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Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
Chris Hoddle (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 09:39
[www.northamptonchron.co.uk]

"We had opportunities that we can't let slip and we backed ourselves to win the game, even at half-time after the pathetic performance."

Well at least he agrees with most on here?



http://chrishoddle.smugmug.com/photos/i-TsCHdzK/0/M/i-TsCHdzK-M.gif

 
andysaint
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
andysaint (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 10:00
It does make you wonder if a batch have just been told they are being let go at the end of the season. The atmosphere must be rather toxic down there

 
undersizedprop2
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
undersizedprop2 (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 10:13
I appreciate the straight talking. Makes a change from benign platitudes.

 
St.Sinner
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
St.Sinner (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 10:55
I think when he first came in, he was fooled by the players and coaches things weren’t as bad as they are.
Now he’s been here a while now and is clearly fed up of the players@#$%&attitude and lack of direction from the coaches.
Time to air the dirty laundry that Mallinder & Co hid under the bed for so long.

Gaffney's off at the end of the season and paid regardless of where we finish, he was was here primarily to steady the ship & address the problems top to bottom. I think after settling in, his jobs now just properly begun.
He can see what’s going on, who cares, who doesn’t. And now he can bring it to the rest of the board & supporters attention.

Stuff end of season clear out, let’s start now.

 
andysaint
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
andysaint (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 11:28
You do wonder if we have seen the likes of North for the last time. If some kind of mutual termination will be agreed and he will spend some time with Wales and a region getting his fitness back. Same with one or two others, give them a release and a chance to train with a club to get a contract for next season.

 
ajack
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
ajack (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 11:52
Something is clearly very wrong at the club. No idea what or who it is, usually a split over something or someone. If it is not resolved before the start of next season it is hard to see a new coach or two will make much difference.

 
Walks11
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
Walks11 (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 12:18
As much as I hate to agree with HLTW this boils down to a cultural issue. The first thing Boyd must do is identify the toxic elements and remove them. This could be players, coaches or other back room staff. Until this is done he will be fighting a losing battle. That could lead to quite a radical and sweeping change of personnel and may also require taking a further step backwards before we can move forward. IMO it has become obvious that Dickens and the rest of the coaching team are not being listened too and not will they so wholesale changes are required in that department.

Agree ajack very difficult to turn around in time for September

 
Longers
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
Longers (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 12:26
I have to commend an idea that was attributed to Sir Clive when he was merely Mr Woodward - getting rid of the "sappers".

A common enough term in industry change management.

Get rid of Anyone with the negative attitudes. If you can't improve 5-10%year on year what are you doing?

And if coaches cannot support the team in that pursuit, change the coaches, as well as the players.

 
Casual Saint
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
Casual Saint (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 12:26
Sounds like the club needs the sort of overhaul that it had post relegation, there seemed to be exactly the same conversations taking place then about culture, attitude etc. I imagine that it will be considerably harder to undertake in the Premiership though.



Once a scrum half .... always a scrum half

 
Saint Wilf
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
Saint Wilf (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 12:41
So what has Gaffney achieved since he arrived? He looks like a rabbit in the headlights to me. No significant change of coaching staff, players, skill level, tactics or even results.

 
alwayshopeful
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
alwayshopeful (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 12:44
Just my opinion, here...

It is very clear all has not been well at the club for months and months... We ended up stuck in an ever decreasing circle that we could not get out of without a whole bunch of people admitting that they had been wrong or had just not "successful" in transition..

So, finally *(and way late) Jim goes.. this is not the solution - nor could it have been - this is just the fist part of turning things around.. Gaffneys primary focus would have had nothing to do with 2018 other than avoiding relegation. His role was to dig deep, dig fast and clean house before the new guy arrives.. The whole thing with George North, what ever the details, speaks to Gaffney calling out the culture of the club and targeting changes as necessary.

before the end of the season (or the day after at least) we will see more terminations, more people leaving and more discomfort. He will get this all done so that when the New guy arrives he is building, not demolishing.

So, to be honest, every player dropped - every coach that leaves and every change that is made now, is really just a tangible sign that changes are happening and every one should be applauded.. even if it has no impact in this season.. now, 2019-20 season... thats where we should be looking now..

 
tedge
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
tedge (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 12:48
Quote:
Saint Wilf
So what has Gaffney achieved since he arrived? He looks like a rabbit in the headlights to me. No significant change of coaching staff, players, skill level, tactics or even results.

His remit was NOT to change any of the players or coaches. He was invited to be a mentor to an Interim Head Coach and the other coaches. He can't possibly have an impact on players' skills in such s short time. He has identified some of the team's shortcomings and IMO has influenced some positive changes. His appointment was temporary with the aim being to mentor the coaches and help get us through this awful season. No way could he change things for the better overnight

 
St. Andy
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
St. Andy (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 12:57
Quote:
Saint Wilf
So what has Gaffney achieved since he arrived? He looks like a rabbit in the headlights to me. No significant change of coaching staff, players, skill level, tactics or even results.

Did we expect that any of those things were going to happen? I am not sure that hiring and firing was ever part of his remit. Or indeed coaching and skills and improving results. It must be perfectly plain by now that the playing side of the club needs radical change and that is impossible mid season and certainly cannot happen overnight. We failed to undertake evolution so now we need revolution.

I think Gaffney’s role is to come from outside so he has no axe to grind. To observe everyone coaches and players alike and then report to the board and to the new coach, where he believes the issues that are clearly blighting us lie.

 
St.Sinner
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
St.Sinner (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 13:02
Quote:
tedge
Quote:
Saint Wilf
So what has Gaffney achieved since he arrived? He looks like a rabbit in the headlights to me. No significant change of coaching staff, players, skill level, tactics or even results.

His remit was NOT to change any of the players or coaches. He was invited to be a mentor to an Interim Head Coach and the other coaches. He can't possibly have an impact on players' skills in such s short time. He has identified some of the team's shortcomings and IMO has influenced some positive changes. His appointment was temporary with the aim being to mentor the coaches and help get us through this awful
season. No way could he change things for the better overnight

Spot on he was never here to perform miracles, his signing was important as it marked the beginning of the end of this mess.
He’s doing what he was brought in to do, by being open about the performances and the culture problems within the team.
The first step to addressing your problem is admitting you have one. Jim never could.

He will be informing Boyd who/what the problems are & im sure he will back wholesale changes. Who’d want to take over from this next season? Gaffney was never the solution, just a experienced head to get real with these players and coaches.

 
ajack
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
ajack (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 13:27
Totally agree with the posts above. Also done a really good job on the PR side, saying just enough but not too much.

 
Former Hollywood Saint
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
05 March, 2018 13:30
Firstly, I agree with the fact that Gaffney was never going to come in and revamp the squad. He is a Consultant. He said straight from the off that the coaches would talk to him and ask his for a few tips. That will never completely turn a team around.

Secondly, he is completely right. A couple of weeks ago (after the Chuffs game?) there were some disgruntled folks on here (quite right I suppose) that only one player came over to the Saints fans after the game to thank them for travelling down.

Many other clubs do this, so why don't they thank the fans for travelling the length and breadth of the country to follow them - and this season especially watch them play badly. We follow them no matter what, though. That deserves credit to the travelling fans.

Lastly, when was the last time the players went round and kicked signed balls in to the ground? That was a great way of interacting and thanking the crowd, but even that has stopped.

It is like they just don't care any more and its rather sad.




FHS

 
HungryLikeTheWolf
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
Wilson Pickett (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 13:41
Quote:
ajack
Something is clearly very wrong at the club. No idea what or who it is, usually a split over something or someone. If it is not resolved before the start of next season it is hard to see a new coach or two will make much difference.


A load of stuff.

The owners don’t want to lose money which puts a big strain on all areas of the club.

Before Gaffney arrived, Jim’s era was predicated on a style of management where the coaches did not interact or have relationships with the players (except maybe a select few golden kids like Dickson, Myler, Day, maybe Hartley)... players also felt the coaches were not trying to improve the players individually

Various players don’t like Dorian, they don’t like his outdated coaching style and how he treats them

Many of the senior players are selfish and spend @#$%& all time with the younger players, helping them with their game etc. Some, like Courtney, do however, but that is clearly culturally wrong

The physios aren’t up to scratch or at least there are grumblings of players not having good rehabilitation with repeated long term injuries




There’s a few of them

 
ajack
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
ajack (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 13:49
You clearly have a very in depth knowledge of the inner workings of the club.

 
HungryLikeTheWolf
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
Wilson Pickett (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 13:51
No I just pick up acedotes from various quarters, sometimes indirectly and it all pretty much correlates. Small town, small business



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/03/2018 13:51 by HungryLikeTheWolf.

 
ajack
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
ajack (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 13:56
Oh, so you don't actually know any of that to be true then?

 
JRM
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
JRM (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 13:59
Lammy said to me....(Sm120)

 
HungryLikeTheWolf
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
Wilson Pickett (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 14:08
well if you don’t want me to give you the courtesy of responding to your posts and providing info that’s fine Ajack, believe what you like mate, doesn’t affect me

 
Matt247
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
Matt247 (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 14:13
Quote:
Longers
I have to commend an idea that was attributed to Sir Clive when he was merely Mr Woodward - getting rid of the "sappers".
A common enough term in industry change management.

Get rid of Anyone with the negative attitudes. If you can't improve 5-10%year on year what are you doing?

And if coaches cannot support the team in that pursuit, change the coaches, as w9ell as the players.
Are talking about the now discredited forced ranking system in the US. Used by some large firms as a way to discard staff for poor performance....and avoid and hid the fact was downsizing. It was a way of avoiding paying redundancy money. This system has largely been abandoned by major firms.....

 
GOD
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
Saintsby (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 14:45
"Management is about arranging and telling. Leadership is about nurturing and enhancing". Tom Peters

"Excellent firms don't believe in excellence - only in constant improvement and constant change" TP

"The simple act of paying positive attention to people has a great deal to do with productivity" TP

"I don't think I was a fine game coach. I think I was a good practice coach."—John Wooden on uber-preparation,
"John Wooden = probably the most successful basketball coach[ever]

All aparently missing at Saints for the last few years (at least) so "Give a lot, expect a lot, and if you don't get it, prune". TP



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 05/03/2018 16:45 by Bob Stainsby.

 
Flapjack
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
Flapjack (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 14:57
With the exception of Mr West, the rest of the coaching staff are all still relative novices. That's not to say they won't become decent coaches, or they aren't already, but look at the wider picture of the what has happened to Saints over the last 3 seasons & it's a difficult challenge for experienced ones, let alone young coaches who are still finding their way. In a camp filled with big egos & an obvious bad atmosphere, Mr Gaffney's band-aid was always going to come loose eventually, the language he uses is refreshingly honest, yet the timing of the revelations of Mr North's disappearance still smacks of Mr Ferguson & Mr Mourinho's diversion tactics after a difficult/poor performance/result. If you take some time to look at what has changed since Mr Mallinder left, we've seen the line speed & intensity of defence improve (occasionally). We've seen the young players being given little or no opportunity, we've seen the same serial offenders continue to phone it in, we've seen recruitment go very poorly and we've seen the same issues around the way the side play continue. Most people know to change a band-aid after a while, but it should quite apparent to everyone, we're still bleeding.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/03/2018 14:58 by Flapjack.

 
inaruck
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
inaruck (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 15:56
While I appreciate Gaffney's straight talking, perhaps if he's identified which players are no longer showing respect for the supporters, he himself could show some respect for the supporters by no longer selecting them.

 
Sans Culottes
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
Sans Culottes (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 16:25
Quote:
Former Hollywood Saint
Firstly,
Lastly, when was the last time the players went round and kicked signed balls in to the ground? That was a great way of interacting and thanking the crowd, but even that has stopped.

It is like they just don't care any more and its rather sad.




FHS

FHS they certainly did that after the Irish match

 
Omnium
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
Omnium (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 17:35
Quote:
Flapjack
....... We've seen the young players being given little or no opportunity, we've seen the same serial offenders continue to phone it in,......

Mr. Gaffney has said on a number of occasions that he is NOT picking the team. Perhaps it is time he did!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/03/2018 17:36 by Omnium.

 
Saintalex
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
Saintalex (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 20:22
Which players do we think are not trying or caring???

 
Flapjack
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
Flapjack (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 20:59
Quote:
Omnium

Mr. Gaffney has said on a number of occasions that he is NOT picking the team. Perhaps it is time he did!

That would infer, or perhaps imply Mr Omnium, that the only thing that has really changed is the person who is speaking to the press would it not?

 
Sadsaint
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
Sadsaint (IP Logged)
05 March, 2018 22:59
I agree.Jim did wonders as a coach but when the hard times came, he was unable to crack the whip and lift the team. Alan Gaffney is saying the things Jim should have been saying over the last two seasons making his displeasure clear. He has not previously singled anyone out, but if George refused to play, he must have been amazed that a seasoned Lion and international was unwilling to turn out when trying to regain his place in the Welsh side. To repeat, one of our major problems has been the lack of straight talking from the coaches and the club administrators who still seem to be in denial of the sad decline of the club.

 
Omnium
Re: Gaffers says team needed to show more respect to supporters
Omnium (IP Logged)
06 March, 2018 00:03
I am not inferring owt. I am stating what he has said. He leaves the picking of the team to the coaches. Lest we forget, the acting head coach recommended him here and they probably have a clear division of responsibility. Gaffney is concentrating on Skills and Methods, he would probably be unaware of any "Gentlemen's agreement". He would also be unaware of the political ramifications of upsetting Wales online, or indeed, offending Eif.

Teacups and storms



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/03/2018 00:04 by Omnium.


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