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And we all thought the logo was something to do with the Middle East
Discussion started by Stopsy , 07 November, 2019 07:49
And we all thought the logo was something to do with the Middle East
Stopsy 07 November, 2019 07:49
The Saracens logo which I thought was a crescent with a star, is now so obvious, its a capital C preceding a star denoting any titles were preceded by cheating.

(Sm142) Here



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/11/2019 08:17 by Stopsy.

Re: And we all thought the logo was something to do with the Middle East
PrestonTiger 07 November, 2019 09:50
And the Fez ? I assume that's used to hide the key to safety deposit boxes where the sack of krugerands have been deposited

Re: And we all thought the logo was something to do with the Middle East
Tom Paine 07 November, 2019 10:38
At the risk of being called a 'melt' or 'snowflake' by Yorkie & Co, I would suggest that the cultural mis/appropriation by Saracens, including the name itself, the wearing of the Fez and the supposedly comic 'fluence' gesture is becoming unacceptable. Worcester have already had some criticism of their adoption of native American dress and chanting, and calling your team Crusaders shows a lack of historical sensibility. How would we react if a South African team called themselves the 'Boers' and waved sjamboks around? Likewise, 'Saints' is also a bit dubious- probably best to stick to animal adjuncts and certainly avoid religious and echoes of historical conflicts.

Re: And we all thought the logo was something to do with the Middle East
Stopsy 07 November, 2019 10:43
Saints was from the original St James club.

I think you mean Exeter rather than Worcester.

I have no issue with the Saracens name, the funny bit was when their fans were wearing mock Crusader outfits (Sm8)

Re: And we all thought the logo was something to do with the Middle East
Rich W 07 November, 2019 10:45
I certainly wouldn't feel much about a SA team called the Boers - I think that might be in issue in SA but why would it bother us? As far as I recall we were probably the villains of that particular piece.



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Re: And we all thought the logo was something to do with the Middle East
Stopsy 07 November, 2019 10:50
Neither the Brits nor the Boers come out of Southern Africa with any credit

Re: And we all thought the logo was something to do with the Middle East
Rich W 07 November, 2019 10:56
Either way.



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Re: And we all thought the logo was something to do with the Middle East
Tom Paine 07 November, 2019 11:12
Sorry about mixing up Exeter and Worcester. Are you ok with the 'Chiefs'? The name itself is innocent enough until it is linked to NA culture.

Re: And we all thought the logo was something to do with the Middle East
Stopsy 07 November, 2019 11:19
I can understand why some find it wrong, I don't.

Re: And we all thought the logo was something to do with the Middle East
SK 88 07 November, 2019 11:56
The Chiefs racist branding and iconography will all come home to roost at some point.

Saracens is a more complex one for me, Saracen as a term is no longer used for any group and never really held negative connotations, it is almost a term post its origins, a bit like "Barbarian". The only middle eastern iconography they use is the Fez and the Camal mascot, which is much better than a disparaging cartoon representation of real people. And also its been the name of the club literally for ever. It's not a made up name in the last 20 years well after these conversations were already happening (ala Chiefs).

Re: And we all thought the logo was something to do with the Middle East
Rich W 07 November, 2019 12:32
Well put.



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Re: And we all thought the logo was something to do with the Middle East
Dreadnought 07 November, 2019 12:55
Wikipedia:-
"Saracen is a despective term widely used among Christian writers in Europe during the Middle Ages to refer to Arabs and Muslims"

The Fez is a recent construct (19th Century) and is has no context with the use of the word Saracen.
The employment of the image of a camel just like wearing a Fez is totally random.

Re: And we all thought the logo was something to do with the Middle East
Stopsy 07 November, 2019 13:16
The fez signifies that the wearer has completed the haj

Re: And we all thought the logo was something to do with the Middle East
Dreadnought 07 November, 2019 15:55
Quote:
Stopsy
The fez signifies that the wearer has completed the haj

Not true as at the time these hats first came into use the Haj was suspended (980AD) and instead of going to Mecca for the Haj, the pilgrims were directed to Fez where the hats were sold and hence the name.

Furthermore, Fez hats were actually worn by Turkish non muslims and at the end of the nineteenth century was considered to be the national headress of Turkey.

By the beginning of the 20th century, Austria had become the new capital of the fez manufacturing industry.

Re: And we all thought the logo was something to do with the Middle East
Stopsy 07 November, 2019 16:11
Ah, thank you Deadnaught

Re: And we all thought the logo was something to do with the Middle East
SimonG19 07 November, 2019 16:48
Quote:
Dreadnought
Quote:
Stopsy
The fez signifies that the wearer has completed the haj

Not true as at the time these hats first came into use the Haj was suspended (980AD) and instead of going to Mecca for the Haj, the pilgrims were directed to Fez where the hats were sold and hence the name.

Furthermore, Fez hats were actually worn by Turkish non muslims and at the end of the nineteenth century was considered to be the national headress of Turkey.

By the beginning of the 20th century, Austria had become the new capital of the fez manufacturing industry.

I just assumed they were big Tommy Cooper fans liking the way he could make things (like huge amounts of money) disappear but so badly that everyone watching knew what was going on.

Re: And we all thought the logo was something to do with the Middle East
Yorkie 07 November, 2019 18:55
Quote:
Tom Paine
At the risk of being called a 'melt' or 'snowflake' by Yorkie & Co

I don't ever remember referring to you or anyone else with such terms?



http://www.jakehowlett.com/tuckshop/wrappers/chocolate/plain/yorkie-nutter.jpg

Re: And we all thought the logo was something to do with the Middle East
ttbb 07 November, 2019 19:01
Personally I think our sport is in a bad way. This means that the competitions we have spent hundreds of hours watching over the last few seasons have been fixed. Don't get me started on SA winning the world cup- it's already been said by others and it's not pretty.

Re: And we all thought the logo was something to do with the Middle East
Siggy89 07 November, 2019 21:20
Quote:
ttbb
Personally I think our sport is in a bad way. This means that the competitions we have spent hundreds of hours watching over the last few seasons have been fixed. Don't get me started on SA winning the world cup- it's already been said by others and it's not pretty.

It is but after this week's official confirmation of the cheating there is a much better chance of the Premiership no longer being corrupt.

Re: And we all thought the logo was something to do with the Middle East
Tom Paine 07 November, 2019 21:24
Apologies, Yorkie. I was anticipating your down-to-earth take on such matters. It was a bit of a tongue-in-cheek post, though I do agree with SK88 about the Chiefs. No offence intended.

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