Bath
QUICK TURNAROUND TO THE TOUN. GLASGOW WARRIORS v BATH
Coetzee: return?
By PG Tips
January 18 2023
Bath face a quick turnaround to their Friday night European Challenge Cup fixture against Glasgow Warriors at Scotstoun. They will travel without a win, but still an outside chance of qualifying for the knockout rounds, only 5 days after a frustrating defeat to Toulon that epitomises their season to date: promising but ultimately dashing hopes through basic errors. Against hosts who have won all their three matches do they have any chance of winning the shootout in the last chance saloon?
Warriors currently stand 5th in Pool A, qualified and well clear of nearest rivals Perpignan (whom they have twice beaten) and Bath. They have rotated their squad through the tournament, so with a knockout place certain, will they continue their rotation, or field their strongest squad in search of a big, morale-boosting score? With 14 named in the recently announced Scotland 6 Nations squad (7 forwards, 7 backs), plus their strong Argentine, South African and Tongan presence, they have ample strength to draw on. Bhatti, Bergan, the Fagersons, Gray & Du Preez could be their main threats up front with Price, Weir, Jones, Tuipolotu & Steyn the names to watch out for in the backs. With 11 tries across their 3 Pool rounds, against Bath’s 7 they look favourites for the win, whichever squad they select.
With the 5-day turnaround and a stern Premiership test up next at Sale, Johann van Graan has a balancing act to manage. He said after the Toulon defeat that Bath have to look after the players. "It will be a balance of using the squad and seeing what we have available but like I said at the start we are certainly going to give it our best shot in both competitions.” There will be no England training camp callups for the first time in years, although Bayliss, Redpath & McConnochie have made the Scotland squad. Those overlooked by England and the 3 Scots will want to showcase their credentials – for the Scots to press their case for selection and in the English case as a timely reminder. Van Graan particularly namechecked Hill, Lawrence, Cokanasiga as England candidates for their recent form, also feeling Dunn and Spencer should be in consideration.
On the injury front, Sam Underhill suffered a neck injury at Kingsholm, not as first feared a concussion, but it would seem wise not to risk him, with Reid taking his place. Hopefully Bayliss will have recovered from the illness that side-lined him last Sunday. Coetzee, Obano, McNally, Roux, Williams and Hamer-Webb are all due back from injury soon. It may be a week too early for all but Coetzee, but there could be a recall for Joseph and a first outing (if registered) for prop cover Millar-Mills. There is a tricky call to be made at standoff. Bailey’s goalkicking let him down last Sunday and relieved the pressure Bath meant to apply on their visitors. Francis may appear the safer pair of hands, at least in goalkicking, but Bailey is the future and has the greater threat in distribution and break. I would opt for him, with Spencer or Gallagher taking on the frontline goalkicking – though JvG may see it differently.
Van Graan’s post -match interview after the Toulon defeat was a mix of frustration and commendation. He acknowledged that Bath shot themselves in the foot conceding soft tries at beginning and end of the match but was full of praise for the scrum and please by the attacking intent which brought 3 good, if fortunate tries. That Bath were still in the hunt for a win until the final minute is something to build on. The signs of improvement are there, but the build is annoyingly gradual. This weekend, with its slim hope of further progress, offers a chance to pick up the pace. Bath must take it.
Possible Bath Squad:
Bath: Morozov, Dunn, Rae, Lee-Warner, Attwood, Hill, Reid, Bayliss. Spencer (Capt.), Bailey. McConnochie, Redpath, Lawrence, Cokanasiga. Gallagher.
Replacements: Boyce, Annett, Millar-Mills, Spencer, Coetzee. Schreuder, Francis, Joseph.
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StumbleuponQUICK TURNAROUND TO THE TOUN. GLASGOW WARRIORS v BATH. TEAM UP!
Discussion started by Comeonmylovers.co.uk (IP Logged), 18/01/2023 10:29
18/01/2023 10:29
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Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2023:01:24:10:31:34 by P G Tips.
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Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2023:01:24:10:31:34 by P G Tips.
Slightly too many in the backs there again PG. still I suppose we have form for 16 on the pitch.
Looking forward to welcoming you all up to Scotstoun for the return game.
Not a clue what team we will put out!!! Given other fixtures, it looks unlikely that we'll be able to secure a home tie in the next round, whatever our result (unless you fancy sending your U13s up for a 3 figure defeat!). That's of course the competition rules and down to our points difference not being good enough, but let's just say that people have been asking the question of whether it makes for a credible tournament format when a team could well (without counting chickens) win all 4 group games, 3 of which with a TBP, and not be ranked in the top 8 seeds going into the last 16.
So we might try to smash the PD, or we might be pragmatic and save ourselves - I don't know. I suspect much will depend on who Townsend wants to get some game time and who he wants rested.
I said at the time that the win we had at the Rec, with the team we sent down, was a massive moment for us, and so it has proved - we're now 7 wins in a row (Zebre, Bath, Edinburgh and Perpignan away; Perpignan 'home' at Murrayfield due to weather; and Edinburgh and Stormers at Scotstoun). The Stormers game was as good a performance as we have put in for a few years. We're starting to regain our identity as an attacking force, and the artificial pitch helps a lot with that.
After last year's really disappointing season, there's a feel good again.
So you'll probably beat us!
If anyone's travelling up and has questions, just let me know.
Not a clue what team we will put out!!! Given other fixtures, it looks unlikely that we'll be able to secure a home tie in the next round, whatever our result (unless you fancy sending your U13s up for a 3 figure defeat!). That's of course the competition rules and down to our points difference not being good enough, but let's just say that people have been asking the question of whether it makes for a credible tournament format when a team could well (without counting chickens) win all 4 group games, 3 of which with a TBP, and not be ranked in the top 8 seeds going into the last 16.
So we might try to smash the PD, or we might be pragmatic and save ourselves - I don't know. I suspect much will depend on who Townsend wants to get some game time and who he wants rested.
I said at the time that the win we had at the Rec, with the team we sent down, was a massive moment for us, and so it has proved - we're now 7 wins in a row (Zebre, Bath, Edinburgh and Perpignan away; Perpignan 'home' at Murrayfield due to weather; and Edinburgh and Stormers at Scotstoun). The Stormers game was as good a performance as we have put in for a few years. We're starting to regain our identity as an attacking force, and the artificial pitch helps a lot with that.
After last year's really disappointing season, there's a feel good again.
So you'll probably beat us!
If anyone's travelling up and has questions, just let me know.
Happy you've won 7 in a row. We've won 1 European pool game in the last 21 attempts. You'll be fine.
Any chance you'll put our your 4th's this time instead of your 2nd's/3rd's to give us a chance?
Already mentally prepared for another defeat where the optimists see the green shoots of progress and the pessimists (myself included) continue to conclude we're just not a very good team
I expect a largely second string team from us with the bulk of the first choicers held back for the Sale match.
So it seems that Bristol were naughty and have had points deducted. Glasgow are now very much in line for a home tie in the next round.
None of the other winless sides in our pool has an easy game this weekend. Victory on Friday would surely give us a good chance of progressing.
Quote:FiveSticks
I expect a largely second string team from us with the bulk of the first choicers held back for the Sale match.
Why would we prioritise a league match in a no-relegation season over a Cup we’re not out of?
Quote:OptimistQuote:FiveSticks
I expect a largely second string team from us with the bulk of the first choicers held back for the Sale match.
Why would we prioritise a league match in a no-relegation season over a Cup we’re not out of?
We’re not competitive in the challenge cup and we have a chance of not finishing bottom in the PL again which is significant.
Quote:OptimistQuote:FiveSticks
I expect a largely second string team from us with the bulk of the first choicers held back for the Sale match.
Why would we prioritise a league match in a no-relegation season over a Cup we’re not out of?
It is kind of laughable that we're not out of a competition in which we've lost 3 out of 3 achieving one bonus point.
Quote:OptimistQuote:FiveSticks
I expect a largely second string team from us with the bulk of the first choicers held back for the Sale match.
Why would we prioritise a league match in a no-relegation season over a Cup we’re not out of?
I agree, We have the slimmest of chances of actually winning something. We should put the best 23 out we can. I could see Attwood being rested as 2 games on carpet in 5 days will be a test on the old limbs.
adopted player, 24/25 Hame Faiva. 23/24 Ted Hill. 22/23 Cam Redpath. 21/22 Max Clark. 20/21 Henry Thomas. 19/20 Max Wright. 18/19 Cooper Vuna.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2023:01:19:07:19:35 by copester.
I think jvg will be going for the win but do think that will involve making changes.
5 day turnaround is a really big ask- agree that attwood is an obvious candidate to be rotated out for spencer.
Assume underhill out but bayliss maybe feeling better.
Would like to see coetzee get a run but loads of competition in the backrow.
Would stick with Bailey personally- don't think we look like creating anything at all when francis is at 10.
5 day turnaround is a really big ask- agree that attwood is an obvious candidate to be rotated out for spencer.
Assume underhill out but bayliss maybe feeling better.
Would like to see coetzee get a run but loads of competition in the backrow.
Would stick with Bailey personally- don't think we look like creating anything at all when francis is at 10.
Quote:charlieboa
Would stick with Bailey personally- don't think we look like creating anything at all when francis is at 10.
Totally agree. And I'd just go into the match and go to the corner every time unless it's right under the sticks.
I think there could be a few more changes with the short turnaround from last week but nothing drastic.
Agree Bailey should start unless coaches think his confidence is shot and he needs a breather. He’s definitely changed his kicking technique since he first came into the side and has a fade/slice type strike which I’m sure he didn’t used to have.
Agree Bailey should start unless coaches think his confidence is shot and he needs a breather. He’s definitely changed his kicking technique since he first came into the side and has a fade/slice type strike which I’m sure he didn’t used to have.
Quote:OptimistQuote:charlieboa
Would stick with Bailey personally- don't think we look like creating anything at all when francis is at 10.
Totally agree. And I'd just go into the match and go to the corner every time unless it's right under the sticks.
No point going for the corner, we have no effective lineout to take advantage of doing that.
If Bailey starts, Spencer should be handed the kicking duties.
Team's Up. Seven changes:
Bath Rugby have made seven changes for the EPCR Challenge Cup trip to Glasgow Warriors.
Juan Schoeman and Johannes Jonker have been introduced into the front row while Will Spencer and Chris Cloete come into the second and back row respectively.
Louis Schreuder is at scrum-half, meaning Tom Dunn will take the captaincy from hooker. Piers Francis’ inclusion at fly-half sees Orlando Bailey move to full-back and fellow Academy back Max Ojomoh lines up on the wing.
The familiar centre duo of Cameron Redpath and Ollie Lawrence, alongside wing Joe Cokanasiga, complete the backline.
Ted Hill and Miles Reid continue at blindside flanker and Number 8, and Australian Fergus Lee-Warner is set to continue at lock.
On the bench, Jonathan Joseph and Richard de Carpentier return to the matchday 23.
Bath Rugby team to play Glasgow Warriors
15 Orlando Bailey, 14 Max Ojomoh, 13 Ollie Lawrence, 12 Cameron Redpath, 11 Joe Cokanasiga, 10 Piers Francis, 9 Louis Schreuder; 1 Juan Schoeman, 2 Tom Dunn ©, 3 Johannes Jonker, 4 Will Spencer, 5 Fergus Lee-Warner, 6 Ted Hill, 7 Chris Cloete, 8 Miles Reid
Impact players: 16 Niall Annett, 17 Valeriy Morozov, 18 D’Arcy Rae, 19 Tom Ellis, 20 Richard de Carpentier, 21 Ben Spencer, 22 Matt Gallagher, Jonathan Joseph
P G Tips
Jaco Coetzee: my adopted Player, 2023-24.
Bath Rugby have made seven changes for the EPCR Challenge Cup trip to Glasgow Warriors.
Juan Schoeman and Johannes Jonker have been introduced into the front row while Will Spencer and Chris Cloete come into the second and back row respectively.
Louis Schreuder is at scrum-half, meaning Tom Dunn will take the captaincy from hooker. Piers Francis’ inclusion at fly-half sees Orlando Bailey move to full-back and fellow Academy back Max Ojomoh lines up on the wing.
The familiar centre duo of Cameron Redpath and Ollie Lawrence, alongside wing Joe Cokanasiga, complete the backline.
Ted Hill and Miles Reid continue at blindside flanker and Number 8, and Australian Fergus Lee-Warner is set to continue at lock.
On the bench, Jonathan Joseph and Richard de Carpentier return to the matchday 23.
Bath Rugby team to play Glasgow Warriors
15 Orlando Bailey, 14 Max Ojomoh, 13 Ollie Lawrence, 12 Cameron Redpath, 11 Joe Cokanasiga, 10 Piers Francis, 9 Louis Schreuder; 1 Juan Schoeman, 2 Tom Dunn ©, 3 Johannes Jonker, 4 Will Spencer, 5 Fergus Lee-Warner, 6 Ted Hill, 7 Chris Cloete, 8 Miles Reid
Impact players: 16 Niall Annett, 17 Valeriy Morozov, 18 D’Arcy Rae, 19 Tom Ellis, 20 Richard de Carpentier, 21 Ben Spencer, 22 Matt Gallagher, Jonathan Joseph
P G Tips
Jaco Coetzee: my adopted Player, 2023-24.
Quite a few positives to be taken from this, albeit it appears reasonably safe to assume this is the end of our 'Cup run' (sic):
- great to see Max Ojomoh back, hopefully ready to step in for Cam during 6Ns
- good to see JJ back - Lawrence is going to need a rest at some point
- good to see big Joe continuing his run of fitness
- that's still a fantastic looking back row and back-row replacements even allowing for several names missing
- good to see Will Spencer getting what is, for him, an extended run injury-free. Potentially a pretty decent second-row pairing that
- interesting to see if Bailey at 15 can bring in a bit of 'second playmaker' variation to our attack
- great to see Max Ojomoh back, hopefully ready to step in for Cam during 6Ns
- good to see JJ back - Lawrence is going to need a rest at some point
- good to see big Joe continuing his run of fitness
- that's still a fantastic looking back row and back-row replacements even allowing for several names missing
- good to see Will Spencer getting what is, for him, an extended run injury-free. Potentially a pretty decent second-row pairing that
- interesting to see if Bailey at 15 can bring in a bit of 'second playmaker' variation to our attack
Bailey at 15 seems a good move, kicking pressure removed but still available in the backs, I think he plays some of his best rugby there and for England he would regularly come into the line and overload defences then put people away with a pass.
Cloete needs game time and is clearly of it at the moment give away pens, Ojomoh on the wing is interesting, defence in midfield a question so wing might be a good move but is he quick enough?
FLW straight in as normal.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Cloete needs game time and is clearly of it at the moment give away pens, Ojomoh on the wing is interesting, defence in midfield a question so wing might be a good move but is he quick enough?
FLW straight in as normal.
Agree with all that opti and SW.
Interesting that mojo doesn't think he is quick enough for 13 but keeps getting used on wing.
Bit surprised coetzee not in 23 but as you say cloete needs a game and arguably so does rdp after a few weeks off.
Interesting that mojo doesn't think he is quick enough for 13 but keeps getting used on wing.
Bit surprised coetzee not in 23 but as you say cloete needs a game and arguably so does rdp after a few weeks off.
Glasgow Warriors team news
Glasgow Warriors: 15. Josh McKay, 14. Sebastian Cancelliere, 13. Sione Tuipulotu, 12. Huw Jones, 11. Kyle Steyn (c), 10. Tom Jordan, 9. Ali Price, 1. Jamie Bhatti, 2. Johnny Matthews, 3. Lucio Sordoni, 4. Alex Samuel, 5. Richie Gray, 6. Euan Ferrie, 7. Sione Vailanu, 8. Matt Fagerson.
Replacements: 16. George Turner, 17. Nathan McBeth, 18. Simon Berghan, 19. JP du Preez, 20. Lewis Bean, 21. Tom Gordon, 22. George Horne, 23. Duncan Weir,
P G Tips
Jaco Coetzee: my adopted Player, 2023-24.
Glasgow Warriors: 15. Josh McKay, 14. Sebastian Cancelliere, 13. Sione Tuipulotu, 12. Huw Jones, 11. Kyle Steyn (c), 10. Tom Jordan, 9. Ali Price, 1. Jamie Bhatti, 2. Johnny Matthews, 3. Lucio Sordoni, 4. Alex Samuel, 5. Richie Gray, 6. Euan Ferrie, 7. Sione Vailanu, 8. Matt Fagerson.
Replacements: 16. George Turner, 17. Nathan McBeth, 18. Simon Berghan, 19. JP du Preez, 20. Lewis Bean, 21. Tom Gordon, 22. George Horne, 23. Duncan Weir,
P G Tips
Jaco Coetzee: my adopted Player, 2023-24.
Quick insight on the Glasgow selection - it's pretty well out first choice starting backs, barring perhaps Smith at 15. Price hasn't really been firing on all cylinders this season though, so there will be some Warriors fans disappointed not to see George Horne start - I'm not, he's the perfect guy to have on the bench to pick the pace up in the final 20.
Bit more rotation up front - some of it forced, some of it to give guys a rest. Matthews is our 3rd choice hooker, but no Glasgow fan will have any worries about him playing whatsoever - he's your classic never let you down kind of player. Alex Samuel in the second row and Euan Ferrie at blindside are both still very green, so there's the development aspect of this selection, but they're well supported by experienced players next to them.
Bit more rotation up front - some of it forced, some of it to give guys a rest. Matthews is our 3rd choice hooker, but no Glasgow fan will have any worries about him playing whatsoever - he's your classic never let you down kind of player. Alex Samuel in the second row and Euan Ferrie at blindside are both still very green, so there's the development aspect of this selection, but they're well supported by experienced players next to them.
Huw Jones v Cameron Redpath mini Scottish centre trial!
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
To me this selection looks more suited to a 4G pitch than last week. Schoeman, W Spencer, Schroeder and Bailey as another distributer from 15 looks like a faster game pick. We are playing knockout Rugby so might as well give it a go.
adopted player, 24/25 Hame Faiva. 23/24 Ted Hill. 22/23 Cam Redpath. 21/22 Max Clark. 20/21 Henry Thomas. 19/20 Max Wright. 18/19 Cooper Vuna.
adopted player, 24/25 Hame Faiva. 23/24 Ted Hill. 22/23 Cam Redpath. 21/22 Max Clark. 20/21 Henry Thomas. 19/20 Max Wright. 18/19 Cooper Vuna.
Quote:Malco
White flag selection. Going to get stuffed.
Who - that is available - would you add into the team to change the colour of the flag Malco?
Did Sheffield Wednesday wave the white flag when they saw the team sheets against Newcastle in the F A Cup recently?
I think that the Glasgow fans thought the same when they changed loads of names for the visit to the Rec?
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Oddschecker have Glasgow at 2/11, Bath at 11/2. It's a brave supporter putting money on the BB&W. Go well boys.
Adopted players: 24/25 J Bayliss; [24] O Lawrence; [23] J Cokanasiga; [22] M Green; [21] A Watson; [20] T Faletau; [19] M V Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw
Family . Community . Nation - [sdp.org.uk]
My mind's been going places without me lately - Bushfire The B52's
Adopted players: 24/25 J Bayliss; [24] O Lawrence; [23] J Cokanasiga; [22] M Green; [21] A Watson; [20] T Faletau; [19] M V Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw
Family . Community . Nation - [sdp.org.uk]
My mind's been going places without me lately - Bushfire The B52's
Quote:shipwrecked
Huw Jones v Cameron Redpath mini Scottish centre trial!
And Sione Tuipulotu on the outside.
J
Just as a bit of info, think they left for the trip early yesterday. Cars all at Lambridge a.m. .
So should have been good settling in sessions etc. etc. Assume they 'flew'?
Let's hope they have a decent surface to play on - i.e. snow, frost, ice etc.
Mind you can't be worse than the Rec this week! LOL!
So should have been good settling in sessions etc. etc. Assume they 'flew'?
Let's hope they have a decent surface to play on - i.e. snow, frost, ice etc.
Mind you can't be worse than the Rec this week! LOL!
Quote:annie blackthorn
Just as a bit of info, think they left for the trip early yesterday. Cars all at Lambridge a.m. .
So should have been good settling in sessions etc. etc. Assume they 'flew'?
Let's hope they have a decent surface to play on - i.e. snow, frost, ice etc.
Mind you can't be worse than the Rec this week! LOL!
No snow here - it is flipping cold though - I'm just about to set off dressed up as the Michelin Man!
And it's an artificial track, so nice and fast for running rugby!
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2023:01:20:18:29:15 by East_Stand_Warrior.
Quote:ChippenhamRomanQuote:shipwrecked
Huw Jones v Cameron Redpath mini Scottish centre trial!
And Sione Tuipulotu on the outside.
J
Indeed - Tuipolotu has been in astonishingly good form this season at both 12 and 13. Easily Glasgow's player of the year so far. For Twickenham in a couple of weeks, you'd think it's him plus one of Jones, Harris or Redpath.
Quote:East_Stand_WarriorQuote:ChippenhamRomanQuote:shipwrecked
Huw Jones v Cameron Redpath mini Scottish centre trial!
And Sione Tuipulotu on the outside.
J
Indeed - Tuipolotu has been in astonishingly good form this season at both 12 and 13. Easily Glasgow's player of the year so far. For Twickenham in a couple of weeks, you'd think it's him plus one of Jones, Harris or Redpath.
Harris at 12?
Been pretty frantic from both teams. Two weak tries though. Maul defence a worry.
Remind me why Charteris has a job?.
Remind me why Charteris has a job?.
DUMB! DUMB! DUMB!
Stupid penalties & errors killing us AGAIN!!!
Adopted Players: All of the little blighters!!!
Stupid penalties & errors killing us AGAIN!!!
Adopted Players: All of the little blighters!!!
We can't even call our lineouts a lottery... At least with the lottery, you have a chance!!!
Adopted Players: All of the little blighters!!!
Adopted Players: All of the little blighters!!!
Tight game, spoilt by the most irritating and biased commentary I've heard for decades.
Scrum very good. Lineout terrible. We’re also run out of ideas quick in attack but our carrying and defence have been pretty good.
All in all, not a bad half. Nice try from Cloete and I think Reid has been excellent. We’ve a strong bench so we’re in with a shout.
All in all, not a bad half. Nice try from Cloete and I think Reid has been excellent. We’ve a strong bench so we’re in with a shout.
Honestly I quite like the commentary! Sure it's from a Scottish perspective, but I'm sure they've had enough from the other way around.
Why. Is our lineout defence. So bad. And was last year. Who. I wonder. Is our lineout coach?
No try!
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2023:01:20:21:07:28 by CoochieCoo.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2023:01:20:21:07:28 by CoochieCoo.
Just hope Piers Francis is ok. Horrible collision, especially so with his history of concussion.
We may lose this, we may win it. Our scrum has been excellent. Our defence has been (one lapse aside) excellent. Our lineout has not.
I think the ref has been an interesting balance of pedantic (bad) but trying to accelerate (good).
The commentators are Glasgows answer to Statler and Waldorf. I have never heard such poor commentary.
Presume a draw is no use to us?
Edit, just seen the above post. A losing BP and a draw could get us through. Madness.
J
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2023:01:20:21:55:42 by ChippenhamRoman.
Edit, just seen the above post. A losing BP and a draw could get us through. Madness.
J
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2023:01:20:21:55:42 by ChippenhamRoman.
Well, we’re hard to beat but with a lineout and/or a maul, we might be able to win.
FLW is an unbelievable player. If had to only keep one of our 2Rs for next season, it’d be him. He and Reid really stood up tonight.
FLW is an unbelievable player. If had to only keep one of our 2Rs for next season, it’d be him. He and Reid really stood up tonight.
Didn't feel as though either team deserved to win but Bath's defence and resilience was brilliant nonetheless.
Not sure I understood the decision to go for the draw unless we stand a chance to go through.
Not sure I understood the decision to go for the draw unless we stand a chance to go through.
If Brive and Falcons both lose we qualify, which says a lot about the structure of this tournament!
We don't have a Cup thread so I'll add this here:
Elsewhere Toby Booth is mounting an outstanding ECC campaign with Ospreys beating Tigers 26-27 to go 2nd on the table!
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Elsewhere Toby Booth is mounting an outstanding ECC campaign with Ospreys beating Tigers 26-27 to go 2nd on the table!
I am a Scot living in Bath who also supports Glasgow, but that commentary from John Barclay was quite appalling. In fact it was so biased it was embarrassing. He should know better as a former Scottish captain. Just wait til you hear him as the pundit for the Calcutta Cup.
Well I didn't enjoy that game as much as I expected to! Fair play to Bath, I thought your defensive line worked well against our play, and you clearly had dominance in the scrum (even if there were one or two dodgy calls!).
Bit of a wake up call for Glasgow - we've been playing really well and with some fantastic rugby recently. Tonight was very poor and m it looked like all that talk had gone to our heads a bit. We seemed to be trying to overplay and pick the flash option every time rather than taking contact and recycling - our handling was poor. I'm glad that reminder came in a game in which the result didn't really matter, but we need to make sure we learn the lesson.
The 2 points should enough to see Bath through to the next round, so I'll look forward to renewing acquaintances in Dublin for the final - hopefully with a different ref!
Bit of a wake up call for Glasgow - we've been playing really well and with some fantastic rugby recently. Tonight was very poor and m it looked like all that talk had gone to our heads a bit. We seemed to be trying to overplay and pick the flash option every time rather than taking contact and recycling - our handling was poor. I'm glad that reminder came in a game in which the result didn't really matter, but we need to make sure we learn the lesson.
The 2 points should enough to see Bath through to the next round, so I'll look forward to renewing acquaintances in Dublin for the final - hopefully with a different ref!
Remember how good Ollie Lawrence was with ball in hand when he joined? Remember how it helped turn as around? I miss that. I don't mind the tactical game. But we really played so little rugby.
Quote:hasta
Remember how good Ollie Lawrence was with ball in hand when he joined? Remember how it helped turn as around? I miss that. I don't mind the tactical game. But we really played so little rugby.
It seems as if very little is being developed in the way of fluency in attack & accuracy in execution. Much has been achieved defensively which was desperately needed but there’s a whole lot more to playing rugby & by so doing providing some entertainment. The fact that Ollie Lawrence is making less of an impact is indicative of how much we lack going forward despite a pretty strong lineup.
Lawrence needs a creative 10, Piers Francis isn’t of that style, sorting the defence was a priority the rest will follow in time.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Quote:shipwrecked
Lawrence needs a creative 10, Piers Francis isn’t of that style, sorting the defence was a priority the rest will follow in time.
That is a fair point SW. We are really lacking in that position. Bailey hasn’t shown the development we hoped for & is an erratic place kicker whilst Francis has his limitations. I hope that is the only reason for the lack of fluency as I don’t see why you can’t address defence & attack simultaneously, as the latter is Madock’s responsibility. If so we have to wait until late in the year before we see any effectiveness from the back line which is depressing.
Quote:shipwrecked
Lawrence needs a creative 10, Piers Francis isn’t of that style, sorting the defence was a priority the rest will follow in time.
When I see francis named at 10 the chances of me paying to watch the game plummet and I paint the wall instead.
Obviously goes wider than him and definite concern about how little rugby we play and how we don't use some great assets.
Baby steps I guess from a v v low base and that's why Russell is coming in to hopefully get mad dogs ideas on to the pitch.
Last season we got thumped in this fixture despite winning at half time. Fitness, resilience, defence, scrum all improved but still a long way to go
Encouraged by more positive comments about the scrum.
Did schoeman and jonker go OK? Decent effort from our third choices if so.
Things improve or get worse with morozov and rae on?.
Can we place lots of credit at the door of Hatley? Seems too big a coincidence that he moves back to having more focus on it and it improves significabtly. Pleased for him- season from hell last year
Sure having attwood and spencer fit helps as well, 2 grear scrummaging locks.
Lineout. ... Sounds like more of the same dross?
Did schoeman and jonker go OK? Decent effort from our third choices if so.
Things improve or get worse with morozov and rae on?.
Can we place lots of credit at the door of Hatley? Seems too big a coincidence that he moves back to having more focus on it and it improves significabtly. Pleased for him- season from hell last year
Sure having attwood and spencer fit helps as well, 2 grear scrummaging locks.
Lineout. ... Sounds like more of the same dross?
All 4 props were pretty solid in the scrum. Morozov seems to show up more in the loose and Jonker will be disappointed with missing Fagerson at the first try. Other than that they went well.
Lineout is a shambles. We clearly miss Ewels, McNally and last night Bayliss.
We all love Tom Dunn but he looked nervous at lineout time and clearly under threw at least 2 that were stolen. I dont understand why we didnt go to Reid at the front more often.
adopted player, 24/25 Hame Faiva. 23/24 Ted Hill. 22/23 Cam Redpath. 21/22 Max Clark. 20/21 Henry Thomas. 19/20 Max Wright. 18/19 Cooper Vuna.
Lineout is a shambles. We clearly miss Ewels, McNally and last night Bayliss.
We all love Tom Dunn but he looked nervous at lineout time and clearly under threw at least 2 that were stolen. I dont understand why we didnt go to Reid at the front more often.
adopted player, 24/25 Hame Faiva. 23/24 Ted Hill. 22/23 Cam Redpath. 21/22 Max Clark. 20/21 Henry Thomas. 19/20 Max Wright. 18/19 Cooper Vuna.
Yes I’d agree all 4 went well. Rae and Morosoz got a couple of scrums going forward at quite a rate, leading to a YC for their prop, which we should’ve then taken advantage of. Ellis’ YC shortly after, which gave up our advantage and gave them their chance of winning looked dumb but I could see what he was thinking and how hard he worked to get through the middle of the maul. Looked silly - bit unlucky I thought. Overall, forwards did well and discipline was good. Nice to see Spencer put in a good shift, which likely helped with the scrum. Great back row effort, with a nice balance between the 3.
Agree on Lawrence. Hugely frustrating last week and this on plastic pitches (remember Sarries away? He tore it up with ball in hand!) Pointless having him. We got a penalty advantage from a scrum in their half in the first half and moved it quick to Redpath and he kicked it in the air. Lawrence looked at him thinking what we’re all thinking: “give me the effin ball!” Need to use him more, and JCok. Bailey made some nice breaks.
As said above, small steps. Harder to beat. Obvious problems that have obvious fixes, one being the lineout (where it might be time for a new approach/coach?!) the other our attacking game which hopefully develops as our foundation solidifies and when Saint Finn of Glasgow arrives.
Agree on Lawrence. Hugely frustrating last week and this on plastic pitches (remember Sarries away? He tore it up with ball in hand!) Pointless having him. We got a penalty advantage from a scrum in their half in the first half and moved it quick to Redpath and he kicked it in the air. Lawrence looked at him thinking what we’re all thinking: “give me the effin ball!” Need to use him more, and JCok. Bailey made some nice breaks.
As said above, small steps. Harder to beat. Obvious problems that have obvious fixes, one being the lineout (where it might be time for a new approach/coach?!) the other our attacking game which hopefully develops as our foundation solidifies and when Saint Finn of Glasgow arrives.
JVG said pragmatic and it certainly is. We were warned. Yesterday we saw the other side of Lawrence as a defensive player. I thought the combination of him and Redpath was excellent and they made smart decisions on when to rush and when to drift. Glasgow looked threatening but ultimately weren't because we marked them all the way to the touchline and they would eventually drop it. We'd win a scrum and we'd go again.
Reid was fantastic. I read an interview with him early in the season about how he's looking to develop his game and especially his carrying. Playing 8 has really allowed him to show that side of his game.
A word for Schoeman as well. Infinitely better than Morozov who I know some folk are eager to retain.
Reid was fantastic. I read an interview with him early in the season about how he's looking to develop his game and especially his carrying. Playing 8 has really allowed him to show that side of his game.
A word for Schoeman as well. Infinitely better than Morozov who I know some folk are eager to retain.
Have to agree scrum wise we have seen a real improvement last 3/4 weeks and really starting to build a strong platform. Going to be massively helped by Obano in the next few weeks hopefully.
Lineout is the only real issue now, albeit a major issue for Glasgow so some slack needs to be given but we need to find what works and stick to it. Think we always need one of Roux/McNally/Ewels for it to function well.
As much as people slate Baileys kicking(wasn’t fine yesterday) Francis at 10 is so slow and kicks absolutely everything away.
Backrow again so good Reid is playing some of his best rugby ever and is going unnoticed. Bar one bad set the defence was really good read Glasgow every time.
Sale next week going to be a very tough time but injuries and callups means I think we have a sneaky chance at an upset.
Lineout is the only real issue now, albeit a major issue for Glasgow so some slack needs to be given but we need to find what works and stick to it. Think we always need one of Roux/McNally/Ewels for it to function well.
As much as people slate Baileys kicking(wasn’t fine yesterday) Francis at 10 is so slow and kicks absolutely everything away.
Backrow again so good Reid is playing some of his best rugby ever and is going unnoticed. Bar one bad set the defence was really good read Glasgow every time.
Sale next week going to be a very tough time but injuries and callups means I think we have a sneaky chance at an upset.
I thought our backrow was brilliant last night, they led our defensive very well
Quote:Malco
White flag selection. Going to get stuffed.
Can't get it right all the time.
Quote:hemingtonQuote:Malco
White flag selection. Going to get stuffed.
Can't get it right all the time.
Thank god.
Well played Bath, decent result at their place. Now keep it up!
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
The BBC report is very, very unflattering towards Bath. Essentially, we didn't get hammered because Glasgow were terrible. Is that right? I despise the modern BBC as much as the next person; have they got this wrong as well?
Quote:I only listened to the very one eyed radio commentary, so it’s hard to know. But they refer to Ben Spencer as Brad Spencer, so with that lack of care about the detail on the opposition it is clear it was written for the home teams fans.recman
The BBC report is very, very unflattering towards Bath. Essentially, we didn't get hammered because Glasgow were terrible. Is that right? I despise the modern BBC as much as the next person; have they got this wrong as well?
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2023:01:21:13:37:29 by dcsh.
Quote:I'm not the next person then because I think there's a lot to admire about the BBC, and those who call for its defunding might realise this should we lose it. The correspondent is the regular rugby reporter in Scotland. Not having seen the game I won't comment on how biased he was but he's usually quite objective-maybe we didn't try and play much attacking rugby, Glasgow did, but executed poorly?recman
The BBC report is very, very unflattering towards Bath. Essentially, we didn't get hammered because Glasgow were terrible. Is that right? I despise the modern BBC as much as the next person; have they got this wrong as well?
Glasgow probably should have been out of sight, but errors did keep us in it...
Adopted Players: All of the little blighters!!!
Adopted Players: All of the little blighters!!!
A clue that might explain the tone of the BBC match report, as per the commentary, is that it was written by BBC Scotland.
Glasgow weren’t great. We weren’t whether. As WJM said, the answer is always on the scoreboard. If we were so cr4p, they should have hammered us. Arguably, if we’d have handled the last 5 minutes better and/or kicked our goals, we should have won.
Glasgow weren’t great. We weren’t whether. As WJM said, the answer is always on the scoreboard. If we were so cr4p, they should have hammered us. Arguably, if we’d have handled the last 5 minutes better and/or kicked our goals, we should have won.
Indeed, as FivesSticks alluded to. Now 7th, before Falcons play and 'only' top 6 qualify.
Quote:FiveSticks
It's all of no consequence anyway, given the Brive result.
Whilst it’s a shame for us not to qualify, the competition is farcical enough, having a team with no wins qualify would have been even worse.
I don't particularly disagree that it would have been silly if we qualified, but equally we had the hardest draw (by dint of our useless performance last season).
Anyway, everything at the league. Two weeks totally clear after the Sale game, which we absolutely shouldn't expect anything out of, but should throw everything at.
Anyway, everything at the league. Two weeks totally clear after the Sale game, which we absolutely shouldn't expect anything out of, but should throw everything at.
It would if course have been absurd for us to qualify, but it would have been quite funny (at least for Bath supporters) if we had progreesed beyond the next round!
PG
PG
Quote:hasta
I don't particularly disagree that it would have been silly if we qualified, but equally we had the hardest draw (by dint of our useless performance last season).
Anyway, everything at the league. Two weeks totally clear after the Sale game, which we absolutely shouldn't expect anything out of, but should throw everything at.
Unfortunately because of our useless performance this year we will no doubt get an equally hard draw next season.
Ah, OB, your 'when life gives you lemons, @#$%& in everyone's tea' attitude continues to be a joy.
Quote:Nick Holder
are we the worst top flight side in Europe? No wins in 22???
It's not easy to say with total certainty as some teams, like Bath have played in both competitions, while others, like Zebre have only played in the Challenge cup. So, does Bath's record of 3 wins, 3 draws and 20 losses in 26 matches across both competitions compare with, say, Zebre's record of 6 wins and 2 losses in 22 matches entirely within the Challenge cup?
Is we ignore the competitions, only Bayonne, with one win in 12 challenge cups matches is a worse aggregate than Bath, but that was in 3 years, rather than 5.
In terms of overall results regardless of competition, Bath have the worst record in European competitions, by some margin, over the last 5 years.
It's very sad how far our club has fallen. The Tarquin+Hooper years have been utterly disastrous.
Quote:Fair enough, but you can't change the past, only learn from it. The big question is whether we are in a better place compared to say, 1 year ago? Most would say we are, though with unspectacular progress.bathonian80
It's very sad how far our club has fallen. The Tarquin+Hooper years have been utterly disastrous.
With the right pegs in the right shaped holes the back room looks better, we have gained some top players through other teams unfortunate demise. More to come next season at 10.
It should look brighter, it just feels a bit inconsistent results wise. We are losing or winning by 1 score.
Time to focus now, no cup distractions, few 6N weaknesses, become a team that expects to win rather than collecting LBPs and finish the season strongly.
Quote:Yes. lets hope he is ok, the damage to his face looked nasty which got me thinking that it was caused by Tuipulota leading with his forearm. Piers was very groggy but Tuipulota unmarked and received no treatment. Yes, Piers tackled high but it didn't seem to me that the referee/tmo considered whether Tuipolota fended him off with his forearm unlike the Northampton player who was red carded for the use of his forearm.dr.bath1865
Just hope Piers Francis is ok. Horrible collision, especially so with his history of concussion.
Personally I think this campaign has really helped us as a club and certainly JVG whilst Bristol played the likes of Zebre (no disrespect meant to Zebre) we have had a huge set of 4 games against 2 of the strongest sides in the competition and we certainly have not been embarrassed.
Going forward this will help the squad playing full strength Glasgow and Toulon is basically European Cup (Senior) standard both these sides have tested our players and although we have not progressed or won the coaching team have seen aspects of the squad against quality outfits.
I am sure deep down despite the clear determination to want to win everything JVG will have his sights set on a top 8 position and European Cup qualification maybe higher and having those extra weekends off will assist along with the lack of International selection bar Scotland will certainly be welcomed.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2023:01:23:09:14:16 by Ali1969.
Going forward this will help the squad playing full strength Glasgow and Toulon is basically European Cup (Senior) standard both these sides have tested our players and although we have not progressed or won the coaching team have seen aspects of the squad against quality outfits.
I am sure deep down despite the clear determination to want to win everything JVG will have his sights set on a top 8 position and European Cup qualification maybe higher and having those extra weekends off will assist along with the lack of International selection bar Scotland will certainly be welcomed.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2023:01:23:09:14:16 by Ali1969.
Quote:bathonian80
It's very sad how far our club has fallen. The Tarquin+Hooper years have been utterly disastrous.
The question that follows then is more about, "have we reached the bottom and started to move up and in the right direction?"
So far, I believe the evidence suggests the answer is definitely, "yes" but speed and extent of direction remains to be proven
Watching some of the top european teams fight it out over the weekend, Bath's efforts look good inexperienced amateurs at the very best. In every aspect.
I had maybe foolishly thought that with the changes in the coaching and backroom staff that things, by this stage in the season, would have at least looked as if "they had got a grip".
I had maybe foolishly thought that with the changes in the coaching and backroom staff that things, by this stage in the season, would have at least looked as if "they had got a grip".
Quote:annie blackthorn
Watching some of the top european teams fight it out over the weekend, Bath's efforts look good inexperienced amateurs at the very best. In every aspect.
I had maybe foolishly thought that with the changes in the coaching and backroom staff that things, by this stage in the season, would have at least looked as if "they had got a grip".
Ummm, weren’t you the one who posted the following just one week ago…?
Quote:annie blackthorn
Have to say utterly fed up with the negative and undermining comments on here.
Call yourselves Bath Supporters = I don't think so. Criticisms, singling out individuals mistakes, etc. etc. "Should have", "could have", etc
Hypocritical much?
Quote:dr.bath1865
Just hope Piers Francis is ok. Horrible collision, especially so with his history of concussion.
Cited……Really!
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
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Quote:I think he only avoided a red card due to his own injuries, so I at least, was expecting him to be up before the beak.Old Bath Tub
Cited……Really!
Still hope that he himself is okay though.
RAEBURN SHIELD
Nothing to do with the thread but not worth creating a new one... I'm booking a holiday and note that the last Prem rugby fixtures clash with the coronation. I have zero interest in the latter but wanted to check whether any of the usual informed posters knew whether Prem Rugby have plans to move the games as I've read that English Prem football fixtures will be rescheduled? Given the disruptions to this season already I can't miss another fixture.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2023:01:23:20:12:08 by TomReagan.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2023:01:23:20:12:08 by TomReagan.
Not heard anything Tom, but I would be surprised if a move was not being considered.
PG
PG
Cheers PGT. Will hold off from booking anything. Never known a season for such disruption...
Expect it's going to be a ban but it's absurd. He's covering across maybe thinking he can scrag the guy from side on/behind and the ball carrier steps into him.
Quote:Trawling
Expect it's going to be a ban but it's absurd. He's covering across maybe thinking he can scrag the guy from side on/behind and the ball carrier steps into him.
I mentioned it earlier today but I felt Tuipulota led with his forearm. I was watching the game in a pub so my first thoughts were under the influence of alcohol but I wonder if anyone has access to a recording to see if I'm talking b#''*x. Probably am if he has been cited.
Highlights are on YouTube and can see it via the Somersetlive website.
Doesn't lead with forearm I'd say.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2023:01:23:21:14:30 by Maeght.
Doesn't lead with forearm I'd say.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2023:01:23:21:14:30 by Maeght.
Quote:Trawling
Expect it's going to be a ban but it's absurd. He's covering across maybe thinking he can scrag the guy from side on/behind and the ball carrier steps into him.
Don't really recognise that description.
Quote:TomReagan
Cheers PGT. Will hold off from booking anything. Never known a season for such disruption...
Surely they will play on the Friday night or Sunday afternoon?
Adopted players: 24/25 J Bayliss; [24] O Lawrence; [23] J Cokanasiga; [22] M Green; [21] A Watson; [20] T Faletau; [19] M V Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw
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My mind's been going places without me lately - Bushfire The B52's
Quote:Maeght
Highlights are on YouTube and can see it via the Somersetlive website.
Doesn't lead with forearm I'd say.
Thanks, just watched it. I can see why I thought it at the time. Tuipulota slightly drops his shoulder as Piers approaches but Piers should have taken more care. Comparisons with other cards issued at the weekend I would have thought yellow sufficient.
Quote:MaeghtQuote:Trawling
Expect it's going to be a ban but it's absurd. He's covering across maybe thinking he can scrag the guy from side on/behind and the ball carrier steps into him.
Don't really recognise that description.
I kind of see what you are saying. He was a bit unlucky, seemed set for the tackle but ended up tackling Tuipulotas shoulder with his head which is not a great outcome. He was considered passive on the commentary I heard so it should be fairly low level.
Quote:Love the last home game with ciders in the sun after so could cope with a Sunday or Monday kick-off but the Friday night would be a huge disappointment. Anyway, some time away but leaving all 4 days free.Clarkey3kQuote:TomReagan
Cheers PGT. Will hold off from booking anything. Never known a season for such disruption...
Surely they will play on the Friday night or Sunday afternoon?
Are we really saying that our only Saturday afternoon match on the Rec between the new year and the end of the season might be our February game with London Irish. I despair.
Quote:Francis AllenQuote:Maeght
Highlights are on YouTube and can see it via the Somersetlive website.
Doesn't lead with forearm I'd say.
Thanks, just watched it. I can see why I thought it at the time. Tuipulota slightly drops his shoulder as Piers approaches but Piers should have taken more care. Comparisons with other cards issued at the weekend I would have thought yellow sufficient.
Yes, I can see why you thought that too. I did too until I watched the it a couple of times.
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2023:01:24:19:22:34 by Maeght.
I see Piers Francis's citing was thrown out and he's free to play (concussion protocols permitting obv).
Quote:Dorset Boy
I see Piers Francis's citing was thrown out and he's free to play (concussion protocols permitting obv).
I'm glad someone has seen sense. I'm still unsure Piers connected with his head, I think the damage to his face was caused by Tuipulota's leading arm however Piers has admitted it was a high tackle. I hope Piers is fit to resume soon.
The EPCR summary only says that his offence "did not merit a sending off" but gives no other reason why.
Having not seen it, but followed the debate, I take it that any head contact was indirect -or could there have been mitigation?
PG
Having not seen it, but followed the debate, I take it that any head contact was indirect -or could there have been mitigation?
PG
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