do any worse than the tosh served up in the first 40 today

+1

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Saints VS Sale
SaintMaul (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 20:31
Quote:
SuffolkSaint
Quote:
The Buck
I am sure Gaffney said on his Wednesday radio Northampton interview a month / 6 weeks ago that the young players need to be given an opportunity to see what they can do
Since that interview I think we have gone the other way

Pisi and Tuitavake instead of Collins
Burrell instead of Stephenson
BrŁssow instead of Ludlum
API instead of Ribbans
Brooks instead of Hill

Why donít we give these guys ago?

They canít do any worse than the tosh served up in the first 40 today

+1

+2

 
fleetg
Re: Saints VS Sale
fleetg (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 21:19
HLTW
It seems as though we don't disagree quite as much as I previously thought. You also think we need a whole new coaching team (at least that's the inference from your post) which as you know I think is necessary. I guess the main difference is you believe we need 3 new squad players ; I believe we need 3 times that at least.
Nothing wrong with having differing opinions Sir. Have a good rest of weekend.

 
HungryLikeTheWolf
Re: Saints VS Sale
Wilson Pickett (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 21:36
Same to you

I think current coaches are sub standard, no room for charity now. Bring in a new lot.

Player wise I think Boydy will make Harrison, Brussow, Ludlam, Ribbans, Api, Mikey, 9s, Francis, Collins, Harry look another level to what weíve seen thus far.

So I assume dramatic improvements from whoever stays from this season, across the squad.... plus a few big ball carrrying signings

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Saints VS Sale
BerniesBestFriend (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 21:57
First home game missed this season and boy am i not sorry ... just embarrassed that i gave our ST's to a colleague at work

 
tedge
Re: Saints VS Sale
tedge (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 22:06
Changing the coaching team is not straightforward. If Boyd listens to Gaffney he is unlikely to get an unbiased opinion of Dickens - they are old mates and it was Dickens who brought Gaffney on board. Furthermore Boyd has said he wants to work with English coaches - might be so but they can't be conjured up in the short term; does he even know any ? IMO he is much more likely, at least to begin with, to soldier on with what he inherits - the currently contracted coaches. Similarly with the playing squad and in both instances it will take at least a season to change anything. It is to be hoped that he is a good enough DoR to get more out of coaches and players than is currently the case, whilst assessing them all for the longer term.

 
OlneySaint2
Re: Saints VS Sale
OlneySaint2 (IP Logged)
03 March, 2018 23:05
Agree with posts about using other players. We seem to use the same players week in week out regardless. There should be demonstrable competition for each shirt. Those playing are bound to be complacent (and probably tired), They get picked whatever the result. Those not playing become down-hearted. They watch their rivals persistently losing and retaining their places. Looking at the player profiles of the squad I see several who might consider themselves on the scrapheap, many of whom are good players/prospects. If we want to see effort and heart, share some game time around, especially at this stage of the season. Other teams do. They don't overuse players and they develop their prospects. In so doing they create a playing environment in which first teamers and reserves alike can thrive and a happier dressing room.

It is interesting that we have the strongest A league side in the division. They sweep all before them, but most don't get involvement in the first team. It is interesting, as SuffolkSaint says, that our AW Cup side won away at Sale, but the players who achieved that win have to watch their first team counterparts losing at home to Sale.

 
Brackleysaint
Re: Saints VS Sale
Brackleysaint (IP Logged)
04 March, 2018 08:10
Quote:
ElySaint
Quote:
SaintsAsh
Brussow just went into a breakdown, got there first and was swatted like a fly. When we try to clear them out after they get there first, we cannot budge them at all. The difference is night and day.

I was skeptical about him signing and so far I've seen nothing exceptional from him

One player can't do everything. He is one player who could hold his head up after yesterday's performance, gave it everything. In his post match comments Gafney said Brussow has a different attitude to a lot of the other players "can't wait to get back on the pitch"

 
Shire
Re: Saints VS Sale
Shire (IP Logged)
04 March, 2018 09:09
I suspect that there are players on the pitch who expect to not be around next season and are playing accordingly.If our "reserves" are top of their tree, and not being played in the first team, is it because their tree is not that high?

 
tedge
Re: Saints VS Sale
tedge (IP Logged)
04 March, 2018 09:20
Quote:
Shire
I suspect that there are players on the pitch who expect to not be around next season and are playing accordingly.If our "reserves" are top of their tree, and not being played in the first team, is it because their tree is not that high?

Inclined to agree; although many on here make constant calls for fringe players to be used it's hard to ignore the probability that the reason they are not is because they have demonstrated in training or for the Wanderers that they really aren't good enough to make a difference. Indeed we have seen examples of this on the odd occasion they have been selected. It is a reflection of the overall quality of the squad and the players who have been recruited over the past three years, or those who have come through the academy, some of whom are not up to standard. The fact that we have the strongest second team in the country is, to me, confirmation of that.

 
Deesaint
Re: Saints VS Sale
Deesaint (IP Logged)
04 March, 2018 09:52
Quote:
tedge
Quote:
Shire
I suspect that there are players on the pitch who expect to not be around next season and are playing accordingly.If our "reserves" are top of their tree, and not being played in the first team, is it because their tree is not that high?

Inclined to agree; although many on here make constant calls for fringe players to be used it's hard to ignore the probability that the reason they are not is because they have demonstrated in training or for the Wanderers that they really aren't good enough to make a difference. Indeed we have seen examples of this on the odd occasion they have been selected. It is a reflection of the overall quality of the squad and the players who have been recruited over the past three years, or those who have come through the academy, some of whom are not up to standard. The fact that we have the strongest second team in the country is, to me, confirmation of that.

Until that first half I would agree 100%
Now I think I would rather watch 15 fighters who are proud to wear the shirt and give their best
As a supporter who although this will be the last year has brought 2 season tickets attended all sorts of expensive dinners and events I just expect a level of application that sees the efforts many put into supporting this club repaid by what happens on the pitch
Win or lose effort pride application however it is dressed has slipped from many of the so called first team

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Saints VS Sale
SaintMaul (IP Logged)
04 March, 2018 10:44
Quote:
Deesaint
Quote:
tedge
Quote:
Shire
I suspect that there are players on the pitch who expect to not be around next season and are playing accordingly.If our "reserves" are top of their tree, and not being played in the first team, is it because their tree is not that high?

Inclined to agree; although many on here make constant calls for fringe players to be used it's hard to ignore the probability that the reason they are not is because they have demonstrated in training or for the Wanderers that they really aren't good enough to make a difference. Indeed we have seen examples of this on the odd occasion they have been selected. It is a reflection of the overall quality of the squad and the players who have been recruited over the past three years, or those who have come through the academy, some of whom are not up to standard. The fact that we have the strongest second team in the country is, to me, confirmation of that.

Until that first half I would agree 100%
Now I think I would rather watch 15 fighters who are proud to wear the shirt and give their best
As a supporter who although this will be the last year has brought 2 season tickets attended all sorts of expensive dinners and events I just expect a level of application that sees the efforts many put into supporting this club repaid by what happens on the pitch
Win or lose effort pride application however it is dressed has slipped from many of the so called first team

+

I'd agree about quality from the Academy.

But any player can learn good defence and show full commitment. If theoretically higher quality players are not showing this commitment then collectively we will continue to concede easy ground and tries.

So if suggest we focus on making ourselves hard to beat by picking those who will give 100%.

We monitor player movement. How long does it take a player to get back to their feet after a tackle. The commentators replayed an example in the Quins big game about one of our starting players from yesterday taking 14 seconds to get up after a tackle.and how slow lots of us players are. Yet we have some starters like Harrison who pride themselves on getting up quickly.

How much ground do they cover. How many offensive tackles do they make - driving the player back.

These are all measured and with 50% of the game being defence would be where I'd suggest we stsrt focusing selection.

Get heart and commitment back in then worry about quality of attack.

 
ElySaint
Re: Saints VS Sale
ElySaint (IP Logged)
04 March, 2018 11:36
Quote:
Brackleysaint
Quote:
ElySaint
Quote:
SaintsAsh
Brussow just went into a breakdown, got there first and was swatted like a fly. When we try to clear them out after they get there first, we cannot budge them at all. The difference is night and day.

I was skeptical about him signing and so far I've seen nothing exceptional from him

One player can't do everything. He is one player who could hold his head up after yesterday's performance, gave it everything. In his post match comments Gafney said Brussow has a different attitude to a lot of the other players "can't wait to get back on the pitch"

That may be. However, I didn't say he could or should do everything. And I stand by my view that I have seen nothing exceptional from him. Being more committed or performing better than many other Saints players is not currently a massive task. Sure he may be steady, but nothing special, so far.

 
MarchingIn
Re: Saints VS Sale
MarchingIn (IP Logged)
04 March, 2018 11:49
Quote:
SaintsAsh
Barnes just wasted 10 seconds sending of a Sale ball boy. Sale kicked it out on the 80 mins and 7 seconds. But two penalties to to get the bonus turned down?????

Barnes was right and there should be more sanction to follow for Sale.

Said person was not wearing anything that indicated they were either a water carrier or a medic, but climbed over the boards onto the side lines, either picked up or took a ball from one of the actual ball boys and threw it onto the pitch to prevent Saints taking a tap and go.

Cynical cheating behaviour from Sale

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Saints VS Sale
Matthew (IP Logged)
04 March, 2018 17:36
Quote:
MarchingIn
Quote:
SaintsAsh
Barnes just wasted 10 seconds sending of a Sale ball boy. Sale kicked it out on the 80 mins and 7 seconds. But two penalties to to get the bonus turned down?????

Barnes was right and there should be more sanction to follow for Sale.

Said person was not wearing anything that indicated they were either a water carrier or a medic, but climbed over the boards onto the side lines, either picked up or took a ball from one of the actual ball boys and threw it onto the pitch to prevent Saints taking a tap and go.

Cynical cheating behaviour from Sale

Echoes of Tigers a few seasons back.... Did anything come of that? Nothing significant as I recall. But definitely cheating rather than gamesmanship - the individual in question knew exactly what he was doing.



ACTUAL TRAINING FOOTAGE FROM
BEHIND THE SCENES AT SARACENS:
http://images6.fanpop.com/image/photos/37800000/Scrooge-McDuck-gif-mickey-and-friends-37815657-245-188.gif

 
fair_weather_fan
Re: Saints VS Sale
fair_weather_fan (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 12:19
Quote:
Mobbs
1st Half : Going through the motions, not bothered, feeling sorry for themselves with Day and Wood off.
2nd Half : Better but too little too late.

Conclusions: Francis is a 12 not a 10.
Playing a genuine winger rather than makeweights can be advantageous.
Give game time to players who will be here next season.
Arguing against myself, start Myler or Grayson at outside half.
Find some real leaders.

Key Moment for me was when Saints had attacking ball despite being two tries down. Francis had already missed a regulation three points. Barnes is on the cusp of yellow carding the next Sale offender. We get a penalty in front of the posts. Nobody wants to make a decision, not Foden, not Mikey, nobody ! The scrum is going ok, Sale are on the back foot....it seems like an eternity but on comes the tee. Look, we are not going to get relegated ( even after today ) but ninth, tenth or eleventh place makes damn all difference - go for the scrum, think big points not safety three, the only way to get back into this game is tries not penalties. Sure, Francis gets the three but for Sale its a let off and before you know it they have a try bonus point before half time. This team, this squad is going to have to play their way out of this mess. What we saw today in the first half was an insult to the ground staff, academy players and supporters who worked so hard to get the game on in the first place.

Rant over !

Spot on. I waa saying the same to the Missus in the church's, we need to call a scrum or risk a long kick for a lienout. Sale were sacking every lineout illegally (for anyone that thinks WB had a good game he was his usal self with certian aspects of the laws ignored completely), but if they did it agan they would have lost a player for certain. Our best chance to score. Only kick a P if you are already ahead on the scoreboard.


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