Bath must try to disrupt the luck of the Irish at the Brentford Community Stadium on Monday. Irish, currently 7th in the Premiership are enjoying their best season since 2012, earning 7 try bonus points in their 11 matches to date. All the teams above them have a game in hand, so they will be desperate to win at home to start their New Year with a bang. Bath, desperate for a bit of luck, go to London on the back of another heavy defeat, knowing that they must look to themselves, not fortune, to reverse their slump.
Irish will argue that their position owes less to luck than merit. Since promotion from the Championship in 2019 they have built a well-balanced and competitive squad, introduced exciting young talent alongside veteran campaigners and begun a steady climb up the table. They have scored more tries than any other Premiership club so far and shown impressive ability to fight back from seemingly losing positions. They will be conscious though that they have only won 3 of their 11 Premiership ties, so can afford neither complacency, nor lack of ruthlessness against their struggling visitors. Where Bath’s set piece is an Achilles’ heel, theirs is a strength. Their scrummage is sound and occasionally dominant, their lineout highly reliable, a platform for a potent rolling maul bringing Creevy several tries. He, plus Coleman, Simmons, Rogerson and Mafi are their main forward danger men on the carry. Behind the scrum international halfbacks Phipps and White are in sprightly form, while Hassell-Collins, Rona and Loader are deadly finishers. Perhaps the key threat though is the go forward gained by the direct play of Janse van Rensburg. It will be interesting to see what counters Bath’s namesake defence coach can find to blunt the centre’s impact.
Bath have undoubtedly suffered savage luck on the injury and availability front but can neither blame luck alone for their current plight, nor rely on it for redemption. By Monday a new Chairman will have taken office and, hopefully, outlined a vision to return Bath to competitiveness and, ultimately, winning ways. With an interim defence coach, new head coach and new arrival at prop all recently announced, the squad must embrace the future, while finding determination, defensive steel and a stable forward performance for the here and now. Bailey, Ojomoh and De Glanville have shown the way in attacking attitude, but defence, from the entire 23 has to be priority, along with discipline. Stuart Hooper mentions the need for physicality and “fronting up”. Ewels, Dunn, Stuart and other senior figures up front must set the tone. They must dominate possession and territory, deny Irish continuity and momentum and take luck out of the equation.
Neal Hatley has told the press that squad morale remains high despite this season’s results. The losing streak must end sometime. A new year, a new broom is as good a time as any. Let us hope it will be on Monday.
Possible Teams: Bath Rugby: Boyce, Dunn, Stuart, Ewels (Capt.) McNally, Ellis, Underhill, Bayliss. Spencer, Bailey. McConnochie, Ojomoh, Joseph, Rokodoguni. De Glanville. Replacements: Doughty, Cordwell, Rae, W Spencer, De Carpentier. Fox, Cipriani, Hamer-Webb.
London Irish: Chawatama, Creevy, Hoskins, Coleman, Simmons, Rogerson, Pearson, Cracknell. Phipps, Jackson. Hassell-Collins, Janse van Rensburg, Rona, Loader. Parton.
Replacements: Goodrick-Clarke, Dell, Van der Merwe, Mafi, Nott. White Williams, Luns.
Would not be surprised to see Morozov come straight into either the starting line up or bench - word was when his signing was announced that he was already training with the team, and with the reasons given for cancelling the Premiership cup game that we could not put out a front row sort of makes sense.
Irish board apparently casting accusations as to Bath rugby's decision to cancel the Premiership match which is really quite distasteful given the current pandemic and player welfare rightly being high on the agenda - but I am sure they are better informed than us and have evidence of this great injustice.
One would have thought they should be very confident given their form and us being 12-0 and unable to buy a win - still maybe they are getting their excuses in early in case they slip on a banana skin.
Following the cancellation of our Premiership Rugby Cup fixture against Exeter Chiefs earlier this week, we are sorry to share that our Gallagher Premiership game against London Irish on Monday 3 January at Brentford Community Stadium can no longer go ahead safely.
Further Covid-related player absences means that our fixture must be cancelled.
Premiership Rugby will determine the points allocation for this fixture over the coming days in line with the Gallagher Premiership regulations.
We are sorry to share this news today and wish you all a happy and healthy New Year.
Hi durbansharks6. Welcome to the board. Please refrain from posting new threads for every topic - this is already covered on the main match thread which is a sticky.
Tomato Soup No good news at all for Bath. We really are a sorry state of affairs.
Watching Exeter and Bristol thinking how they have progressed both on and off the pitch and how we lack direction.
Unbeaten in 2, new coaches and chairman on the way, looking good.
shipwrecked
I was talking about the rugby which in the game you are talking about has been decidedly ordinary, infrastructure is another matter altogether.
I was quite impressed by Exeter's handling at times under pressure. To me there was plenty of skill on show.
Perhaps if Luke Pearce (usually, IMHO one of the very best referees) had shown Bristol a yellow card for their persistent red zone infringement, or been a bit tougher on both sides offside defence, the game might have opened up more?
Should these comments not be on an "Other Games This Weekend" thread? I haven't had a chance to watch the Exe Bris game yet (cos I've only just got up).
shipwrecked
I was talking about the rugby which in the game you are talking about has been decidedly ordinary, infrastructure is another matter altogether.
I was quite impressed by Exeter's handling at times under pressure. To me there was plenty of skill on show.
Perhaps if Luke Pearce (usually, IMHO one of the very best referees) had shown Bristol a yellow card for their persistent red zone infringement, or been a bit tougher on both sides offside defence, the game might have opened up more?
PG
The rugby was a far cry from these times though PG, Exeter used to dominate teams up front and be unstoppable from 5m out.
Exeter could rip sides apart from the 22m line.
If Bath went from top of the table to 12th this board would be in an inferno!
If we are going to make comparisons Sale who were 3rd are a way off where they were last season. Wasps were under Lee Blackett the performing somersaults. They are currently 9th and 10th.
Fortunes change quickly courtesy of Covid and injuries and perhaps even referees. One of the suggestions from the pundits was Exeter have lost their mojo because of their inability to win the breakdown. (Sometime known as flopping!)
If the offside line was policed rigorously PG perhaps Bath would fly up the table?
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Tomato Soup
The only thing Bath has to shout about is a distant past that the current younger generation and future generations know nothing of.
This site is full of nostalgic grey haired fools clinging to a time that has past and supporting a club that makes no progress year after year.
Thinning rather than grey. A fool... I don't think so, but not for me to say. I do know that the vast majority of posts on this site have been very critical of the club's mediocrity for several seasons. The abject rubbish we've suffered this season has been clear to all. There's a hope that we'll come good again but I don't see much nostalgia, and as for supporting a club that continues to disappoint, that's what supporters of most clubs in most sports do the world over. Easy to just switch allegiance and follow success if that's what you want, but few fans can.
Well you've started the new year with points so there's that!
Most importantly hopefully all your players are fine and with a new defence coach and a number of injuries and absences maybe a week "off" isn't the worst thing in the world for the club right now?
OldMarovian Well you've started the new year with points so there's that!
Most importantly hopefully all your players are fine and with a new defence coach and a number of injuries and absences maybe a week "off" isn't the worst thing in the world for the club right now?
Best of luck for the rest of the year
I usually think any game is better than no game for both players and fans but not so sure currently.
As you say hopefully everyone is OK, get another week of Brent trying to convey defence messages and some players will be a week nearer comebacks.
For me this season is now an extension of pre season for 22/23. That should be the focus, not short term targets of trying to scrape a few wins
Btw if you have a ‘cold’ but test negative on LFT, don’t go to the party. Both me and wife had symptoms for 12 hours before getting a positive. Looks like omicron is one step ahead!
Woodpecker Hmm shame…or maybe not
Today I will be mostly supporting Glos on BT!
Btw if you have a ‘cold’ but test negative on LFT, don’t go to the party. Both me and wife had symptoms for 12 hours before getting a positive. Looks like omicron is one step ahead!
For every omicron case testing positive I'd suggest there are probably 4-5 more who don't!
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
charlieboa For me this season is now an extension of pre season for 22/23
100% this. Will be criminal if we don't get game-time into players who will be important match-day squad players next season. Doubly so if we waste game-time on players who will not be at Bath next season.
OutsideBath LI fans and their conspiracy theories for cancelling premiership cup game left with egg on their face.
Just visited their site, what a generally miserable and not too intellegent bunch amongst that lot. Notwithstanding the fact that they appear to have (conveniently) forgotten that their December 2020 match with Bath was was cancelled due to Covid in their camp, they appear to still be whining like toddlers about their players wanting to leave their little club 8+ years ago? At least they can at long last make the point that they are above Bath in the league, which should help as they wipe away their salty tears of perceived betrayal.
charlieboa For me this season is now an extension of pre season for 22/23
100% this. Will be criminal if we don't get game-time into players who will be important match-day squad players next season. Doubly so if we waste game-time on players who will not be at Bath next season.
Completely agree but also need to sort out quickly who among the coaches will be staying and in what roles so they can start to focus on how we will be playing next year and what we want to achieve
For me the goal has to be winning the Euro Challenge Cup with a top 6 Prem position an absolute must
charlieboa For me this season is now an extension of pre season for 22/23
100% this. Will be criminal if we don't get game-time into players who will be important match-day squad players next season. Doubly so if we waste game-time on players who will not be at Bath next season.
Completely agree but also need to sort out quickly who among the coaches will be staying and in what roles so they can start to focus on how we will be playing next year and what we want to achieve
For me the goal has to be winning the Euro Challenge Cup with a top 6 Prem position an absolute must
Agree, no point Brent drilling the players with a specific style of defence if he is going to get replaced by jpf in 6 months and if he wants something totally different. Difficult period to manage but I think clarity for all parties ASAP would be helpful.
Going well in challenge cup and top half prem seems a reasonable target. interesting that geech thinks it will be 2-3 years before we see significant upturn. I am a bit more bullish than that, or at least can't see why we couldn't improve a decent amount quickly from such a low base.
charlieboa For me this season is now an extension of pre season for 22/23
100% this. Will be criminal if we don't get game-time into players who will be important match-day squad players next season. Doubly so if we waste game-time on players who will not be at Bath next season.
Completely agree but also need to sort out quickly who among the coaches will be staying and in what roles so they can start to focus on how we will be playing next year and what we want to achieve
For me the goal has to be winning the Euro Challenge Cup with a top 6 Prem position an absolute must
Given the absolute shambles the playing side of Bath rugby is in that goal seems a little over optimistic. In addition the architects of Bath’s demise will still be at the club influencing the playing side.
I would suggest finishing somewhere between 9th and 11th with a Challenge cup 1/4 final is more realistic.
Hats seemed to give a timeframe of the next couple of weeks, so I’d assume everyone will know where they stand by then. If there are protected conversations to be had, then they would probably happen during this period. I also get the impression from Hats that JvG is very much inputting into this process.
charlieboa For me this season is now an extension of pre season for 22/23
100% this. Will be criminal if we don't get game-time into players who will be important match-day squad players next season. Doubly so if we waste game-time on players who will not be at Bath next season.
Completely agree but also need to sort out quickly who among the coaches will be staying and in what roles so they can start to focus on how we will be playing next year and what we want to achieve
For me the goal has to be winning the Euro Challenge Cup with a top 6 Prem position an absolute must
Agree, no point Brent drilling the players with a specific style of defence if he is going to get replaced by jpf in 6 months and if he wants something totally different. Difficult period to manage but I think clarity for all parties ASAP would be helpful.
Going well in challenge cup and top half prem seems a reasonable target. interesting that geech thinks it will be 2-3 years before we see significant upturn. I am a bit more bullish than that, or at least can't see why we couldn't improve a decent amount quickly from such a low base.
Who is jpf Charlie? Have I missed a rumour/announcement?
charlieboa For me this season is now an extension of pre season for 22/23
100% this. Will be criminal if we don't get game-time into players who will be important match-day squad players next season. Doubly so if we waste game-time on players who will not be at Bath next season.
Completely agree but also need to sort out quickly who among the coaches will be staying and in what roles so they can start to focus on how we will be playing next year and what we want to achieve
For me the goal has to be winning the Euro Challenge Cup with a top 6 Prem position an absolute must
Agree, no point Brent drilling the players with a specific style of defence if he is going to get replaced by jpf in 6 months and if he wants something totally different. Difficult period to manage but I think clarity for all parties ASAP would be helpful.
Going well in challenge cup and top half prem seems a reasonable target. interesting that geech thinks it will be 2-3 years before we see significant upturn. I am a bit more bullish than that, or at least can't see why we couldn't improve a decent amount quickly from such a low base.
Who is jpf Charlie? Have I missed a rumour/announcement?
Pretty sure that's meant to be JvG, Johann van Graan.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
charlieboa ...... interesting that geech thinks it will be 2-3 years before we see significant upturn. I am a bit more bullish than that, or at least can't see why we couldn't improve a decent amount quickly from such a low base.
What Tigers achieved in such a short time is remarkable but shows it needn't take 2 to 3 years. Maybe Geech was judging this against his own standards, reminds me of some old builder shaking his head at a job and saying 'Who did this? It will take me a lot of work to put right'.
charlieboa ...... interesting that geech thinks it will be 2-3 years before we see significant upturn. I am a bit more bullish than that, or at least can't see why we couldn't improve a decent amount quickly from such a low base.
What Tigers achieved in such a short time is remarkable but shows it needn't take 2 to 3 years. Maybe Geech was judging this against his own standards, reminds me of some old builder shaking his head at a job and saying 'Who did this? It will take me a lot of work to put right'.
Hooper and Tarquin are still involved so it’s going to take a lot longer than 2-3 years to see any form of improvement. Geech is being over optimistic.
charlieboa ...... interesting that geech thinks it will be 2-3 years before we see significant upturn. I am a bit more bullish than that, or at least can't see why we couldn't improve a decent amount quickly from such a low base.
What Tigers achieved in such a short time is remarkable but shows it needn't take 2 to 3 years. Maybe Geech was judging this against his own standards, reminds me of some old builder shaking his head at a job and saying 'Who did this? It will take me a lot of work to put right'.
Tigers and Gloucester tbf. Both had strong Academies to draw from and both had done well at age grade for a few years (particularly Hartpury) so that made life easier I'm sure but Bath also has a few decent lads coming through.
charlieboa ...... interesting that geech thinks it will be 2-3 years before we see significant upturn. I am a bit more bullish than that, or at least can't see why we couldn't improve a decent amount quickly from such a low base.
What Tigers achieved in such a short time is remarkable but shows it needn't take 2 to 3 years. Maybe Geech was judging this against his own standards, reminds me of some old builder shaking his head at a job and saying 'Who did this? It will take me a lot of work to put right'.
Hooper and Tarquin are still involved so it’s going to take a lot longer than 2-3 years to see any form of improvement. Geech is being over optimistic.
My hope is Tarquin will be focussed more on the ground project and Hoops will either see sense and leave the coaching to the new team or they will just lock him in the changing rooms. Either way the new regime must get a clean start without interference.
Partly though, despite Geech's great history I don't see how his opinion is worth much these days? I am usually the last person to put people down but I can't recall the last time he showed any great insight. Happy to be shot down on that one if someone can post his comments.
B4thB4ck despite Geech's great history I don't see how his opinion is worth much these days?
Other than contributing the well-worn cliche 'test match animal' I'd say his last meaningful contribution was appointing Martin Johnson as captain of the '97 Lions.
I wonder if the most significant of the most recent Bath moves has been for Bruce to take a tangible step away. There has always been that undercurrent of 'interference' rumours ... and it may well be that Hooper has borne the brunt of that - trying to juggle constant messages and suggestions from the owner, with what's happening on the ground.
I'm grateful that Brent has had a couple of weeks to implement a defense. A mini pre-season hopefully. A focus I hope will be on the breakdown. I've watched Underhill get numerous legitimate turnovers only to be denied by the ref this season, which has been deeply frustrating. Without Reid and Bayliss out of position at 8 we've lacked someone who can slow down opposition momentum. In the backs Redpath was very good at it before his injury and we've relied on Roko to get the odd one.
I do like Ellis, he's a big lump who can make big hits but the balance of the backrow with Coetzee injured has been woeful all season. Assuming Bayliss has recovered from illness he'll start at 8 with Underhill at 7. I'd be tempted to start De Carpentier alongside him as a breakdown threat, being very good at it for the 7s or even Cowan. I rate Richards as the better player but I was impressed with Cowan's speed and jackal threat. Maybe he play like Curry does for England with 6/7 numbers the wrong way round.
Alternatively we give Merigan a start and have Bayliss at 6. With De Carpentier on the bench with Richards or the other Spencer.
But, while that game was recorded as a 28-0 Chiefs win, the Irish v Bath goes down as a 0-0 draw, with the Exiles awarded four points and Bath two.
The decision was made by a Premiership Rugby panel chaired by Martyn Phillips, along with rugby director Phil Winstanley.
In a statement, the Premiership said: "The panel was satisfied that Bath did all they could to fulfil the fixture, trying to find a replacement hooker, which was key to the match being cancelled.
"This search involved speaking with clubs from the Welsh regions, the RFU Championship and a number of the major rugby player agencies."
So that must have meant Dunn, Doughty, Du Toit and John Stewart all out? I guess thats the result of them all packing down vs each other in training... Still looks like they did a thorough sweep for replacements.
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