ELVs a coaching perspective
By H Rees June 4 2008
I have been asked to put together my views on the ELVs and some of the coaching issues they may raise. One of the great things about rugby union is that it is governed by laws, not rules. Rules are set in stone and cannot be argued with.
Laws, as an intelligent man (yes Ladies, they do exist) once said, are “for the guidance of wise men and the adherence of fools”. In other words, they should be open to interpretation by any and all.
This being the case everything you see on here will be my interpretation of the laws and my view on how I feel it will affect the coaching I undertake. This will be open to debate and no view is to be seen as right or wrong, just interpretation – so please discuss at length and let’s make the whole board a more informed place because of it.
Background
The ELVs have had a proportion of them trialled this season in the Super 14. Some, not all, of these are travelling North for trial in all levels of the game, down to youth and amateur levels. Some have been sent back to be rethought. Some will appear in an “elite” NH competition, we are told. Many of these actually just refine laws already in common usage but there are some key ones that will cause a change in the way the game is played. I shall concentrate on these alone, specifically the ones that are being used universally from outset.
Maul
- Players will be allowed to defend against the maul by pulling it down
View - This is the one law I have a major concern over. Safety in our game is paramount and I cannot see how this can be done safely. A well organised and controlled maul is virtually an upright scrum. Does a maul always end in a try? No. Can it be defended against? Yes, with a modicum of difficulty but it can and is. Imagine if you will the idea of several older, overweight players in the lower leagues. To them a maul is a part of the standard fare for their game. What happens if these large (many over 18 stone) men suddenly have their drive collapsed? Are they going to be fit and flexible enough to cope with the sudden pressures on joints, ribs and lungs that this will create? I foresee major injuries this season at all levels, but mostly in the lower leagues. Some will be very serious indeed.
At this point I would like to do a rare thing, and that’s praise the RFU. After consultation with youth coaches across the country they have confirmed that this rule change and the one regarding the removal of the requirement for shoulders to be above hips will NOT be trialled at U19 and lower youth levels until it can be proven that safety is not compromised.
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| 4 Jun, 2008 20:36 | Report |
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Claytosaurus Rex |
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Tom Paine (IP Logged) Registered User |
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Re: ELVs a coaching perspective
It has always been legal for one (brave and foolish) man to tackle, below the hips, the ball carrier within a group of opponents bound together but not bound to any opponents ( therefore not technically a maul). It is becoming quite a common way to defend against the maul, which is virtually impossible to defend legally once it is moving. In practice refs tend to give a maul a lifespan and then allow it to be collapsed. To me it is legalised obstruction and I'd be glad to see the back of it.
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| 4 Jun, 2008 21:40 | Report |
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TCM2007 (IP Logged) Registered User |
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Re: ELVs a coaching perspective
Quote:The other possible option that seems more likely to guarantee results is someone just grabs the legs of the player at the front of the maul, bringing it all down. The risk there is that your head is right in the middle of the collapsing bodies and likely to get damaged, so I would look to use the current option more.
That's not legal under the ELVs:
A defending team may pull the maul to the ground.
To do this, the defender must grasp an opposing player in the maul anywhere between the shoulders and
the hips and then pull that player to the ground.
If the maul is brought down by any other action it is regarded as a collapse which remains illegal
Stuart
--------------------------
I'm listening to:
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| 4 Jun, 2008 21:45 | Report |
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| 4 Jun, 2008 21:49 | Report |
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| 4 Jun, 2008 21:49 | Report |
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GnB (IP Logged) Registered User |
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Re: ELVs a coaching perspective
Quote:Hywel re ELVs at scrum
One thing is for certain, I wouldn’t want to be a 10 defending that channel this season! Everything is going to be coming at the 10 and a whole lot quicker than before as the attacks will have had extra time to gain speed and momentum. 10s will have to tackle like demons
Anybody still think Joey will be first choice fly half this season?
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| 4 Jun, 2008 22:28 | Report |
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Butthead (IP Logged) Registered User |
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Re: ELVs a coaching perspective
Good work, coach! Any truth in the rumours of the "Elite" competition to trial further ELVs will be the Fat Bloke 7s?
Also, regarding this point:
How about another persepective? This places more emphasis on the attacking team to secure the ball quickly (away from the cheats). Although I had thought hands were to be allowed, as long as you enter through the gate?
Also, regarding this point:
Quote:Thankfully we haven’t been asked to go the whole hog and accept the “cheats charter” of free kicks for hands in rucks and killing the ball
How about another persepective? This places more emphasis on the attacking team to secure the ball quickly (away from the cheats). Although I had thought hands were to be allowed, as long as you enter through the gate?
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| 4 Jun, 2008 22:30 | Report |
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| 4 Jun, 2008 22:39 | Report |
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andreww (IP Logged) Registered User |
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Re: ELVs a coaching perspective
the ELVs are written in full on the IRB website, with full explantions and the new laws - funny that hen being on the IRB site~:
Full ELVS and explanations
Full ELVS and explanations
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| 4 Jun, 2008 22:42 | Report |
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| 4 Jun, 2008 22:46 | Report |
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Butthead (IP Logged) Registered User |
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Re: ELVs a coaching perspective
What is the world coming to?
From the end of the full set:
From the end of the full set:
Quote:IRB Health and Safety legal advisers
Disclaimer
Rugby is a physical contact sport and there are inherent risks associated with participating in Rugby related
activities. Accidents can happen and may happen to you. The IRB (including its operating entity IRFB
Services (Ireland) Limited and other associated entities) does not accept any responsibility or liability in
negligence or otherwise in relation to any injury, loss or damage suffered by persons seeking to replicate
activities demonstrated in this IRB Guide To Experimental Law Variations product or participating in Rugby
related activities generally.
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| 4 Jun, 2008 22:46 | Report |
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Azrael (IP Logged) Registered User |
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Re: ELVs a coaching perspective
Quote:Hywel
I repeat, only some of the rules are coming in to the northern hemisphere, not all of the ones being trialled in SH.
That is what makes this such a pigs ear of a set of rules.
I agree Hywel - what they should have done is try the exact same set of laws that were trailled in the S14 this year, pretty much all of which were deemed to enhance the game by making it quicker without diminishing the traditional aspects of the game - this mish mash will create an imbalanced and improper study.
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Re: ELVs a coaching perspective
Nice one Hywel.
With the exception of the new maul law, I don't really have a problem with the ELVs being adopted in the GP. What I cannot except is the notion that the free-kick for everything law is being trialled in a different competition (the ECC has been mooted I believe) next season. Some teams (including Wuss) will be playing to one set of laws one week, and a different set the next. Ridiculous IMHO.
The free kick for everything law is a step too far IMHO. I hope the ECC trial is a disaster and is sent back South for good. Unfortunately the S14 has declared them to be a success, so I fear Phase 2 in the GP is inevitable.
-----
G4E
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With the exception of the new maul law, I don't really have a problem with the ELVs being adopted in the GP. What I cannot except is the notion that the free-kick for everything law is being trialled in a different competition (the ECC has been mooted I believe) next season. Some teams (including Wuss) will be playing to one set of laws one week, and a different set the next. Ridiculous IMHO.
The free kick for everything law is a step too far IMHO. I hope the ECC trial is a disaster and is sent back South for good. Unfortunately the S14 has declared them to be a success, so I fear Phase 2 in the GP is inevitable.
-----
G4E
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| 5 Jun, 2008 08:53 | Report |
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Claytosaurus Rex |
Date Joined: Oct, 2005 Location: Powick Posts: 7332 |
Re: ELVs a coaching perspective
It would seem that the collapsing of mauls is going to have quite an effect on rugby if they are not careful. In this safety first ruled world of ours, parents may not let their children be put in danger...
Times Online
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2008:06:05:08:54:18 by Powick_Eastander.
Times Online
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2008:06:05:08:54:18 by Powick_Eastander.
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| 5 Jun, 2008 09:24 | Report |
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DOK (IP Logged) Registered User |
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Re: ELVs a coaching perspective
The RFU have refused to implement the pulling down the maul ELV for under 19s and below.
[www.sportinglife.com]
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2008:06:05:09:30:26 by DOK.
[www.sportinglife.com]
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2008:06:05:09:30:26 by DOK.
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| 5 Jun, 2008 09:58 | Report |
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| 5 Jun, 2008 12:18 | Report |
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The Royal Navy's No.1 Warriors fan |
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Re: ELVs a coaching perspective
Not having Sky I have not had the experience of watching these new laws in force so will reserve any judgement until I can see them in force. Does seem odd that the players will have to learn one set of rules for one competition and a further set for another.....did I say odd, I meant STUPID!!!
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| 5 Jun, 2008 12:33 | Report |
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| 5 Jun, 2008 14:22 | Report |
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| 5 Jun, 2008 14:32 | Report |
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Re: ELVs a coaching perspective
Absolutely true. My thoughts are that he will be more isolated because of the distance away that the rest of the defence will be. One man is easier to beat in isolation and additionally he will always be that fraction behind what the ball carrier does as he has to react. I see attacks going wider initially to draw the 7 across, effectively acting as a blocker to his own teams defence!
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| 5 Jun, 2008 17:38 | Report |
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TCM2007 (IP Logged) Registered User |
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Re: ELVs a coaching perspective
Quote:Thanks for the Mem.
Great article, thanks.
It will be more dificult for the 10 to defend as he is 5m further back, however the 7 will remain the same distance from the 8 or attacking backs as this season as it's only the defending side who have to move back.
Both sets of backs will have to be 5m from the scrum.
Stuart
--------------------------
I'm listening to:
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| 6 Jun, 2008 12:49 | Report |
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apb (IP Logged) Registered User |
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Re: ELVs a coaching perspective
Quote:Does seem odd that the players will have to learn one set of rules for one competition and a further set for another.....did I say odd, I meant STUPID!!!
Not just the players, but the refs as well. Its especially complicated at the very lowest level of the game, where the ref sits at home watching the super 14 before coming out to ref a game in the afternoon. This actually happened to my 4th XV in April where the ref actually played the ELVs without telling anyone - I've never seen so many free kicks awarded in a whole season, never mind a single game!!!
TykesRugby.co.uk
Supporting Leeds RU since 2002
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| 7 Jun, 2008 19:03 | Report |
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Brummagem Bertie (IP Logged) Registered User |
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Re: ELVs a coaching perspective
Excuse my ignorance, but do I take it from this article that the ELVs discussed above will be in place in the GP next season?
And if that is the case, which extra ones will be introduced into the "elite" competition?
Apologies if I'm a little bit behind the times or have misunderstood anything!
Whatever you do, do it safely!
And if that is the case, which extra ones will be introduced into the "elite" competition?
Apologies if I'm a little bit behind the times or have misunderstood anything!
Whatever you do, do it safely!
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