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Season Ticket survey
Discussion started by Innings , 15 May, 2020 18:18
Season Ticket survey
Innings 15 May, 2020 18:18
Oh Dear, manifestly a box-ticking exercise, endless multiple choice questions, like asking me to list six or even ten 'match day experience' factors in order of importance. Can I not just be a committed supporter who's invested many years and tears in Sarries? I really cannot analyse the relative importance to me of half the items in every question, but you cannot complete the survey without that dissection.

Why not the old-fashioned idea of focus group meetings? Even easier to organise, on-line, now that everyone's stuck at home most of the time.



Innings

Points win matches: tries win hearts and minds.

Re: Season Ticket survey
The Bard 15 May, 2020 22:59
A very long survey and quite agree about the tedious questions where you have to rank insignificant things in order. On the other hand questions about the club and the salary only have black or white choices.
But the club are clearly in financial straits and appear to be seeking fans who will pay multiple years season ticket funds up front.

Re: Season Ticket survey
Roger G 15 May, 2020 23:11
Having failed to reward brand loyalty for the last few years I suspect it may be difficult to get more than a very few hard core fans to do that. They need to be whiter than white and show what has changed...and I don't know how they'll do that.

Re: Season Ticket survey
Comfortably Dumb 16 May, 2020 00:43
Multiple choice questions were painfully annoying but I did have fun with the occasional free text options.

Re: Season Ticket survey
boomer! 16 May, 2020 10:31
Quote:
Roger G
Having failed to reward brand loyalty for the last few years I suspect it may be difficult to get more than a very few hard core fans to do that. They need to be whiter than white and show what has changed...and I don't know how they'll do that.
.
.
I thought Saracens rugby team winning the Premiership 5 times and Euro Champions Cup 3 times was reward (we got) for brand loyalty. Clearly I have misunderstood the point of supporting a team and going to rugby matches.

Doh!



It's not the size of the dog in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog.

Re: Season Ticket survey
Dave Berko 16 May, 2020 11:31
Was this an email? If so not had it!!!!!!

Re: Season Ticket survey
Roger G 16 May, 2020 13:50
Quote:
boomer!
Quote:
Roger G
Having failed to reward brand loyalty for the last few years I suspect it may be difficult to get more than a very few hard core fans to do that. They need to be whiter than white and show what has changed...and I don't know how they'll do that.
.
.
I thought Saracens rugby team winning the Premiership 5 times and Euro Champions Cup 3 times was reward (we got) for brand loyalty. Clearly I have misunderstood the point of supporting a team and going to rugby matches.

Doh!

Loyalty is a two way thing and it can hardly be argued that Sarries have looked after their core support too well over the last few years. They say it's about making memories, not winning, so no all those trophies aren't the reward I look for. I enjoyed watching Sarries, and felt much more a part of the club, when the outcome of the season was much less certain, and we could only dream of trophies. Back in those days there were modest discounts for regular season ticket renewals, and the occasional small gift (e.g. a scarf or a cap).

And regarding the memories I'm left with, right now my ones of recent years are having my seat price hiked more than once, to the point that I don't know if I can afford even the much less central view I now have, while it now transpires that some of that extra cash was being used in a rather cavalier way, thus raising doubts about the legitimacy of all the trophies that you so enjoyed winning.

Re: Season Ticket survey
Steve Robo 16 May, 2020 16:45
Just tried to do the survey and its closed

Re: Season Ticket survey
myleftboot 16 May, 2020 20:31
Quote:
Steve Robo
Just tried to do the survey and its closed
obviously not for you then! It's a tough world right now, for everyone. Can't blame them for trying but I'd imagine a Sarries ticket is very low in most people's lists right now!

Re: Season Ticket survey
Barty II 17 May, 2020 13:10
Why choose to take part in an optional survey and then moan about the content....

Re: Season Ticket survey
Innings 17 May, 2020 17:17
Well
Quote:
BartyII
Why choose to take part in an optional survey and then moan about the content....
It might be because some people might want to contribute to a well-considered and prepared survey, but be less pleased when it's clearly not actually worth the effort.



Innings

Points win matches: tries win hearts and minds.

Re: Season Ticket survey
nicsue 17 May, 2020 22:30
Quote:
Steve Robo
Just tried to do the survey and its closed

No it's not. I saw your comment and dashed back to my email to have a go. It's still open, it took me 35 minutes to complete, it asks some rubbish questions, and I am just so excited that as a thank you for completing it I am to be sent the results.
If you didn't get the email it says to contact Supporter Services - no idea if there is anyone there as I know one person was made redundant and one was furloughed.

Re: Season Ticket survey
AP 18 May, 2020 07:43
I started it, the internet went down, life moved on, I didn't go back.



Successful hills are here to stay
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Welcome to the Soft Parade

Re: Season Ticket survey
Barty II 18 May, 2020 08:08
Quote:
Innings
Well
Quote:
BartyII
Why choose to take part in an optional survey and then moan about the content....
It might be because some people might want to contribute to a well-considered and prepared survey, but be less pleased when it's clearly not actually worth the effort.

Just like the answers to any survey, that's a matter of opinion. I personally found it pretty thorough and well put together. Clearly, they are listing out as much as possible, every option they feel is available at the time and getting the fans opinion on which is the priority. Fail to see how that isn't worth the effort, but like I said, its all opinion. as for ranking items from 1-10, I see why people can find that tiresome but the simple fact is they will only be looking at what items are consistently at the extreme ends of thinking - people's main priorities, and what the club doesn't need to focus their resources on. The stuff in the middle will just happen if it can. If they show us the results in a few weeks, and we can clearly see what the majority of respondents priorities are, then hopefully we see that's exactly what they do, and shows they are listening.

I may of course be missing something, so interested to know what you would consider a better considered/prepared survey that's worth your effort.

Re: Season Ticket survey
Jim 55 18 May, 2020 17:42
I was reminded of that well known periodical Pravda. Written to get the answers they want, I started it and gave up, very disappointing.

Re: Season Ticket survey
Barty II 19 May, 2020 09:10
Quote:
Jim 55
I was reminded of that well known periodical Pravda. Written to get the answers they want, I started it and gave up, very disappointing.

Alternative scenario - they run an open survey, suggestions are made that are entirely valid but simply not feasible. The club are then seen to be ignoring the fans, said survey was a waste of time and the cycle continues. I think its perfectly reasonable for them to basically be saying "here's some possibilities we think we can handle in the current climate, which of them would be your preference and what don't you care about?"

Re: Season Ticket survey
jonnybrowne 19 May, 2020 11:08
The survey was pretty long but no problem with that - I’ve filled in plenty of “employee feedback” surveys that have taken as much if not more time.

Clearly the club needs to get bums on seats for next season and try to make it worthwhile for everyone without having to speculate too much to accumulate, as it were, and I won’t criticise them for that.

Re: Season Ticket survey
Duncan96 19 May, 2020 13:00
Quote:
Roger G
Quote:
boomer!
Quote:
Roger G
Having failed to reward brand loyalty for the last few years I suspect it may be difficult to get more than a very few hard core fans to do that. They need to be whiter than white and show what has changed...and I don't know how they'll do that.
.
.
I thought Saracens rugby team winning the Premiership 5 times and Euro Champions Cup 3 times was reward (we got) for brand loyalty. Clearly I have misunderstood the point of supporting a team and going to rugby matches.

Doh!

Loyalty is a two way thing and it can hardly be argued that Sarries have looked after their core support too well over the last few years. They say it's about making memories, not winning, so no all those trophies aren't the reward I look for. I enjoyed watching Sarries, and felt much more a part of the club, when the outcome of the season was much less certain, and we could only dream of trophies. Back in those days there were modest discounts for regular season ticket renewals, and the occasional small gift (e.g. a scarf or a cap).

And regarding the memories I'm left with, right now my ones of recent years are having my seat price hiked more than once, to the point that I don't know if I can afford even the much less central view I now have, while it now transpires that some of that extra cash was being used in a rather cavalier way, thus raising doubts about the legitimacy of all the trophies that you so enjoyed winning.

Looks like it's getting hard for them in a kind of damned if they do damned if they don't way. The survey asks what kind of gifts people would value which sounds like a good idea to me (to ask that is) and asks for opinions about discounts (again, a good idea to ask). I.e. asking for opinions on the things you want to see.

It also acknowlwdges that the manner of the previous price hikes was badly done (to put it mildly). Can they say more than "We got it wrong"?. After all, the problem is that, for all the time you have been going to Saracens Nigel Wray has been subsidising your seat to the tune of upto £500 per year. At some point that has to stop doesn't it which is the problem? As a long time supporter you have had more of a subsidy than the rest of us. Surely they deserve some credit for that.

And as for salaries causing the price hikes, of course, that's the reason. But the naughty stuff was, I believe, largely contained in the "Co investments". Post corona and a house price slump that may well cost NW money. At the time I think they were expected to make money as they were loans against houses and not cash outgoings. All Prem clubs bar Exeter (who I've read off load costs to a more tax effective business) lose money so it's not just Saracens.

Fair to say, then, I understand ticket price rises hurt when you can't afford them. I think you are going to carry on being hurt and angry about them but I don't see a solution. The "good old days" are going to look better and better for you I'm afraid.

Re: Season Ticket survey
Barty II 01 June, 2020 17:06
For those interested, the latest email from the club has a link to the results at the bottom. Make for interesting reading so far. Haven't fully digested so not going to comment just yet

Re: Season Ticket survey
McSaracens 01 June, 2020 17:29
Hi Barty, any chance you could share a link, either here or via a PM?

As usual no email!

Thanks so much



“I believe it might have been said before, but there is something special happening at Saracens, and I want to be part of it.” - Nils Mordt



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/06/2020 17:30 by McSaracens.

Re: Season Ticket survey
Duncan96 01 June, 2020 21:47
Seasonal Member Survey

Does that work?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/06/2020 21:49 by Duncan96.

Re: Season Ticket survey
nedrichards 01 June, 2020 22:24
As far as I can see from the survey the most well regarded facet of the club is Sarrie the Camel, closely followed by "Quality of Rugby". As is right and proper, "quality rugby" never got on a hovercraft, after all.

Re: Season Ticket survey
myleftboot 02 June, 2020 06:51
Was there no option to bring back the r/c kicking tee delivery car? That would fly over our carpet now!

Re: Season Ticket survey
Barty II 02 June, 2020 07:08
Quote:
nedrichards
As far as I can see from the survey the most well regarded facet of the club is Sarrie the Camel, closely followed by "Quality of Rugby". As is right and proper, "quality rugby" never got on a hovercraft, after all.

Did think that the 15 people saying Sarrie the Camel negatively affects their matchday experience need to lighten up a bit!

Re: Season Ticket survey
Innings 02 June, 2020 10:41
Perhaps the clearest indication was that whilst there is a committed and long-standing core of respondents, even they are not generally prepared to pay top Premiership prices for Championship product. It may be a hangover from the gouging price rises of a couple of seasons ago, or a reaction to paying so much for so little this time around, but many respondents make clear that their ceiling of acceptable cost has been reached. What this realisation will do to the ambition to have a top European club based in a small stadium is to be seen. IMHO, either seat numbers for all games at Barnet has to go to about 20,000, or Sarries have to go from Barnet, or ambitions have to be scaled back.



Innings

Points win matches: tries win hearts and minds.

Re: Season Ticket survey
Sara'sman 02 June, 2020 12:19
I felt the club was on course towards breaking even with the new stand likely to increase the numbers (and income from) both corporates and higher priced seats, the university rental, and the rumoured increased ground sponsorship. If the second athletics track in the wider complex is delivered, this may enable the ground to gradually increase to c15k capacity with bigger wider stands behind the goals, delivering a larger number of lower priced seats. The salary scandal and Covid have obviously set this back a long way. I recall Nigel taking of the mid-term need for a larger stadium, even suggesting this might not be at Copthall. There is a positive side to our low (considering the quality of the side) average gate: our ground has a very welcoming atmosphere, with a significant proportion of long term genuine rugby fans and is growing strongly from a smaller base for whom attending rugby games is a long established habit.

Whilst I share Innings' worry regarding income generated through the gate I'd give similar concern to the sustainability of our unique culture. The club has a laudable and leading caring reputation for both staff and the wider community. There can be no doubt that this is strongly led personally by Nigel's energy, actions and finance, nor that it must be under threat after the recent events.

On the survey it seems long winded, a little clumsy with some misleading "averages", but nonetheless a welcome opportunity for supporters to give feedback, a chance taken by a significant number given our small core fan base.

Re: Season Ticket survey
OldMarovian 02 June, 2020 12:58
Quote:
Barty II
[Did think that the 15 people saying Sarrie the Camel negatively affects their matchday experience need to lighten up a bit!

I think they should be named and shamed!! Who could not like Sarrie the Camel?

I found the survey and the results interesting.

In my view it raises lots of questions about the role we fill as supporters. Is it a simple as a transaction in which we pay money and expect to be entertained? Do we value our own contribution versus the clubs sustainability? etc

A great point was made about the degree to which Nigels largess actually subsidises ALL our seating and how that isn't sustainable if we want a club in the future. The thing reinforced by the survey seems to me to be that the thing the majority want is their support of the club to be cheaper. How that links with the club continuing as on ongoing concern should be obvious given we can't simply add 5-10K seats at the current site.

The thing that I was a bit disappointed about was the large support for STs always being the cheapest option to the exclusion of filling the venue by offering cheaper match day tickets on occasion. Whilst I understand the "not wanting to see someone get a cheap ticket when even at ST prices you have paid more" it seems painfully short-sighted to me.
Tbh I'd happily have someone sitting next to me who has paid £X less if it meant that we were having most games full. In terms of my experience of games I'd say one of the biggest differences in my enjoyment is how full the stadium is as it has a great atmosphere when full.

I feel that the club is mising a trick by not having more events that are ST "perks" (or maybe free to ST and paid for others) The SSA do a great job of organising events but some of the things they do are things that could be rolled into part of the "offering" to ST holders to make you feel extra value of that at a relatively low cost to the club. We have the summer gathering and Chrsitmas parties but why not add to that with events where there could be a discussion panel or even a watch and the post game analysis of a fanmous game? Q&A with the players etc

Re: Season Ticket survey
Mac L 02 June, 2020 13:22
Good to see survey and results. Obviously I was missed out on both sets of emails

Re: Season Ticket survey
myleftboot 02 June, 2020 14:02
Really agree with OldMarovian about the cheap tickets, it was those that got me going more than the odd game a season at Vic Road, and really catching the bug.

Re: Season Ticket survey
Innings 02 June, 2020 14:48
It occurs to me that it would have been informative for the club to have applied a geographic overlay to the analysis. It may be that some preferences are directly linked to how far one lives from the ground. For a simple example, I live in Hampshire, and getting to a home game by car involves a 58 mile drive to get to the stadium, similar to get to OAs. Therefore, match-day tends to be exactly that, a day's commitment. In that context, the cost of travel means that perks like free access to some games, free or reduced-price merchandise are neither here not there in my selection of preferences, whilst the experience on match-day is paramount. Someone living closer to the ground might see their incentive in terms of supporter events like meeting players, access to training sessions and so on, with the match-day experience already good enough.

My only major opinion was that the home games played at football grounds should not be included in the season ticket package. Why should I be excited about a minimum three hour journey on public transport, each way to watch a game in a stadium that I don't like?



Innings

Points win matches: tries win hearts and minds.

Re: Season Ticket survey
OldMarovian 02 June, 2020 15:32
Agree myleftboot. I think it's a great way to capture interest from initially "casual" fans.

Quote:
Innings
In that context, the cost of travel means that perks like free access to some games, free or reduced-price merchandise are neither here not there in my selection of preferences, whilst the experience on match-day is paramount. Someone living closer to the ground might see their incentive in terms of supporter events like meeting players, access to training sessions and so on, with the match-day experience already good enough.

That's interesting. What sort of things would improve the matchday experience for you Innings?

One thing that obviously wasn't covered by the survey but I would love to know was whether the recategorising of tickets and price hike was a success in terms of revenue generation.

Re: Season Ticket survey
Innings 02 June, 2020 19:31
Quote:
What sort of things would improve the matchday experience for you Innings?

Actually, very little. Moving the sun a bit so that it didn't shine just over the roof of the west stand in the second half would be a good start. After that, the more difficult things.



Innings

Points win matches: tries win hearts and minds.

Re: Season Ticket survey
maynas 03 June, 2020 11:23
Still waiting for news when I get my refund for the tickets I bought for the Spurs match never mind my season ticket. Surely it must be obviously to them by now that there wont be a game at Spurs nor Allianz Park (or whatever its called now Allianz are no longer sponsors) this season. I dont mind giving money to charities but there are more worthy ones around at the moment given the state of the world post virus.

Re: Season Ticket survey
Barty II 03 June, 2020 11:40
Quote:
maynas
Still waiting for news when I get my refund for the tickets I bought for the Spurs match never mind my season ticket. Surely it must be obviously to them by now that there wont be a game at Spurs nor Allianz Park (or whatever its called now Allianz are no longer sponsors) this season. I dont mind giving money to charities but there are more worthy ones around at the moment given the state of the world post virus.

The News

Re: Season Ticket survey
maynas 03 June, 2020 11:49
Just more vagueness. These guys should be running an airline they are so good at avoiding a refund. Spurs match wont happen. Refund now.

Re: Season Ticket survey
Barty II 03 June, 2020 11:54
Its in the hands of the league, and players are now returning to non-contact training. No decision made on when and how matches will be held. The league wants teams to be aligned on the method of exchanges and refunds when it happens so it's not a major mess. If certain clubs refund their home matches, and others don't, fans who travel to away games then have to work out what they've had back and what's left. Far more sensible to hold fire, and sort it all out in one go when a proper decision is made.

Of course Saracens statement is vague. Because there's not a single person in the country who knows exactly how this is going to play out.

Re: Season Ticket survey
Innings 03 June, 2020 12:35
This isn't an airline, with hundreds working in payment processing: it's a small business facing unprecedented difficulties. Best use of resources would be that a single refund or re-allocation process be offered equally to all when the plans for this and next season will be known, and that seems to be exactly what Sarries are doing. Writing to ask for more certainty than that already available simply distracts from the task in hand.



Innings

Points win matches: tries win hearts and minds.

Re: Season Ticket survey
The Bard 03 June, 2020 20:40
I suspect any staff left who might have dealt with it have been furloughed anyway.


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