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Poll: O/T: Masking up/down?
Discussion started by Bod (IP Logged), 23 July, 2020 20:41
K-Nut
Bod
23 July, 2020 20:41

Will you be using a mask for your retail therapy from tomorrow?

Yes - No sweat!
Maybe - depends how I feel
No, never - The World's gone mad
Shopping??????
Tsk, tsk, I have my man Simpkins do that sort of thing for me
Amazon/Ocado is all I know these days
Nie rozumiem! Gdzie jest wódka?

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39 Votes

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Given the trumpeting of the Ł100 fines advised for non compliance from tomorrow, if you are found in the pick & mix area without your mask/shield/scarf/crash helmet or other appropriate attire, are you inclined to quickly conform or otherwise?

Given that all the wise and wonderful of the scientific expert types seemed to think it was all twaddle back in March/April - what specifically has changed other than greater availability of PPE.

Is a cultural aversion to masking up a sufficient defence for those who find the concept uncomfortable or difficult to accept or, just do as you're told?

If the staff don't wear masks then why should the clients?

If the Police come to a premises to investigate or prosecute an infraction should they also wear a mask or similar?

Should they use a hand sanitiser before handcuffing the miscreant?

How's it work for a covered market or an open market?

If you only go into Morrisons cafe for your breakfast, or cup of tea and a sticky bun in the afternoon when you're buying 20 B&H do you need to wear a mask? How about at the Petrol pumps?

I'm sure there are plenty of other worrying conundrums vexing the citizens of these shires?

Your views and theories are important!


(Sm85)



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 23/07/2020 20:45 by Bod.

BathMatt53
BathMatt53
23 July, 2020 21:01
Its the law - of course we will. We aren't Americans you know. ..'They want to throw God's wonderful breathing system out' and all that crazy talk. Will be interesting to see what happens to those who try and shop without them - I can see some disagreements on the cards, M&S fight club.



[Actively seeking a new adoptee: until I'm assigned one I'm going for Joshua Matavesi]

warrenball
warrenball
23 July, 2020 21:48
Why is everyone so exercised about wearing masks? Lots of people do it every day in their jobs to protect their health, this is only an extension of that. Once back in your car you can remove the mask. Is that really so hard?

Never In Doubt
Never In Doubt
23 July, 2020 21:50
Things that have changed since March/April:

1. We are now trying to open up our society rather than lock it down therefore increasing the risk of infection spread
2. Countries that use masks (e.g. Japan 86% & Singapore 90% mask acceptance - Yougov data) have seen much lower deaths (990 & 27 respectively - John Hopkins data) vs UK (>45k).
3. Increased research seems to suggest that countries that accept mask wearing have lower infection rates (Prof Lavoie - Montreal Behavioural Medicine Centre)
4. There is also now some evidence that wearing a mask can provide limited protection to the wearer in low viral load situations (Royal Society - UK national academy of sciences).

Yes it seems reasonable to believe that when there was little actual scientific evidence that wearing masks made a material difference, there was a PPE shortage and we were all in lockdown then wearing masks was not beneficial. It is hardly surprising that there was no scientific evidence at that stage for a novel virus.

Now we are out of lockdown, there is more actual evidence to support wearing masks and we have more PPE then I see very little downside to wearing masks. Given that the virus will not disappear in the near term, there are no approved vaccinces, treatment remains limited; it seems to me logical that we have to change our habits to limit future spikes.

Wearing a mask is no more than a minor inconvenience to me so of course I will do my bit to try and limit the overall impact.

P G Tips
P G Tips
23 July, 2020 22:20
Bod
Is the final question Russian or Serbo Croat?

PG

Beergoggles
Beergoggles
23 July, 2020 23:14
Breathtaking incompetence from the government. If the mask regulations had come in in parallel with the reopening no one would have blinked. As it is it’s almost impossible to argue for the logic of masks optional one month ago, masks mandatory now. I’ll wear one for the minimum amount of essential shopping I’ll do. All discretionary spending will be online.

sid the seagull
sid the seagull
23 July, 2020 23:46
Niqabs are ok.

PECK

K-Nut
Bod
24 July, 2020 01:03
Quote:
P G Tips
Bod
Is the final question Russian or Serbo Croat?

PG

Polish (I lived there for 3 years 90-93)
"I don't understand,Where do you keep the Vodka ?"

(Sm72)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 24/07/2020 01:20 by Bod.

P G Tips
P G Tips
24 July, 2020 06:33
I knew what it meant - I learned my Serbo Croat (worked in Montenegro 6 months in same era) phonetically so seldom saw it spelt!

PG

Devonport Lad
Devonport Lad
24 July, 2020 08:41
Right, head above the parapet time. I feel strongly about this - perhaps understandably as the father of a key worker who has worked an incredible number of hours in very challenging conditions over the past months.
I’ve no doubt the BBC will spend the day scouring the country to do “vox pops” with people who think this is all difficult and confusing. Well it isn’t. No debate, no polls, no handwringing about civil liberties and loss of personal choice. Unless you are genuinely in one of the exempted categories, JFDI!
(Ducks and stands by for “incoming”!)

Bath Supporter Jack
Bath Supporter Jack
24 July, 2020 08:59
Devonport Lad

Don't duck....................it is a very simple thing to do which cannot do any harm and, might, do some good.

In BANES with no new cases for a few weeks it does seem a bit academic.

Bathovalballer
Bathovalballer
24 July, 2020 09:02
I wonder if Mr Corbyn or his brother will wear masks as they are so vocal on people's civil and human rights?

Personally I don't like the idea of having people's faces covered as it affects how you interact with one another but will willingly comply with the law, especially if it is deemed for the greater good.

Now I wonder when masked if teachers will be able to consider themselves safe and able to return to work, teaching youngsters who have had very little amounts of the virus? Or will they still be hiding behind the dictats of their Unions and political masters, and going in fear of suffocation and stress of having to contribute to the greater good like virtually every other institution and industry in the country?



Adopted player 2019/20 Jonathan 'JJ' Joseph.

The Jink Joseph.

Adopted player 2018/19 Adopted player 2018/19 Semesa 'The Rock' Rokoduguni

MESSAGES->author
OutsideBath
24 July, 2020 09:07
Quote:
Bath Supporter Jack
Devonport Lad
Don't duck....................it is a very simple thing to do which cannot do any harm and, might, do some good.

In BANES with no new cases for a few weeks it does seem a bit academic.

+1

No need to duck, think even in 2020 we are in a free society. Equally no need to wear a mask, just shop online it's simple as that.

MESSAGES->author
CoochieCoo
24 July, 2020 09:16
It’s common sense! When in a crowded area where a mask. I will put it on in a crowded Oxford Street but not when walking in the countryside. Yes I will obey the law and wear a mask in a shop crowded or not.



https://pbflaa.by.files.1drv.com/y4mToRbTHGUTg0zWMi8LNeOlOmx4tZHsH3crYbASv0X_qWBw8j30S9KV-RiZIf_AWoOZXD7D3Rjy1tYRAKXykpZSHuOObVQBiovPpB6PnDUuBM6xlx2F1yOjKpEBmWUfMru3SCm255j3p-CnndC7J9ZUG29r1BtfFWHHj-MdzDOpzBuTRTPqNaco8ctf1svZyW0?width=106&height=160&cropmode=none
https://pbfkaa.by.files.1drv.com/y4mhxY1k8zrLn92LwcIYgSd1KcA6zBGX-Wgw2dNz8Us0xA71EhjMmL2tc-ggx7OlsBDECw8eAZ_oAWnNyh5doimzOEics5H87cuh5Q-Sb-ViPD6Pt6QUBneu5F2tlWLltGQZ8pd5qFmsZwbKB39L5Dki21gJfnsiaxLiCiuWPCZUjkXp4EttajzFAgcCl6YuDDF?width=160&height=107&cropmode=none

Kaapstad
Kaapstad
24 July, 2020 09:22
I won't be wearing one.

ballsout
ballsout
24 July, 2020 10:08
Quote:
Kaapstad
I won't be wearing one.

(Sm16)

K-Nut
Bod
24 July, 2020 10:11
Quote:
ballsout
Quote:
Kaapstad
I won't be wearing one.

(Sm16)

And?

BathMatt53
BathMatt53
24 July, 2020 10:28
Then expect to get into lots of arguments with people when you are trying to do your shopping. it will be awkward and it will take you twice as long. Just seems to be a cantankerous thing to do just to make some point that doesn't really seem worth making IMO.



[Actively seeking a new adoptee: until I'm assigned one I'm going for Joshua Matavesi]

K-Nut
Bod
24 July, 2020 10:41
Why would you call out someone not wearing a mask in a shop when the staff are unmasked, and not another person, lingering in a locale for a few hours maskless having a pint or two?
Is there a virtue reference I'm missing?
(Sm3)

BathMatt53
BathMatt53
24 July, 2020 10:46
Quote:
Bod
Why would you call out someone not wearing a mask in a shop when the staff are unmasked, and not another person, lingering in a locale for a few hours maskless having a pint or two?
Is there a virtue reference I'm missing?
(Sm3)

I think that the staff have to be masked? Why would someone be drinking a pint in the local co-op for an hour or 2?!



[Actively seeking a new adoptee: until I'm assigned one I'm going for Joshua Matavesi]

annie blackthorn
annie blackthorn
24 July, 2020 10:52
Wel -l I had a txt from my GP Surgery yesterday which informed me that they would not be issuing me with a letter to say I didnt need to wear a mask, attaching several explanatory govt issued documents. I wondered what had prompted them to feel the need to do this, and mentally rolled my eyes at the thought of the patients who had obviously been having an argybargy on the matter.

Bit mystified to start with, until I worked out that as am 'old' and now take high blood pressure medication must come under a certain category of patient. As I have been wearing a surgical face mask in shops for the past 6 weeks or so for my own protection, no problem. About to go out and about so be interesting to see whether one can spot the difference as I have mostly been in a minority up to the present. Esp at petrol stations with shopping facility. Good luck to all those wh are going to find their restriction on their freedoms irksome, but as observed maybe they have staff (or at least a 'partner') who will go into shops etc. for them. (Sm54)

ballsout
ballsout
24 July, 2020 11:03
Quote:
Bod
Why would you call out someone not wearing a mask in a shop when the staff are unmasked, and not another person, lingering in a locale for a few hours maskless having a pint or two?
Is there a virtue reference I'm missing?
(Sm3)

Because I'm not some idiot who employs the "well if they're not going to do it then I'm not going to it" strategy. Just wear a mask ffs, it's not a big deal.

K-Nut
Bod
24 July, 2020 11:06
To be fair Annie, GPs and local surgeries have been notably absent from any proactive engagement with the general public across the Covid scenario. Saying that, trying to obtain a GPs appointment prior to lockdown was a nightmare so what else was to be expected?
(Sm72)

K-Nut
Bod
24 July, 2020 11:33
Quote:
ballsout
Quote:
Bod
Why would you call out someone not wearing a mask in a shop when the staff are unmasked, and not another person, lingering in a locale for a few hours maskless having a pint or two?
Is there a virtue reference I'm missing?
(Sm3)

Because I'm not some idiot who employs the "well if they're not going to do it then I'm not going to it" strategy. Just wear a mask ffs, it's not a big deal.

You patently need no spurious justifications or strategies to demonstrate or underline your idiocies bo.
The explanation to my enquiry is?
Popping into a shop to buy a paper requires a mask, but an afternoon watching the sports channel in a pub doesn't?

I'm sure your explanation will be fulsome and explicit.
You might be one of his fanboys but, "Because Boris says so" doesn't work

(Sm72)

Kaapstad
Kaapstad
24 July, 2020 11:37
Quote:
BathMatt53
Then expect to get into lots of arguments with people when you are trying to do your shopping. it will be awkward and it will take you twice as long. Just seems to be a cantankerous thing to do just to make some point that doesn't really seem worth making IMO.

Thanks for the lecture.

ballsout
ballsout
24 July, 2020 11:38
Couldn't care less what Boris says, I wear one anyway. Wore one to the shops yesterday, because it's the right thing to do.

Grow up bod. Seriously, it's about time.

MESSAGES->author
woodpecker
24 July, 2020 11:42
Quote:
Bod
Quote:
ballsout
Quote:
Bod
Why would you call out someone not wearing a mask in a shop when the staff are unmasked, and not another person, lingering in a locale for a few hours maskless having a pint or two?
Is there a virtue reference I'm missing?
(Sm3)

Because I'm not some idiot who employs the "well if they're not going to do it then I'm not going to it" strategy. Just wear a mask ffs, it's not a big deal.

You patently need no spurious justifications or strategies to demonstrate or underline your idiocies bo.
The explanation to my enquiry is?
Popping into a shop to buy a paper requires a mask, but an afternoon watching the sports channel in a pub doesn't?

I'm sure your explanation will be fulsome and explicit.
You might be one of his fanboys but, "Because Boris says so" doesn't work

(Sm72)

There are lots of anomalies and have been since Covid started, why can I do a. but I cant do b? Numerous phone ins, about why can hairdressers do this and beauticians cant do that? Why can I meet my friends but not my mum?

Dont worry about it, be grateful you dont need to wear one in the pub, clearly its impossible to eat and drink with a mask on, but its a risk. Its all about risk/reward and trying to keep certain sectors open. Can you stay 1m apart on a plane, no, tough titties!

Ideally we wouldnt have coivd-19 and ideally we would have legislated for every eventuality for when it turned up, but we didn't...

I have no issue with wearing a mask and I'm glad nearly everything is open.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 24/07/2020 11:46 by woodpecker.

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
24 July, 2020 11:44
Quote:
Kaapstad
Quote:
BathMatt53
Then expect to get into lots of arguments with people when you are trying to do your shopping. it will be awkward and it will take you twice as long. Just seems to be a cantankerous thing to do just to make some point that doesn't really seem worth making IMO.

Thanks for the lecture.

Problem is your original comment was deliberately provocative wasn't it? No reason or explanation, no point to make, just seems like its an "I'm not playing statement". Perhaps its laziness, try posting more than just a few words!



https://i.ibb.co/gjWyP09/Unknown-1-2.jpg


Beno Obano Age 25 years, Loosehead prop, 5ft 8ins 18st 12lbs 'Mauls are like Transformers' they change form to become more powerful!

MESSAGES->author
CoochieCoo
24 July, 2020 11:48
There may be very pertinent reasons that shop staff don’t wear masks because of asthma etc. Sainsbury’s have two cashiers who don’t wear masks and the two do look as if they are in this category. However they are behind screens so just as effective.



https://pbflaa.by.files.1drv.com/y4mToRbTHGUTg0zWMi8LNeOlOmx4tZHsH3crYbASv0X_qWBw8j30S9KV-RiZIf_AWoOZXD7D3Rjy1tYRAKXykpZSHuOObVQBiovPpB6PnDUuBM6xlx2F1yOjKpEBmWUfMru3SCm255j3p-CnndC7J9ZUG29r1BtfFWHHj-MdzDOpzBuTRTPqNaco8ctf1svZyW0?width=106&height=160&cropmode=none
https://pbfkaa.by.files.1drv.com/y4mhxY1k8zrLn92LwcIYgSd1KcA6zBGX-Wgw2dNz8Us0xA71EhjMmL2tc-ggx7OlsBDECw8eAZ_oAWnNyh5doimzOEics5H87cuh5Q-Sb-ViPD6Pt6QUBneu5F2tlWLltGQZ8pd5qFmsZwbKB39L5Dki21gJfnsiaxLiCiuWPCZUjkXp4EttajzFAgcCl6YuDDF?width=160&height=107&cropmode=none

K-Nut
Bod
24 July, 2020 11:54
Quote:
shipwrecked
Quote:
Kaapstad
Quote:
BathMatt53
Then expect to get into lots of arguments with people when you are trying to do your shopping. it will be awkward and it will take you twice as long. Just seems to be a cantankerous thing to do just to make some point that doesn't really seem worth making IMO.

Thanks for the lecture.

Problem is your original comment was deliberately provocative wasn't it? No reason or explanation, no point to make, just seems like its an "I'm not playing statement". Perhaps its laziness, try posting more than just a few words!

How is stating an opinion in simple terms provocative?
I don't find concise comment uncomfortable .
(Sm3)

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
24 July, 2020 11:55
Quote:
Bod
Quote:
shipwrecked
Quote:
Kaapstad
Quote:
BathMatt53
Then expect to get into lots of arguments with people when you are trying to do your shopping. it will be awkward and it will take you twice as long. Just seems to be a cantankerous thing to do just to make some point that doesn't really seem worth making IMO.

Thanks for the lecture.

Problem is your original comment was deliberately provocative wasn't it? No reason or explanation, no point to make, just seems like its an "I'm not playing statement". Perhaps its laziness, try posting more than just a few words!

How is stating an opinion in simple terms provocative?
I don't find concise comment uncomfortable .
(Sm3)

Missed the point Bod, Kaapstad clearly does find it a problem!



https://i.ibb.co/gjWyP09/Unknown-1-2.jpg


Beno Obano Age 25 years, Loosehead prop, 5ft 8ins 18st 12lbs 'Mauls are like Transformers' they change form to become more powerful!

K-Nut
Bod
24 July, 2020 12:01
His point of view and the manner by which it's expressed is a problem to you ?
That's what I understand from your response.
(Sm154)

Kaapstad
Kaapstad
24 July, 2020 12:04
My comment was meant to be nothing more than that. The poll seemed a gauge of what people intend to do?

I don't agree with some of the masking up policy. There are people on here who may feel a little annoyed about the issue? I'm certainly not about to irritate anyone (even further) who disagrees with me by listing my reasons- we don't agree.

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
24 July, 2020 12:05
Quote:
Bod
His point of view and the manner by which it's expressed is a problem to you ?
That's what I understand from your response.
(Sm154)

What?



https://i.ibb.co/gjWyP09/Unknown-1-2.jpg


Beno Obano Age 25 years, Loosehead prop, 5ft 8ins 18st 12lbs 'Mauls are like Transformers' they change form to become more powerful!

BathMatt53
BathMatt53
24 July, 2020 12:16
Quote:
Kaapstad
Quote:
BathMatt53
Then expect to get into lots of arguments with people when you are trying to do your shopping. it will be awkward and it will take you twice as long. Just seems to be a cantankerous thing to do just to make some point that doesn't really seem worth making IMO.

Thanks for the lecture.

Genuinely didn't mean it to come across that way, so I apologise. I just don't really see why you wouldn't wear one unless you couldn't, seems like it would be a lot of hassle.



[Actively seeking a new adoptee: until I'm assigned one I'm going for Joshua Matavesi]

K-Nut
Bod
24 July, 2020 12:17
Indeed Kaapstad.

Blind faith in the directives of those who try to guide us through these curious times doesn't seem to be best for the majority given the outcomes so far, but respect towards those who find solace in having such guidance as reassuring should be maintained . Agreeing to disagree is a mature position I find, although increasingly difficult across the last years' of polarisation of opinions, and assumptions about peoples' motivations.
(Sm72)

warrenball
warrenball
24 July, 2020 12:20
Why not just agree that doctors and politicians really have no idea about the efficacy of wearing masks but the downside is so small (unless you have severe breathing problems) that you may as well just wear them and be done with it. Same argument over seat belts, crash helmets or smoking in public, some people just like to be argumentative.

Kaapstad
Kaapstad
24 July, 2020 12:29
No problem BM-really.(Sm128)

I find the whole mask strategy floored. The masks (believing they work) should have been introduced in January/February? Wearing them now with slow/prevent the spread of the virus?

If people want to wear them- fine.

With a club website, the other members will be likeminded about the core subject. The snag with OT subjects is it things open up all kinds of potential arguments?

I keep my comments minimal on here because I have found it a little "tricky" in years gone by.

ballsout
ballsout
24 July, 2020 13:01
Ah so wearing them was a good idea in January, but now they're a bad idea. Got it.

Ignore the politics. Not common sense.

John Tee
John Tee
24 July, 2020 13:12
I'll be wearing one...socially responsible.
Not that concerned about making a point on whether the science is correct or not.
I have friends who are more nervous about Covid so i give that due respect.
It is what it is...

Kaapstad
Kaapstad
24 July, 2020 13:23
Quote:
ballsout
Ah so wearing them was a good idea in January, but now they're a bad idea. Got it.
Ignore the politics. Not common sense.

Yes and a no.

and another yes and no.

DorsetBoy
Dorset Boy
24 July, 2020 13:30
There is very little logic in the introduction of compulsory mask wearing at the present time, particularly when in many of the local areas there have been no new cases for a number of weeks now. You then have the daft situation of it being compulsory in the corner shop you call into for 2 minutes, but not compulsory when you go to get your hair cut, let alone having to wear one to get a take away coffee, but not having to wear one if you choose to drink the same coffee on the premises...
Add to that a large number (almost certainly the majority) of people touching their masks, and not using the straps to put them on and off or up and down.

I will comply, but think the policy is seriously flawed.

John Tee
John Tee
24 July, 2020 13:34
Had hair cut the other day, wore mask as did the cuttters, paid extra for PPE, not a problem.
I thought hairdressers were covered by having to adopt masks but
didnt query it

Kaapstad
Kaapstad
24 July, 2020 13:35
(Sm152)

Common sense DB.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 24/07/2020 13:37 by Kaapstad.

B4thB4ck
B4thB4ck
24 July, 2020 13:58
Wore one for the 1st time today at a car dealership. Was surprised at how hot and stuffy it made me feel but stuck with it. One bonus, when the salesman started on his usual lecture on GAP insurance and special treatments he could not see the bored apathy on my face.

I felt the need to create a small air gap under my chin to let some cool air in just for a few seconds every 10 minutes. Defeated the point of the mask in those moments but since there were only 2 of us distancing in a huge showroom it seemed an ok compromise. I would not do this in a supermarket.

MESSAGES->author
hasta
24 July, 2020 14:18
There is a not unreasonable probability of a second wave in the winter with no vaccine available in time. Getting people used to wearing them now (given it's not a common thing in this country) makes it more likely that if a second wave hits we'll be able to manage it better with masks and not have to lockdown.

Mike the Taxi
Mike the Taxi
24 July, 2020 14:38
Just got back from Morrisons.

Everyone was wearing a face covering of some sort; mostly masks, even parents with children young enough not to be required to had their children wearing them.
All staff were wearing them, some with vizors.
For the sake of 10 minutes compliance, why not, it's no big deal?

B4thB4ck
B4thB4ck
24 July, 2020 15:15
Quote:
B4thB4ck
Wore one for the 1st time today at a car dealership. Was surprised at how hot and stuffy it made me feel but stuck with it. One bonus, when the salesman started on his usual lecture on GAP insurance and special treatments he could not see the bored apathy on my face.
I felt the need to create a small air gap under my chin to let some cool air in just for a few seconds every 10 minutes. Defeated the point of the mask in those moments but since there were only 2 of us distancing in a huge showroom it seemed an ok compromise. I would not do this in a supermarket.

Just to add, when the dealer tells you the value of your existing car, the mask covers up the inevitable involuntary cough that results....

DanWiley
DanWiley
24 July, 2020 16:05
I still have a doubt its a good idea to keep the virus that close to your face.

I'd agree the message is confused. Shop employees DON'T need to wear them! These are the people who are far more likely to have it. Your average customer is a minimal vector. If you keep playing with the mask (as some have already said they do) or casually take off as you leave, you've negated any point in wearing it for your own benefit. You've just been in a place where the virus is reletively likely to get on your hands and you've just put you hand to your face.

I suspect in theory it stops spread, in reality its a bit of a placebo. It won't really stop the spread but it makes people feel like they can control this virus and there's a lot of scared people out there.

Kaapstad
Kaapstad
24 July, 2020 16:19
Top post Dan. These a lot of hysteria around. If it reasures people great.

BathMatt53
BathMatt53
24 July, 2020 16:41
Quote:
DanWiley
I'd agree the message is confused. Shop employees DON'T need to wear them!

I would agree about that! It said that they don't need to wear them, but that you probably should. Then the official guidance says:

Shop and supermarket staff

Face coverings are not required for employees in shops, supermarkets or indoor shopping centres. This also applies to banks, building societies and post office staff.

This is because there will be times when screens or visors are in use, or when a staff member is not in close proximity to people they do not normally meet, and so it will not be necessary for staff to wear a face covering.

Employees should continue to follow guidance from their employer based on a workplace health and safety assessment.


There will be times where screens and visors are in use?

...or when a staff member is not in close proximity to people they do not normally meet?

Surely this means that:

There will be times where screens and visors are NOT in use?

...or when a staff member IS in close proximity to people they do not normally meet?

I am now officially lost in terms of which workers do or don't need them tbh.



[Actively seeking a new adoptee: until I'm assigned one I'm going for Joshua Matavesi]

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
24 July, 2020 16:45
Quote:
Dan Wiley
I suspect in theory it stops spread, in reality its a bit of a placebo. It won't really stop the spread but it makes people feel like they can control this virus and there's a lot of scared people out there.

Quote:
Kapstaad
Top post Dan. These a lot of hysteria around. If it reasures people great.

Please keep your conspiracy theories to yourselves. if you want to join the 'They want to throw God's wonderful breathing system out' brigade please do it quietly.

It really is time the "Masks don't work" party started validating that opinion with a fact or two.

Out of interest how can you expect to get reasoned debate on a thread when you have one YES option in a poll followed by 6 other ways to say NO.



https://i.ibb.co/gjWyP09/Unknown-1-2.jpg


Beno Obano Age 25 years, Loosehead prop, 5ft 8ins 18st 12lbs 'Mauls are like Transformers' they change form to become more powerful!

DanWiley
DanWiley
24 July, 2020 16:52
I'm pretty agnostic (in religious terms) so I can't be in the "God's wonderful breathing system" brigade. I do think you do have a wonderful breathing system, irrespective of whether there is a god, and by a large most of the population has one (in its fullest sense, immune system etc) that can easily deal with this virus. But be careful if you are infirm.

BathMatt53
BathMatt53
24 July, 2020 17:04
Quote:
DanWiley
But be careful if you are infirm.

Or unlucky. The numbers may be proportionately small but there are plenty of 30+ year olds who have died without existing health conditions.



[Actively seeking a new adoptee: until I'm assigned one I'm going for Joshua Matavesi]

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
24 July, 2020 17:10
Quote:
BathMatt53
Quote:
DanWiley
I'd agree the message is confused. Shop employees DON'T need to wear them!

I would agree about that! It said that they don't need to wear them, but that you probably should. Then the official guidance says:

Shop and supermarket staff

Face coverings are not required for employees in shops, supermarkets or indoor shopping centres. This also applies to banks, building societies and post office staff.

This is because there will be times when screens or visors are in use, or when a staff member is not in close proximity to people they do not normally meet, and so it will not be necessary for staff to wear a face covering.

Employees should continue to follow guidance from their employer based on a workplace health and safety assessment.


There will be times where screens and visors are in use?

...or when a staff member is not in close proximity to people they do not normally meet?

Surely this means that:

There will be times where screens and visors are NOT in use?

...or when a staff member IS in close proximity to people they do not normally meet?

I am now officially lost in terms of which workers do or don't need them tbh.

Is everyone going crazy or is it me?

If the current trend is to have a 'check list for living' or 'living by numbers' then I'll happily build a website and charge for registration. Week 1 will be 'How to get out of bed'

The masks issue supplements social distancing, if you cant do the 2m thing then wear a mask, alternatively live in a perspex cage!

I take PayPal by the way on livingbynumbers.com



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Beno Obano Age 25 years, Loosehead prop, 5ft 8ins 18st 12lbs 'Mauls are like Transformers' they change form to become more powerful!

DanWiley
DanWiley
24 July, 2020 17:17
Well, you need to be "lucky" not to catch any fatal illness. And when you say unlucky W/E 3rd July, the latest stats I could find on the ONS, in the age range 30-70:

74 people died of covid, about 1% of those would have had no comorbidities, so less than 1 person. Compared to over 2000 people who died aged 30-70 of all causes that week.

You're very unlucky to die of anything in that age range, you've got to think its really not your week if you die from Covid.

K-Nut
Bod
24 July, 2020 17:19
Quote:
shipwrecked
Quote:
Dan Wiley
I suspect in theory it stops spread, in reality its a bit of a placebo. It won't really stop the spread but it makes people feel like they can control this virus and there's a lot of scared people out there.

Quote:
Kapstaad
Top post Dan. These a lot of hysteria around. If it reasures people great.

Please keep your conspiracy theories to yourselves. if you want to join the 'They want to throw God's wonderful breathing system out' brigade please do it quietly.

It really is time the "Masks don't work" party started validating that opinion with a fact or two.

Out of interest how can you expect to get reasoned debate on a thread when you have one YES option in a poll followed by 6 other ways to say NO.


"Yes" seems to be in the lead here by a decent chalk, but if you voted otherwise we're happy to celebrate your options even if we might disagree.

My wife's Aunty used to send her to the corner shop to refill the Sherry bottle in Abercmwboi

K-Nut
Bod
24 July, 2020 17:24
.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 24/07/2020 19:30 by Bod.

BathMatt53
BathMatt53
24 July, 2020 17:40
Quote:
shipwrecked

Is everyone going crazy or is it me?

If the current trend is to have a 'check list for living' or 'living by numbers' then I'll happily build a website and charge for registration. Week 1 will be 'How to get out of bed'

The masks issue supplements social distancing, if you cant do the 2m thing then wear a mask, alternatively live in a perspex cage!

I take PayPal by the way on livingbynumbers.com

I will of course wear a mask and think that its clear for Joe public. I do however find the Government advice far more complex than I think it needs to be.

In fact the lateness of it and the way it reads is a bit like something my 15 year old will push out when he has forgotten about his homework and has to smash something out ASAP. He can be your first subscriber to the 'get out of bed' tutorial too SW - is there an extra one for how to make a bed and pee somewhere close to the toilet pan?



[Actively seeking a new adoptee: until I'm assigned one I'm going for Joshua Matavesi]

MESSAGES->author
OutsideBath
24 July, 2020 18:49
So much antagonism over a subject with a simple answer.

If you are going to the shops the law states a face covering is required. Some won’t bother and I doubt anyone will have the balls to do anything about it as they are probably looking for an argument by not wearing a face covering.

If you don’t want to wear a face covering don’t go to the shops and get what you need online. Only downside to this is the high street shops will fail if too many people take this option. Not something we can worry about though.

Kaapstad
Kaapstad
24 July, 2020 20:24
Quote:
shipwrecked
Quote:
Dan Wiley
I suspect in theory it stops spread, in reality its a bit of a placebo. It won't really stop the spread but it makes people feel like they can control this virus and there's a lot of scared people out there.

Quote:
Kapstaad
Top post Dan. These a lot of hysteria around. If it reasures people great.

At no point have I mentioned "conspiracy".

I find your assertion that I want to "join" some brigade or other quite offensive.

This needles hostile stuff is why I normally leave it to others to comment on here.





Please keep your conspiracy theories to yourselves. if you want to join the 'They want to throw God's wonderful breathing system out' brigade please do it quietly.

It really is time the "Masks don't work" party started validating that opinion with a fact or two.

Out of interest how can you expect to get reasoned debate on a thread when you have one YES option in a poll followed by 6 other ways to say NO.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 24/07/2020 20:43 by Kaapstad.

ballsout
ballsout
24 July, 2020 20:33
Quote:
DanWiley
If you keep playing with the mask (as some have already said they do) or casually take off as you leave, you've negated any point in wearing it for your own benefit. You've just been in a place where the virus is reletively likely to get on your hands and you've just put you hand to your face.

Why have you 'just been a place where the virus is likely to get on your hands' ... when everyone who goes in there has been wearing a mask?

The mask isn't for your own benefit, droplets can still get into your eyes. It's to stop you from spreading it, through coughing, sneezing, speaking etc.

The ignorance of armchair critics is astounding.

B4thB4ck
B4thB4ck
24 July, 2020 20:54
Quote:
DanWiley
.... If you keep playing with the mask (as some have already said they do) or casually take off as you leave, you've negated any point in wearing it for your own benefit. You've just been in a place where the virus is reletively likely to get on your hands and you've just put you hand to your face.

There is a preferred way to remove the mask by the strings so you don't touch the mask itself or go near your mouth and nose. Then sanitise your hands once done. Not too difficult. There is also a preferred way to remove gloves by only touching the insides.

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
24 July, 2020 20:58
Quote:
Kaapstad
I find your assertion that I want to "join" some brigade or other quite offensive.
This needles hostile stuff is why I normally leave it to others to comment on here.

I agree with you actually but if you condone a comment like ..... " It won't really stop the spread but it makes people feel like they can control this virus and there's a lot of scared people out there."
then you have to back that up with a fact, link or reference because basically it doesn't make sense to most people.

Its you choice if you decline to wear a mask, personally I don't agree but you have to be prepared to defend your position if you make a statement that is against the flow.



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Beno Obano Age 25 years, Loosehead prop, 5ft 8ins 18st 12lbs 'Mauls are like Transformers' they change form to become more powerful!

Kaapstad
Kaapstad
24 July, 2020 21:21
Having foolishly commented from an unpopular viewpoint. It has moved toward silly arguments and an unwarranted assertion.

If I chose not to list/reference my view that's up to me. To do so would clearly lead to more "flack"! Think me ignorant or whatever you like. I also don't feel compelled to convince others they "must be wrong because...", misguided or in a brigade. Others have their view-great.


What looked to be a straw poll will certainly be my last venture onto the site.

All the best with the season Bath!

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
24 July, 2020 22:17
I'm genuinely sorry to hear that, all comments are valid whatever they are, from my point of view I feel obliged to challenge opinions if I consider them questionable.
There are posters on this board that are used to the 'to and fro' of debate, perhaps we should be more sensitive to infrequent board members who post occasionally. I take what I consider a logical view on this but if I caused offence I apologise.



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Beno Obano Age 25 years, Loosehead prop, 5ft 8ins 18st 12lbs 'Mauls are like Transformers' they change form to become more powerful!

K-Nut
Bod
25 July, 2020 01:35
I don't perceive any foolishness Kaapstad.
Don't ever allow the chatterati to shut down your expression of a POV
Other motivations are clearly evident from the positions taken and comments offered by the critics who decry your opinion.
The kneejerk, abusive rejection of your point of view is quite illuminating

(Sm3)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 25/07/2020 01:37 by Bod.

John Tee
John Tee
25 July, 2020 09:04
local story and endorsed by the police ...wearing a mask 'caused' 2 dogs to attack a walker .. hospital, stiches ect and the owner said they'd never done that before. Both on a long leash.

So, thats it, then..

rally
rally
25 July, 2020 09:11
I think BoJo should wear a mask designed to look like a letter box...or wear a nifty cowboy-bank-robber style face covering so that we won't know who he is when he pops into his local Tesco.

rally
rally
25 July, 2020 09:14
Quote:
John Tee
local story and endorsed by the police ...wearing a mask 'caused' 2 dogs to attack a walker .. hospital, stiches ect and the owner said they'd never done that before. Both on a long leash.
So, thats it, then..

One of my grandchildren cried and hid behind his mum when he saw his grandmother with a mask on.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 25/07/2020 09:16 by rally.

ilovebathtime
ilovebathtime
25 July, 2020 11:46
I think not wearing a mask in a shop when you have no medical reason not to is incredibly selfish.

The difference between a shop and a pub is that people who may love to go to the pub can choose not to because of the risks, it's not the same in shops, especially supermarkets where some people in a vulnerable category are not able to order online or rely on others, so have no choice but to go.

Wearing a mask is about protecting other people (even if only a marginal improvement) it is also about avoiding another lockdown.

The evidence has changed since March which is why the guidance changes, that is the thing about science, it is never proven. It's the same reason that people don't sail round the world worried that they might fall off the end of the world. Science and discovery means we know that isn't going to happen.

The government's response has been awful, the rules don't make sense, and the rules there are aren't even being followed by those that make them, but if you can wear a mask then wear one. I genuinely do not understand why you wouldn't

BerkeleyWood
The Bear
25 July, 2020 12:15
Quote:
ilovebathtime

The government's response has been awful, the rules don't make sense, and the rules there are aren't even being followed by those that make them, but if you can wear a mask then wear one. I genuinely do not understand why you wouldn't

I agree with the assessment about masks. The risk is to others and they have no way to protect themselves from you (realistically they can't demand compensation from you).

But we should be doing the right thing regardless of the rules. I dislike the tendency to expect the government to legislate for everything. Well established laws have loopholes and oddities. Throw them together at rapid speed and in a period where people will seek to challenge any legislation and we can't be relying on laws to tells us to do the right thing.

We have a responsibility to one another, regardless of what we think of the government.

John Tee
John Tee
25 July, 2020 13:29
Everyone seems to have adhered to the directive to wear a mask whilst in shops this morning, ime. All ages.
No drama ...

TomReagan
TomReagan
25 July, 2020 15:20
Quote:
The Bear
Quote:
ilovebathtime

The government's response has been awful, the rules don't make sense, and the rules there are aren't even being followed by those that make them, but if you can wear a mask then wear one. I genuinely do not understand why you wouldn't

I agree with the assessment about masks. The risk is to others and they have no way to protect themselves from you (realistically they can't demand compensation from you).

But we should be doing the right thing regardless of the rules. I dislike the tendency to expect the government to legislate for everything. Well established laws have loopholes and oddities. Throw them together at rapid speed and in a period where people will seek to challenge any legislation and we can't be relying on laws to tells us to do the right thing.

We have a responsibility to one another, regardless of what we think of the government.

Agree with both posts. I think the dithering and conflicting messages in the last few days have been particularly amateurish as it shouldn't have been too difficult to establish where masks should and shouldn't be worn, but fully accept the general argument that loopholes/inconsistencies/occasional lack of clarity can be forgiven to a degree.
A bit curious as to what the 'chatterati' means, (as used in a Bod post), both generally and in the context of this debate. Is it the view taken by the majority or a noisy, self-confident minority? Please enlighten me!

Mike the Taxi
Mike the Taxi
25 July, 2020 15:44
[newsthump.com] - I Wonder if The Donald has Misunderstood?

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
25 July, 2020 15:57
Tom, unfortunately Bod won't say "he thinks masks are a waste of time" so he implies that his imagined 'chatterati' are saying it for him.



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Beno Obano Age 25 years, Loosehead prop, 5ft 8ins 18st 12lbs 'Mauls are like Transformers' they change form to become more powerful!

TomReagan
TomReagan
25 July, 2020 16:15
Quote:
shipwrecked
Tom, unfortunately Bod won't say "he thinks masks are a waste of time" so he implies that his imagined 'chatterati' are saying it for him.
Not sure SW- I inferred that the term wasn't being used as a compliment! I'm thinking that advocates of wearing masks are, in this instance, seen as the chatterati. I looked the word up and at least learnt that it was first used by Auberon Waugh, and he used it as a derogatory term!

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
25 July, 2020 16:24
I see, oh well lets hope we get a working vaccine soon so we can read these threads historically!



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Beno Obano Age 25 years, Loosehead prop, 5ft 8ins 18st 12lbs 'Mauls are like Transformers' they change form to become more powerful!

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
25 July, 2020 16:38
No explanation needed really!

https://i.ibb.co/HxSdjxk/main-qimg-96df11294421e4f97acba66ce719d306.jpg



https://i.ibb.co/gjWyP09/Unknown-1-2.jpg


Beno Obano Age 25 years, Loosehead prop, 5ft 8ins 18st 12lbs 'Mauls are like Transformers' they change form to become more powerful!

Bath Supporter Jack
Bath Supporter Jack
25 July, 2020 17:05
Been in to Bath today to check out the barbers............and wait for it the GYM!!

Straight into the barbers, next to Waitrose no appointments, no waiting...............excellent. I have never booked an appointment at a barber and I was not starting now.

Into Health Food shop on Walcot, called into the store, asked to pass all my items over the bar code reader myself and tapped the credit card....................wearing a mask obviously.

Into the Gymn no one there at all! Chatted to the guy on the desk he had had 7 people all day up until about 3.30. Said that a lot of people had cancelled their membership! They stopped taking my money and apparently will start next month. So gym looks very OK with no bookings.

Wandered back to Laura Place via the Green Tree to check out how they are operating. No food for the time being but up and operating, which is good.

Mask observation..........................a week ago I would say it was 1 in 50 wearing a mask, now I would say it is 1 in 10.

DorsetBoy
Dorset Boy
25 July, 2020 17:06
Quote:
shipwrecked
No explanation needed really!
https://i.ibb.co/HxSdjxk/main-qimg-96df11294421e4f97acba66ce719d306.jpg

Except the reality isn't actually like that is it.
The mask wearer is still emitting, but just not so far.

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
25 July, 2020 17:08
Which is what it shows.



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Beno Obano Age 25 years, Loosehead prop, 5ft 8ins 18st 12lbs 'Mauls are like Transformers' they change form to become more powerful!

DorsetBoy
Dorset Boy
25 July, 2020 17:11
I'd say it's very exaggerated. The projection from the mask wearers is more than about 2 inches, and as the mask gets wet it becomes further and further.

Bath Supporter Jack
Bath Supporter Jack
25 July, 2020 17:24
Is that just breathing SW.....................if that what it purports to be then I am afraid I just don't believe it.

If it is sneezing then you just have two very badly behaved young ladies!

Mike the Taxi
Mike the Taxi
25 July, 2020 18:04
Either that, or they are both enjoying a Hamlet cigar (other cigars are available)!

Beergoggles
Beergoggles
25 July, 2020 19:17
Our miserable excuse for a government have decreed that from a completely arbitrary date we should wear masks in shops etc and so we will. What they haven’t explained is the criteria that decreed that masks should be worn from this date and the corresponding criteria that explains when they no longer need to be worn. Airborne diseases have always been around ... and will always be around. Do we therefore take it that we have to wear these hideous masks for ever ... or maybe only until there is nil risk of catching an airborne disease.

MESSAGES->author
OutsideBath
25 July, 2020 19:38
Think Boris said masks will be mandatory until end 2021, not sure I believe him though as his record on the truth isn’t great. Some scientists indicating covid19 will never go away, so not unreasonable to expect masks to be a permanent fixture along with regional lockdowns.

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
25 July, 2020 19:39
Coronavirus is not proven to be an airborne disease, that is the whole point! Its predominantly spread by the virus existing in tiny water droplets. The start date is irrelevant, it obvious when the measure will be lifted.
If it were predominantly airborne we would be in huge trouble.

Incidentally Spain may be at the start of a second wave, this is not a political game where you score points by getting dates right. You just do what you can to keep the spread low.



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Beno Obano Age 25 years, Loosehead prop, 5ft 8ins 18st 12lbs 'Mauls are like Transformers' they change form to become more powerful!

Bath Supporter Jack
Bath Supporter Jack
25 July, 2020 20:09
On the statistics there is currently very little difference between deaths from flu and deaths from Covid.

Does that mean flu is irrelevant?

DorsetBoy
Dorset Boy
25 July, 2020 20:32
So returnees from anywhere in Spain (or its islands) have to self isolate for 14 days from midnight, BUT the FCO are only saying travel to mainland Spain is not advised.
Therefore if you have a trip coming up to the Balearics or Canaries you won't be covered by your travel insurance if you cancel.
Why not just make it mainland Spain for self isolation?

B4thB4ck
B4thB4ck
25 July, 2020 21:05
I think it is worth remembering how countries such as France, Italy and Spain traditionally go into a sort of business shutdown and de camp to the beach for August. The city centre hot spots mean there is increased risk of the med islands accommodating the urban holiday makers and spreading the virus. Nothing new here but the timing of the new increases is very unfortunate.

John Tee
John Tee
26 July, 2020 09:47
I think we in the middle of a live testing period... because nobody really has a definitive take on this and we cant lockdown forever..
So we will either get a sort of tolerance or we will find out catching it is no big deal for 90% etc.. I just dont think we can get blase about one or the other so we are buying time.

People seem to have a casual or quite fearful attitude but by and large, my observations have been that most are still on message..
as per my comment in shops and masks yesterday.
What certain sections do away from these communial directives might differ, but where everyone mixes, as in all ages, shopping, i think they are complying around here.

At this point, i heard a guy at work had a very bad version, one death, 3 postive tests..and a few stories of people saying they've had it but not corrobarated....since March.

TG Kesmo
TG Kesmo
26 July, 2020 12:21
Right my twopence worth
I will wear a mask if the situation demands it and before you start firing I live in Wales and aside from public transport I am allowed to use my own assessment.
My major problem with masks are that people use them as justification for not taking other more effective risk mitigation.
I spent many years assessing medical risks and believe me PPE should be the last option, distancing is so much more effective, it is still 2 m in Wales and long may it stay that way. There were no COVID deaths in Wales last week.. I am concerned that shops like Tesco’s are using masks to decrease social distancing measures and increase shop numbers in England same is happening here in Wales. Some people seem to think this is all over they couldn’t be more wrong.

TG Kesmo
TG Kesmo
26 July, 2020 12:32
Comment on “ vapour photo” above not that I want to dissuade any one from wearing a mask should the situation prevail. BUT non medical masks without filters will all transmit water vapour. The photo is not credible because this will happen with or without the mask. You are trying to trap major droplets so stand 2m away not about 1 as in the photo and these droplets will not reach you. So distancing always better than non filtering mask. If you can’t keep 2 m away then limit to a minimum the time spent less than 2m. If all else fails hope everyone else is wearing a non saturated mask and wear one yourself.

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
26 July, 2020 12:52
Quote:
TG Kesmo
Right my twopence worth
I will wear a mask if the situation demands it and before you start firing I live in Wales and aside from public transport I am allowed to use my own assessment.
My major problem with masks are that people use them as justification for not taking other more effective risk mitigation.
I spent many years assessing medical risks and believe me PPE should be the last option, distancing is so much more effective, it is still 2 m in Wales and long may it stay that way. There were no COVID deaths in Wales last week.. I am concerned that shops like Tesco’s are using masks to decrease social distancing measures and increase shop numbers in England same is happening here in Wales. Some people seem to think this is all over they couldn’t be more wrong.

TGK, as a Cardiff resident from a medical point of view its illogical to argue against that. Particularly the final sentence. Problem is though both Wales and Scotland have the luxury of not funding the furlough. I strongly suspect that business in Wales has taken a greater hit by extending lockdown.

Mark Drakeford is incredibly timid and the Public Transport guidelines are odd, why can't you use a phone on the bus if masking is mandatory? Running for the bus not permitted. Having said all that most in Wales have simply got on with lockdown. Except of course in the 'meat packing towns' of Wrexham and Merthyr but then that industry seems to have their own brand of madness all over the world.



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Beno Obano Age 25 years, Loosehead prop, 5ft 8ins 18st 12lbs 'Mauls are like Transformers' they change form to become more powerful!

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
26 July, 2020 13:11
Quote:
TG Kesmo
Comment on “ vapour photo” above not that I want to dissuade any one from wearing a mask should the situation prevail. BUT non medical masks without filters will all transmit water vapour. The photo is not credible because this will happen with or without the mask. You are trying to trap major droplets so stand 2m away not about 1 as in the photo and these droplets will not reach you. So distancing always better than non filtering mask. If you can’t keep 2 m away then limit to a minimum the time spent less than 2m. If all else fails hope everyone else is wearing a non saturated mask and wear one yourself.

Agree 2m is best but please advise us of how many viral particles are in water vapour as opposed to water droplets. The two are not the same!

Woodpecker has provided the only substantiated comments on mask wearing in this thread in his post above. Everything else is just opinion.

If masks are so ineffective why do the medical fraternity insist on wearing them? Why was there such an outcry when they were not available for our doctors, nurses and care staff?
I suspect if we had a plentiful supply they would have been required earlier. Lets keep it simple, unless there are reasons for not masking up, please just do it?



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Beno Obano Age 25 years, Loosehead prop, 5ft 8ins 18st 12lbs 'Mauls are like Transformers' they change form to become more powerful!

warrenball
warrenball
26 July, 2020 13:53
I agree with the last comment, it is not a difficult thing to wear a mask, just do it.

At the same time I have sympathy for the concern that putting a mask or gloves on on can give a sense of false security as most of us don't know how to use PPE correctly and staying apart where possible is preferable (note: most policemen I see walking together in pairs).

Not just in the current virus but in everyday life I am as guilty as the next man of not always using protective equipment when handling weedkillers or solvents, even though I am aware of the possible repercussions. I think this is an age thing, those of us who have reached old age after growing up in households full of asbestos, proper solvent based paints, resins and adhesives can be guilty of not worrying too much about some of these risks.

DanWiley
DanWiley
26 July, 2020 13:55
It's a pretty odd way that we are currently being required to to be honest. In shops, unless it's a shop where wearing one is a bit inconvenient (a pub). The staff don't have to wear one, which is odd as, spending time each day in such an environment means your pretty likely to have it compared to the shoppers who spend 90% of their time in their bubble and only come to that environment maybe one a week for an hour. Boris wears one, but he's had it so it's doing little good. For some reason I don't need to wear one at work, probably because wearing one 8 hours a day 5 data a week would get old very quickly.

As I say, it feels like a simple task that the government can give everyone to help them overcome their fear, whilst allowing businesses get back to normal. They demonstrably didn't help during Spanish flu, they may have made things worse, they probably aren't helping in a clinical sense now.

TG Kesmo
TG Kesmo
26 July, 2020 14:33
Quote:
shipwrecked
Quote:
TG Kesmo
Comment on “ vapour photo” above not that I want to dissuade any one from wearing a mask should the situation prevail. BUT non medical masks without filters will all transmit water vapour. The photo is not credible because this will happen with or without the mask. You are trying to trap major droplets so stand 2m away not about 1 as in the photo and these droplets will not reach you. So distancing always better than non filtering mask. If you can’t keep 2 m away then limit to a minimum the time spent less than 2m. If all else fails hope everyone else is wearing a non saturated mask and wear one yourself.

Agree 2m is best but please advise us of how many viral particles are in water vapour as opposed to water droplets. The two are not the same!

Woodpecker has provided the only substantiated comments on mask wearing in this thread in his post above. Everything else is just opinion.

If masks are so ineffective why do the medical fraternity insist on wearing them? Why was there such an outcry when they were not available for our doctors, nurses and care staff?
I suspect if we had a plentiful supply they would have been required earlier. Lets keep it simple, unless there are reasons for not masking up, please just do it?

Ok medical grade masks are better than the cheap disposable ones they were required by med staff because they were handling known symptomatic cases who are liable to shed a high viral load..
Risk assessment 101 says
First eliminate risk - medics can’t do that as they need to provide treatment
Second reduce Risk- limit time spent with patients not possible for sickest patients need to be close to provide treatment
Third tier and las t resort mitigate risk - this is where the PPE comes in

That tier of risk reduction works for everyone
Eliminate don’t get near enough to anyone to catch it or isolate
Reduce limit time in indoor spaces with other people e.g. shops to a minimum
Mitigate where a mask if you have to breach reduction limits or distancing

MESSAGES->author
shipwrecked
26 July, 2020 14:42
Which was your original comment, I agree 2m distance works best, there is a tier of effectiveness medical grade masks, 3 ply masks, face coverings.

They are not a replacement for distance but an extra layer of protection. Its just you made a good point then eroded it in the original post. Basically we agree.



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Beno Obano Age 25 years, Loosehead prop, 5ft 8ins 18st 12lbs 'Mauls are like Transformers' they change form to become more powerful!

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