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OTY cited
Discussion started by daktari , 17 February, 2020 13:45
OTY cited
daktari 17 February, 2020 13:45
For punch at Wasps game , I told you this would happen, thank Dallaglio and BT sports



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 17/02/2020 14:08 by daktari.

Re: OTY cited
Rich W 17 February, 2020 14:09
This is outrageous.



...

Re: OTY cited
Al from Cov 17 February, 2020 14:24
Quote:
daktari
For punch at Wasps game , I told you this would happen, thank Dallaglio and BT sports

Thank Dallaglio and BT Sports??? Not thank the player for the dirty punch that left Rowlands with a right mark on his face?

Re: OTY cited
Stopsy 17 February, 2020 14:24
Well he either punched him or he didn’t, if he had not have punched then even the biased Dallaglio couldn’t have been cheerleader

Re: OTY cited
jojo 17 February, 2020 14:43
thick skinned idiot.

Re: OTY cited
Rich W 17 February, 2020 14:46
But no citing for the hand in the face (around the eye area) of the man prone on the ground that provoked it.



...

Re: OTY cited
Stopsy 17 February, 2020 14:52
Is that to me jojo?

Re: OTY cited
daktari 17 February, 2020 14:55
Quote:
Rich W
But no citing for the hand in the face (around the eye area) of the man prone on the ground that provoked it.

Of course not , BT Sport and Dallaglio didnt endlessly report and repeat that element of the event , as they didn`t earlier when Dan Cole seemed to have been attacked.

Re: OTY cited
daktari 17 February, 2020 16:15
Dallaglio uses the words "punch" and "fist" during the commentary , without any evidence of the hand being closed or open and disregards the hand in OTY face/eyes prior to the alledged action. That is what is called selective and prejudicial reporting at anyone`s level apart from those who choose not to see it. See here



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 17/02/2020 16:16 by daktari.

Re: OTY cited
SimonG19 17 February, 2020 16:40
I think the citing officer and the disciplinary panel are quite capable of making their own minds up.

Re: OTY cited
daktari 17 February, 2020 16:42
Quote:
SimonG19
I think the citing officer and the disciplinary panel are quite capable of making their own minds up.
Now that is being somewhat naive following the many travesty's meted out over the last few years.

Re: OTY cited
jojo 17 February, 2020 17:29
what do you think Stops?

It could refer to anyone TY You or even that pillock in the commentary box. I know which one I meant.(Sm14)

Re: OTY cited
ukms 17 February, 2020 18:18
Quote:
daktari
Dallaglio uses the words "punch" and "fist" during the commentary , without any evidence of the hand being closed or open and disregards the hand in OTY face/eyes prior to the alledged action. That is what is called selective and prejudicial reporting at anyone`s level apart from those who choose not to see it. See here

Do you really think the citing officer and TMO sit listening to the BT sport commentators ? smiling smiley .... they have their own feeds and don’t listen to BT or any commentary ......

Re: OTY cited
Gaz 17 February, 2020 18:52
Nathan Hughes was pinned down by the throat by I can't remember who, he retaliated with a punch and was cited and banned for it. The guy pinning him down wasn't cited.

I didn't defend Nathan at the time. Retaliation is not an excuse. In fact I think I criticised him for the safety of my keyboard! Also didn't waste energy worrying about whether the other guy should or shouldn't be cited. You just can't go round punching people on the rugby field anymore.

Re: OTY cited
SK 88 17 February, 2020 19:37
Quote:
ukms
Quote:
daktari
Dallaglio uses the words "punch" and "fist" during the commentary , without any evidence of the hand being closed or open and disregards the hand in OTY face/eyes prior to the alledged action. That is what is called selective and prejudicial reporting at anyone`s level apart from those who choose not to see it. See here

Do you really think the citing officer and TMO sit listening to the BT sport commentators ? smiling smiley .... they have their own feeds and don’t listen to BT or any commentary ......

I once saw a video on the TMO in the Pro 14 final.

You could clearly hear Stuart Barnes' TV commentary on in the background.

A lifetime in rugby does not make me share your faith in fairness or due process at all.

Re: OTY cited
SK 88 17 February, 2020 19:44
Also on TMO's and TV producers:

Link to picture of newspaper report

Trnalsation:

Quote:
"WELL, WE'RE TRYING TO BE OBJECTIVE" FRED GODARD, DIRECTOR FOR FRANCE TÉLÉVISIONS
In the OB van, this is madness. I give orders, we hear the live comments... the TMO is in the middle of it all. When he is isolated, he has more distance. He can really watch the TV. When the TMO reviews a sequence, I offer him different angles. Can I sometimes forget an angle ? I have to be careful... (smiles). An English supports the English, a French supports the French... I once have not shown a punch by a Castres player in a scrum during the HCup. The player could have been expelled. There was a beginning of a fight, we understood that the French hooker had started it. The TMO asked me for the image.... Ah, I didn't have it. If I had been English, I would have had it. In another match in Toulon, I may have considered that a try was valid in the spirit. Maybe I forgot an angle... It is possible.... When England lost to New Zealand for a foot that touched the line in the final minutes, Rowan Kitt [the video referee during France/South Africa, the same day] felt that it was not in the spirit of the game, that the try should have been awarded. Don't forget he's English! If I had been the New Zealand director for the match, I would have multiplied the slowdowns forward and backward to make the TMO surrender to the evidence. If you're on the other side, you put the image on, but you don't insist as much. Either the referee has understood you or he is uncompromising. But hey, we try to be objective because now we're being watched. Fifteen years ago, it was freer...

Let's not be stupid and wilfully blind here. English TV producers under pressure from the commentators will find some footage and not find other footage. A Wasps employee is commentating and influencing these matches. And apparently we're meant to say that is fine.

Re: OTY cited
tigerburnie 17 February, 2020 21:33
There's punching and there's punching, a certain farmer ex of this parish was known to give the appropriate level of correction for those who asked for it, certain players have deserved a smack, Manu giving Splashton one seemed to be perfectly in proportion(even if the hysterical Sinners fans said he could have been killed OTT or what). Johnno, Louis Deacon were all applauded for doing such in an England or Lions shirt, even Dayglo chucked the odd handbag. What is supposed to have happened at the weekend was a poke, the guy was lying on his back, so no backswing to create the required level of thump.

Re: OTY cited
ukms 17 February, 2020 23:40
Quote:
SK 88
Also on TMO's and TV producers:
Link to picture of newspaper report

Trnalsation:

Quote:
"WELL, WE'RE TRYING TO BE OBJECTIVE" FRED GODARD, DIRECTOR FOR FRANCE TÉLÉVISIONS
In the OB van, this is madness. I give orders, we hear the live comments... the TMO is in the middle of it all. When he is isolated, he has more distance. He can really watch the TV. When the TMO reviews a sequence, I offer him different angles. Can I sometimes forget an angle ? I have to be careful... (smiles). An English supports the English, a French supports the French... I once have not shown a punch by a Castres player in a scrum during the HCup. The player could have been expelled. There was a beginning of a fight, we understood that the French hooker had started it. The TMO asked me for the image.... Ah, I didn't have it. If I had been English, I would have had it. In another match in Toulon, I may have considered that a try was valid in the spirit. Maybe I forgot an angle... It is possible.... When England lost to New Zealand for a foot that touched the line in the final minutes, Rowan Kitt [the video referee during France/South Africa, the same day] felt that it was not in the spirit of the game, that the try should have been awarded. Don't forget he's English! If I had been the New Zealand director for the match, I would have multiplied the slowdowns forward and backward to make the TMO surrender to the evidence. If you're on the other side, you put the image on, but you don't insist as much. Either the referee has understood you or he is uncompromising. But hey, we try to be objective because now we're being watched. Fifteen years ago, it was freer...

Let's not be stupid and wilfully blind here. English TV producers under pressure from the commentators will find some footage and not find other footage. A Wasps employee is commentating and influencing these matches. And apparently we're meant to say that is fine.

Shooting yourself in the foot somewhat. .......

So what you are saying is despite BT sport showing footage and the biased commentary the TMO turned a blind eye to an incident that was clearly visible to everyone else, which resulted in a Tigers player staying on the pitch ? Had he been carded at the time the game ‘could’ have had a different outcome.

Re: OTY cited
tigersimon 18 February, 2020 09:10
Quote:
Gaz
Nathan Hughes was pinned down by the throat by I can't remember who, he retaliated with a punch and was cited and banned for it. The guy pinning him down wasn't cited.
I didn't defend Nathan at the time. Retaliation is not an excuse. In fact I think I criticised him for the safety of my keyboard! Also didn't waste energy worrying about whether the other guy should or shouldn't be cited. You just can't go round punching people on the rugby field anymore.

As Gaz says ‘Retaliation is not an excuse’ and unfortunately the video does show some movement of OTYs hand towards Rowlands. Unclear what happened before this to cause this reaction but the Laws of the game rightly so punish the person who retaliates.

So IMO Guilty and cops the 3-4 week ban.

Not handled well by Ref and TMO at the time as the inference was it had been checked?

Dayglo clearly has a bias towards Wasps and BT Sport should ensure integrity and NOT have him or Ben Kay as commentary team members for Wasps and Leicester games respectively. The director runs replays based on what the commentary team says and have seen plenty of occasions where the TMO who sits in a BT truck has been influenced. Not sure where & when the Citing officer watches the game? Benny tries to be impartial but like I said on the Sinners Api disciplinary hearing thread the other week, there are enough commentators (panel members) not to put people in this position.
The time for comments from Lol and Ben is on the Wednesday evening programme.

Re: OTY cited
SK 88 18 February, 2020 10:02
UKMS, the TMO did check it and said it was fine. As it clearly was to everyone other than the Wasps employee who spent minutes badgering on about it and who set the post match agenda about it.

It's funny to me that many people in the game get so sanctimonious about appealing to officials for decisions when it very clearly works. You can't blame Dallaglio, his histrionics have deflected the coverage away from Wasps sacking their coach and bottling the match. Job done by their director on the PR front I'd say.

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