Of course they can. I was at Twickenham in '99 when an unfancied French team surprised the All Blacks, there is no reason why they can't do it again. Of course all of the current All Blacks will also remmeber that day and not want to repeat it.
If France turn up, something that can never be guaranteed, then this should be game of the tournament so far. Chabal to come off the bench and score two tries to take France out of reach - the stuff dreams are made of.....(or are those nightmares)


There is far too much talk about good ball and bad ball.
In my opinion, good ball is when you have possession and bad ball is when the opposition have it.

That team shows nary a glimmer of Gallic flair. Just that it will boot the ball to kingdom come and try to tackle the ABs running it back.

A game of contrasts.

Well Apart from Carter and the two Wingers New Zealands backline doesnt look to great either. I mean McAlister and Mulihiana (bad spelling) arent an accomplished pairing... things could go wrong me finks, specially against Jouzion

Muliaina is a brilliant fullback and a very good centre.

McAlister so long as he doesn't try to be clever is an accomplished #12.

I have seen Macdonald run through 10+ players before he was tackled on several occasions including this world cup. Admittedly it was only Italy, but how well does France usually do against them?

Allez les Bleus.

Four more years boys, four more years !

Brilliant France. Absolutely brilliant! Well deserved. Thank you! Shut those Kiwis up for another 4 (four) years.

Allez les bleus...........until next saturday evening that is.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007:10:06:23:10:14 by ENGLANDREDROSE.

A Wasp, you should really thank Wayne Barnes.

Everyone keeps saying that this will shut the kiwi's up for the next 4 years... After the World cup and next years internationals they are still gunna be the best team in the world.

Raura

yes thank Barnes for being wise to the standard AB cheating methods, taking a man out off the ball.

I've been waiting for a ref to come along with the testicular fortitude to deal with McCaw and his black shirts. Well done Barnsie.

Quote:

Rarua
The reason England (and France) lack depth at the test level is because the first recourse to a vacancy in their team is for clubs to look overseas, while NZ and SA et al look to the lower grades within the province. When Carter is injured up stands Evans.

Oops.

Balpw2,

Does that include a ref without the balls to blow up for a forward pass ?

If that was obstruction, then a penalty was the right decision. But I can't agree it was a sin binning.

Quote:

Duncan Wellington
Does that include a ref without the balls to blow up for a forward pass ?

That's one each, as he missed Carters forward pass that led to McAllisters try

Whoaa! What an afternoon/night... My head is still spinning (may have someting to do with the amount of beer I drank).
Wayne Barnes did not lose the game. New Zealand did. Barnes is a good ref. He made one or two errors but what referee does not? New Zealand do a fair bit of cheating themselves so they cannot complain really. France took their chances, tackled like their lives depended on it and won. I do think the better team lost not that it matters anymore!

Steve Nottingham Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Does that include a ref without the balls to blow
> up for a forward pass ?
>
> That's one each, as he missed Carters forward pass
> that led to McAllisters try

If you're keeping count then what about the block by Michalak that didn't even get a penalty where as McAllister got binned.
Anyway, it's what is given on the day and you have to say that the French defence was brilliant, and I think the best team won. AB's had a massive about of possesion but didn't do enough with it. I also think that Luke McAllister has proved once and for all that he is a centre and nothing else. He does not have the rugby brain to play at 10.

Isn't it ironic that Kiwi's go out of the world cup to a forward pass.

As has bee said elsewhere, why didn't the ABs set themselves up for a drop goal in the final minutes. There was plenty of opportunity. Instead they tried to use forward power to score a try; something we were told that only England tried to do these days, while the ABs played a more expansive game.

The truth is that NZ 'domination' has always been founded on forward power, and when the going gets tough that is what they try to resort to. And some of them blaming the referee of course.

DaveAitch,

I think if one of either Kelleher or Carter (or even EVans for that matter) had been on the paddock they would have gone for the drop goal in about 77 or 78 minutes. Leonard will be a good player, but hasn't got the experience yet, and I'm afraid McAllister doesn't have the brain for playing 10.
I also think that with the French defense as good as it was, keeping the ball tight was the only real option (as opposed to going out wide)

Duncan, that then shows extremely poor management. Losing by two points with minutes to go a drop goal is always a way to breach a solid defence. To have no one in the side capable of doing it when it becomes necessary is bizarre for a team of NZ's status. I am unsure about 'going wide'; the drop goal pass is often almost straight back.

As regards Carter, should he have been playing? He was obviously not fully fit - even if he claims he was. Have NZ no other number 10 now, or is it just a case that the ABs have come to rely on Carter too much for his kicking?

The problem sitting here in England is that we have had it stuffed down our throats how slow and overweight are forwards are. How poor our backs are, and how the Southern Hemisphere countries are light years ahead and how wonderfully well the ball is moved down the backs. There was certainly none of it against France. Had that been another England performance the Kiwis would have been laughing at us.

My recording of the game has been deleted, so I can't check, but I am sure that McAllister did attampt a drop goal, but missed to the left. Did I imagine this or did it really happen?


There is far too much talk about good ball and bad ball.
In my opinion, good ball is when you have possession and bad ball is when the opposition have it.

PoyntonShark,
Yes he did try a drop goal, but from his own 10 metre line, when it should have been a couple of minutes earlier from just outisde the French 22.
DaveAitch, I agree that the management have to take a good proportion of the blame, Howlett not playing etc, but I think the problem of the team on the park at the time was the three injuries to Kelleher, Carter & Evans, that's why there wasn't enough experience out there at 9 or 10. But even saying that, it's obvious that the rest of the teams big players were rattled and somebody should have sorted it out (be it McCaw or Muliaina or MacDonald etc).
As for the going out wide and the drop goal, I was talking about 2 different aspects of the game, my fault for not explaining it properly :-)

The ABs had a bad day at the office. It probably happens to them less than it does to other nations. Unfortunately it does seem to happen more at World Cups to them than it does to other teams.

I do believe that all past games have some importance in any game that is being played (and I have argued this with several people). It must have crossed the minds of the players, even if only subconsciously, when things were not going to plan, that another failure would mean they were the ultimate chokers. Once that happens players will try too hard; they will try to force the issue. Normally the ABs play relaxed, because they know they will win, and things come easy to them.

Some day NZ will win the WC again, and they must start as favourites in four years time. That might, of course, be their undoing.

I agree, it will only become more of a monkey on their backs. Which is why the current administration have questions to answer regarding the preparation for this. If they took it as the Tri-Nations I think that they would also perform better.
One thing to come out of this as well, is in general the level of happiness with a win in New Zealand is fairly low. I can remember the 42-11 win over France was not met with the best of appreciation. High standards are one thing, but maybe with not getting the credit that they possibly should for some good wins, that affects the players too ?