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Why-oh-why is Flatman in this team when Payne "deserves" a full call-up?



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I'd love to know what this 30 year Saffa offers that Seymour, Ben Woods, or Saull don't.

"This 30 year old Saffa" I presume you're referring to Fourie?

He's been mightily impressive in a struggling Leeds team for several seasons. Dunno what the others offer because I don't watch them regularly, but Fourie is worthy of his place IMO.

Leeds Carnegie Soundtrack

May 2010: The Proclaimers: "I'm on my way/From misery to happiness today [...] "
May 2011: Status Quo: "Down down, deeper and down"

Quote:

"This 30 year old Saffa" I presume you're referring to Fourie?
He's been mightily impressive in a struggling Leeds team for several seasons. Dunno what the others offer because I don't watch them regularly, but Fourie is worthy of his place IMO.

That may be true but the guy isn't ever going to be a full England international (certainly not while Moody, Rees, S.Armitage are around), and by putting him in here you're taking away game time from one of the young English opensides like Saull, Skinner or Woods - players who could have a big part to play in future England teams.

Journeyman poach = better than any prospect.

/England mode/

Quote:

That may be true but the guy isn't ever going to be a full England international (certainly not while Moody, Rees, S.Armitage are around), and by putting him in here you're taking away game time from one of the young English opensides like Saull, Skinner or Woods - players who could have a big part to play in future England teams.

Well thats a huge assertion from someone outside the England setup. I don't believe anyone is called up to ANY England team if they aren't considered at least in some way as worth looking at with a view to full international call-ups.

And even if you're right, then by including Fourie then you are showing the young prospects what it is they should be doing to get noticed.

EDIT: The other thing is that, again, if nothing else, it shows that there are other players outside the traditional Leicester-Wasps axis, and that you can play well for your club and not be expected to move down south to be noticed

Leeds Carnegie Soundtrack

May 2010: The Proclaimers: "I'm on my way/From misery to happiness today [...] "
May 2011: Status Quo: "Down down, deeper and down"



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2010:02:05:13:12:31 by apb.

Ben Youngs is the last player who should have been sent back to his club. Sure enough Micky Young is worth a start, but thats not the issue here.

I reckon Youngs is worth a place in the Senior squad, but obviously MJ does not. So at the very least he should be given as much Saxons time as possible.

To be honest Id have picked him to start at Twickenham tomorrow.

I think Youngs has been with the Full England Squad all week and that is why the other two guys are in the Saxons squad. In that respect his performance at Bath has jumped him up a place rather than Young + Wigglesworth being selected ahead of him.

The way i read it is, if Care or Hodgson break down today \ tomorrow morning then Youngs is the one in England and able to hot foot it to Twickers.

Quote:

And even if you're right, then by including Fourie then you are showing the young prospects what it is they should be doing to get noticed.

I'd have thought the likes of Saull (starting 7 for the premiership leaders and standout Premiership openside this season) and Skinner (Harlequins captain) are doing that anyway.

Quote:

The other thing is that, again, if nothing else, it shows that there are other players outside the traditional Leicester-Wasps axis, and that you can play well for your club and not be expected to move down south to be noticed

Saull - Sarries
Seymour - Sale
Skinner - Harlequins



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2010:02:05:13:42:50 by dawson9.

Quote:

standout Premiership openside

A matter of opinion, surely?

Leeds Carnegie Soundtrack

May 2010: The Proclaimers: "I'm on my way/From misery to happiness today [...] "
May 2011: Status Quo: "Down down, deeper and down"

Quote:

dawson9

Quote:

The other thing is that, again, if nothing else, it shows that there are other players outside the traditional Leicester-Wasps axis, and that you can play well for your club and not be expected to move down south to be noticed

Saull - Sarries
Seymour - Sale
Skinner - Harlequins

Sarries - South
Sale - Manchester - doesn't count!!
Quins - South

OK, OK, not really the point I was making, I know!!

Hendre Fourie is an execellent player and is worth a shot. He'll have to play a blinder to get many more chances, because of all the other players there are around.

Leeds Carnegie Soundtrack

May 2010: The Proclaimers: "I'm on my way/From misery to happiness today [...] "
May 2011: Status Quo: "Down down, deeper and down"

Geraghty gearing up for England's big weekend
Saturday February 6, 2010
Issued by Jessica Chambers RFU


Geraghty in action for Saxons



Tomorrow the Saxons take on Italy A in Treviso (ko 2.30pm, local time) and Shane Geraghty is gearing up for another massive weekend of English rugby.

Last November the Northampton fly half ran out at Twickenham in England's autumn internationals and today he will watch as his teammates take on the Welsh in their RBS 6 Nations opener.

"I will send the Northampton guys a text today to wish them luck. I'm sure they will do a good job. The Saxons trained against England last week and they were raring to go, especially Courtney Lawes he's on fire at the moment.

"I will be watching the boys on TV this afternoon it's the first match of the Six Nations so it will be a massive game, you never know what's going to happen against Wales." said Geraghty.

Geraghty put in an impressive performance last weekend in the Saxons' 17-13 victory over Ireland A, scoring a try, adding sevens points with the boot and his tap tackle prevented Ireland from crossing the line.

"The coaches were delighted with our performance especially off the back of losing in the Churchill Cup." added Geraghty.

"The Ireland match was a massive win for us and puts us in a great position going into Sunday's game."

With six members of tomorrow's starting Saxons line-up holding senior England caps the players will be out to impress.

Geraghty continued, "The ultimate goal is to play for the senior squad but we've come away with the Saxons and we are here to show what we can do on the international stage.

"Everyone here is enjoying being in the Saxons, it's a great environment and we have some young up and coming players who are really excited to be here and that rubs off on the senior members of the group.

"It's going to be tough, playing away in Italy is always tough but we have some new guys in Danny Cipriani (London Wasps) and Jon Clarke (Northampton Saints) who bring experience with them and training has gone really well."


England Saxons to face Italy A:

15 Danny Cipriani (London Wasps)
14 David Strettle (Harlequins)
13 Jon Clarke (Northampton Saints)*
12 Brad Barritt (Saracens)
11 Miles Benjamin (Worcester Warriors)
10 Shane Geraghty (Northampton Saints)
9 Micky Young (Newcastle Falcons)
1 David Flatman (Bath Rugby)
2 Rob Webber (London Wasps)
3 Paul Doran-Jones (Gloucester Rugby)
4 Geoff Parling (Leicester Tigers)
5 George Skivington (London Wasps, captain)
6 Chris Robshaw (Harlequins)
7 Hendre Fourie (Leeds Carnegie)*
8 Phil Dowson (Northampton Saints)

Replacements:

16 Tom Mercey (Saracens)
17 Rob Vickers (Newcastle Falcons)*
18 Dave Attwood (Gloucester Rugby)
19 Tom Wood (Worcester Warriors)
20 Richard Wigglesworth (Sale Sharks)
21 Dominic Waldouck (London Wasps)
22 Alex Goode (Saracens)

*Denotes uncapped for England Saxons

Any idea of the score so far?

31-5 to England.

Slater582 - Excellent news, thanks for this.

Italy RFU report translated by Google

Home Italy Italy A ITALY "A", HOUR IS NOT ENOUGH: Saxons 5-0 IN A META 'RACE, Ends 5-31
ITALY "A", HOUR IS NOT ENOUGH: Saxons 5-0 IN A META 'RACE, Ends 5-31
National team
Sunday 07 Febbraio 2010 16:42

Mogliano Veneto (TV) -- Three goals in the final quarter of an hour make it too heavy liabilities for Italy "A" by Gianluca Guidi, beat to 5-31 this afternoon in Mogliano Veneto from England Saxons. A score that does not do full justice to the performance of the second performance blue captained by Valerio Bernabo, deployed today in the position of flanker.

In advantage to 5-0 at half-time thanks to a goal of scrumhalf Pablo Canavosio, Italy "A" has missed two opportunities to increase their advantage that might otherwise route the first meeting with the wing Samuele Pace, stopped a step away from the goal line, then the number ten Luciano Orquera that hit the post on a penalty kick.

Then, also because of the swirl of change, the guests have gradually taken over the reins of the meeting but had to wait for the yellow card shown to the second line Santiago Dellape the twenty-first and the resumption of its numerical superiority to be able to score with Benjamin the goal of overtaking, which kicked off the big final quarter of an hour by guests.

Embittered after the final whistle, the coach of the Azzurri Gianluca Guidi: "It is useless to deny it, those who play to win and do it today for over an hour our team has had the chance. We have serious difficulty in a team with great talents like the Saxons, playing well, with an effective organization, creating a beautiful goal with Canavosio. We lacked that little bit extra at the end that would make the difference. Start from the good things have shown for more than sixty minutes to prepare the match on 26 February in Biella against Scotland 'A', but they are unfortunately the defeat and disappointment for a game that we could win. "



Mogliano Veneto (TV), Sunday, February 7, 2010

International Meeting

ITALY 'A' v England Saxons 5-31 (5-0)

Scorers: p.t. 30 'm. Canavosio (5-0); s.t. 8 'cp. Geraghty (5-3), 21 'm. Benjamin tr. Geraghty (5-10), 27 'm. Technical tr. Goode (5-17), 36 'm. Goode tr. Goode (5-24), 42 'm. Strettle tr. Goode (5-31)

Italy "A": Buso, Pace, Pratichetti A. (29 'st. Pavan G.), Pratichetti M., Sepe M.; Orquera, Canavosio; Vosawai, Favaro (37' pt. Orlando), Bernabo (capt); Dellapè (31 'st. Tveraga), A. Pavanello ; Rouyet, D'Apice, Sbaraglini (20 'st. De Marchi AL)

England Saxons: Cipriani; Strettle, Clarke, Barritt, Benjamin; Geraghty, Young; Dowson, Fourie, Robshaw, Skivington (capt), Parling, Doran-Jones, Webber, Flatman

Referee MacPherson (Scotland)

Notes: 21 'st. yellow Dellape, about 5000 spectators, sunny day, field in good condition