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TG Kesmo
TG Kesmo
22 March, 2018 13:22
Quote:
dcsh
Of course it should be remembered that players do move clubs before their contracts have expired nowadays. So you canít just dismiss a rumour on the grounds that their contract isnít up.
Yes but very rarely in the first of 3 years, buying out 1 would be fairly expensive the remainder of 1/2pís prohibitive..

B4thB4ck
B4thB4ck
22 March, 2018 13:24
I heard the French military have put in a joint bid with Toulon for his day job and rugby job, we get a signing on fee plus 50 tanks (only joking).

gaz59
gaz59
22 March, 2018 14:22
Quote:
dcsh
Rugby Inside Line has a number of Bath related rumours today.

And the Cokansiga info here:

[www.rugbypass.com]

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
22 March, 2018 14:44
OK I get that TKD, the source may be iffy but credible enough for Todd to feel he should respond to it in the regional press.

I take your point that we should be sceptical of press stories these days but lets be honest a bit of gossip can be quite enjoyable!

MESSAGES->author
CoochieCoo
22 March, 2018 14:54
Quote:
dcsh
Of course it should be remembered that players do move clubs before their contracts have expired nowadays. So you canít just dismiss a rumour on the grounds that their contract isnít up.

But Leigh signed a three year dual contract with Wales and Scarlets only 8 months ago. There would be some big compensation fee to break that contract!

[www.wru.co.uk]



https://pbflaa.by.files.1drv.com/y4mToRbTHGUTg0zWMi8LNeOlOmx4tZHsH3crYbASv0X_qWBw8j30S9KV-RiZIf_AWoOZXD7D3Rjy1tYRAKXykpZSHuOObVQBiovPpB6PnDUuBM6xlx2F1yOjKpEBmWUfMru3SCm255j3p-CnndC7J9ZUG29r1BtfFWHHj-MdzDOpzBuTRTPqNaco8ctf1svZyW0?width=106&height=160&cropmode=none
https://pbfkaa.by.files.1drv.com/y4mhxY1k8zrLn92LwcIYgSd1KcA6zBGX-Wgw2dNz8Us0xA71EhjMmL2tc-ggx7OlsBDECw8eAZ_oAWnNyh5doimzOEics5H87cuh5Q-Sb-ViPD6Pt6QUBneu5F2tlWLltGQZ8pd5qFmsZwbKB39L5Dki21gJfnsiaxLiCiuWPCZUjkXp4EttajzFAgcCl6YuDDF?width=160&height=107&cropmode=none

MESSAGES->author
Which Tyler
22 March, 2018 15:48
TBH, I felt that Bana's departure pretty much confirmed that we'd secured Cokanasiga (in the even of LI's relegation).
I feel the signature of Johnny Williams is still up in the air - if we haven't already secured it, he may be getting second thoughts now we've signed Roberts. That signing gives us 4 centres ready to start, and a promising youngster in the academy; with an age range of 1X early 30s; 1X late 20s; 1X mid 20s and 2X early 20s.
I'd (obviously) like Johnny to come, and give us 3 you guns, probably fighting it out for 2 extensions; or one of them converting to back3; but it would make us less attractive.



A man who cannot change his mind, cannot change anything
http://www.rugbyrebels.co/board/download/file.php?id=608
RAEBURN SHIELD




Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 22/03/2018 15:49 by Which Tyler.

MESSAGES->author
Rawce
22 March, 2018 18:04
Quote:
shipwrecked
I take your point that we should be sceptical of press stories these days but lets be honest a bit of gossip can be quite enjoyable!
Yes, but too often it's used as a stick to beat the coaches/management/groundskeepers with.

by
by
23 March, 2018 11:44
Don't think its been discussed here but there was a recent Q and A, where some things were announced:
- Changes in the physio and backroom staffing
- Some more signings yet to be announced
- Tactical kicking is part of the game plan and Chudley is being brought in to improve it.

BathMatt53
BathMatt53
23 March, 2018 11:53
Quote:
by
Don't think its been discussed here but there was a recent Q and A, where some things were announced:
- Changes in the physio and backroom staffing
- Some more signings yet to be announced
- Tactical kicking is part of the game plan and Chudley is being brought in to improve it.

Thanks By.

If we kick tactically or not tonight we won't see the ball again for 20 mins, so hope that it minimised unless absolutely necessary. Particularly with Whitten and Turner on the wings, who are both handy under the high ball.

Lets hope the physio can work her / his magic and keep the players out of the treatment room!

Interesting news about signings. I don't think that we have formally seen anything in relation to those out of contract yet have we (KPN etc.)?

by
by
23 March, 2018 13:03
Well Todd said that they have a specific game plan for Exeter, hinting that it might be different than what we've been seeing so far. He said he won't go any further than that as he doesn't want to give anything away.

The two seasons of constant long term injuries has to be addressed, so I'm glad the physio team has been looked at.

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
25 March, 2018 18:08
At the end of the Somersetlive article about Joe Cokanasiga's move was this snippet

"The Blue, Black and Whites are still looking for another centre and a third fly-half to replace Josh Lewis when he joins Dragons."

This is on top of Willison, Roberts, just though it was interesting!

BathMatt53
BathMatt53
25 March, 2018 18:42
I guess we lose Lewis, Tapuai, Hurrell and Banners is the thinking (as we discussed before).

MESSAGES->author
Which Tyler
25 March, 2018 19:35
Let's go for the Hat-trick, and bid for TBC.

Mind you, with the DeGlanvilles coming through, we might be looking for someone more senior (as 3rd choice?)



A man who cannot change his mind, cannot change anything
http://www.rugbyrebels.co/board/download/file.php?id=608
RAEBURN SHIELD




Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 25/03/2018 20:49 by Which Tyler.

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
25 March, 2018 19:48
TBC?

BathMatt53
BathMatt53
25 March, 2018 20:28
Theo Brophy Clewes?

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
25 March, 2018 20:39
Oohhh.... I see..I think thats called an ah-ha moment. Is that a bit like a Viking pillage though?

BathMatt53
BathMatt53
30 March, 2018 11:00
From Ruck

Rugby Inside Line has reported that fly-half Stephen Myler has been in advanced talks with Sale Sharks over the last few days. Clubs that have also been linked with the one-cap England international have been Bath, Connacht and the French Pro D2.

We could do worse as a 3rd choice 10 if he's asking reasonable money IMO.

DanWiley
DanWiley
30 March, 2018 14:14
3 aging also-rans, that's what we need at
10.

BathMatt53
BathMatt53
30 March, 2018 14:24
Quote:
DanWiley
3 aging also-rans, that's what we need at
10.

Burns is 27?

DanWiley
DanWiley
30 March, 2018 14:28
Right so this is his peak, he ain't getting any better.

BathMatt53
BathMatt53
30 March, 2018 14:34
Quote:
DanWiley
Right so this is his peak, he ain't getting any better.

DW that wasnít what you said, you referred to them as ageing. Then in his peak. FB May have had a nightmare most of the season but he has lots of years left (letís hope he gets his mojo back).

As we always say, it will be tough for us to get a good 3rd choice FH. Given the cash we are reportedly spending on RP and FB we canít be spending for a top notch one. Canít say I would be hugely bothered if Myler came or not, we have bigger fish to fry at the mo.

DanWiley
DanWiley
30 March, 2018 14:38
He's on the way down from this season on, and there's nothing left fur us in this season. I call that aging.

Signing myler alongside Rhys and Burns smacks of someone who doesn't know what they want.

Hamptonite
Hamptonite
30 March, 2018 18:49
I heard Stephen Myler was going to Coventry.
Would be a great signing for them if so!

BathMatt53
BathMatt53
31 March, 2018 16:29
Rugby inside line saying Roko to Newcastle and 1/2p spotted again at Farleigh?

I canít see either happening tbh given their contract status.

DanWiley
DanWiley
31 March, 2018 16:33
None of that would make sense to me to any of the people involved.

ballsout
ballsout
31 March, 2018 16:38
If the club let Roko go to Newcastle I'll probably just give up turning up anymore, until the club is run properly from top to bottom.

BathMatt53
BathMatt53
31 March, 2018 16:40
Arenít RIL notoriously dodgy with rumours? Or is that just Fisslers view?

MESSAGES->author
OutsideBath
31 March, 2018 16:58
Roko to Falcons would be disastrous, but I can imagine our money men sanctioning it.

Ian E
Ian E
31 March, 2018 17:05
But isnít Joe Cokanasiga coming because Rokoís here?

Bathovalballer
Bathovalballer
31 March, 2018 17:54
If the Roko to Newcastle rumour is true, I just wonder what the hell is going on at Farleigh Towers. Roko is arguably the best finisher in the Prem, and if we let him go we really do need all our bumps felt. He won us the game nearly single handedly against Saracens and has had a huge influence in our attack such as it is over the past 3/4 seasons.

Do the money men at this club really care what we put out on the field of play. Cockinsaga whatever his name is may be potentially as good as Roko but he is miles off being the finished article. I would prefer Roko going to Toulon for a rest/ recuperation and come back firing than go to another club.

I know its not confirmed, but feel after yesterday we lurch from one crisis to another and it is all bad news. If not true, why doesn't the club say so. They have enough non playing staff and hangers on to man the airwaves as they must see, as they are meant to read this site, how the unrest from the supporters is mounting and how many are saying they will not renew their season tickets. Or don't they care? God the way the supporters have been treated and taken for granted is just contemptuous in the extreme.

Rolfs_Cartoon_Club
@Hydor18
31 March, 2018 17:54
Forget Myler, we should be going for Cipriani it be our first choice flyhakf and let him re-ignite or wretchedly underperforming backline.

MESSAGES->author
Which Tyler
31 March, 2018 18:05
Quote:
Bathovalballer

I know its not confirmed, but feel after yesterday we lurch from one crisis to another and it is all bad news. If not true, why doesn't the club say so. They have enough non playing staff and hangers on to man the airwaves as they must see, as they are meant to read this site, how the unrest from the supporters is mounting and how many are saying they will not renew their season tickets. Or don't they care? God the way the supporters have been treated and taken for granted is just contemptuous in the extreme.
presumably, the same reason as every time you make this demand.
Which would be the same reason every club does the same as Bath in this case with every rumour and every time a fan demands an explanation.

Besides, as you've proven with Attwood; if the ckub do explain - you call them liars and continue to believe what you want to believe regardless.



A man who cannot change his mind, cannot change anything
http://www.rugbyrebels.co/board/download/file.php?id=608
RAEBURN SHIELD




Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 31/03/2018 21:39 by Which Tyler.

Bathovalballer
Bathovalballer
31 March, 2018 18:15
WT, You put words in my mouth as I have said NO[u][/u] such thing. I have though queried, as many hundreds of supporters and pundits alike, how/why DA's trip to Toulon happened, especially when he was desperately needed back in England to help secure a top 6 finish. And when we are in the throws of an injury crisis that is spectacular to say the least.

I am not blaming him if we most probably fail in that quest, but his sojourn in Toulon is totally unprecedented, and I only hope he returns in one piece, fully motivated, as we are going to need him and his considerable powers to keep us from the bottom half of the league next year.

sid the seagull
sid the seagull
31 March, 2018 19:17
Have been thinking we could way worse than Danny C for a while Hydor.
It would be the end of Freddie though and DC would have to be allowed to play the way he saw fit.

HOP

Boldangrey
Boldangrey
31 March, 2018 19:54
You miss the point that his psychological state would probably have meant he would be mis-firing if he was playing for Bath now.

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
31 March, 2018 20:58
The problem with Bahrovinglabber or whatever he is called doesn't read the comments written and simply repeats the same message over and over and over...BoB how hard is it to get someones name right!

MESSAGES->author
Clarkey3k
31 March, 2018 21:31
Cips might be on his way back to Sale...



Adopted players: 2019/20 T Faletau; [19] M V Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw

Family . Community . Nation - [sdp.org.uk]

dannyf2
dannyf2
01 April, 2018 09:17
Quote:
@Hydor18
Forget Myler, we should be going for Cipriani it be our first choice flyhakf and let him re-ignite or wretchedly underperforming backline.

Bristol I heard

BathMatt53
BathMatt53
09 April, 2018 17:37
Joe Simpson to Ealing according to TRP?!

by
by
10 April, 2018 09:06
Ealign?!? There must be half a dozen premiership clubs wanting to sign him.

MESSAGES->author
Which Tyler
10 April, 2018 09:26
Wealthy, ambitious club wants their boy back.
Can probably earn as much there, being a big fish and an inspiration behind a promotion attempt over the next couple of years; and possibly starting to look at life after rugby in his home town.

IIRC Simpson was always one of those players allegedly unhappy about leaving London (presumably not unhappy enough to look to move to Quin's or Sarries, but priorities change when you're 30 and given up hopes of international level).



A man who cannot change his mind, cannot change anything
http://www.rugbyrebels.co/board/download/file.php?id=608
RAEBURN SHIELD




Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/04/2018 09:26 by Which Tyler.

Boldangrey
Boldangrey
10 April, 2018 12:59
I thought the thing about Ealing was they didn't want promotion because of their ground.

Championship rugby with little TV exposure will surely not pay top salaries.

HMilner
Big Dog
10 April, 2018 13:11
Still don't know what will happen re. ring fencing the Premiership so would seem an interesting decision if Simpson does head to Ealing. I don't see it happening personally but what do I know!?



Adopted players:
2018-19 Jonathan Joseph
2017-18 Shaun Knight

BathMatt53
BathMatt53
10 April, 2018 13:58
It says that he can only go if they pay him £150k per year as that the clause in his contract (i.e. no fee to pay and he can go if someone does).

Bath Supporter Jack
Bath Supporter Jack
10 April, 2018 21:49
Ealing Trailfinders.......the money is in the name!

BathMatt53
BathMatt53
11 April, 2018 17:40
TRANSFER RUMOUR: We have heard that South African utility back Jesse Kriel could be heading to the Premiership next season. Sale Sharks have allegedly signed a marquee South African fullback and look the likely destination in order to replace club captain Will Addison.

Yet another good signing for Sale, if true.

Bath Hammer
Bath Hammer
11 April, 2018 17:45
I have got to the stage where I am less interested in potential new players than changes in the coaching team. Failing the replacement of TB we have at least to hope for a new attack coach.

BathBurger
BathBurger
11 April, 2018 18:16
Quote:
BathMatt53
TRANSFER RUMOUR: We have heard that South African utility back Jesse Kriel could be heading to the Premiership next season. Sale Sharks have allegedly signed a marquee South African fullback and look the likely destination in order to replace club captain Will Addison.
Yet another good signing for Sale, if true.

Certainly a few names being mentioned around Sale. Cipriani, Myler, Marler, Haskell I believe, K Brookes. Will be interesting to see how many end up there, but some serious recruitment taking place by the looks of it.

BathMatt53
BathMatt53
11 April, 2018 18:39
K Brookes to Wasps I thought to replace Marty Moore?

Old Bath Tub
Old Bath Tub
11 April, 2018 18:58
Quote:
BathMatt53
TRANSFER RUMOUR: We have heard that South African utility back Jesse Kriel could be heading to the Premiership next season. Sale Sharks have allegedly signed a marquee South African fullback and look the likely destination in order to replace club captain Will Addison.
Yet another good signing for Sale, if true.

Could be true, I heard destination Gloucester to replace Moriarty (Sm128)

JamboBris
JamboBris
11 April, 2018 19:48
Different Kriel there mate. That's the flanker, Jaco if I recall correctly.

Old Bath Tub
Old Bath Tub
11 April, 2018 20:14
Quote:
JamboBris
Different Kriel there mate. That's the flanker, Jaco if I recall correctly.

Oops ! Wrong glasses again

Danchinho
Danchinho
12 April, 2018 07:18
Jesse Kriel has been the in form centre in Super Rugby so far this season. Would be a good signing for anyone.



I probably don't know what i'm talking about.

Ali1969
Ali1969
14 April, 2018 12:09
How about snapping up Paddy Jackson $ Stuart Olding both released by Ulster and both fantastic players - I bet there that most DoR's will be asking the question. Why mot us!!

MESSAGES->author
Coalminer
14 April, 2018 12:17
They are good players but if the DORs askntheir wives and daughters they will understand why not. That is before they ask the club sponsors

nixworld2
nixworld2
14 April, 2018 12:47
Quote:
Ali1969
How about snapping up Paddy Jackson $ Stuart Olding both released by Ulster and both fantastic players - I bet there that most DoR's will be asking the question. Why mot us!!

No. A thousand times no. It will never happen, and for good reason.

MESSAGES->author
Rawce
14 April, 2018 13:22
I wouldnít touch them with someone elseís barge pole.

Ali1969
Ali1969
14 April, 2018 14:50
We do not know the full circumstances in relation to the court case but suffice to say that they were both acquitted and neither was charged with a lesser offense meaning there was no plea bargaining by either side.

Many innocent males have been accused and tried for Rape and we should be very careful in judging people who have been through due diligence within our Criminal Justice system and acquitted of all charges.

I understand Ulster's position which made the players position at the club completely impossible.

Both players are quality rugby players and I do not know them in relation to personalities but as they have been proven Not Guilty then they deserve to be given a chance.

I am not defending dithers actions on that night I am just stating a point.

nixworld2
nixworld2
14 April, 2018 15:15
Quote:
Ali1969
We do not know the full circumstances in relation to the court case but suffice to say that they were both acquitted and neither was charged with a lesser offense meaning there was no plea bargaining by either side.
Many innocent males have been accused and tried for Rape and we should be very careful in judging people who have been through due diligence within our Criminal Justice system and acquitted of all charges.

I understand Ulster's position which made the players position at the club completely impossible.

Both players are quality rugby players and I do not know them in relation to personalities but as they have been proven Not Guilty then they deserve to be given a chance.

I am not defending dithers actions on that night I am just stating a point.

In regards to your point about false rape allegations, you may find the below article of interest.

Irrespective of the result in court, if you leave a girl you have just had sex with crying, bleeding, hysterical and in pain, then message your mates about being a "top sh**ger", and bragging about spit roasting, then you are a complete tool.

[www.independent.co.uk]

Ali1969
Ali1969
14 April, 2018 16:30
You are quite right and that is digusting and vile - the question is the why did the prosecution not charge with Malicious communications or other offences specifically designed to catch these type of sexual predators there are many other offences for which all of them could have been rightly placed on the Sex Offnders Register.

I am not defending these vile creatures but merely pointing out that given the reporting of the case for which most of us have not been privy to - history (clearly wrongly) will show these creatures as being totally innocent.

My heart goes out to the victim and I hope she makes a full recovery and realizes that not all males are complete animals.

Enough Said.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 14/04/2018 17:09 by Ali1969.

BathMatt53
BathMatt53
15 April, 2018 13:27
Olding going to Exeter according to reports? Wouldnít sit well with me if they came to Bath, despite not being guilty of the crimes they were charged with.

gaz59
gaz59
15 April, 2018 15:55
Might not be guilty of a criminal offence but the evidence, some shown in court and some not, suggest young men whose values, judgement and attitude towards women are totally reprehensible

So no, not welcome at my club

Old Bath Tub
Old Bath Tub
15 April, 2018 15:58
Quote:
gaz59
Might not be guilty of a criminal offence but the evidence, some shown in court and some not, suggest young men whose values, judgement and attitude towards women are totally reprehensible
So no, not welcome at my club

Totally agree, found not guilty does not necessarily mean they were not.

wetside
wetside
15 April, 2018 17:42
Totally agree, found not guilty does not necessarily mean they were not.[/quote]

Not guilty means not guilty.
Are you saying it was a miscarriage of justice ?
Were you at trial ?

southgate
southgate
15 April, 2018 17:42
Don't want either of them,

Old Bath Tub
Old Bath Tub
15 April, 2018 18:12
[quote wetside]Totally agree, found not guilty does not necessarily mean they were not.[/quote]

Not guilty means not guilty.
Are you saying it was a miscarriage of justice ?
Were you at trial ?[/quote]

No I was not at the trial, and I am not saying there was a miscarriage of justice in this instance, but in reality there are many who have walked free and shouldn't have.

MESSAGES->author
hasta
15 April, 2018 18:29
Not guilty (or not proven) of rape. Doesn't mean not reprehensible. Jackson in particular hasn't exactly clothed himself in contrition.

Substitute
Substitute
15 April, 2018 18:39
I can't help but feel that the only judgement that affects a person's livelihood to such an extent such come from a court of law.

If we don't like Jackson's (et al) behaviour then there is a duty to investigate if it is confined to this small group of personnel before condemning them. I bet it isn't. Much more comfortable to think there are only a few bad apples...

BathMatt53
BathMatt53
15 April, 2018 18:45
IMHO we as individuals need to very careful with language in relation to this issue.

They were found not guilty of the crime for which they were on trial. However, in PJs own words:

"I recognise that my behaviour has fallen far short of the values expected of me as an international player, a role model for the game of rugby and as a son and a brother.Ē

Barnoid
Barnoid
15 April, 2018 18:50
Like them or not, we have two international 10s contracted for next season. Hiring a third, with a ton of baggage, would surely be absurd.

That said, arguing about this is a good distraction from whatís happening on the pitch at the moment, right?

BathMatt53
BathMatt53
15 April, 2018 18:53
Barnoid we havenít been linked with them - Exeter have though. Just turned into a discussion about how we would feel if they were linked... lots of better distractions!

DanWiley
DanWiley
16 April, 2018 07:04
I don't think we need these two, and we certainly don't need the baggage which will come whether you think it is justified or not.

For me, not guilty is not guilty. But we're still free not to hire someone because we feel they are a bit of an ********. On the other hand, if we felt we required a certain player sufficiently to justify their level of ********Ness I think I'd be ok with that. I don't think all our players need to be " really great guys". As a lesser example, I think it's have taken cipriani when he was a classic ********.

BathMatt53
BathMatt53
16 April, 2018 07:13
More made up Agent garbage by the sounds of it.

[www.exeterchiefs.co.uk]

gaz59
gaz59
16 April, 2018 08:44
Well done Chiefs - nothing more needed

terracehugger
terracehugger
16 April, 2018 12:29
Quote:
Barnoid
Like them or not, we have two international 10s contracted for next season. Hiring a third, with a ton of baggage, would surely be absurd.
That said, arguing about this is a good distraction from whatís happening on the pitch at the moment, right?

Regrettably, on this season's form, neither of our two "Internationals" would get a look in at any of the other Premiership teams.

Not giving an opinion on the 2 former Ulster players, just stating the obvious!

charlieboa
charlieboa
22 April, 2018 07:18
Rugby paper saying as well as coko we are being linked to theo b-c. Would be a really good signing I think but a weird decision for him? Could possibly get in ahead rhys and Freddie on recent form mind you!

Ali1969
Ali1969
22 April, 2018 09:43
In relation to the Ulster two - as I previously stated history will show them as Not Guilty - there are many reasons why people who are not innocent walk away not guilty - lack of continuity in exhibits and evidence - and in my experience when we are talking sexual offences coupled with intoxicants or other substances the defence will always lean to "Muddy the Waters" for the Jury - there will always be subjecture due to the presence of intoxicants,substances or circumstances and a classic tactic will be to show that the victim and witnesses could not have been clear in their recollection of the events. Harsh but a well used tactic in these cases - it is then for the Jury to decide often they will resort to their own personal experiences whilst intoxicated to decide if the evidence is beyond (and this is the most important aspect) ALL REASONABLE DOUBT.

I personally like the Scottish system of being guilty but not proven - this would capture a lot of persons who get away with such offences through technical issues.

The only thing I find strange given Jacksons' comments post trial and the reported incident - we obviously have to be very careful in the knowledge that none of us have been privy to the entire judicial case and prejudices we have all formed - is that the prosecution did not look to pursue a lesser offence given there was potential exchanges using mobile telecommunications. As I said before they may well have considered it but there were no grounds...We just do not know.

My heart goes out to the victim and I hope in time she will make a recovery - In relation to the players whatever personally you feel - they are 2 talented players who will go to another club and do well no doubt - like it or not.

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
22 April, 2018 11:34
When a legal case not 'cut and dried' There are some instances where some of the accused are found not guilty however, there are also some that are found guilty.

Judgements of people's character based on what happens in a court of law are extremely risky.

It has to be said that a very many sexual assault cases are currently decided without all the evidence available. Why? Because the police are under resourced to read through all the evidence, often digital and the CPS staff have been massively cut to a point where justice is genuinely threatened. Hence the recent controversy about disclosure.

My experience in commenting on sexual assault is,if you don't know ALL the facts let the people who do decide.

DanWiley
DanWiley
22 April, 2018 14:06
"I personally like the Scottish system of being guilty but not proven"

What does that practically mean?

Mike the Taxi
Mike the Taxi
22 April, 2018 14:51
[en.wikipedia.org] Not proven

Bath Hammer
Bath Hammer
22 April, 2018 18:04
Quote:
shipwrecked
It is not uncommon for clubs to see a dip in form related to ground development, have to say that West Ham are a bit of an extreme example of this! Sorry BH. On the plus side once established the performances jump up!

I hope youíre right! It is hard going supporting Bath & West Ham at present.

DanWiley
DanWiley
22 April, 2018 18:25
But, as it says, that effectively means:

"There is no difference between the legal effects of a "not guilty" and "not proven" verdict, which both acquit the defendant"

So at best it seems to be adding as grey area in the minds of people who "don't actually know. "

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
22 April, 2018 20:29
Quote:
Bath Hammer
Quote:
shipwrecked
It is not uncommon for clubs to see a dip in form related to ground development, have to say that West Ham are a bit of an extreme example of this! Sorry BH. On the plus side once established the performances jump up!

I hope youíre right! It is hard going supporting Bath & West Ham at present.


I know BH strong similarities between the two I also support Surrey CC, now if you want an odd season there is a team to ponder, 3rd in the table last year only won 2 games all season and drew 10 matches!

Bath Hammer
Bath Hammer
22 April, 2018 21:56
I am, though, at long last able to celebrate the success of Essex & they won their first match of the new season today.

Ali1969
Ali1969
23 April, 2018 09:55
"There is no difference between the legal effects of a "not guilty" and "not proven" verdict, which both acquit the defendant"

So at best it seems to be adding as grey area in the minds of people who "don't actually know. "

Dan, the legal system is such that there is never a simple solution in relation to outcomes - the Scottish systems allows for overwhelming evidence which fails on a technical issue or a legal argument often out of the jury's hearing in the Judges chambers or otherwise to be taken into account so :- when you hear the saying "there is no smoke without fire" this really sums up the Guilty but not proven outcome - it allows the person judging (Potentially an employer such as a school or care agency to have an alarm bell ring to consider a persons suitability for employment) it just shows a lower burden of proof more akin to the civil court "Beyond the balance of Probabilities" hope this makes sense.

MESSAGES->author
OutsideBath
23 April, 2018 10:41
Quote:
Bath Hammer
Quote:
shipwrecked
It is not uncommon for clubs to see a dip in form related to ground development, have to say that West Ham are a bit of an extreme example of this! Sorry BH. On the plus side once established the performances jump up!

I hope youíre right! It is hard going supporting Bath & West Ham at present.

I also support Arsenal and LA Lakers basketball, both of which are as bad as Bath.. (Sm43)

Beergoggles
Beergoggles
23 April, 2018 10:45
Quote:
Ali1969
Dan, the legal system is such that there is never a simple solution in relation to outcomes - the Scottish systems allows for overwhelming evidence which fails on a technical issue or a legal argument often out of the jury's hearing in the Judges chambers or otherwise to be taken into account so :- when you hear the saying "there is no smoke without fire" this really sums up the Guilty but not proven outcome - it allows the person judging (Potentially an employer such as a school or care agency to have an alarm bell ring to consider a persons suitability for employment) it just shows a lower burden of proof more akin to the civil court "Beyond the balance of Probabilities" hope this makes sense.


As a 'man in the street' not legally trained this sounds like an a terrible outcome. No justice for the victim and no opportunity for the defendant to move on. In effect purgatory for both parties and a lifetime of 'nudge nudge wink wink' adjudication.

DanWiley
DanWiley
23 April, 2018 11:36
It does make sense. But. I wouldn't be very happy with it.

"there is no smoke without fire" is the sort of thing that a gossipy neighbour says over the fence. Fine in that context, not when you are talking about a person's because as you say "an employer such as a school or care agency to have an alarm bell ring to consider a persons suitability for employment" That either should or should NOT be the case based on a person's past. Such a grey area leaves a lot of room for false positives and negatives.

I don't really like "Beyond the balance of Probabilities" on similar grounds. I'm sure practice it gets it right more often than not, but it feels like accepting that this verdict might be wrong. Out of interest, what is beyond the balance of probabilities? If you had to put odds on whether the person was guilty, what would the tipping point be?

DanWiley
DanWiley
23 April, 2018 11:38
Well put beergoggles.

Ali1969
Ali1969
23 April, 2018 13:19
Beyond the balance of probabilities is used in civil matters it just means a lower burden of proof is required - ie more likely than not to be the case - obviously in the case of a criminal trial a much greater burden of proof is required - beyond ALL reasonable doubt.

I think we have well and truly gone off piste and enough has been said in relation to the law and these players.

Chris1850
Chris1850
23 April, 2018 13:29
Quote:
DanWiley
Out of interest, what is beyond the balance of probabilities? If you had to put odds on whether the person was guilty, what would the tipping point be?

51%

DanWiley
DanWiley
23 April, 2018 15:14
As I say, I'm sure it works in practice. But does that not make you feel a little uncomfortable? What's the worst things that can happen to you as a result of a civil case? I guess its fairly limited?

I am interested, but it is off topic and this thread is about transfer rumours, which plenty will be interested in, so we can leave it there.

MESSAGES->author
joethefanatic
23 April, 2018 17:22
Quote:
OutsideBath
Quote:
Bath Hammer
Quote:
shipwrecked
It is not uncommon for clubs to see a dip in form related to ground development, have to say that West Ham are a bit of an extreme example of this! Sorry BH. On the plus side once established the performances jump up!

I hope youíre right! It is hard going supporting Bath & West Ham at present.

I also support Arsenal and LA Lakers basketball, both of which are as bad as Bath.. (Sm43)

Arsenal, Bath and the Washington Redskins. The last 20 years has not been that special.



... IMHO, of course.

Now in Honolulu

quanco
quanco
23 April, 2018 18:31
Quote:
joethefanatic
Quote:
OutsideBath
Quote:
Bath Hammer
Quote:
shipwrecked
It is not uncommon for clubs to see a dip in form related to ground development, have to say that West Ham are a bit of an extreme example of this! Sorry BH. On the plus side once established the performances jump up!

I hope youíre right! It is hard going supporting Bath & West Ham at present.

I also support Arsenal and LA Lakers basketball, both of which are as bad as Bath.. (Sm43)

Arsenal, Bath and the Washington Redskins. The last 20 years has not been that special.

Arsenal, Bath and Washington Wizards... didnít realise so many Bath fans also followed Arsenal until this point.



Josh Bayliss [Bath Rugby] - Adopted Player 2018/19

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
23 April, 2018 20:24
Flipping heck you Gunners fans in the last 20 years Arsenal have won 3 Premier League trophies and 7 FA cups! Many PL clubs will be very, very lucky to sneak the odd FA cup (Sm26)

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
23 April, 2018 20:30
Incidentally a recent survey on why Gunners supporters supported their club found that the main reason was because they were alphabetically the first on the list of PL clubs!

BathPatriot
BathPatriot
23 April, 2018 20:54
Lucky for me that I als follow the Patriots who have been unreal over the past 20 years.

MESSAGES->author
Rawce
23 April, 2018 20:59
(Chicago) Bears fan so a bit like Bath, Iím just too young to remember the real glory days.

Substitute
Substitute
23 April, 2018 21:25
New Orleans Saints, Bath and Crystal Palace... I think I've experienced the whole gamut of sporting emotions.

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