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England, Fans & The Game of Rugby Union- Conned by Conor


By England Fan
February 27 2017

Now that the dust has settled we can reflect a bit more calmly on this match.   England ran out winners but the game of rugby was let down very badly in more ways than one.


RBS Six Nations 2017

England  36 v 15 Italy 

 

As Eddie Jones said after the match "that was not a game of rugby"! 

Ok, it was perfectly legal to not challenge but for players to be the other side of the line flaying the arms  up and down made the whole thing a farce.   

It is obvious that Conor O'shea has kept this tactic for England Only!  Why not deploy this tactic against the Welsh or Irish?  You can't tell me he just had this eureka moment prior to the England match.

It would appear he was upset at the referring of their first match against Wales and then of course Ireland shipped a boat load of points passed them in the next match. 

One wonders if his job was on the line against England.  They refused to form rucks after tackles, meaning no offside line was formed.  That allowed Italian players to stand anywhere on the pitch, with the exception of one metre around the tackle area.

Former RWC2003 winner Mat Dawson said (and I agree with him whole heartedly) "Well done Italy on ruining this international. Now World Rugby have to change the laws because of your inability to compete at this level.

Italy head coach Conor O'Shea appears dejected after the RBS 6 Nations match at Twickenham Stadium, 

"Hopefully we've earned a bit of respect here today." Italy coach Conor O'Shea

Errr   NO Conor .............Because and let's be honest here Italy are just not up to standard, they have actually slipped back the last few years, since they joined the 6Nations.

 

I am not bitter............... I would have been, if England had lost this game.  One thing that did irk me and I will remember forever, is the the fact that Conor actually agreed in his interview afterwards at having a laugh England.  Very professional.  

As to these punters like the Brian Moore(s) of this world and the ITV crowd going on about England not being able to think and checking the laws etc.,   Some of these punters have been International players themselves and should know that there is a game plan and generally the team is instructed to stick with it.   

England were expecting a game of rugby not a game of rugby league.............. and they certainly expected the opposition to engage in the game as professional sportsman, not sit on the fence and and swing their arms around like 'pat-a-cake'. 

From a England fan's point of view and the Neutral fan they were short changed yesterday as tickets for matches at Twickenham are not cheap.   

The only fans gloating about this tactic are the usual ones, those who want to see England beaten at all costs.............and all cost to the game of rugby.

First Try was dan Cole but no pic., of this one.

England's Danny Care scores his side's second try

England's Elliot Daly scores his side's third try - All Pictures PA/Images

England's Jack Nowell celebrates scoring his side's fourth try

 

 England's Ben Te'o scores his side's fifth try

 

England's Jack Nowell scores his side's sixth try

 

England: Brown, May, Te'o, Farrell, Daly, Ford, Care, Marler, Hartley, Cole, Launchbury, Lawes, Itoje, Haskell, Hughes. Replacements: Nowell for May (56), Slade for Te'o (76), Youngs for Care (52), M. Vunipola for Marler (56), George for Hartley (56), Sinckler for Cole (72).

Not Used: Wood, Clifford.

Italy: Padovani, Bisegni, Campagnaro, McLean, Venditti, Allan, Gori, Lovotti, Gega, Cittadini, Fuser, van Schalkwyk, Steyn, Favaro, Parisse. Replacements: Benvenuti for Bisegni (52), Canna for Allan (62), Bronzini for Gori (36), D'Apice for Gega (65), Ceccarelli for Cittadini (52), Biagi for Fuser (75), Mbanda for Favaro (58).

Not Used: Rizzo.

Referee: Romain Poite (France).

 

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England, Fans & The Game of Rugby Union- Conned by Conor
Unofficial England Rugby Union (IP Logged)
27/02/2017 17:50
What do you think? You can have your say by posting below.
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Re: England, Fans & The Game of Rugby Union- Conned by Conor
P G Tips (IP Logged)
27/02/2017 19:50
Good luck to Italy- they challenged England legally and caused some problems. Really quite entertaining - even for this England fan!

It does though highlight a couple of farcical points;

1. World Rugby often create more problems than they solve when they tinker with the laws.

2. The ruck is already confused enough. Viz: ""a ruck requires one or more players from each team to be on their feet in a contest over the ball."

a. "on their feet"? How many AP or 6 Nation rucks meet this criterion? Tonight's BBC news item showed a clip to illustrate a ruck- from Saturday's Scotland -wales match -all the players went off their feet! You could not make it up!

b. "over the ball". Why then are teams allowed to get away with clearouts 5, 10, occasionally even 15 metres beyond the ball? Or several metres to the side of the ruck?

In practice the refereeing of the ruck has not met with the definition for years.

I hope the RFU & World Rugby start to insist on policing it properly.

PG

 
Re: England, Fans & The Game of Rugby Union- Conned by Conor
rikholmes (IP Logged)
27/02/2017 20:35
YOU say you are not bitter - you are clearly bitter. Italy did nothing illegal, and 15 professional rugby players couldn't work out what to do about it. Where was the captain? Where was the plan? Italy made England look like utter fools, and that is why Eddie Jones gave the most appalling press conference I've ever seen - he sounded like a rambling drunk man in the pub.
"that wasn't rugby" - well,it was played with a rugby ball, to the laws of World rugby...so it was Rugby, just not the rugby you were expecting
Well played Italy
(if you want to retain any credibility, try not to quote Dawson as a legitimate source!)

 
Re: England, Fans & The Game of Rugby Union- Conned by Conor
ballsout (IP Logged)
28/02/2017 01:43
I never want to watch another match like that again. Awful.

Once England started dealing with it, towards the end of the first half, they tore Italy apart. Very satisfying.

 
Re: England, Fans & The Game of Rugby Union- Conned by Conor
DrV'sHairyCraic (IP Logged)
28/02/2017 13:39
Quote:
rikholmes
YOU say you are not bitter - you are clearly bitter. Italy did nothing illegal, and 15 professional rugby players couldn't work out what to do about it. Where was the captain? Where was the plan? Italy made England look like utter fools, and that is why Eddie Jones gave the most appalling press conference I've ever seen - he sounded like a rambling drunk man in the pub.
"that wasn't rugby" - well,it was played with a rugby ball, to the laws of World rugby...so it was Rugby, just not the rugby you were expecting
Well played Italy
(if you want to retain any credibility, try not to quote Dawson as a legitimate source!)

I'm an out and out England fan & I totally agree. Jones' moan was to deflect the fact that he couldn't work out how to counter it for over 30 mins. Then Haskell finally worked it out. Do what you need to do to create a ruck.

Jones was talking ever since the Wales game about smashing Italy in the Ruck. And yet people seem to think it's Italy's fault for ensuring that there were fewer rucks.

Jones' comments came back and bit him on the ar5e!

 
Re: England, Fans & The Game of Rugby Union- Conned by Conor
DrV'sHairyCraic (IP Logged)
28/02/2017 13:44
I was at the game with friends and having paid 70ea for tickets, we were all glad to see that Italy were still it for long periods.

We all want to see a contest for the ball as that is what rugby ultimately is but many sides now do not commit players to unwinnable rucks. Why should Italy especially when they know England want them to?

 
Re: England, Fans & The Game of Rugby Union- Conned by Conor
alforth (IP Logged)
28/02/2017 15:11
I agree. The essence of rugby football is a fair contest for the ball. This contest is based on strength, skill, and yes tactics and guile also have a place, however, what went on last Sunday was the ugliest thing I have ever seen on a rugby field. It reminded me of the time years ago when scrum-halves behind the ruck would fake a pass without the ball to draw the opposition offside, this was, at that time, not against the laws but it was clearly not in the spirit of the game. I think the lawmakers should have a look Saturday's antics in the same light.

It is certainly the case that many people, rugby players or otherwise, will applaud anything which discomfits England, it is also the case that England should have reacted more quickly and with less complaining to counter the tactics, as they did in the second half. England were certainly taken by surprise and apparently lacked a knowledge of the laws nevertheless the sight of a great player like Parisse ignoring the ball and standing alongside the scrum half waving his arms was little short of sickening.

If Connor O'Shea thinks that Italy earned respect by only loosing by a margin of 6 tries to 2, I can only say I respectfully disagree with him.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2017:02:28:15:14:55 by alforth.

 
Re: England, Fans & The Game of Rugby Union- Conned by Conor
rikholmes (IP Logged)
28/02/2017 15:57
and I respectfully disagree with you. If you offload out of a tackle, that avoids a ruck. If you only commit two men to a breakdown, that pays only lip service to a ruck, if you feed a scrum, that means it isn't a scrum, if you don't compete at a lineout, if you don't defend a maul... Rugby has laws, but no set way of playing.

It was embarrassing to see a rudderless England, no guidance whatsoever from the captain, and it is embarrassing to see so many England fans whinging.

Oh, and its "losing", not "loosing"

 
Re: England, Fans & The Game of Rugby Union- Conned by Conor
alforth (IP Logged)
28/02/2017 18:53
I'm not quite sure what you are disagreeing with. There are clearly different ways of playing including those that you mention. The tactic that Italy used was legal and they were perfectly entitled, under existing laws, to play in the way that they did. What I complained about (whinged about, if you must have it) in my post is the fact that the laws permit this. I believe I would have found it equally ugly whichever teams were playing.

I doubt if the IRB will be too concerned about my opinion; if there is to be any modification of the Law it will come from wiser heads than mine, of which I am sure you are one. I agree entirely with your comment about England, this only added to my perception of the ugliness of the situation. I must stress that it is only my perception, others will disagree.

Thank you for correcting my spelling. Oh, by the way, you missed the apostrophe in "it's" (contracted form of it is).

 
Re: England, Fans & The Game of Rugby Union- Conned by Conor
Mark W-J (IP Logged)
28/02/2017 20:59
You say "It is obvious that Conor O'shea has kept this tactic for England Only! Why not deploy this tactic against the Welsh or Irish? You can't tell me he just had this eureka moment prior to the England match."

Maybe this article on the BBC can help you there: [www.bbc.co.uk]

Quote:
Conor O'Shea
There was an offside in our game against Ireland that was clarified as being onside. Brendan came to me and said: 'Please listen and don't think I'm mad.' We talked as a group of coaches and said: 'OK, will we go for this?'

 
Re: England, Fans & The Game of Rugby Union- Conned by Conor
Steve Sydney (IP Logged)
28/02/2017 22:57
I doubt we'll see it again as the counter would now be with every team ..... if you face this no contest ruck situation... just pick up the ball and straight forward.

Then tackles then rucks will have to stop this forward progress

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