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MESSAGES->author
Unhappy sponsor
shendy (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 08:11
Diageo not happy about Paddy Jackson joining London Irish - "not consistent with our values". It'll be interesting to see how that pans out...
[www.bbc.co.uk]

 
Duckonstilts
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Duckonstilts (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 08:48
Seems a very sensible view by them. Sports people are almost exclusively shown wearing their kit in the media. Any negative press for a player will link the sponsors to the issue. Its also possible they are morally opposed...

 
Walks11
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Walks11 (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 09:21
i think LI have been incredibly naïve if they thought there would be no fallout over this signing. whatever the rights and wrongs of it sponsors can pull the plug on money quite quickly with any threat to their brand/image. interesting to see how it pans out, be quite significant if they pull out or if LI try to wriggle out of the Jackson signing itself

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Stockers (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 11:34
LI have also just lost Cash Converters as a sponsor (see BBC report above).

 
Saint Stokey
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Saint Stokey (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 11:39
Would a sponsor be aware of a signing prior to it being announced?

 
Duckonstilts
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Duckonstilts (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 11:46
The big issue for Irish is the media are involved. Right now journalists will be contacting the other sponsors for comment, any that hoped to not get involved and hope it blows over will now be put under pressure to come down on wither one side or another.

Sponsorship of a small club like London Irish is not worth any kind of negative implications. Thankfully I think there biggest sponsor is run by their chairman... So they are likely going to be OK but I still dont understand why anyone would hire a player with such baggage.

 
Saint Ted
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Saint Ted (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 12:07
It's nothing more than a PR exercise by Diagio, get's them good press by saying it's not part of their values while also not mentioning that the whole thing was in part probably fuelled by their products, when in reality the knock on effect of LI signing Paddy Jackson to them would have been absolutely miniscule and the vast majority of people would never even have put the pieces together

As for cash converters who's business plan pretty much prays on some of the most vulnerable people to make money, it's almost laughable for them to be taking a moral high ground over a man who was judged to be not guilty by trial

Most of the 'outrage' on this case was based on the messages from the WhatsApp group, the worst of which that were highlighted in the press weren't even sent by Paddy Jackson

 
BrianB
Re: Unhappy sponsor
BrianB (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 12:34
Just for a bit of balance, the club is saying the loss of Cash Converters in nothing to do with Jackson.

 
Deesaint
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Deesaint (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 13:06
We live in a society where ‘virtue signalling ‘ and PC correctness are the dominant forces
Let’s hope a certain Australian rugby player doesn’t sign for a perm club
The heavens will fall

 
Duckonstilts
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Duckonstilts (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 13:11
Another way of looking at it is People cant get away with being an Ahole just because they are rich/Famous/White/Male (delete as appropriate).

 
HungryLikeTheWolf
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Wilson Pickett (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 13:17
Reap what you sow.... not sure this is about PC or not. He admitted to pretty grim behaviour against a woman and will face the fallout.


More importantly he was a failure at Perpignan.

 
fleetg
Re: Unhappy sponsor
fleetg (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 13:45
Interesting last comment Duckonstilts bringing race into this thread.

 
Shire
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Shire (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 13:51
There is only one race :Human Race

 
Duckonstilts
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Duckonstilts (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 13:58
Yes fleetg, i was being a bit OTT in my statement. Unfortunately History is on my side.


Quote:
Shire
There is only one race :Human Race

I completely agree. And dont get me wrong, as someone who ticks some of those boxes its a tough old life having to take some of the blame for stuff others have done. But the world is changing and hopefully one day we can all just be people. For now, there will be a period of adjustment for all people, companies and institutions.

 
SK 88
Re: Unhappy sponsor
SK 88 (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 14:31
Quote:
shendy
Diageo not happy about Paddy Jackson joining London Irish - "not consistent with our values". It'll be interesting to see how that pans out...
[www.bbc.co.uk]

Tiger popping by,

I find it interesting that this is "not consistent" with Diageo's "values" rather than, say, the signings of Nick Phipps or Sean O'Brien. Enjoy Responsibly guys.

 
Hantsaintsrus4
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Hantsaintsrus4 (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 16:15
Snowflakes AND big babies in June? That was then, this is now, for goodness sake he can't be punished forever for doing something stupid. Those of us that have been on rugby and cricket tours are really pleased that smart phones were not around for 'photos, recordings and texts to lay a trail of evidence to be analysed and criticised by the limp wristed types who stayed at home.
The crew that I go to rugby with are solid citizens, employers, parents,grandparents,people who put something back into society with time and money. But the crude mickey taking, sexist, racist and homophobic jokes are for our consumption and would not survive broadcast. More tolerant and helpful people you will not meet. Now supposing our car journey were to be filmed, should we be jailed?

Time to stop feigning outrage methinks and let the player,and more importantly, his family get on with their lives.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Unhappy sponsor
higgy365 (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 17:44
Fair play, Hants, for being so open and up front about the fact you are an intolerant racist, sexist homophobe. Stay classy.

 
Deesaint
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Deesaint (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 18:32
Quote:
higgy365
Fair play, Hants, for being so open and up front about the fact you are an intolerant racist, sexist homophobe. Stay classy.

You’ve obviously never been on a rugby tour

 
ElySaint
Re: Unhappy sponsor
ElySaint (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 19:12
Not only to echo Higgy's point Hants but you are fundamentally wrong in your argument. Jackson is not being punished, if anything he's been generously offered an opportunity by LI. I wouldn't touch him with a barge pole. The only outrage is coming from you as far as I can tell.

 
shiversaint
Re: Unhappy sponsor
shiversaint (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 19:22
Quote:
Hantsaintsrus4
Snowflakes AND big babies in June? That was then, this is now, for goodness sake he can't be punished forever for doing something stupid. Those of us that have been on rugby and cricket tours are really pleased that smart phones were not around for 'photos, recordings and texts to lay a trail of evidence to be analysed and criticised by the limp wristed types who stayed at home.
The crew that I go to rugby with are solid citizens, employers, parents,grandparents,people who put something back into society with time and money. But the crude mickey taking, sexist, racist and homophobic jokes are for our consumption and would not survive broadcast. More tolerant and helpful people you will not meet. Now supposing our car journey were to be filmed, should we be jailed?

Time to stop feigning outrage methinks and let the player,and more importantly, his family get on with their lives.

It is not remotely comparable with what you and the lads get upto on tour.

The issue with this and what so many people fail to understand is that someone in the public eye has a PR platform, and by virtue of their employment, that is also their employer's platform. It's the same issue with Folau. When you arise to fame you are held to a higher moral standard as your behavior WILL affect more people. Fame also vastly changes how people interact with you - that power is something that needs to be handled very carefully. This is where Jackson fell down. Similarly, the prices that famous people pay for their misdeeds are often more severe.

Don't forget, there is not an equivalence between Not Guilty and Innocence in both law and definition. Deliberately so.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Stockers (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 19:30
Quote:
shiversaint
Quote:
Hantsaintsrus4
Snowflakes AND big babies in June? That was then, this is now, for goodness sake he can't be punished forever for doing something stupid. Those of us that have been on rugby and cricket tours are really pleased that smart phones were not around for 'photos, recordings and texts to lay a trail of evidence to be analysed and criticised by the limp wristed types who stayed at home.
The crew that I go to rugby with are solid citizens, employers, parents,grandparents,people who put something back into society with time and money. But the crude mickey taking, sexist, racist and homophobic jokes are for our consumption and would not survive broadcast. More tolerant and helpful people you will not meet. Now supposing our car journey were to be filmed, should we be jailed?

Time to stop feigning outrage methinks and let the player,and more importantly, his family get on with their lives.

It is not remotely comparable with what you and the lads get upto on tour.

The issue with this and what so many people fail to understand is that someone in the public eye has a PR platform, and by virtue of their employment, that is also their employer's platform. It's the same issue with Folau. When you arise to fame you are held to a higher moral standard as your behavior WILL affect more people. Fame also vastly changes how people interact with you - that power is something that needs to be handled very carefully. This is where Jackson fell down. Similarly, the prices that famous people pay for their misdeeds are often more severe.

Don't forget, there is not an equivalence between Not Guilty and Innocence in both law and definition. Deliberately so.

Or the unique verdict of "Not Proven" in Scots Law which kind of says, "We know you did it, you know you did it, but it can't be proven beyond all reasonable doubt"

 
Hantsaintsrus4
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Hantsaintsrus4 (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 19:35
Interesting views on the London Irish site.

 
SaintsDuncan
Re: Unhappy sponsor
SaintsDuncan (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 20:09
Including this one:

Guinness are the main sponsor of the House of Rugby podcast that features James Haskell every week. As a young man he filmed his mate and a girl in bed without her consent and showed the video to his friends. Something imo far more serious than anything PJ is actually proven to have done

 
shiversaint
Re: Unhappy sponsor
shiversaint (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 20:56
Quote:
SaintsDuncan
Including this one:
Guinness are the main sponsor of the House of Rugby podcast that features James Haskell every week. As a young man he filmed his mate and a girl in bed without her consent and showed the video to his friends. Something imo far more serious than anything PJ is actually proven to have done

Is that proven or just hearsay from bitter LI fans? There's a pretty strict set of laws around doing that.

I would be wary of contributing "but s/he did this!" kind of things on this forum - this particular event with PJ doesn't have a lot to do with us and getting directly involved by quoting [currently] unsubstantiated things is a good way to stir up something.

 
SaintsDuncan
Re: Unhappy sponsor
SaintsDuncan (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 21:08
Quote:
shiversaint
Quote:
SaintsDuncan
Including this one:
Guinness are the main sponsor of the House of Rugby podcast that features James Haskell every week. As a young man he filmed his mate and a girl in bed without her consent and showed the video to his friends. Something imo far more serious than anything PJ is actually proven to have done

Is that proven or just hearsay from bitter LI fans? There's a pretty strict set of laws around doing that.

I would be wary of contributing "but s/he did this!" kind of things on this forum - this particular event with PJ doesn't have a lot to do with us and getting directly involved by quoting [currently] unsubstantiated things is a good way to stir up something.

A quick Google links to a news article reporting his and Paul Doran Jones being suspended from their school and to be fair the thread isn't bitter and certainly not aimed at Saints



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/06/2019 21:09 by SaintsDuncan.

 
 
Saint Ted
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Saint Ted (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 21:11
Quote:
shiversaint
Quote:
SaintsDuncan
Including this one:
Guinness are the main sponsor of the House of Rugby podcast that features James Haskell every week. As a young man he filmed his mate and a girl in bed without her consent and showed the video to his friends. Something imo far more serious than anything PJ is actually proven to have done

Is that proven or just hearsay from bitter LI fans? There's a pretty strict set of laws around doing that.

I would be wary of contributing "but s/he did this!" kind of things on this forum - this particular event with PJ doesn't have a lot to do with us and getting directly involved by quoting [currently] unsubstantiated things is a good way to stir up something.

It is true, he talks about it on the podcast, which is sponsored by Guinness, the mate in question was also formerly of this parish, Paul Dorian Jones.

This was in 2003 when they were 17/18 at school

 
HungryLikeTheWolf
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Wilson Pickett (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 21:26
.... slight difference from schoolboy to famous and wealthy international sportsmen acting like d1cks.

Zero empathy for Jackson, and yes blokes act like morons on rugby trips.



Players getting drunk and doing stupid stuff like Cips or Manu is one thing. A group of grown men acting like that around girls is low rent, I can’t stand it. Typically they’re blokes who are rubbish at talking to women.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/06/2019 21:33 by Wilson Pickett.

 
Hantsaintsrus4
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Hantsaintsrus4 (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 21:31
Quote:
higgy365
Fair play, Hants, for being so open and up front about the fact you are an intolerant racist, sexist homophobe. Stay classy.

That is one of the nicest thing ever said to me. Thank you.
Totally wrong but I'll take it.

 
HungryLikeTheWolf
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Wilson Pickett (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 21:37
Quote:
Hantsaintsrus4
Snowflakes AND big babies in June? That was then, this is now, for goodness sake he can't be punished forever for doing something stupid. Those of us that have been on rugby and cricket tours are really pleased that smart phones were not around for 'photos, recordings and texts to lay a trail of evidence to be analysed and criticised by the limp wristed types who stayed at home.
The crew that I go to rugby with are solid citizens, employers, parents,grandparents,people who put something back into society with time and money. But the crude mickey taking, sexist, racist and homophobic jokes are for our consumption and would not survive broadcast. More tolerant and helpful people you will not meet. Now supposing our car journey were to be filmed, should we be jailed?

Time to stop feigning outrage methinks and let the player,and more importantly, his family get on with their lives.


I’m in a mixed marriage, if I heard one of you at Saints making racist jokes you’d have ‘my crew’ suggesting that’s a very bad idea. Not cool, at all.

 
Hantsaintsrus4
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Hantsaintsrus4 (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 21:52
Quote:
Wilson Pickett
Quote:
Hantsaintsrus4
Snowflakes AND big babies in June? That was then, this is now, for goodness sake he can't be punished forever for doing something stupid. Those of us that have been on rugby and cricket tours are really pleased that smart phones were not around for 'photos, recordings and texts to lay a trail of evidence to be analysed and criticised by the limp wristed types who stayed at home.
The crew that I go to rugby with are solid citizens, employers, parents,grandparents,people who put something back into society with time and money. But the crude mickey taking, sexist, racist and homophobic jokes are for our consumption and would not survive broadcast. More tolerant and helpful people you will not meet. Now supposing our car journey were to be filmed, should we be jailed?

Time to stop feigning outrage methinks and let the player,and more importantly, his family get on with their lives.


I’m in a mixed marriage, if I heard one of you at Saints making racist jokes you’d have ‘my crew’ suggesting that’s a very bad idea. Not cool, at all.

 
Hantsaintsrus4
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Hantsaintsrus4 (IP Logged)
12 June, 2019 21:59
Quote:
Hantsaintsrus4
Quote:
Wilson Pickett
Quote:
Hantsaintsrus4
Snowflakes AND big babies in June? That was then, this is now, for goodness sake he can't be punished forever for doing something stupid. Those of us that have been on rugby and cricket tours are really pleased that smart phones were not around for 'photos, recordings and texts to lay a trail of evidence to be analysed and criticised by the limp wristed types who stayed at home.
The crew that I go to rugby with are solid citizens, employers, parents,grandparents,people who put something back into society with time and money. But the crude mickey taking, sexist, racist and homophobic jokes are for our consumption and would not survive broadcast. More tolerant and helpful people you will not meet. Now supposing our car journey were to be filmed, should we be jailed?

Time to stop feigning outrage methinks and let the player,and more importantly, his family get on with their lives.

HLTW you will never hear any of us say anything that would upset anyone. Your missing the point. If we in our car on the way to rugby wish to tease each other we will.
I’m in a mixed marriage, if I heard one of you at Saints making racist jokes you’d have ‘my crew’ suggesting that’s a very bad idea. Not cool, at all.

 
SaintsDuncan
Re: Unhappy sponsor
SaintsDuncan (IP Logged)
13 June, 2019 09:36
Quote:
Wilson Pickett
.... slight difference from schoolboy to famous and wealthy international sportsmen acting like d1cks.

Not when taking the moral high ground there isn't....oh and he was an adult at the time.

 
HungryLikeTheWolf
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Wilson Pickett (IP Logged)
13 June, 2019 10:08
I’d have to disagree. I was significantly more mature and experienced as a 27 year old than an 18 year old. Judging teenagers is a tough call...

 
Hantsaintsrus4
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Hantsaintsrus4 (IP Logged)
13 June, 2019 10:20
It is not any other person's business but among those that go to rugby with me, two are mixed race and one is an homosexual.I am quiet happy for people to call me names if it helps them.
I wasn't at the trial in question and cannot like those here who were, suggest whether guilty or not guilty, or a mix of both was the correct decision. I know I don't believe texts sent under the influence or not, between lads.
Rugby has to become more inclusive, I for one would not want to stop any player coming to the Gardens because he has made a poor decision in the past. I have and do make mistakes and learn from them.
Let's get proactive as a club and welcome people like Paddy if he should ever want to play here and has the ability to do so. Rehabilitation is the way to help, not exclusion.

As far as jokes are concerned HLTW they are a coping process, a way to relieve the stress of difficult and often embarrassing situations. It's probably best that you are not around the police or others dealing with body parts, or soldiers having to deal with a friend and colleagues badly mutilated- they tell jokes, it helps.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 13/06/2019 10:42 by Hantsaintsrus4.

 
SaintsDuncan
Re: Unhappy sponsor
SaintsDuncan (IP Logged)
13 June, 2019 10:43
Quote:
Wilson Pickett
I was significantly more mature and experienced as a 27 year old than an 18 year old. Judging teenagers is a tough call...

As were we all, but both were adults at the time. For a company to take the moral high ground, saying this does not fit with our core values, and seek (publicaly at least) to perhaps impose sanction in one case but not the other is somewhat of a double standard.

Would Diageo be happy for a LI acadamy player to perform the same actions as Haskell? How would that sit that sit with their "core values"?

 
Walks11
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Walks11 (IP Logged)
13 June, 2019 12:29
at the end of the day a professional sportsperson has responsibilities to his employer and indirectly whoever funds his career & lifestyle i.e. sponsors. Ulster and IRFU were within their rights to terminate contracts for this poor behaviour. rightly or wrongly sponsors can pick and choose where they take the moral high ground so it may be double standards but is ultimately their choice as to where they pump funds. By doing so they are handing responsibility of their brand to a 3rd party and its employees and with that carries risk as they are ultimately not in control of it. I'm sure any potential sponsorship deal goes through this and regularly reviewed. A pod cast fronted by someone who had an alleged misdemeanour 15 years ago would be considered low risk to any damage of reputation surely. A high profile sponsorship deal with a Premier rugby club carries with it a completely different level of exposure and risk and so no wonder they are getting twitchy over the signing.

 
brancastersaint
Re: Unhappy sponsor
brancastersaint (IP Logged)
13 June, 2019 14:38
While I find this a very interesting debate, but I won't get drawn into it too far, safe to say that I to believe LI could have made a better choice for a new 10, who I have no idea, but there's obviously a lot of deep rooted resentment towards PJ.
it could all be academic anyway, S Myler - ex of this parish will probably get back to his very best and have PJ sat on the subs bench most of the season.

sits back and waits for light hearted abuse

 
Walks11
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Walks11 (IP Logged)
13 June, 2019 14:44
Quote:
brancastersaint
While I find this a very interesting debate, but I won't get drawn into it too far, safe to say that I to believe LI could have made a better choice for a new 10, who I have no idea, but there's obviously a lot of deep rooted resentment towards PJ.
it could all be academic anyway, S Myler - ex of this parish will probably get back to his very best and have PJ sat on the subs bench most of the season.

sits back and waits for light hearted abuse

don't think that would be too far off the mark. I did wonder when the signing was announced if it was a veiled attempt to bring him back to the Irish fold and this was a stepping stone to this re-integration.

 
HungryLikeTheWolf
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Wilson Pickett (IP Logged)
13 June, 2019 15:01
Quote:
Walks11
at the end of the day a professional sportsperson has responsibilities to his employer and indirectly whoever funds his career & lifestyle i.e. sponsors. Ulster and IRFU were within their rights to terminate contracts for this poor behaviour. rightly or wrongly sponsors can pick and choose where they take the moral high ground so it may be double standards but is ultimately their choice as to where they pump funds. By doing so they are handing responsibility of their brand to a 3rd party and its employees and with that carries risk as they are ultimately not in control of it. I'm sure any potential sponsorship deal goes through this and regularly reviewed. A pod cast fronted by someone who had an alleged misdemeanour 15 years ago would be considered low risk to any damage of reputation surely. A high profile sponsorship deal with a Premier rugby club carries with it a completely different level of exposure and risk and so no wonder they are getting twitchy over the signing.


Very spot on

 
Hantsaintsrus4
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Hantsaintsrus4 (IP Logged)
13 June, 2019 18:26
Guinness has withdrawn their support to LI. Hopefully the club refused to reconsider their decision to sign Paddy.

 
twsaint
Re: Unhappy sponsor
twsaint (IP Logged)
13 June, 2019 19:22
Absolutely correct from Guinness.

 
Hantsaintsrus4
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Hantsaintsrus4 (IP Logged)
13 June, 2019 20:44
Ah now don't you be worrying at all tw, the Guinness is just for the tourists, in south west Ireland it's watered down but we drink the Murphy's or the Beamish to be sure!
When you were at the crime scene, sober and observant please report what you saw.
Sorry Ted, righteous people sicken me, tell me to shut up.

 
Saint Ted
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Saint Ted (IP Logged)
13 June, 2019 21:10
Each to their own on this one, one of those subjects where nobody is going to agree on it and my view on it is too strong to even be close to impartial

 
Quinten Poulsen
Re: Unhappy sponsor
Quinten Poulsen (IP Logged)
13 June, 2019 22:08
This is a guy who went to court presumed innocent and was found not guilty. Diageo can pretend it's about moral values but we all know it's about money.


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