Bath
It's been a long time...
By Devonport Boy
September 20 2023
By my reckoning the last time Bath met London Scottish in a top level competition was in the 98/99 season in the old Allied Dunbar Premiership. They beat us by 13-11 in October 98 at the Stoop, but Bath delivered a resounding 76-13 win back at the Rec on 16 th May 99. I think we’d just about take that on Saturday!
Of course, a lot of water has flowed under Pulteney Bridge since then. The fortunes of the two famous old Clubs have differed greatly, with London Scottish having to rebuild themselves. But they’ve shown great determination and resilience over the years and with the future of London Irish still very uncertain and London Welsh plying their trade in the lower divisions, London Scottish are now the highest flying of the traditional old “exile” clubs. You can bet they’ll bring those qualities to the Rec on Saturday.
OK, before we look forward, let’s address the elephant in the room. Last Saturday wasn’t the result that we would have wanted from the first game of the season at the Rec. That said, and looking at it objectively, a predominantly young Bath team selected quite rightly in my view in the spirit of the Premiership Cup as a development competition was always going to find playing the team that won the Championship in 22/23 a huge challenge. We were beaten by a better team on the day. It’s sport. It happens. How we move forward from that is the issue for Saturday and beyond. Despite the result there were some encouraging individual performances and there is a lot there to build on.
Personally, I don’t think we will see wholesale changes for the London Scottish game, unless we picked up some injuries against Jersey.Don’t forget, this squad beat Cornish Pirates at the Mennaye two weeks ago and consistency of selection is needed if they are to grow as a team. I do think we might see one or two senior players who need some game time in advance of the Edinburgh friendly on 6th October, though. I know a number of supporters were disappointed with the heavy reliance on the boot in the game against Jersey and are concerned that it might indicate how the Premiership squad are going to play. I don’t think you can extrapolate too much from the Premiership cup games; as I understand it there are different training programmes in place with specific focus on each competition.
I look forward to seeing a confident squad of predominantly young players on Saturday who will build on the win against Pirates and who, with guidance from the coaches, will have addressed and fixed the problems that we saw against Jersey. It’ll be another testing day for the pack but they’ll rise to the challenge. We’ve got immense talent in our backs and it would be great to see the team play in a way that allows them to unleash it.
It might not be 73 – 13 but hopefully it’ll feel like 1999 again!
COYB
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Discussion started by Comeonmylovers.co.uk (IP Logged), 20/09/2023 12:53
20/09/2023 12:53
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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2023:09:26:10:23:20 by CoochieCoo.
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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2023:09:26:10:23:20 by CoochieCoo.
I remember those games well, being a young whipper snapper in Scottish's Development team back then trying to get the odd 5mins for the 1XV.
Players shirts were heavy and baggy, with studs long enough to get good purchase of the mud.
Scottish have done well to rebuild and find their "correct" level again. However finances are dreadful due to the RFU restricting commercial opportunities for the Champo and slashing funding at the same time.
Scottish dont have the rich investors that Jersey, Ealing and Doncaster have, so as much as I'd love a close game, I feel Bath will run away with it. Unless they employ the useless kicking strategy...
Designed in Scotland | Made in the West Country
Players shirts were heavy and baggy, with studs long enough to get good purchase of the mud.
Scottish have done well to rebuild and find their "correct" level again. However finances are dreadful due to the RFU restricting commercial opportunities for the Champo and slashing funding at the same time.
Scottish dont have the rich investors that Jersey, Ealing and Doncaster have, so as much as I'd love a close game, I feel Bath will run away with it. Unless they employ the useless kicking strategy...
Designed in Scotland | Made in the West Country
A team that conceded six tries against Jersey playing a team that conceded seven tries against Jersey. So perhaps a reasonably even match is on the cards.
We all want to see meaningful contests so I trust there will be some agreement reached with Exeter regarding the nature of the side they are sending to the Rec on 7th October. If not with our senior players in Edinburgh the game could be a farce.
We all want to see meaningful contests so I trust there will be some agreement reached with Exeter regarding the nature of the side they are sending to the Rec on 7th October. If not with our senior players in Edinburgh the game could be a farce.
I suppose we run that risk when we arrange a fixture on the same weekend. We've clearly decided to treat the cup competition as being developmental hence the friendly v Edinburgh. Exeter must do what suits them best. I agree that it'll be pretty pointless, or rather, quite the opposite if Chiefs feel they need to give their first team a game, but that's inevitable when it's left to each side to adopt their own approach without any criteria laid out re selection.
A stronger team this week:
Bath Rugby XV: 1 Juan Schoeman, 2 Niall Annett, 3 Johannes Jonker, 4 Fergus Lee-Warner, 5 Ewan Richards, 6 Miles Reid (c), 7 Chris Cloete, 8 Jaco Coetzee, 9 Louis Schreuder, 10 Piers Francis, 11 Will Muir, 12 Will Parry, 13 Louie Hennessey, 14 Gabe Goss, 15 Tom de Glanville
Replacements: 16 Jasper Spandler, 17 Arthur Cordwell, 18 Kieran Verden, 19 JJ Tonks, 20 Nahum Merigan, 21 Tom Carr-Smith, 22 Sam Harris, 23 Arthur Green (debut)
Bath Rugby XV: 1 Juan Schoeman, 2 Niall Annett, 3 Johannes Jonker, 4 Fergus Lee-Warner, 5 Ewan Richards, 6 Miles Reid (c), 7 Chris Cloete, 8 Jaco Coetzee, 9 Louis Schreuder, 10 Piers Francis, 11 Will Muir, 12 Will Parry, 13 Louie Hennessey, 14 Gabe Goss, 15 Tom de Glanville
Replacements: 16 Jasper Spandler, 17 Arthur Cordwell, 18 Kieran Verden, 19 JJ Tonks, 20 Nahum Merigan, 21 Tom Carr-Smith, 22 Sam Harris, 23 Arthur Green (debut)
Well, I got that wrong in my preview! Happy with that though. Really looking forward to seeing that team run out at the Rec tomorrow.
Wow, very young centre partnership and surprisingly strong pack. I expect a big win for Bath via a lot of 5m goal line rumbles...
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Quote:Just what I was thinking. Assume they have very meticulous prep schedules for each player but from a fan's perspective doesn't seem very bright. (I'm not being presumptuous or disrespectful to London Scottish, but on paper Jersey are clearly a much stronger side).Dorset Boy
Looks like the team that should have played last week!
Quote:Dorest Boy
Looks like the team that should have played last week!
Looks like Bath are following their own season build-up procedure that's not based on which team they're playing. This week's selection seems indicative, with what looks like a move towards a second-15 composition. (it may also indicate where Bath see Barbeary in the player hierarchy).
It will be interesting to see how they divide their assets between the Edinburgh friendly and the Exeter match the following afternoon. I think my preference would be to use the Saints and Exeter matches to get the whole team up to match day fitness.
Quote:P G Tips
I think the announcement on Alfie was “later rounds of Prem Cup” OB.
PG
OK thanks PG, guess with his injury record the club needs to be very cautious about when to play him.
Yes, this team would have been far more competitive against Jersey Reds& we might have gained a win whereas we could comfortably overpower LS. Also the rest time could have been kinder to those players.
A pack that would likely do OK in a Prem match. Nice back 3, too.
Should be interesting and hopefully enjoy a France-style motivational pick-me-up at home by putting some nice tries and a few points past some (with all due respect) weaker opposition.
I like Reid as captain. Smart lad. Always speaks well. Bath boy. Maybe not this year, but definitely a future skipper IF he can nail down a starting shirt. Big season for him as BIG competition.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Should be interesting and hopefully enjoy a France-style motivational pick-me-up at home by putting some nice tries and a few points past some (with all due respect) weaker opposition.
I like Reid as captain. Smart lad. Always speaks well. Bath boy. Maybe not this year, but definitely a future skipper IF he can nail down a starting shirt. Big season for him as BIG competition.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Will be really interesting to see how a decent Chiefs side go away at Jersey
The Glaws v Saints game tonight on TNT looks a good match up and worth a watch
The Glaws v Saints game tonight on TNT looks a good match up and worth a watch
Frontline guys being held back for last 2 weekends before the prem starts I guess which I am fine with.
Assume Edinburgh game will involve a similar squad that play falcons a week later and it will be a very young team + fringe guys who play exeter same weekend.
Good to see coetzee if OK after that clear out and muir having no adverse reaction.
Assume Edinburgh game will involve a similar squad that play falcons a week later and it will be a very young team + fringe guys who play exeter same weekend.
Good to see coetzee if OK after that clear out and muir having no adverse reaction.
Glaws v Quins last night was a good game. Typical Quins with a slow start, go three tries down early on and then so nearly yet another 'impossible' come back
Suspect you guys will give us quite a pummelling. Jersey comfortably beat us first game, but we were far more competitive against donny last week. Certainly not at the level to compete with a premiership outfit.
We didn't have any preseason games this year and had a lot of squad churn over the summer so we are openly using these games to try out combos and to get fit for the league.
Hopefully we put up a bit of a fight! 🙂
We didn't have any preseason games this year and had a lot of squad churn over the summer so we are openly using these games to try out combos and to get fit for the league.
Hopefully we put up a bit of a fight! 🙂
Quote:Mike the Taxi
HT 19 v 6
When was the last time Bath scored 3 tries, in a game?
Sarries last season??
Sarries at home last season. Quins at HQ last season.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Quote:Went off for an HIA in the first half and didn’t come back on to the pitch. He came out to the sideline during the second half and gave a thumbs up when asked if he we ok, so ready into that what you will.OutsideBath
Assume Coetzee was injured?
Quote:Against Pirates 2 weeks ago they got 4 tries. [www.bathrugby.com]Mike the Taxi
HT 19 v 6
When was the last time Bath scored 3 tries, in a game?
Quote:Mike the Taxi
HT 19 v 6
When was the last time Bath scored 3 tries, in a game?
Didn't we score at least 4 in the last 6 premiership games last season?
Hope you pay more attention to the road when you're working MtT!
Quote:dcshQuote:Went off for an HIA in the first half and didn’t come back on to the pitch. He came out to the sideline during the second half and gave a thumbs up when asked if he we ok, so ready into that what you will.OutsideBath
Assume Coetzee was injured?
OK thanks, hopefully not too serious then.
Quote:Dorset BoyQuote:Mike the Taxi
HT 19 v 6
When was the last time Bath scored 3 tries, in a game?
Didn't we score at least 4 in the last 6 premiership games last season?
Hope you pay more attention to the road when you're working MtT!
It's OK, DB, you are safe. I gave up driving and owning a car when I retired, 12 years ago!
People I know still refer to me as 'Mike the Taxi', which is what I was when I joined this group!
Anyone in the Teachers stand know what caused the argy bargy that led to the penalty at the restart after our try? My ref link has died so I couldn't hear what the ref said to Miles.
Quote:Susanne
Anyone in the Teachers stand know what caused the argy bargy that led to the penalty at the restart after our try? My ref link has died so I couldn't hear what the ref said to Miles.
Ref said he saw something happened on the ground that was unacceptable, but I don’t think he singled anyone out.
Widcombe Garçon
Quote:I don’t know what caused it but it nearly spilled over the barricade onto me at one stage.Susanne
Anyone in the Teachers stand know what caused the argy bargy that led to the penalty at the restart after our try? My ref link has died so I couldn't hear what the ref said to Miles.
Horatio Nelson
Enjoyable game in the sunshine, and totally different to the turgid tripe served up last week.
Chris Cloete was very effective, as was Miles., and TDG. Thought that the youngsters in midfield did well.
Chris Cloete was very effective, as was Miles., and TDG. Thought that the youngsters in midfield did well.
Good result. We almost certainly won't progress (because Exeter) so continued sensible building of the squad into the next two games and sharpening of the team is the order of the day.
There were definitely some positives out there - Coetzee carried very effectively before going off with an HIA, Cloete and Miles played well, Lee-Warner very physical, Hennessy's best game yet.
The negative was the ridiculous penalty count. We must have given away double figures in the first half alone - repeatedly not rolling away and also some very dumb ones. Offside at a ruck when the opposition are on their own line and just trying to set up a clearing box kick is crazy. A better side would have punished such indiscipline.
Things did improve in the second half when we started to rip through a tired defence but the scoreline flattered the overall performance.
The negative was the ridiculous penalty count. We must have given away double figures in the first half alone - repeatedly not rolling away and also some very dumb ones. Offside at a ruck when the opposition are on their own line and just trying to set up a clearing box kick is crazy. A better side would have punished such indiscipline.
Things did improve in the second half when we started to rip through a tired defence but the scoreline flattered the overall performance.
Giving away 5 penalties to, no offence, London Scottish, within the opening 4 minutes said it all. Terrible discipline, terrible ball retention. So the usual Bath rugby fare.
A curate's egg. The indiscipline and poor ball retention have been commented on. I was hoping we might get some sort of edge in the scrums, didn't, but I don't recall more than one needing to be reset which made a welcome change, although on that occasion there were big lumps of turf that needed to be replaced which isn't a great sight given it's just September. The obvious positives were the line out drives, the far more ambitious intent and some excellent offloading amidst the errors. Jaco was excellent until another HIA, which must be so demoralising for him. The Horse was his usual excellent self and the half backs were much better than last week, albeit Jersey are a stronger side.
The penalties were certainly irritating but there was odd inconsistency from the ref at the breakdown. Bath penalised for not rolling away within 1.5 seconds. Scottish holding on/sealing off given over a minute before any penalty.
These are, in their impact, effectively the same offence in intent to slow down ruck ball and hamper attack. Really very puzzling.
PG
These are, in their impact, effectively the same offence in intent to slow down ruck ball and hamper attack. Really very puzzling.
PG
It was clear on one 'not rolling away' pen that the Bath player was being held down, and looked similarly harsh for another one. Mind you, the laws of rugby will always create potential arguments over interpretation so I try to be phlegmatic. Our offside pens were very dull!
A curate's egg for sure. Was really looking forward to our first home match in the sunshine and hoping for a good show from our XXIII. As it turned out Mrs C3k left after 60mins, a bit bored with the contest by then and I left at F/time feeling underwhelmed. The continued kick and chase or one out drive game plan reminded me of the first half/most of 22/23. It's early days but I really hope we pick up where we left off last season in future matches.
Adopted players: 24/25 J Bayliss; [24] O Lawrence; [23] J Cokanasiga; [22] M Green; [21] A Watson; [20] T Faletau; [19] M V Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw
Family . Community . Nation - [sdp.org.uk]
My mind's been going places without me lately - Bushfire The B52's
Adopted players: 24/25 J Bayliss; [24] O Lawrence; [23] J Cokanasiga; [22] M Green; [21] A Watson; [20] T Faletau; [19] M V Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw
Family . Community . Nation - [sdp.org.uk]
My mind's been going places without me lately - Bushfire The B52's
I only listened to part of it on the radio but the most used phrase by matt garvey was 'compounding errors' which didn't sound ideal.
Sensed he was v frustrated at our ability to continually make errors, whether it be skills based mistakes or errors of judgement.
Guess it's hard to read much into the season so far- next few games will tell us a little more but only really after a month of the prem will we get a feel for how the season may go.
Was nice to hear coetzee going well but a blow to lose him to yet another hia- fingers crossed he is OK.
Sensed he was v frustrated at our ability to continually make errors, whether it be skills based mistakes or errors of judgement.
Guess it's hard to read much into the season so far- next few games will tell us a little more but only really after a month of the prem will we get a feel for how the season may go.
Was nice to hear coetzee going well but a blow to lose him to yet another hia- fingers crossed he is OK.
Error upon error, no continuity, constant groans from the crowd whenever we lost the ball every 2 minutes. Perennial problem at Bath.
We played a tad more ambitiously than against Jersey at least, but that was a low bar tbf.
We played a tad more ambitiously than against Jersey at least, but that was a low bar tbf.
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