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JFPC
JFPC
01 February, 2020 08:08
Quote:
BathMatt53
Time to close the thread!

What? Why? Is brexit now 'done'?



Adopted player 2019/20 Will Chudley.

BathMatt53
BathMatt53
01 February, 2020 08:42
It’s going to turn into a ‘I told you so thread’, whether it goes well or badly. All this tripe about the country now coming together is, well, tripe. I was hoping that it had died a natural death. No worries I just won’t click on it!



[Actively seeking a new adoptee: until I'm assigned one I'm going for Joshua Matavesi]

BBandW
BBandW
01 February, 2020 08:47
Quote:
BathMatt53
Time to close the thread!

Brexit has only just started - why would you want to close the thread ?

MESSAGES->author
OutsideBath
01 February, 2020 09:13
Quote:
BathMatt53
Time to close the thread!

Or rename it the “I told you so” thread

DanWiley
DanWiley
01 February, 2020 09:45
Just let threads live and die naturally. If people don't want to say an bring it will close itself. If they do they'll just start another.

"Britain will in time be Great again.

Britain is and was, what's going to change to make it greater?

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
01 February, 2020 10:12
Quote:
BathMatt53
Time to close the thread!

+1 Agree



https://i.ibb.co/gjWyP09/Unknown-1-2.jpg


Beno Obano Age 25 years, Loosehead prop, 5ft 8ins 18st 12lbs 'Mauls are like Transformers' they change form to become more powerful!

gaz59
gaz59
01 February, 2020 10:45
Quote:
OutsideBath
Quote:
BathMatt53
Time to close the thread!

Or rename it the “I told you so” thread

So if things do start to go badly and we don't get a good deal with the EU and we get shafted by Trump what are we supposed to do? Put fingers in ears, cover eyes and say well it wasn't ever about being better off it was all about having the right to decide to be shafted by Trump etc and look what we've got!

Sorry but if as a result of this monumental decision we are not better off I will say so. Not to be pious and smug but hopefully to help get back to a stronger place

And equally if it does actually go well then I'm happy to have a forum to acknowledge that too

Even Johnson is now accepting that Brexit is not really done, it is just the beginning

John Tee
John Tee
01 February, 2020 11:05
Well, we are out, so that is step one, step two is to find our way in a new world.
Will we get everything we want, probably not but we get to make the choice and/or compromise.
I dont really get why people want that to fail but that is for them.

Things change but to be fair, the U.S has always seen us as a competitor to deal with...in a way, no different from say, Germany or any other dominating power bloc. We just fight them less now.
Free trade will work if the entities want it to...and make it difficult if they dont.
What, for example, suits Germany and France and the euro elite to keep their project, might not suit the smaller countries, so it becomes a question of how well they buy off their objections.

Europe will go under much much change and the inhibitor to all this will be the political element rather than the practical, imo.

Man from LA
Man from LA
01 February, 2020 12:55
Quote:
gaz59
Quote:
OutsideBath
Quote:
BathMatt53
Time to close the thread!

Or rename it the “I told you so” thread

So if things do start to go badly and we don't get a good deal with the EU and we get shafted by Trump what are we supposed to do? Put fingers in ears, cover eyes and say well it wasn't ever about being better off it was all about having the right to decide to be shafted by Trump etc and look what we've got!

Sorry but if as a result of this monumental decision we are not better off I will say so. Not to be pious and smug but hopefully to help get back to a stronger place

And equally if it does actually go well then I'm happy to have a forum to acknowledge that too

Even Johnson is now accepting that Brexit is not really done, it is just the beginning

It's a free country (and always has been, irrespective of what anyone says, hence the referendum we had), you can say now you think it's a bad decision or in the future, the Farage's and Bill Cash's don't own free speech or care about democracy, if they did they wouldn't have been trying for 40 years to overturn the will of the people from 1975. And just like Farage and Cash have done but in reverse, the millions of pro-Europeans in the UK are free to campaign to rejoin the EU in the future.

The ironic thing is, thanks to Brexit, the UK now has the biggest pro-EU movement in Europe.

gaz59
gaz59
01 February, 2020 14:48
Just one more time. I don't want Brexit to fail. I want this country and my family who live in it to be better off. I just don't think it will by some distance

And already it seems Johnson is backtracking and reports indicating there will after all be considerable checks on EU imports and goods coming in from NI.

Without full alignment it is difficult to see the EU agreeing a free trade treaty. Johnson is right on this one, we are only just at the beginning

John Tee
John Tee
01 February, 2020 16:31
if you want to trade to europe, you'll have to consider alignment, if you dont, you might not...
Does it have to be a national level, i dont see why it should ...

If you dont want to buy chicken from a certain country dont buy it.
I do this in supermarkets all the time....we look at contents etc. Not hard.
Markets sell products people buy...

If europe want to make buying hard...why would they do that..?

MESSAGES->author
joethefanatic
01 February, 2020 19:00
Looks like Gibraltar is stuffed.

[www.theguardian.com]



... IMHO, of course.

Now in Honolulu

John Tee
John Tee
01 February, 2020 19:39
Is anyone surprised... nope, not in a million.

Lets see Spain put their African enclaves in the Med up as well...lol



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/02/2020 19:41 by John Tee.

MESSAGES->author
joethefanatic
01 February, 2020 20:19
Quote:
John Tee
Is anyone surprised... nope, not in a million.
Lets see Spain put their African enclaves in the Med up as well...lol

They don't need to, they're not leaving the EU.



... IMHO, of course.

Now in Honolulu

gaz59
gaz59
01 February, 2020 21:51
Perhaps, just perhaps Johnson is beginning to realise that with making promises to get into no 10 comes the responsibility of delivering on those promises

And that is the tricky bit

John Tee
John Tee
01 February, 2020 22:20
Quote:
joethefanatic
Quote:
John Tee
Is anyone surprised... nope, not in a million.
Lets see Spain put their African enclaves in the Med up as well...lol

They don't need to, they're not leaving the EU.

Whats that got to do with it....

If Gibraltar want to join Spain, they'll vote for it, otherwise its a complete non question.

annie blackthorn
annie blackthorn
01 February, 2020 22:58
I would suggest that Mods consider closing this thread.

I do wonder what the rightwing eurosceptics, esp those who rant on and on in Parliament, will find to do with themselves - who will they start on next as not being acceptable Brits? Presumably the Scots, The Welsh and the Irish? LOL!

Bathovalballer
Bathovalballer
01 February, 2020 23:29
I see the EU is so desperate for money they have hit the UK with a bill for around £1.09 billion extra for last year.

I will look forward to the day when the Brits aren't propping up the rest of Europe and not seeing any true benefits in return. I believe the UK provides something like 15% of the total EU budget so the rest of the European countries are going to have to dig deeper to fund the bun fight in both Brussels and Strasbourg in the future. That is going to be interesting. Thank God we are coming out.



Adopted player 2019/20 Jonathan 'JJ' Joseph.

The Jink Joseph.

Adopted player 2018/19 Adopted player 2018/19 Semesa 'The Rock' Rokoduguni

Man from LA
Man from LA
01 February, 2020 23:55
Quote:
Bathovalballer
I see the EU is so desperate for money they have hit the UK with a bill for around £1.09 billion extra for last year.
I will look forward to the day when the Brits aren't propping up the rest of Europe and not seeing any true benefits in return. I believe the UK provides something like 15% of the total EU budget so the rest of the European countries are going to have to dig deeper to fund the bun fight in both Brussels and Strasbourg in the future. That is going to be interesting. Thank God we are coming out.

[www.statista.com]

The share of total contributions for 2018 (most recent figures):

Germany 20.78%
France 15.5%
UK 11.88%
Italy 11.74%

This bit was interesting too:

'The amount which the United Kingdom contributes to the European Union budget was a key issue during the Brexit referendum of 2016. Prior to the referendum, the “Leave” campaign famously claimed that the UK sends the EU 350 million British pounds a week, a figure which omitted the rebate which the UK receives from the EU as well as public sector receipts. As of 2018, the UK contributed approximately 8.93 billion to the EU budget and received 8.52 billion back.'

Propping up? 15%?

Fake news.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/02/2020 00:03 by Man from LA.

MESSAGES->author
joethefanatic
02 February, 2020 02:08
Quote:
annie blackthorn
I would suggest that Mods consider closing this thread.

This is where we see whether what was promised is what gets delivered. I think that is going to be of great interest to all concerned.



... IMHO, of course.

Now in Honolulu

DanWiley
DanWiley
02 February, 2020 08:53
You realise Bob that the NHS budget alone is something like £130 billion? I know people desperately struggle to get their heads around this, but £1 billion isn't a great deal of money in governmental terms. £8 billion was a bargain given the advantages of membership.

BBandW
BBandW
02 February, 2020 13:59
Quote:
gaz59
Perhaps, just perhaps Johnson is beginning to realise that with making promises to get into no 10 comes the responsibility of delivering on those promises
And that is the tricky bit

Johnson has never shown a shred of concern for fulfilling his promises. As to "responsibility", although he can undoubtedly translate it into Latin and Greek, he doesn't know its meaning in English.

MESSAGES->author
OutsideBath
02 February, 2020 14:23
Quote:
BBandW
Quote:
gaz59
Perhaps, just perhaps Johnson is beginning to realise that with making promises to get into no 10 comes the responsibility of delivering on those promises
And that is the tricky bit

Johnson has never shown a shred of concern for fulfilling his promises. As to "responsibility", although he can undoubtedly translate it into Latin and Greek, he doesn't know its meaning in English.

In this respect he is no different to Blair, Brown and Cameron. Not a shred of integrity and honesty amongst them.

DanWiley
DanWiley
02 February, 2020 17:01
Those three all feel very different to me.

Blair's biggest problem was supporting the USA in a baffling war. I do not know what he educted to get from it?

Brown was never really a prime minister. He got there by paying his dues I guess but still.

Cameron misjudged the referendum. Completely.

Boris seems fundamentally corrupt and yet shallow in a way that none of the above did. I think they all had principals, whether you agreed with them or not. I don't even believe Boris believes in brexit.

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
02 February, 2020 17:09
Thread has turned into an abuse Boris thread, just seems so childish and bitter I'm afraid. Hope you are proud.

PS People have been banned on the rugby side of the board for this.

Oh by the way how relevant is it to the thread title (Sm158). Chose another thread title this one died a while ago.



https://i.ibb.co/gjWyP09/Unknown-1-2.jpg


Beno Obano Age 25 years, Loosehead prop, 5ft 8ins 18st 12lbs 'Mauls are like Transformers' they change form to become more powerful!

Bathovalballer
Bathovalballer
02 February, 2020 17:41
Boris is getting Brexit done, thank goodness. And trying to get the country together and back on its feet again. I sincerely hope he manages it, even allowing for the bumps in the road on the way. Nobody else ever looked likely to get the people's vote through Parliament, but he does. Hurray. And we can move on and I believe will ultimately proper.

DanWiley
DanWiley
02 February, 2020 18:31
"Hope you are proud"

Having spoken to the guy, I'm quite happy with my assessment. If you believed, as I do, Boris doesn't believe in brexit, how would that effect your appraisal of his honesty? The thing Boris is getting done is project Boris.

Calling out someone as a charlatan is no bad thing. Trying to stop someone doing so is.

MESSAGES->author
Le marseillais
02 February, 2020 18:32
As a friend of your country, I am a bit sad to see you leaving.
But I understand quite well your reasons.
The problem is that nobody knows actually if it is a good idea.
I sincerely hope it will be for you, and for the rest of Europe also.
I wish you good luck.



ASM Clermont Auvergne supporter

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
02 February, 2020 18:51
Quote:
DanWiley
"Hope you are proud"
Having spoken to the guy, I'm quite happy with my assessment. If you believed, as I do, Boris doesn't believe in brexit, how would that effect your appraisal of his honesty? The thing Boris is getting done is project Boris.

Calling out someone as a charlatan is no bad thing. Trying to stop someone doing so is.

I'm not totally in disagreement and I have no idea how it will pan out, however, the thread has very much gone down the 'Im not playing anymore' or ' it will all go wrong', attitude.

Aligning Boris Johnson with Donald Trump indicates a complete lack of knowledge of worldwide politics.

One of the things I always though left wing politics was meant to represent was equality of the individual. Cleary that only applies if you have a left wing bias.

If you are oppositely inclined be prepared to be subjected to vitriol.

Surely its possible to put a point over without abusing the person with a different view.

But again I'm (Sm158) Thats the problem with political threads they always end up in acrimony. Im my opinion O/T threads on politics and religion shouldn't be on a rugby forum.



https://i.ibb.co/gjWyP09/Unknown-1-2.jpg


Beno Obano Age 25 years, Loosehead prop, 5ft 8ins 18st 12lbs 'Mauls are like Transformers' they change form to become more powerful!

John Tee
John Tee
02 February, 2020 18:56
Quote:
Le marseillais
As a friend of your country, I am a bit sad to see you leaving.
But I understand quite well your reasons.
The problem is that nobody knows actually if it is a good idea.
I sincerely hope it will be for you, and for the rest of Europe also.
I wish you good luck.

We've left a political Union, doesn't mean we cant be friends. It depends however, how you treat friends.
I'll still holiday in France because i like it there..thats not going to change

MESSAGES->author
Le marseillais
02 February, 2020 19:05
Quote:
John Tee
Quote:
Le marseillais
As a friend of your country, I am a bit sad to see you leaving.
But I understand quite well your reasons.
The problem is that nobody knows actually if it is a good idea.
I sincerely hope it will be for you, and for the rest of Europe also.
I wish you good luck.

We've left a political Union, doesn't mean we cant be friends. It depends however, how you treat friends.
I'll still holiday in France because i like it there..thats not going to change
Obviously, this will not change anything for the french who like the english, and the english who like the french.
Many english are involved in the communities of south west of France, and have now to leave municipalities staff (hope you understand that)
We are disappointed of this "new deal", as these people are.
The danger is the idiot people, who could pit against each over.



ASM Clermont Auvergne supporter

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
02 February, 2020 19:09
Quote:
Le marseillais
Quote:
John Tee
Quote:
Le marseillais
As a friend of your country, I am a bit sad to see you leaving.
But I understand quite well your reasons.
The problem is that nobody knows actually if it is a good idea.
I sincerely hope it will be for you, and for the rest of Europe also.
I wish you good luck.

We've left a political Union, doesn't mean we cant be friends. It depends however, how you treat friends.
I'll still holiday in France because i like it there..thats not going to change

Obviously, this will not change anything for the french who like the english, and the english who like the french.
Many english are involved in the communities of south west of France, and have now to leave municipalities staff (hope you understand that)
We are disappointed of this "new deal", as these people are.
The danger is the idiot people, who could pit against each over.

Exactement, tout à fait d'accord.



https://i.ibb.co/gjWyP09/Unknown-1-2.jpg


Beno Obano Age 25 years, Loosehead prop, 5ft 8ins 18st 12lbs 'Mauls are like Transformers' they change form to become more powerful!

MESSAGES->author
Le marseillais
02 February, 2020 19:13
Quote:
shipwrecked
Quote:
Le marseillais
Quote:
John Tee
Quote:
Le marseillais
As a friend of your country, I am a bit sad to see you leaving.
But I understand quite well your reasons.
The problem is that nobody knows actually if it is a good idea.
I sincerely hope it will be for you, and for the rest of Europe also.
I wish you good luck.

We've left a political Union, doesn't mean we cant be friends. It depends however, how you treat friends.
I'll still holiday in France because i like it there..thats not going to change

Obviously, this will not change anything for the french who like the english, and the english who like the french.
Many english are involved in the communities of south west of France, and have now to leave municipalities staff (hope you understand that)
We are disappointed of this "new deal", as these people are.
The danger is the idiot people, who could pit against each over.

Exactement, tout à fait d'accord.
That is perfect french ! smileys with beer



ASM Clermont Auvergne supporter

MESSAGES->author
hemington
02 February, 2020 21:14
So that will solve everything - just close the thread!!

Bath Supporter Jack
Bath Supporter Jack
02 February, 2020 21:17
Gaz

If the UK continues as it is and the countries in the EU continue in their swing to the right, their very slow economic growth their continuing decline in world economic terms will that mean leaving the EU has been good or not?

DanWiley
DanWiley
02 February, 2020 22:02
Surely brexit would be an utter failure, for those that want it, if things continue as they are regardless of the performance of other areas of the world?

For me it's pretty much always going to be a failure, whatever the economic outcome, for the inward looking, regressive step that it is.

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
02 February, 2020 22:21
No, thats what you want Dan, that's the problem!

Instead of concentrating on getting the right trade agreement Many remainers want it to fail to prove themselves right. Just admit it rather than wallowing in negativity.

Close this thread and open one on the Brexit Trade Deal if you must talk Europe, really is time to move on!



https://i.ibb.co/gjWyP09/Unknown-1-2.jpg


Beno Obano Age 25 years, Loosehead prop, 5ft 8ins 18st 12lbs 'Mauls are like Transformers' they change form to become more powerful!

DanWiley
DanWiley
03 February, 2020 07:54
No, I want the world to come you together and the EU is that in action. I actually think it's inevitable that it will, just sad that my country has decided not to be a part of that. My country will get left behind.

So, sorry, even with the economics taken out of it, for me, it will be a failure simply for what it is. "inward looking, regressive".

Why are you so keen to close the thread? It's clear some people still want to talk about it. A brexit trade deal thread is still about brexit.

warrenball
warrenball
03 February, 2020 08:21
As I understand the Brexiteers the underlying reason was sovereignty, which means giving total control to our parliament in preference to the EU, yet we have chosen to do this at a time when we have the most inexperienced, useless MP's in my lifetime. We have spent the past 40 odd years having the EU as a safety net, now we have to rely on this dysfunctional bunch and try to out negotiate far bigger more hard nosed countries. Sorry for our fishermen but they were very naive to believe they would be any better off.

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
03 February, 2020 08:33
Quote:
DanWiley
Why are you so keen to close the thread? It's clear some people still want to talk about it. A brexit trade deal thread is still about brexit.
Two reasons:

1) To move on, that phase is over.
2) The spiteful comments and comparisons.

Edit: It's not just me 3 other comments.



https://i.ibb.co/gjWyP09/Unknown-1-2.jpg


Beno Obano Age 25 years, Loosehead prop, 5ft 8ins 18st 12lbs 'Mauls are like Transformers' they change form to become more powerful!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/02/2020 08:35 by shipwrecked.

John Tee
John Tee
03 February, 2020 08:44
Quote:
shipwrecked
......
Instead of concentrating on getting the right trade agreement Many remainers want it to fail to prove themselves right. Just admit it rather than wallowing in negativity.


This, im afraid is more true than it should be, because those people have no positive comments, it is all negative.

Johnson knows how the EU will set up a deal..and people expect they will try and get the best for the EU but they dont seem to think Johnson should do the same which is quite telling.

People should really get over the fact that we are out and we really really ought to try and get the best deal we can get and means you need hard nosed pratical negotiations.

MESSAGES->author
CoochieCoo
03 February, 2020 08:55
If people stop posting to this thread it will close by itself.



https://pbflaa.by.files.1drv.com/y4mToRbTHGUTg0zWMi8LNeOlOmx4tZHsH3crYbASv0X_qWBw8j30S9KV-RiZIf_AWoOZXD7D3Rjy1tYRAKXykpZSHuOObVQBiovPpB6PnDUuBM6xlx2F1yOjKpEBmWUfMru3SCm255j3p-CnndC7J9ZUG29r1BtfFWHHj-MdzDOpzBuTRTPqNaco8ctf1svZyW0?width=106&height=160&cropmode=none
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Bath Supporter Jack
Bath Supporter Jack
03 February, 2020 09:30
Good point CC

However when a good Brexit thing happens people will dig it out and when a "good" Remain thing happens then other people will also post...........so I am afraid it has a life of its own

MESSAGES->author
CoochieCoo
03 February, 2020 09:38
I expect that will happen thread or not!



https://pbflaa.by.files.1drv.com/y4mToRbTHGUTg0zWMi8LNeOlOmx4tZHsH3crYbASv0X_qWBw8j30S9KV-RiZIf_AWoOZXD7D3Rjy1tYRAKXykpZSHuOObVQBiovPpB6PnDUuBM6xlx2F1yOjKpEBmWUfMru3SCm255j3p-CnndC7J9ZUG29r1BtfFWHHj-MdzDOpzBuTRTPqNaco8ctf1svZyW0?width=106&height=160&cropmode=none
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MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
03 February, 2020 09:53
Not so sure actually, if its not there then a new thread has to be started. Which is exactly what is happening in real life!



https://i.ibb.co/gjWyP09/Unknown-1-2.jpg


Beno Obano Age 25 years, Loosehead prop, 5ft 8ins 18st 12lbs 'Mauls are like Transformers' they change form to become more powerful!

MESSAGES->author
woodpecker
03 February, 2020 10:05
Oh dear, just heard on LBC, that Boris is threatening to 'walk away' ........again.

I knew this year would be no different to the last two.

Can't they just get on with agreeing something mutually beneficial without all the stupid rhetoric, Its embarrassing.

I feel sorry for all the thick northerners who thought they were going to 'get brexit done' in December.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/02/2020 10:20 by woodpecker.

MESSAGES->author
CoochieCoo
03 February, 2020 10:06
Better then to have one thread for the told you so’s then umpteen new threads!



https://pbflaa.by.files.1drv.com/y4mToRbTHGUTg0zWMi8LNeOlOmx4tZHsH3crYbASv0X_qWBw8j30S9KV-RiZIf_AWoOZXD7D3Rjy1tYRAKXykpZSHuOObVQBiovPpB6PnDUuBM6xlx2F1yOjKpEBmWUfMru3SCm255j3p-CnndC7J9ZUG29r1BtfFWHHj-MdzDOpzBuTRTPqNaco8ctf1svZyW0?width=106&height=160&cropmode=none
https://pbfkaa.by.files.1drv.com/y4mhxY1k8zrLn92LwcIYgSd1KcA6zBGX-Wgw2dNz8Us0xA71EhjMmL2tc-ggx7OlsBDECw8eAZ_oAWnNyh5doimzOEics5H87cuh5Q-Sb-ViPD6Pt6QUBneu5F2tlWLltGQZ8pd5qFmsZwbKB39L5Dki21gJfnsiaxLiCiuWPCZUjkXp4EttajzFAgcCl6YuDDF?width=160&height=107&cropmode=none

DanWiley
DanWiley
03 February, 2020 10:23
It's all brexit, people are still posting, I just don't see the need?

"This, im afraid is more true than it should be, because those people have no positive comments, it is all negative."

I can't see many positives*. I do see many negatives. What do you expect me to post?

* Come on, lets have a way my life will be materially better because of brexit. I can already give you ways in which its worse.

John Tee
John Tee
03 February, 2020 10:28
Quote:
woodpecker
Oh dear, just heard on LBC, that Boris is threatening to 'walk away' ........again.
I knew this year would be no different to the last two.

Can't they just get on with agreeing something mutually beneficial without all the stupid rhetoric, Its embarrassing .

It cuts both ways...and both sides will be at the rhetoric, so your point is only really useful if you agree that...otherwise, you allow one side a lead or edge and criticise the other for doing the same..

I like the use of 'they' if you mean both sides. .but if by 'they' you mean Johnson and crew then your side is loud and clear.

People have to get their head round the fact that we are now out, so the only way forward is to get the best deal for the UK. The only way forward...or do people want a bad deal so they can say 'told you'

Dunno
Bod
03 February, 2020 10:28
Quote:
woodpecker
Oh dear, just heard on LBC, that Boris is threatening to 'walk away' ........again.
I knew this year would be no different to the last two.

Can't they just get on with agreeing something mutually beneficial without all the stupid rhetoric, Its embarrassing.

I feel sorry for all the thick northerners who thought they were going to 'get brexit done' in December.


Indeed

And so the abusive tw&tfest continues eh?

MESSAGES->author
woodpecker
03 February, 2020 10:30
Quote:
John Tee
Quote:
woodpecker
Oh dear, just heard on LBC, that Boris is threatening to 'walk away' ........again.
I knew this year would be no different to the last two.

Can't they just get on with agreeing something mutually beneficial without all the stupid rhetoric, Its embarrassing .

It cuts both ways...and both sides will be at the rhetoric, so your point is only really useful if you agree that...otherwise, you allow one side a lead or edge and criticise the other for doing the same..

I like the use of 'they' if you mean both sides. .but if by 'they' you mean Johnson and crew then your side is loud and clear.

People have to get their head round the fact that we are now out, so the only way forward is to get the best deal for the UK. The only way forward...or do people want a bad deal so they can say 'told you'

I mean both sides, but I do think Raab is an idiot.

MESSAGES->author
woodpecker
03 February, 2020 10:34
Quote:
Dunno
Quote:
woodpecker
Oh dear, just heard on LBC, that Boris is threatening to 'walk away' ........again.
I knew this year would be no different to the last two.

Can't they just get on with agreeing something mutually beneficial without all the stupid rhetoric, Its embarrassing.

I feel sorry for all the thick northerners who thought they were going to 'get brexit done' in December.

Anyone, northern or otherwise, who believed they were getting brexit done, was thick.




Indeed

And so the abusive tw&tfest continues eh?


In fact on Saturday morning whilst listening to the Today programme, I heard a northerner saying that they 'were glad it was all over'. I will let you be the judge of his thickness or otherwise.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/02/2020 10:35 by woodpecker.

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
03 February, 2020 10:45
Quote:
shipwrecked
Quote:
DanWiley
Why are you so keen to close the thread? It's clear some people still want to talk about it. A brexit trade deal thread is still about brexit.
Two reasons:

1) To move on, that phase is over.
2) The spiteful comments and comparisons.

Edit: It's not just me 3 other comments.

CC for spiteful I could have used another word.

Why oh why, does this thread bring out the worst in people, comments like "thick northerners" are just unnecessary. As are childish Twitter videos. If this thread has to continue can't we at least desist from offence.



https://i.ibb.co/gjWyP09/Unknown-1-2.jpg


Beno Obano Age 25 years, Loosehead prop, 5ft 8ins 18st 12lbs 'Mauls are like Transformers' they change form to become more powerful!

Dunno
Bod
03 February, 2020 10:46
Quote:
woodpecker
Quote:
Dunno
Quote:
woodpecker
Oh dear, just heard on LBC, that Boris is threatening to 'walk away' ........again.
I knew this year would be no different to the last two.

Can't they just get on with agreeing something mutually beneficial without all the stupid rhetoric, Its embarrassing.

I feel sorry for all the thick northerners who thought they were going to 'get brexit done' in December.

Anyone, northern or otherwise, who believed they were getting brexit done, was thick.




Indeed

And so the abusive tw&tfest continues eh?


In fact on Saturday morning whilst listening to the Today programme, I heard a northerner saying that they 'were glad it was all over'. I will let you be the judge of his thickness or otherwise.


QED
You're letting nobody be the judge - you just spout abusive invectives
You sound like Rick (silent P) from the Young Ones - very Corbynesque

MESSAGES->author
CoochieCoo
03 February, 2020 10:59
Come on guys cease the insults. There are winners and losers of elections and referenda, that is democracy. Just because you have a different view you don’t have to insult the other person debate the point not the man.



https://pbflaa.by.files.1drv.com/y4mToRbTHGUTg0zWMi8LNeOlOmx4tZHsH3crYbASv0X_qWBw8j30S9KV-RiZIf_AWoOZXD7D3Rjy1tYRAKXykpZSHuOObVQBiovPpB6PnDUuBM6xlx2F1yOjKpEBmWUfMru3SCm255j3p-CnndC7J9ZUG29r1BtfFWHHj-MdzDOpzBuTRTPqNaco8ctf1svZyW0?width=106&height=160&cropmode=none
https://pbfkaa.by.files.1drv.com/y4mhxY1k8zrLn92LwcIYgSd1KcA6zBGX-Wgw2dNz8Us0xA71EhjMmL2tc-ggx7OlsBDECw8eAZ_oAWnNyh5doimzOEics5H87cuh5Q-Sb-ViPD6Pt6QUBneu5F2tlWLltGQZ8pd5qFmsZwbKB39L5Dki21gJfnsiaxLiCiuWPCZUjkXp4EttajzFAgcCl6YuDDF?width=160&height=107&cropmode=none

MESSAGES->author
woodpecker
03 February, 2020 11:02
Quote:
CoochieCoo
Come on guys cease the insults. There are winners and losers of elections and referenda, that is democracy. Just because you have a different view you don’t have to insult the other person debate the point not the man.

Dear CC,

I apologise, northerners aren't thick

James

warrenball
warrenball
03 February, 2020 11:36
CC I agree with your thoughts, abuse and bad language are not necessary but have been part and parcel of politics for hundreds of years and that was even before the corrosive influence of social media, so I would not be at all surprised to hear your plea fall on deaf ears.

MESSAGES->author
CoochieCoo
03 February, 2020 12:00
Quote:
warrenball
CC I agree with your thoughts, abuse and bad language are not necessary but have been part and parcel of politics for hundreds of years and that was even before the corrosive influence of social media, so I would not be at all surprised to hear your plea fall on deaf ears.

Quote:
Socrates
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser.

....and insults!



https://pbflaa.by.files.1drv.com/y4mToRbTHGUTg0zWMi8LNeOlOmx4tZHsH3crYbASv0X_qWBw8j30S9KV-RiZIf_AWoOZXD7D3Rjy1tYRAKXykpZSHuOObVQBiovPpB6PnDUuBM6xlx2F1yOjKpEBmWUfMru3SCm255j3p-CnndC7J9ZUG29r1BtfFWHHj-MdzDOpzBuTRTPqNaco8ctf1svZyW0?width=106&height=160&cropmode=none
https://pbfkaa.by.files.1drv.com/y4mhxY1k8zrLn92LwcIYgSd1KcA6zBGX-Wgw2dNz8Us0xA71EhjMmL2tc-ggx7OlsBDECw8eAZ_oAWnNyh5doimzOEics5H87cuh5Q-Sb-ViPD6Pt6QUBneu5F2tlWLltGQZ8pd5qFmsZwbKB39L5Dki21gJfnsiaxLiCiuWPCZUjkXp4EttajzFAgcCl6YuDDF?width=160&height=107&cropmode=none

MESSAGES->author
woodpecker
03 February, 2020 12:35
Quote:
CoochieCoo
Quote:
warrenball
CC I agree with your thoughts, abuse and bad language are not necessary but have been part and parcel of politics for hundreds of years and that was even before the corrosive influence of social media, so I would not be at all surprised to hear your plea fall on deaf ears.

Quote:
Socrates
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser.

....and insults!

OK

Not only are northerners not thick, they are amazingly intelligent..... and good looking.

Man from LA
Man from LA
03 February, 2020 20:55
James O'Brien coined a catchphrase for his feelings on Brexit:

"Compassion for the conned, contempt for the conmen."

My contempt is for the career politicians who rail against the EU while happy to take the EU's coin or who only decided to campaign to Leave to become PM, not the people who fell for their lies and BS.

BerkeleyWood
The Bear
03 February, 2020 21:25
Do people not tire of this? This thread has had every shade of 'people who voted differently to me are stupid'.

Are you sure your so clever ?

Have you once stopped and reflected on your values, the differences and why they might be toxic to many a voter.

Do you genuinely believe you lost because of 'lies' or russian interference or Facebook? Or have you been conned into believing that this loss was about something other than views being unpopular?



Adopted Player:
[18] - Taulupe Faletau

annie blackthorn
annie blackthorn
03 February, 2020 22:45
Heyho. All will become clear soon enough.

i.e. who is pulling Boris' strings? Cabinet reshuffle soon.

p.s.Do you think Raab has worked out where Dover is, and does he care?

DanWiley
DanWiley
03 February, 2020 22:48
I'm still happy to discuss it. I presume those that are tired of it just stop reading.

'Have you once stopped and reflected on your values, the differences and why they might be toxic to many a voter."

I honestly don't see why my values have influenced that many voters one way or another.

I believe leave won because they played on the fears, pride and prejudice of a sizable section of the population. That message did contain numerous lies many of which, had they been corrected, could easily have meant a 2% in the result, frankly the weather on the day could have, and we'd be in a very different place now. My views aren't unpopular, there's never been a time where leave reflected a large majority of the population.

MESSAGES->author
joethefanatic
04 February, 2020 01:08
Quote:
The Bear
Do people not tire of this? This thread has had every shade of 'people who voted differently to me are stupid'.
Are you sure your so clever ?

Have you once stopped and reflected on your values, the differences and why they might be toxic to many a voter.

Do you genuinely believe you lost because of 'lies' or russian interference or Facebook? Or have you been conned into believing that this loss was about something other than views being unpopular?

These repeated calls to shut down discussion and debate on Brexit do look a tad convenient.

We're about to enter the period when the negotiations really begin and hard decisions will have to be made (not, it has to be said, historically a strong point of Boris's). This is the bit that decides how the immediate future of the UK will look. I think that's worth a continuing thread.



... IMHO, of course.

Now in Honolulu

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
04 February, 2020 01:28
Quote:
joethefanatic
These repeated calls to shut down discussion and debate on Brexit do look a tad convenient.

We're about to enter the period when the negotiations really begin and hard decisions will have to be made (not, it has to be said, historically a strong point of Boris's). This is the bit that decides how the immediate future of the UK will look. I think that's worth a continuing thread.

Exactly Joe its not about shutting down the discussion in any way. Its about moving it forward to its new phase.

The thread and the discussion that goes with it is being strangled by some who want to re-debate what has already been decided. By all means discuss the future, you are one of the few that seem able to do so.

PS My initial suggestion to close the thread was partly because of rude, inane and inaccurate comments.



https://i.ibb.co/gjWyP09/Unknown-1-2.jpg


Beno Obano Age 25 years, Loosehead prop, 5ft 8ins 18st 12lbs 'Mauls are like Transformers' they change form to become more powerful!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/02/2020 01:31 by shipwrecked.

Dunno
Bod
04 February, 2020 10:31
Quote:
DanWiley
I'm still happy to discuss it. I presume those that are tired of it just stop reading.
'Have you once stopped and reflected on your values, the differences and why they might be toxic to many a voter."

I honestly don't see why my values have influenced that many voters one way or another.

I believe leave won because they played on the fears, pride and prejudice of a sizable section of the population. That message did contain numerous lies many of which, had they been corrected, could easily have meant a 2% in the result, frankly the weather on the day could have, and we'd be in a very different place now. My views aren't unpopular, there's never been a time where leave reflected a large majority of the population.

Only the majority was required
50% +1

You do recognise that don't you? Eh?

MESSAGES->author
Monkey1
04 February, 2020 12:22
Maybe the attention given to abuse could be put to one side for a moment.



Quote:
Man from LA

[www.statista.com]

The share of total contributions for 2018 (most recent figures):

Germany 20.78%
France 15.5%
UK 11.88%
Italy 11.74%




Propping up? 15%?

Fake news.

Your fake news is of course fake news.

Showing the contributions is only part of the story, you need to then also examine how much each country receives back.

That, as everyone knows, is what counts. Germany is the biggest net contributor of course, then the UK, so whichever side of the argument you align to, it is a pretty serious hit to the EU finances to lose the second biggest net contributor to an already creaking budget.

All explained in simple terms & pretty pictures by the BBC HERE.

BerkeleyWood
The Bear
04 February, 2020 13:59
Quote:
shipwrecked
Exactly Joe its not about shutting down the discussion in any way. Its about moving it forward to its new phase.

The thread and the discussion that goes with it is being strangled by some who want to re-debate what has already been decided. By all means discuss the future, you are one of the few that seem able to do so.


This^^^

If people want to make snide comments about the educational ability of their fellow citizens to make themselves feels good or kid themselves into believing this election was lost because of Facebook, Russia, the weather or the bogeyman then so be it. But have the self-awareness of how it sounds to people outside your bubble when you call them thick and it isn't going to change the past.

What happens next is far more interesting...



Adopted Player:
[18] - Taulupe Faletau

John Tee
John Tee
04 February, 2020 14:39
I dont mind the opening gambits in the talks being fiesty or determined.
If you offer up concessions then dont be surprised if someone puts that straight in the back pocket and advances their line forward.

By the same token, in diplomatic speak, we will review it might mean, fat chance and dismissed.
Sooner or later, both sides will need to get serious about what compromises they can sell to their audience.
So, do i want a hardball negotiator, you bet, who on earth wouldn't.
By all means, state your reasons why you wouldn't?

ChippenhamRoman
ChippenhamRoman
04 February, 2020 15:08
Quote:
John Tee
I dont mind the opening gambits in the talks being fiesty or determined.
If you offer up concessions then dont be surprised if someone puts that straight in the back pocket and advances their line forward.

By the same token, in diplomatic speak, we will review it might mean, fat chance and dismissed.
Sooner or later, both sides will need to get serious about what compromises they can sell to their audience.
So, do i want a hardball negotiator, you bet, who on earth wouldn't.
By all means, state your reasons why you wouldn't?

Is it a hardball negotiator or an utter fantasist though?

I love the idea of “tough” but you also have to be realistic.

I would love a brand new BMW. But small problem, I can’t afford one. No amount of tough negotiating is going to get me one.

We all have to be realistic that Brexit was not “done”. The deal was not “ready made” and the real work ahead is the actual “deal” that people were thinking the government when they spoke of a “deal”.

J

MESSAGES->author
woodpecker
04 February, 2020 15:23
Theres a massive debate going on about American chicken on various threads on The Times.

Brexit in a microcosm.

Bath Supporter Jack
Bath Supporter Jack
04 February, 2020 15:30
Very interesting Monkey1

MESSAGES->author
woodpecker
04 February, 2020 15:34
Found this on Monkey's link:

The largest net contributor to the EU budget per capita is the Netherlands, followed by Sweden, Germany, Denmark and the United Kingdom in fifth place, with €112.85 in 2017 .

I would gladly pay that just for FOM, but concede for most of the population that may not be value for money.

Bath Supporter Jack
Bath Supporter Jack
04 February, 2020 15:37
Just heard from someone "in the thick of it"..........that it is already "accepted" that a deal will not be possible with the EU as we are too far apart at the moment.

Apparently it is going to be quickly stated that this is not possible and they are going to get on with other deals and if the EU come our way a bit (by the sounds of it a lot) then there may be a quick and dirty deal done by the end of the year.

Mike the Taxi
Mike the Taxi
04 February, 2020 15:41
A case of 'Don't Count Your Chickens'?

gaz59
gaz59
04 February, 2020 17:00
Quote:
Bath Supporter Jack
Just heard from someone "in the thick of it"..........that it is already "accepted" that a deal will not be possible with the EU as we are too far apart at the moment.
Apparently it is going to be quickly stated that this is not possible and they are going to get on with other deals and if the EU come our way a bit (by the sounds of it a lot) then there may be a quick and dirty deal done by the end of the year.

That was pretty obvious from the blatant U-turn by Johnson, Gove and Raab away from this frictionless free trade deal is the easiest thing imaginable to well we don't actually need a deal after all

And starting to build up the narrative that it is all down to the intransigent EU. Nothing to do with the equally blindingly obvious fact that we are in a very weak negotiating position

gaz59
gaz59
04 February, 2020 17:19
But on a separate though directly related what about Kolpak players in the GP? I read an article about cricketers to say the current arrangements expire at the end of the Brexit transition period

Presumably the same applies to rugby players in the GP? And if so are any clubs going to have problems? Sale springs to mind as having recently recruited several big name South Africans and Glaws have a few too but is this going to be a problem?

Does it explain, in part our difficulty in recruiting a class act at 9 or 10?

DanWiley
DanWiley
04 February, 2020 17:56
"Only the majority was required
50% +1

You do recognise that don't you? Eh?"

I don't think it should have been. You shouldn't pull a country apart based on such a margin. To paraphrase one prominent leaver "if we lose by a 2% margin this won't be over by a point way."

But the comment was in response to:

"have you been conned into believing that this loss was about something other than views being unpopular?

At no point has leave been notably more popular that remain. My view isn't unpopular.

MESSAGES->author
joethefanatic
04 February, 2020 19:59
If we're going to keep tabs on how the negotiations are going, we're going to need a list of what was promised.

I start us off with "frictionless trade with the EU".



... IMHO, of course.

Now in Honolulu

JFPC
JFPC
04 February, 2020 20:01
Quote:
The Bear
Do people not tire of this? This thread has had every shade of 'people who voted differently to me are stupid'.
Are you sure your so clever ?

I think you'll find it's 'you're'!

BBandW
BBandW
04 February, 2020 20:10
Quote:
JFPC
Quote:
The Bear
Do people not tire of this? This thread has had every shade of 'people who voted differently to me are stupid'.
Are you sure your so clever ?

I think you'll find it's 'you're'!

couldn't help but chuckle

BBandW
BBandW
04 February, 2020 20:13
Quote:
joethefanatic
If we're going to keep tabs on how the negotiations are going, we're going to need a list of what was promised.
I start us off with "frictionless trade with the EU".

I'll add- they'll be no borders or checks between southern and northern ireland, or, northern ireland and mainland UK

Mike the Taxi
Mike the Taxi
04 February, 2020 20:55
We will get back control of our Inshore Fisheries waters...

John Tee
John Tee
05 February, 2020 08:00
Quote:
ChippenhamRoman
Quote:
John Tee
I dont mind the opening gambits in the talks being fiesty or determined.
If you offer up concessions then dont be surprised if someone puts that straight in the back pocket and advances their line forward.

By the same token, in diplomatic speak, we will review it might mean, fat chance and dismissed.
Sooner or later, both sides will need to get serious about what compromises they can sell to their audience.
So, do i want a hardball negotiator, you bet, who on earth wouldn't.
By all means, state your reasons why you wouldn't?

Is it a hardball negotiator or an utter fantasist though?

I love the idea of “tough” but you also have to be realistic.

I would love a brand new BMW. But small problem, I can’t afford one. No amount of tough negotiating is going to get me one.

We all have to be realistic that Brexit was not “done”. The deal was not “ready made” and the real work ahead is the actual “deal” that people were thinking the government when they spoke of a “deal”.

J

Personally, i would have said you can have 39bill...dependent on the end deal inc trade.

If you cant afford a BMW, then your hand is weak getting one. For sure.

Our tough will be that we would take no deal. I've never has a problem with that stance but it also depends how much you mean it. I think the current team mean it more than previous regimes...not least because it was undermined by parliament voting against that. That is not an issue now.

If both sides say they want a deal, then we will get one...
There is a great deal of posturing on this.
If Johnson doesnt get one he faces his home audience which he would likely survive.
If Barnier gets no deal, and there are tariifs on EU goods, then he has to sell that to 27 countries.

Personally, i think the time scale will mean a core deal is done but certain areas will take longer.

But, we want free trade because we like that but the eu have a poltical issue granting free trade to an off shore competitor without paying the price of EU membership.

John Tee
John Tee
05 February, 2020 08:04
Quote:
BBandW
Quote:
joethefanatic
If we're going to keep tabs on how the negotiations are going, we're going to need a list of what was promised.
I start us off with "frictionless trade with the EU".

I'll add- they'll be no borders or checks between southern and northern ireland, or, northern ireland and mainland UK

Bang goes your compromises then...make up your mind what you want.

MESSAGES->author
joethefanatic
05 February, 2020 08:19
Quote:
John Tee
Quote:
BBandW
Quote:
joethefanatic
If we're going to keep tabs on how the negotiations are going, we're going to need a list of what was promised.
I start us off with "frictionless trade with the EU".

I'll add- they'll be no borders or checks between southern and northern ireland, or, northern ireland and mainland UK

Bang goes your compromises then...make up your mind what you want.

I think you may be missing the point JT. This is intended as a list of the things that were promised that Brexit would deliver. The idea is to see if they become reality over the next 11 months. I agree it's not looking overly positive right now but there's always hope, I suppose.



... IMHO, of course.

Now in Honolulu



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/02/2020 08:20 by joethefanatic.

John Tee
John Tee
05 February, 2020 08:24
Quote:
joethefanatic
Quote:
John Tee
Quote:
BBandW
Quote:
joethefanatic
If we're going to keep tabs on how the negotiations are going, we're going to need a list of what was promised.
I start us off with "frictionless trade with the EU".

I'll add- they'll be no borders or checks between southern and northern ireland, or, northern ireland and mainland UK

Bang goes your compromises then...make up your mind what you want.

I think you may be missing the point JT. This is intended as a list of the things that were promised that Brexit would deliver. The idea is to see if they become reality over the next 11 months. I agree it's not looking overly positive right now but there's always hope, I suppose.

A list to beat someone then...
But sure, make them red lines then..he will take as much stick for that as he will for breaking them.

As i say, if you want compromises, then they might be some of the compromises.

I think the EU will go for a Canada deal with a few loose ends. That means no tariffs, and the ability to make deals everywhere...
It stands to reason if we want to send goods to the EU we have to abide by regulation.. but those regulations will not need to be adopted by all if they dont trade there.
So no formal national alignment ...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/02/2020 08:35 by John Tee.

gaz59
gaz59
05 February, 2020 09:20
No doubt if Johnson is offered a deal like Canada has he will promote it as historic but there is a lot of ignorance [term not used in a derogatory way, just factual], so I took this from the BBC website:

"What does CETA do?
We've heard a lot about wanting a "zero-tariff, zero-quota" deal between the UK and the EU. Ceta does not do that.
CETA gets rid of most, but not all, tariffs (that's taxes on imports) on goods traded between the EU and Canada. Tariffs remain on poultry, meat and eggs.

It also increases quotas (that's the amount of a product that can be exported without extra charges) but does not get rid of them altogether. For example, quotas on EU cheese exports to Canada increase from 18,500 tonnes to 31,972 tonnes a year.


It does little for the trade in services and in particular almost nothing for the trade in financial services, which is very important for the UK economy.

It also does not remove border checks, so there is still a possibility that goods have to be examined at ports to make sure they meet regulatory requirements, and their paperwork is in order."

Not exactly what his Brexiteer side of the party, a lot of business and many leavers had in mind hence Cummings painting the hard ball narrative now to cover up for what actually comes in

MESSAGES->author
OutsideBath
05 February, 2020 09:36
Just like a general election there will be a long list of lies and broken promises with Brexit.

Not sure how drawing up a list of failures helps though, we have left the EU and there’s nothing anyone can do about it.

DanWiley
DanWiley
05 February, 2020 09:40
It's pretty disingenuous to say one moment "brexit means no boarders within the UK" and the next say "we need to compromise on that."

MESSAGES->author
woodpecker
05 February, 2020 09:52
I've spent the last I dont know, 4 years arguing with brexiters about brexit. For me its the most pointless act of self harm any country has ever done to itself.

However, what's done is done. I think we will spend around ten years wasting time effort and money getting to somewhere not hugely different to where we started with probably no upside and hopefully not much downside (fingers crossed).

My attitude now to what one or other of these govt or EU numbnuts says is 'whatever'!

I'm just going to try to make the best of it probably in a slightly more selfish way than I did in the past. I've already shifted some of the focus of our business out of the UK (but not the bulk of the tax). I'm relatively well off and as such I hope that I can mitigate the loss of FOM which was a key part of my future plans and which I am personally very miffed about.

I may dip in and out, but I'm losing the will to argue much about it. As the brexiters like to say: Get over it!

MESSAGES->author
Clarkey3k
05 February, 2020 11:54
This is well worth a read if people wish to try and understand recent voting patterns in the UK/US and a few countries in the EU. V informative and co-written by A Prof. based at Bath Uni.

National Populism and the revolt against Liberal Democracy



Adopted players: 2019/20 T Faletau; [19] M V Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw

Family . Community . Nation - [sdp.org.uk]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/02/2020 11:56 by Clarkey3k.

John Tee
John Tee
05 February, 2020 13:22
Quote:
gaz59
No doubt if Johnson is offered a deal like Canada has he will promote it as historic but there is a lot of ignorance [term not used in a derogatory way, just factual], so I took this from the BBC website:
"What does CETA do?
We've heard a lot about wanting a "zero-tariff, zero-quota" deal between the UK and the EU. Ceta does not do that.
CETA gets rid of most, but not all, tariffs (that's taxes on imports) on goods traded between the EU and Canada. Tariffs remain on poultry, meat and eggs.

It also increases quotas (that's the amount of a product that can be exported without extra charges) but does not get rid of them altogether. For example, quotas on EU cheese exports to Canada increase from 18,500 tonnes to 31,972 tonnes a year.


It does little for the trade in services and in particular almost nothing for the trade in financial services, which is very important for the UK economy.

It also does not remove border checks, so there is still a possibility that goods have to be examined at ports to make sure they meet regulatory requirements, and their paperwork is in order."

Not exactly what his Brexiteer side of the party, a lot of business and many leavers had in mind hence Cummings painting the hard ball narrative now to cover up for what actually comes in

Canada is not the UK and vice versa so there will be sectors that are more or less applicable.. so adjustments and tweaks required, no doubt.
Border checks will still exist and will be the price you pay for non alignment...
Are we saying that there are no border checks at all from eu goods, no spot checks at all now?
I think that will need to remain and should.

Bath Supporter Jack
Bath Supporter Jack
05 February, 2020 19:30
Gaz

The strength of our negotiating position is that we can walk away.

We don't have a trade deal with the US and run a £70bn surplus we do have a trade deal with the EU and run a £90bn deficit........

That was what was wrong with the May approach.

What they are really scared off is the Singapore on Thames position............watch and wait for that to be emphasised.

Deals apparently lined up with countries representing 13% of World GDP..........

MESSAGES->author
joethefanatic
05 February, 2020 19:46
Quote:
Bath Supporter Jack Deals apparently lined up with countries representing 13% of World GDP..........

I don't doubt that there are deals lined up. The question is whether they are better deals than the ones that we had when we were members of the EU. That is what was promised. I shall await developments with considerable interest.

Philosophically, I'm in the same place as Woodie. I've hedged my risks of having part of my business in the UK and I'm focusing my future investment in the US because I think the eventual US/UK trade deal will be greatly advantageous to them compared to the status quo ante. So, if Brexit is the success that was promised, I'm covered both ways smiling smiley



... IMHO, of course.

Now in Honolulu



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/02/2020 20:01 by joethefanatic.

DanWiley
DanWiley
05 February, 2020 20:49
The EU know Singapore and they know Britain. They know Singapore on thames isn't going to happen and they know we lose out far now than they do from no deal.

As you say, we can but wait and see what happens, but I don't think even you believe it.

gaz59
gaz59
05 February, 2020 22:12
"The strength of our negotiating position is that we can walk away"

So simple isn't it. We just walk away from our single biggest market right on our doorstep and one we have been trading with and trusted for nearly 50 years and we will turn that £70bn deficit into a surplus

And having walked away from being an integral and leading member of a federated economy larger than the US we will get even better deals with non EU countries now we are just the UK

Really?

annie blackthorn
annie blackthorn
05 February, 2020 22:45
So BFJ, do these 'deals' waiting to be done involve trade, jobs, research?
Not to even go there with 'fishing'.

Just as well our financial services will keep the economy afloat whilst they struggle to deliver, sign on the dotted line on all these wonderful fantastic deals. P.s. do not whatever you do hold your breathe until Brexit is done. YOu won't survive.


Boris is riding a wave of jolly popularity, propped up with clevermanipulative 'media' campaigns - and with a 5 yr term and 80majority mandate, and a pathetic divided Opposition in Parliament to hold them to account.
Burying head in sand will be a good option for the next few years.

John Tee
John Tee
06 February, 2020 07:54
If i were the EU, I'd be seriously worried where a 70 bill plus market could go if they 'chased it away.
Of course, they need to present a united front but as far as Europe are concerned we are a huge buyer..
So, its never been true, imv, that we dont have a good hand to play if you want to start adding tariffs.

Bath Supporter Jack
Bath Supporter Jack
06 February, 2020 09:14
Dear Joe........good strategy............we switched from UK earners to Overseas earners and from the middle of last year switched back into UK cyclicals to good effect.

Dear Dan............sorry to disillusion you but I do believe it. As Mr CC knows I have two reasons for voting to leave, i increase in UK wages, ii major concern about the health and future growth of the EU collective economy.

Had a meeting with a major car dealer who says that German car producers are very, very concerned about no deal.

Dear Annie.........I would imagine burying you head in sand for five years would be as bad for your health as holding your breath!!


Interesting that anecdotal evidence is that there is a wall of money looking to buy UK commercial property.............

Toyota looking to double UK car production!

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