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Soccer to Sixways
Discussion started by ROLLO , 29 July, 2020 15:16
Soccer to Sixways
ROLLO 29 July, 2020 15:16
Worcester Raiders, maybe someone more techy can do a link .

Re: Soccer to Sixways
ROLLO 29 July, 2020 15:18
Lost link on offy, was on Facebook.

Re: Soccer to Sixways
Faithful_City 29 July, 2020 15:32
The Linky Thing

Very interesting.

Make more use of the facilities and yet another income stream.

JP

Re: Soccer to Sixways
Faithful_City 29 July, 2020 15:39
I will give it a go certainly.

Next up - hockey??

JP

Re: Soccer to Sixways
WorcesterSauce 29 July, 2020 15:46
An absolutely horrific club. Anyone that follows or indeed has played non league football in Worcester will know what iím talking about. Otherwise, google will help.

Re: Soccer to Sixways
Mikey40 29 July, 2020 15:55
You are right WorcesterSauce, think the owners have misread the feeling in the local football community here. There is only one main football club in Worcester, who have finally made it home back to Claines Lane. despite the lack of help at every turn by the city council. For whatever reason the talks between Worcester City and the owners fell through, probably wanting to keep it a suuporter/community owned club a sticking point for the owners? All the best to the Raiders for the move, but I just can't see them growing to become the main club in the city even playing in a state of the art stadium. Least the City now have the Claines ground all to themselves now, a shame though as I was one of many city supporters who thought the tie up between the rugby club and the football club should be the way forward, it seems it still is... just with the wrong team in my opinion.

Re: Soccer to Sixways
Godolphin 29 July, 2020 17:33
Jason and Colin wanted to own a football club lock stock and barrel, and who easier to buy than Worcester Raiders? They've bought a place in the West Midlands Regional League so have fast tracked a few leagues already. Effectively that's the end of the line for Worcester Raiders, as the club will now probably become Worcester Warriors FC, which is what the owners always wanted.

Re: Soccer to Sixways
TrueWarrior 29 July, 2020 18:33
I have a friend who plays for a team in Raiders league and been to watch him play a few times, they are a horrible outfit. Swearing and intimidating at officials and just generally acting in a disgraceful way. Do not really want us associated with them in any way.

Re: Soccer to Sixways
LiveInHope 29 July, 2020 19:02
I really hope it works for both Warriors & Raiders. Have never been a football man, but we have a huge stadium only used for a few days every month. No one is making money out of professional rugby & up till now Worcester have been losing money. In my book anything that adds money or dilutes our overheads is a good thing.
As for Raiders being a horrible outfit....for me that sounds like most football players, but I am not & never had been a football man, but one of the many things that put me off football is the swearing & play acting that annoys me.
Was worried & orignally not a fan of our new owners, but I have been hugely impressed by them. Yes they are not rugby men, but in the past rugby men have cocked things up. So maybe non-rugby men is the right way forward. They are trying to turn a failing business into a successful business, by adding a football team to project is a good thing & really wish them all the best.

Re: Soccer to Sixways
ROLLO 29 July, 2020 19:46
Apart form never being a football man LiH +1

Re: Soccer to Sixways
Abmatt 29 July, 2020 19:47
LiH Iím not even sure if they are football men.

I am forming the impression that they are business men whoís business happens to be sport, which is what professional sport is now, business.

Re: Soccer to Sixways
LiveInHope 29 July, 2020 20:28
In my view it was always a business as soon as it went professional.
Some say that is wrong, but i became a fan of the professional game, when i discover Scotlands Gary Armstrong (at the time in my book the worlds best 9) was working as an agricultural driver earning £90/week. He was bruised & battered most weeks with maybe an additional £50 under the table as boot money, but it wasnít enough to feed a family well. Just out of Uni with no family I was on considerably more....thus just wrong.
We need business men to ensure the club is run well & viable. Believe good business should lead to good consistent rugby over the medium to long term. The rugby men went for quick wins then bust, just look at Mosely, Wasps & hate to say it old Worcester.
If the new owners are football men - good, if business men - good.

Re: Soccer to Sixways
WorcesterSauce 29 July, 2020 21:50
Just to be clear, there is absolutely no money to be made By owning Worcester Raiders. The only time they may become profitable would be if they got into the very higher leagues. Iím not saying they will be a huge strain on our resources, but they wonít make money. The owners have said that they will grow them organically and not throw money at them so they may never ever advance beyond their current level, weíll see. And for clarity their current level is just a little higher than good pub football!

Re: Soccer to Sixways
Old Col 29 July, 2020 23:03
Are they professionals ? semi -professionals--do they attract any suporters ? Can worcester really support two soccer teams ?

Re: Soccer to Sixways
WorcesterSauce 29 July, 2020 23:31
I understand a few of their team are paid a bit of money but we certainly are not talking about a professional or even semi professional outfit. They money they get is extremely minimal too, on a pay as you play basis.

They get next to no fans. I donít know what their official attendances are but iíd hazard a guess at 100-150 or so.

Worcester can support two football teams at the level they are both currently at, not a problem.

Re: Soccer to Sixways
Old Col 30 July, 2020 09:47
THankyou W.S.

Re: Soccer to Sixways
shrewsburyman 30 July, 2020 10:55
I think that the most encouraging aspect of this is that it shows that the owners are taking a long term view of their business. Do we know how many leagues separate the Raiders from the the City? As far as the Raiders are concerned it seems quite smart as they would probably have become in time the City reserves. It seems to me that City have possibly made the same mistake that they made when they turned Cecil down. Time will tell. Perhaps 3 or 4 of the Morecambe youth team or reserves needing a game could play for the Raiders if the rules allow it.

Re: Soccer to Sixways
ROLLO 30 July, 2020 11:02
If you wrote down a list of the mistakes that Worcester FC have made over the years it would be a pretty long one. There is some more detail on the VF22 site

Re: Soccer to Sixways
WorcesterSauce 30 July, 2020 11:17
Time will tell if this turns out to be another one of those mistakes or not, but iíd suggest that history and ownership shows that by choosing to remain fan owned, Worcester City have taken the completely understandable option.

What happens to Raiders when the owners sell up, for instance? If we get new owners that donít want Raiders about (it is very unlikely that they will be a money maker after all) they suddenly become homeless.

I wouldnít be knocking Worcester Cityís decision just yet. Letís see what the landscape looks like in 5 and 10 years time.

Re: Soccer to Sixways
TrueWarrior 30 July, 2020 13:12
They are certainly better than a pub side. Some decent players at that level and certainly if they were to go up a few steps on the ladder, some very decent players.

Re: Soccer to Sixways
shrewsburyman 30 July, 2020 14:01
It looks to me that the Raiders play in the same division as Bewdley and Pershore which is above pub team level!

Re: Soccer to Sixways
kiddykid 30 July, 2020 20:49
I have no problem with that this. Extra revenue into Warriors is always helpful , although I Doubt if it will make us rich.
However, what II do not want to see are their games used as Ďwarm-upísí for rugby on a Saturday or a Friday evening or Sunday. Or to put it another way...........I donít want to mix football supporters with rugby supporters. Let them play when we are away - and our ladies team should always take precedence as well.

Re: Soccer to Sixways
Eastrrr Bunny 30 July, 2020 21:22
You only have to do a search to find the issues this lot have been involved in. Risky move by the club but hey itís their cash, they just might not keep getting mine if football encroaches.

Re: Soccer to Sixways
Faithful_City 04 August, 2020 07:18
Colin and Jason want a ďLeague Football ClubĒ at Sixways under their ownership.

Quote:

Although rugby fixtures will take precedence, everyone involved in the venture believes the arrival of the Step 6 Raiders will significantly increase the use of facilities at Sixways and the number of spectators visiting the 12,000 seater stadium.

The artificial grass pitch at the Championship standard ground has been certified by the Football Association as good to go and new Raiders chairman Steve Harris shares the ultimate ambition of the Warriorsí co-owners to build a Football League club in Worcester.


This will take several years, which means C&J are here for sometime to come with many more changes at Sixways to build a sustainable business.

Full Article HERE

Worcester City is going to be left behind playing non-league football at Claines

JP

Re: Soccer to Sixways
WorcesterSauce 04 August, 2020 09:04
There is no money to be made in football until you are right at the top level and at that point you need to invest 10s of millions a season to get a return. IF they want to become a football league club it will take millions of investment, which will be taken away from the rugby club. It would be a bad move for rugby.

Re: Soccer to Sixways
ROLLO 04 August, 2020 10:02
It all depends upon what the marginal costs are for putting the games on. The facilites are already there so it could be quite possible that gate money could make a positive contribution to fixed costs.

Re: Soccer to Sixways
shrewsburyman 04 August, 2020 10:42
In the short term it depends on income from the games offsetting the costs of opening the stadium up for those football occasions. As Rollo says they have the advantage of not paying for the ground so we are dealing with marginal costs. Longer term I suspect it will depend as it always does with sport on how successful the team is. If they start winning and move up a league or two they could generate some momentum. Time will tell.

Re: Soccer to Sixways
WorcesterSauce 04 August, 2020 10:51
Of course, if they get big crowds it will undoubtably help but history and precedent would suggest that to get to the football league on a sustainable footing, crowds would need to be well into their thousands.

Initially, after the initial spike has calmed down, they will be getting about 300 (if lucky - that would probably be double or triple their current attendances). Straight away they will be on the back foot as it will cost more to open the stadium up and run it for such small attendances.

As a bit of an example, Salford City, who are extremely well funded by various sources including the Class of 92 from Man Utd, bought a player whilst in the National League (the division below the football league) for £300,000 and paid him £4k per week. Their deficit in the season they were promoted to the football league was £2.5m. This was on crowds of around 2,500 and they only just made it up. They have also had unprecedented media attention and other initiatives such as playing against a Class of 92 team, grants from the FA and having a BBC documentary named after them. Last summer in League 2 they had a net spend of -£3.5m on transfer activity.

That is all for a new team (incidentally Coming from virtually the same level as Worcester Raiders) that have had every single odd in their favour.

Now of course you donít absolutely need that level of spending (as Harrogate And Barrow have this season shown), but it will still take a lot of money, especially as they will be losing money for the first few seasons at least.

If the owners want a football league club they will be pouring in millions more than they will be taking out unless there is an unprecedented rise in terms of attendances, sponsorship etc off the pitch. I think that in reality, they may well rise to the Conference North and find that as their natural level.

Re: Soccer to Sixways
Fiver 04 August, 2020 11:38
I think I'll reserve judgement for a while. I keep reminding myself of all of the comments when Warriors were sold a few years ago. Apparently the end was nigh.

However, Jason and Colin have turned the club around in a way I don't think any of us expected. The players are treated far better, even ex-players are looked after. The general mood at the club seems far better than we've probably ever known it (rose tinted specs for some no doubt).

As to whether or not City have missed an opportunity? It all depends on what they want. No crystal balls so no way of knowing if the decision is a good one or not.

As to the behaviour of Raiders on the pitch, I wouldn't be surprised if C&J straighten that out as it probably wouldn't be good PR if it takes place on the Sixways pitch.

Re: Soccer to Sixways
ROLLO 04 August, 2020 15:06
I would suggest that there is a potentially large pool of support for soccer in and around Worcester. Many Warriors supporters would have supported had CD invested in Worcetsr City rather than what was at the time an amatuer rugby club. It is quite possible to follow both games as Bristol Bears/City are finding.
My belief is that there is a separate audience out there who will support soccer and other sports that can help to make Sixways, and therefore Warriors viable. Providing that it does not interfer with rugby then no problem to me. Above all lets not be snooty about other sports or supporters/fans.

Re: Soccer to Sixways
LiveInHope 04 August, 2020 15:30
Agree with Rollo, especially the overlap of potential supporters between both sports.
If professional rugby in northern hemisphere adjusts to that of southern, there will be less of an overlap between rugby & football, meaning football supporters bored on a Saturday may turn up to watch Warriors & rugby for Raiders.
In Bristol both rugby & football have benefited. Believe season tickets of either get discounted entry (believe but not 100%) for other & last time they played at Sixways they brought alone a few football supporters.
Finally, wouldnít assume City tie up is 100% off the cards. If I was a City supporter/backer I would be worried & asking why not us.
As above very impressed with Jason & Colin. Have faith in them as much as you can in someone I have never met, never spoken to & donít know at all. But they have my vote currently.

Re: Soccer to Sixways
WorcesterSauce 04 August, 2020 16:09
Completely agree there is a potentially very, very large football supporter base in and around Worcester should they ever make the football league. Also agree that we need to not be snooty towards football or itís fans. Unfortunately rugby supporters have a pretty bad habit of claiming the moral high ground over football and rubbing it in football fans faces. This will do us no favours going forward.

Saying all that, I still donít see how Raiders will make the football league without millions of pounds worth of investment and therefore will detract from the rugby club. There first hurdle, which wonít be an easy one, will be tryinf to overtake Worcester City, who still have the edge on them in every way bar the stadium, but at non league level i donít think fans are necessarily that bothered about watching games in good stadiums.

Re: Soccer to Sixways
Trent_Blue 04 August, 2020 18:37
I guess they also have the option of offering it as free entry for warriors fans, imagine they would make more money from the bars, food...etc. Quite big scope to make money when you consider the team are amateurs and paid next to nothIng.


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