Bath

Quote:

Pulteney
From Saints site:
Bath Imploded. - they have serious mental issues in closing out a game. Can’t believe we won that.
Looked like they’re just not fit.
Gaps everywhere because they could barely breathe let alone line up

Pretty damning..

Or alternatively gaps everywhere because we only had 13 players on the pitch at the end.

Totally agree with the mental issue comment, we should have put at least 40pts on them.

Well, we might scrape fourth place and we might not but in a one-off game against the Tiggers, Saints will always have a chance. Leicester have been very effective this campaign as you would expect with Borthwick at the helm but they are rather one dimensional and very reliant on their kicking game. Saints will always score tries but concede far too many for our liking.

Always a pleasure to see The Rec in Spring sunshine - a rare victory for us in Bath.

Thought it was quite telling the difference in approach during the break in play whilst Nansen was injured. Ludlam got everyone round him and looked to read riot act to them whereas a number of Bath players looked to have switched off laughing and joking thinking it was job done
Nice to visit Bath on a sunny Spring day rather than a dank wet Friday night in February

Quote:

OutsideBath
Or alternatively gaps everywhere because we only had 13 players on the pitch at the end..

This! And any time soon there will be some of those over-elaborated coaching analysis videos on Insta/Twitter using one of the Saints tries as a great example of how to pull a defence out of shape - failing to notice that Bath were down to 13.

The moment we changed the players on 60 minutes our pack started going backwards. Instantly every scrum was either rubbish ball or a penalty to Saints. Immediately giving them a 40 yard advantage and a throw in to Saints..................and thereafter more and more pressure on Bath.

If we do not create a squad of players to provide a competitive pack for 80 minutes we will win few games.

Also there is absolutely no point picking Faletau as he is not playing and not committed.

Send him back to Wales now.

Quote:

Bath Supporter Jack
The moment we changed the players on 60 minutes our pack started going backwards. Instantly every scrum was either rubbish ball or a penalty to Saints. Immediately giving them a 40 yard advantage and a throw in to Saints..................and thereafter more and more pressure on Bath.
If we do not create a squad of players to provide a competitive pack for 80 minutes we will win few games.

We have created a competitive pack, it's just that significant numbers of them have rarely been available to play for the last couple of seasons.

Quote:

Malco

Quote:

Bath Supporter Jack
The moment we changed the players on 60 minutes our pack started going backwards. Instantly every scrum was either rubbish ball or a penalty to Saints. Immediately giving them a 40 yard advantage and a throw in to Saints..................and thereafter more and more pressure on Bath.
If we do not create a squad of players to provide a competitive pack for 80 minutes we will win few games.

We have created a competitive pack, it's just that significant numbers of them have rarely been available to play for the last couple of seasons.

I think is reasonable to suppose that part of the definition of "competitive" is "available". By that measure, we do not have a competitive pack.

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... IMHO, of course.

Now in Honolulu

I acknowledge that Beno Obano has been unlucky........I sincerely hope he has some good luck over the next few years.

This replacements thing is a bit of a mystery, the front row replacements were Arthur Cordwell, 2 Jacques du Toit, 3 D'Arcy Rae. These three were first choice and started the game against Quins which we won and were replaced by Tom Doughty, Will Vaughan and Kieran Verden we didn't crumple then.

So why would they be the reason we lost control of the scrum on Saturday?

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Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.

Quote:

shipwrecked
This replacements thing is a bit of a mystery, the front row replacements were Arthur Cordwell, 2 Jacques du Toit, 3 D'Arcy Rae. These three were first choice and started the game against Quins which we won and were replaced by Tom Doughty, Will Vaughan and Kieran Verden we didn't crumple then.
So why would they be the reason we lost control of the scrum on Saturday?

For whatever reason the transformation was clearly evident.

Quote:

shipwrecked
This replacements thing is a bit of a mystery, the front row replacements were Arthur Cordwell, 2 Jacques du Toit, 3 D'Arcy Rae. These three were first choice and started the game against Quins which we won and were replaced by Tom Doughty, Will Vaughan and Kieran Verden we didn't crumple then.
So why would they be the reason we lost control of the scrum on Saturday?

That day Rae, Cordwell did 80 but had a bulky back 5 including McNally, Williams and Hughes (who was replaced by Will Spencer)

Quote:

Dorsetoldboy

Quote:

shipwrecked
This replacements thing is a bit of a mystery, the front row replacements were Arthur Cordwell, 2 Jacques du Toit, 3 D'Arcy Rae. These three were first choice and started the game against Quins which we won and were replaced by Tom Doughty, Will Vaughan and Kieran Verden we didn't crumple then.
So why would they be the reason we lost control of the scrum on Saturday?

That day Rae, Cordwell did 80 but had a bulky back 5 including McNally, Williams and Hughes (who was replaced by Will Spencer)

So would it be true to say that we don't have a front row problem but more of a bulky second row problem that might well be resolved next season with the return of Atwood, McNally, Spencer and mystery lock?

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Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.

SW, would that be the mystery lock we’ve been trying to sign since the summer? Don’t hold your breath.

Back to the game, any news on the Saints player carried off?

Quote:

OutsideBath
SW, would that be the mystery lock we’ve been trying to sign since the summer? Don’t hold your breath.
Back to the game, any news on the Saints player carried off?

Even without the mystery lock OB we will be better off with McNally, Williams and Atwood won't we?

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Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.

Quote:

shipwrecked

Quote:

OutsideBath
SW, would that be the mystery lock we’ve been trying to sign since the summer? Don’t hold your breath.
Back to the game, any news on the Saints player carried off?

Even without the mystery lock OB we will be better off with McNally, Williams and Atwood won't we?

The injury record for Atwood and McNally would suggest not.

Quote:

OutsideBath
SW, would that be the mystery lock we’ve been trying to sign since the summer? Don’t hold your breath.
Back to the game, any news on the Saints player carried off?

Saints tweeted that he was in the changing room with the team after the game and travelled home with everyone else.

I was at the game with my brother in law and family who are over for the first time in 3 years from New Plymouth, Taranaki.

First and foremost what a great day and as usual our supporters were magnificent, as my brother in law said the Rec is one of his most favourite grounds in the world.

On the match well enough has been said so I will say what my brother in law said and he knows a bit about rugby having been involved heavily in Taranaki for many years overseeing players such as the Barrett brothers and being great friends with Kevin the boys dad.

He said he thought we had plenty of attacking options - his most telling comment to be honest was "Bath only know how to lose" - he went on to explain because of this season the players are expecting to lose no matter what position they get into and in his opinion that rubs off on not just the opposition but the officials stating he felt Luke Pearce's attitude appeared to change once Saints started their comeback.

He also said our fitness did not appear great but pointed out that it can appear like that if your battling the expectation of defeat.

On a positive note and one I took on from him he felt we were definitely "fixable" - he stated he liked the look of our backs signalling Spencer and Clarke out for praise and also Morosov it is something about a big LHP breaking down field as he said - shame 2 out of the 3 are going.

He reckons JVG and his coaching team will be reasonably happy with the squad based on what he saw on Saturday maybe with a few more additions - attitude is key and needs to be addressed and fitness needs to be better but like he said these are fixable and reasonably quickly - he said he would be more worried if he were a Saints boss - he thought they looked lightweight and apart from Mitchell at 9 looked "Ordinary" - definitely as he pointed out Bath lost it rather than Saints won it.

He is confident with the fan base we have that the club can turn it round - which from someone like him is a huge boost for me.

Good news Ali.

PG

Good points Ali, thanks an outside view is always useful. I'm beginning to see that Mitchell is fast becoming a real prospect for England 9, (recognising he is Opti's fav 9 already).

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Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.

Quote:

Bath Hammer

Quote:

shipwrecked
This replacements thing is a bit of a mystery, the front row replacements were Arthur Cordwell, 2 Jacques du Toit, 3 D'Arcy Rae. These three were first choice and started the game against Quins which we won and were replaced by Tom Doughty, Will Vaughan and Kieran Verden we didn't crumple then.
So why would they be the reason we lost control of the scrum on Saturday?

For whatever reason the transformation was clearly evident.

More heft in the second row would have helped, but IMHO the key reason was attitude. See Stevie Myler's right boot's comment above. bath did not use the pause wisely. Saints were ready & fired up for the scrum, Bath were not- that was the turning point.

PG

Very glad on the news on the Saints number 5.

Looked for a bit of news but nothing out there so glad to read this.


I am with your brother in law Ali. It looks to me like the team/squad are almost treading water waiting for the new team to come in...........

There needs to be, and indeed there is going to be a change.

Whilst the Saints lad was being treated on the ground I noticed that Bayliss was clearly shaken up. He was stood apart from the rest of the Bath players staring at the injured player, doctor and medics.
It was some time before he joined the rest of the team.
Some sort of encouragement was needed, perhaps an arm round his shoulder from the captain or another senior player.
He got injured himself soon after and I wonder if his mind wasn’t in the right place.

All something that I hope would change as part of the new focus. Bit strange that Bayliss was allowed to stress like that. If you have to tell leaders how to respond to trauma and keep your players focussed I would say you need a different leader!

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Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.

Finding the right leader, & there should be only one, will be a challenge for JvG. The Saints captain was really pestering the referee, maybe too much but he probably gained the advantage in the end. I think it just has to be the right character whatever their age, someone like Miles Reid maybe, but how often will he play? The senior players should step up but do they do so enough? I see very little from the renowned internationals we have in our ranks.I